Ian Koviak wrote:

And rest assured—these scriptures and so-called scientific texts were revised, added to, adjusted and misinterpreted countless times by countless people—for their agendas and personal convictions. Yes, people. Not gods, not angels, not some mystic saints with elephant gods writing with broken tusks. People. Writers, poets, logicians, artists, scientists and philosophers—over the course of many hundreds and thousands of years. There was no "revealed knowledge" that vyasa just wrote down (sorry, ganesh) in one fell swoop. In fact, much of the knowledge in various shastras and supplementary vedic texts were developed right in line with and at the same time as many other scientific and philosophical discoveries and contributions were being made globally. Not just in india. Mathematical concepts, writing, architecture, art, religion, etc—many of the major discoveries in these fields of knowledge were being shared and discovered by moving tribes, shifting and conquering dynasties and eventually via the written, documented word. It seems foolish to highlight india with the singular very biased aim of having people superstitiously be convinced that chanting hare krishna is the best thing ever or has any more potency than chanting or meditating on any phrase or sound that one associates with peace and tranquility. It's also not healthy to be so preoccupied with living a life of no stress and complete mental peace. It robs us of rich experiences and the ability to grow stronger and build our own authentic and personal view of reality. Artificially imposing a framework of thought and belief simply robs our mind and dulls it of it's ability to seek and learn and question and form real ideas based in reality—not fiction.


Cults in so many ways are similar to drugs. They both are capable of inducing our brains to produce dopamine to get that euphoric feeling. In time, it can get addicting.

I remember a scene in Conan the Barbarian when Ah-nold beheaded the Cult Leader finally, then threw the severed head down the temple steps, the crowd dispersed in the most poignant fashion, woke up from stupor, throwing down their torches and walking away in lines into the horizon.

I look forward to the day when children return to their families to rebuild lives, to recover quality time, to restore love, to seek their true potentials, and most of all to find God in the wider world than in a groupthink.

Ian and Henriji,

The comparison to Yoko has merit on a couple of counts. While no analogy is perfect, it is similar to how Yoko broke up the Beatles with her formidable influence over John. Just read Julian Lennon's and other accounts of how Yoko isolated John from family and friends. In the same way, Wai Lana seems to have taken over the direction of Mr. Butler's life into ultra weirdness, snobbery, and disenfranchisement from all but the most brainwashed followers.

Post Wai- tin foil and toe nail consumption ensued; along with extreme reclusiveness, fines for offenses, and exorbitant tithes. Before that he was more accessible and directly "jammed" you (insults and chastisements) with only his words. Before Wifey Wai, he never went on ski vacations, flew around on jets, or passed out toe nail clippings to eat. There was an exodus of some of his original followers after he married Wai due to the noticeable high weirdness.

But he was always paranoid and secretive with outsiders once he discovered that the world did not automatically buy into his messianic bullshit. He hated reporters for not recognizing his greatness as far back as when he called himself "Sai Young". So he withdrew into his little cult, erm, "spiritual path" that happens to believe in his infallibility.

He always enjoyed adulation, politics, free labor, and rich patrons. He always had people cooking and cleaning and providing clothing for him; it just got worse with Wai Lana. Before her, he did not need air purifying systems, aluminum foil lined walls, volumes of "Personal Care" directives, or non-disclosure agreements.

During the newspaper and Independents for Godly Government days Butler lived very simply on a cot with mosquito netting and in a room with one chair. He would sit on tatami mats on the floor reading books and newspapers and making notes for a lecture. There was no air conditioning on Maui or at Koolau on Kauai. It reminded followers of images of Gandhi or Bhaktivedanta in some humble hut in India. At the time he was portraying himself as a dispassionate celibate Saddhu or Saint.

It wasn't until after the first political campaign (1976), when Butler moved to Honolulu or L.A. to work on Kathy Hoshijo's cooking show and his failed music album, that he inhabited high rise apartments (allegedly with drug money). They were nothing extraordinary. Of course the rest of his disciples were sharing apartments, living in low income housing, or in cars. Many were on welfare. Only a few had their own businesses at the time. In California, he stayed at wealthy patron's homes.

So while he was always heading towards the "Super Materialist" good life at the expense of his followers, Wai Lana brought along the creepiest elements.

Here is another comparison to Yoko Ono. While John continued to make good music, some of the directions he went (under her influence) were embarrassing, narcissistic exhibitions. John Lennon Owned by Yoko Ono (OK, the commentator is not politically correct...but makes the point.)

And neither Yoko or Wai Lana can sing (or speak English clearly for that matter).
While Yoko's voice is like nails on a chalk board or something like what "skunk smell" would sound like,
Wai Lana will put you into a diabetic coma with sickeningly sweet auto-tuned resonances.

Trigger Warning for Sensitive Ears:

Yoko Ono sings We are All Water; Look at Me So Arty; I Rule John Lennon

Wai Lana sings Namaste; Look at Me So Spiritual; So Give Me All Your Money

Now back to fun with aluminum foil . . .
'Weird Al' Yankovic Music Video FOIL

But seriously, for us to challenge the thinking of Rama's brother, Aloha girl, or other devotees sneaking a peek on this forum, it is very painful.

First, the aggressive defenses and "auto-tuned brains" full of thought stopping arguments come flying out like projectile vomiting. But when the arguments go up against the truth and the contradictions become apparent, the pain really starts.

The agony of waking up is just too much for most people. Butler banks on this.

But once you start thinking, you'll realize you have been misled.

Looks like FOIL link busted.

Try this one: Exclusive "Weird Al" Yankovic Music Video: FOIL (Parody of "Royals" by Lorde)

It is as had previously stated with Yoko/Wai.
Way Looney merely fanned the all-ready existing flames.
She did escalate it to a new level of weirdness, but she found fertile soil.
Butler’s NARCISSISM was already firmly in place.

Regarding Yoko’s voice: true, when she sings, there is a great deal of dissonance- but that is her style/emotion.
I did get a chance to speak with her once back in New York.
Her voice was very much in keeping with someone who has learned English as a second language- heavily Japanese accented but it was a mellifluous and rather pleasant voice if I remember correctly.

Wai Lana- is a different kettle of fish entirely!
After listening to her speak, I do think she definitely has a speech impediment. There is something intrinsically wrong with the bio-mechanics of her mouth.
We know there is something intrinsically wrong with her mind, she has no soul,
and the vote has already been taken on her voice.

"Off with her head!” quoth the Red Queen.

Now IMAGINE this:

All you devbots, put down your tofu spoons and your ill-blessed mala beads.
Delete your Butler digitized sound bites into the “Trash".
KEEP YOUR HARD EARNED SALARIES.
Throw your cell-phones that Butler uses to enslave you as readily as steel hand cuffs into Pele’s mouth.




Regain your BRAIN!




Question everything!



And give Peace a chance..


There is a whole world out there- give yourselves a chance to find out
what has been kept from you all along.
Miracles do happen, just ask Julian.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYQENKq9gIo]Miracle[/url]


Butler has 2 arms 2 legs and a wife.... just walk away and be FREE!

Haha, Weird Al’s Foil, very appropriate!

Yoko Ono sings We are All Water; Look at Me So Arty; I Rule John Lennon

Wai Lana sings Namaste; Look at Me So Spiritual; So Give Me All Your Money

I wondered what the hell was going on inside the hosts’ minds as they listened to Yoko Ono?

I remember finding a CD in the sales bin at Sam’s, ground floor of the North Tower in New York, just before 9-11. It was Yoko Ono’s Greatest Hits. Did she ever had one single hit? It was $5. No, I did not buy it.

If there’s an alternate theory to the conspiracy that the taking down of Twin Towers wasn’t by the al Qaeda, here’s a good one:

Somebody must have tried to listen to that CD, Yoko Ono’s Greatest Hits and got the wrath of God.

If I may add, when you see Wai Lana’s yoga dance or her singing Namaste on YouTube? Please don’t. We don’t want another 9-11 here. That bad.

That’s one huge problem with the Butler cult, nobody has the guts to admit, let alone voice out that Wai Lana is horri-bol (palm-face). It’s offensive to even think it. Add that on top of all the bullshits everyone has to tolerate in the cult to devote one’s life to Krishna? Poor children. That’s one huge psychological abuse issue.

Check out this amazing article about Tulsi Gabbard, and all the comments.

Bernie Sanders Must Drop Tulsi Gabbard

http://ww4report.com/node/14756

PAY ATTENTION TO COMMENTOR MIKA ERICKSON - that is the real deal opposition to Chris Butler right there.

Dharmabum- Wai Lana sure is Horri-Bol haha and DABS, much respect to Yoko Ono for calling out ACBS and his BS way back then.

Don't be expecting Yoko Ono to be buying up your crazy Hare Krishna RAPEligion.

Yoko will definitely flip that dynamic on its head. Too bad she didn't give ACBS a taste of his own medicine... Sorry, I'll leave that one there.

I'll just say that if she wanted to give some chauvinist Hare Krishna rape lover a taste of his own medicine, she'd have them singing like her.

Yep, I went there. Yoko Ono with a strap on making Hare Krishnas re-evaluate their pro rape teachings.

*drops the mic, walks offstage.*

There's a wave of resistance and seeing through the fog of politics and religion right now. it's about time. A renaissance of thinking is taking place. There will be a few people who complain and bitch through it all and cry "hindu-phobe" whenever you shed light on the craziness, but ultimately vaishnavism has been a self-identified cult since it's inception. It's not anymore representative of hinduism than the rest of the rather rational philosophies and ideologies born in the east. No need to protect it folks. By implication, hinduism has become a hodgepodge of undefinable quasi-spiritual mumbo jumbo mixed with authentic rational thought. It's time to separate the wheat from the chaff. It's time to expose and reveal the glory of india's true contributions to progressive philosophical and cultural realities. Few nations can lay claim to a depth of thought that was prevalent in ancient india—and ironically it had little to nothing to do with brahminical values and beliefs expounded in such heavily altered texts as the Gita. Lets welcome that "hinduism", if we must call it something. Because whatever it's become is far from sound and grounded.

Commentators like Mika Ericsson in that bernie/tulsi post are shedding light on the masquerade. This "character", Tulsi, is not authentic in any way shape and form (she was groomed to play this role). She may be a "nice person" or even sincere (won't be the first time sincerity amounted to a pile of shit)—in fact, I generally think most people are, underneath it all, sincere and looking for a greater good. Regardless what that greater good is, it needs to originate in a authentic space to have meaning and value.

I'm sad that tulsi is choosing to play the "hindu" card. It's not served her well in any well. Not because of the "hindu" part, but that everyone, including herself, knows it's a sham—a card she's playing that in no way reveals the deck.

Oh well. Life goes on, but—yes Rama—all this talk of Yoko has amounted to one fact: Ono may have had a hold on John and a crappy voice, but she is a strong independent woman that spoke her mind and did not need to be part of a cult known for wide scale abuses and she did not need a swamis approval to know that she had value and the ability to make true impact on society by maintaining her unique thinking voice and unreplacate-able "yoko" effect. There is only one yoko. There are hundreds of cheap Wai Lana and Butler couples—hiding under piles of their followers cash—or in this case, er, tin foil.

I must admit I like Siddha’s first album, The Gentle Force. I still hum “Water” and “Simple Country Girl” once in a while. I thought they are catchy. I really don’t know the mystery or the rationale behind banning that album. The instrumentation is world-class. For the theme, I think Siddha’s voice is descent enough, I really thought the album had potentials.

I listened to his and Wai Lana’s collaborated album, it’s pathetic. What happened? I think Siddha got disillusioned as John was because the wife can do no wrong. They both got blinded from the obvious and chose to live in denial. The Emperor and the Empress have no clothes on and no one dare say that to their faces. Well, Siddha, Wai Lana, it’s bad, really bad. Like 9-11 bad.

The comparison has a merit, but what separates Yoko from Wai Lana is Yoko’s strong sense of human rights, especially woman’s rights, Wai Lana has none. Standing up to that twat, A.C. Bhaktivedanta was simply admirable. Dabcult is right.

I remember Wai Lana always seated and dances in front of Siddha during lectures and kirtan, with her long-straight, beautiful and shiny hair. She was obviously smitten, and vice-versa. This talk about their transcendental relationship, his vow of celibacy and her being pure devotee are one big bullshit everyone has to tolerate and live in denial. Gurus are just like anybody else. They shit and have sexual urges, like you and I.

That’s what cults are – not only do the Emperor and the Empress have no clothes on, everyone is nekid, the game must go on.

Warren Buffet said, when the tide ebbs down, people will see who is swimming naked.

The biggest danger is that Tulsi is unfortunately a huge recruitment source for the cult. The more success she achieves, the greater a tool she becomes - so yes, Bernie has to distance himself from her for that reason alone. But he won't. He is stuck in a self-tightening Gordian Knot. It is impossible for him to dump her without looking "Hindu-phobic" - so don't hold your breath waiting for him to vet her out of his campaign any time soon.

Sadly, I once gave Tulsi credit for coming out and honestly avowing her guru. What I didn't realize is how hard it would be to get people to distinguish between a valid religion and a cult. I didn't realize how one lie could hide in plain sight under the Hinduism veil. One lie covers another lie.

What is questionable regarding Bernie is how could he not know Tulsi's history, speeches, and political positions? He and his team are not that stupid. It's not as if he is a bumbling oaf who just did not realize that Tulsi was connected to a cult.

It is not so puzzling that they do not consider her connection with Butler a problem. Chalk that up to the doctrine of multiculturalism or politics as usual. They can't wiggle out of that one without appearing less than liberal.

What is problematic is that Tulsi's politics seem counter to Sander's. But are they? Looking at Willis Butler's (Chris's father's) politics, they are perfectly aligned.

I would investigate if Bernie Sanders knew or knew of Willis Butler "back in the day". Willis was in touch with most of the prominent Socialists/leftists/Communists from the 1950's, 1960's till his death.

So our work is cut out for us.

One thing I can say for certain is that Chris Butler does not care a thing about social justice or humanity. The only thing he cares about is himself and playing his little masturbatory guru games. Just as he makes up his "spiritual path" as he goes, he will change his politics for his own fun and games.

Bernie doesn't mind a little aluminum foil stuck to his heels when the election is being stolen from him....