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Posted by: DINGO ()
Date: November 30, 2017 06:07AM

Don't be fooled by Dr Greg Baer's 'Real Love' Coaching program to teach you how to be unconditionally loving. After learning first-hand and immersing myself in this organisation I can safely state at the end of 6 months, the same as I stated at the beginning that it is most definitely a cult. It ticks every box. Is very clever and deceptive in many ways. It is disguised as a 'coaching company' and cloaked in the façade of being a 'charity' but in reality it is neither any of these.

The organisation I am referring to is from America, and has been set up in the UK - so the activities I refer to are all happening over here. It is called 'Real Love' and was developed by former eye surgeon Dr Greg Baer. He has written several published books on his 'program' or 'principles' for learning how to be 'unconditionally loving'. However, the play of words he uses in the books distorts RealLove with 'real' 'love' and for people who are vulnerable they will potentially not be able to see through the distortion. For example one of his sayings is..

"With Real Love, nothing else matters; without it, nothing else is enough". What this is saying is that the RL program (trademark registered etc.) is what 'real' 'love' is and what we cannot live without. However, when you state the sentence without seeing them written you would agree, not knowing what it was actually referring to. These types of clever statements are rife in all the books. Everything anyone talks about in a group or over the phone is immediately referred to one of Greg's one-liners. This man has made so many over-arching broad sweeping statements and claims - none of which can be backed up, yet they are all whole heartedly believed to be true by all the followers in RealLove.

This is because it is stated that not a single person in the whole world knows what real love is, and the only people who do know are the 'RealLove' people, and it is only they, and ONLY they who can show you what it really is.

Everyone not doing RealLove is somehow perceived as being insane, a victim, in anger, in fear and living a life of lies. Only those doing RealLove are somehow doing the love and unconditional love thing properly. They state that love comes in buckets - every human has a bucket of love. Love runs out, via holes in the bucket and from being given away. Therefore we become 'empty' of love. So we then have to go to a coach or 'daddy' from RealLove who can 'love us' and therefore top up our empty buckets. Only they know how to love us properly, because everyone not doing RealLove is only being conditional and not genuine in how they express their love, kindness, compassion etc.

Until you have 'experienced' the real thing from a coach/daddy then you don't know what real love is. You pay for a 'daddy' and/or a 'mummy' who will love you unconditionally and whom you can call anytime. Using Greg's process of 'Truth > Seen > Accepted > Loved' process, people will tell the truth about something they said, did or thought to their daddy, which means that they have been seen, and in turn because the daddy will not reject or criticise them this means that they have been accepted and therefore loved. This process fills up the empty buckets. (However, I feel that this is the exact same process of counselling and psychotherapy, as I went through this process after having a complete mental breakdown several years ago). But, seeing as Greg says that no one in the whole world (yes! the whole world!!), knows what proper 'real' 'love' is and have never felt it or received it before only they can give this love to people. Greg believes we all have a mental condition called PCSD (Post Childhood Stress Disorder) which everyone doing RealLove, and not doing RealLove is diagnosed with having. Similar to PTSD. So, because our real parents didn't love us properly we are all diagnosed as being just 2 or 3 year olds who are seeking that love our parents didn't give us. What people have to do, is to submit to being 'held'. This process is laying down in the arms of a coach/daddy and being held like a baby and kissed relentlessly and cuddled and nursed like a baby. Apparently we need lots of this to learn how to be loved, and once we know how to be loved, we'll be allowed to give our love to others ...... one day!

Marriages and relationships are broken up. People are told when they can or cannot go dating. All people doing RealLove want anyone they meet to do it too, or feel that they cannot meet anyone outside of RealLove, because they will be damaged by outside people who don't know how to love properly, are fake and only love conditionally etc...

Upon submitting to the having of a mummy and/or daddy (aka coach) people are suggested to relinquish their own parents, who parented everyone wrongly and didn't really love them properly, and instead they are replaced with an 'emotional dad' or 'emotional mum' who takes on that role for them as a parent loving the adult properly. People are also advised to relinquish their own children, friends, work colleages and anyone else. Those doing RealLove therefore become their own little family - all safe and sound. I have seen people who really should be under the care of Mental Health Services being pulled into this organisation and literally mentally being a child and seeing their coach as their real daddy and acting and behaving all childlike. They need proper care by trained professionals. When I joined the facebook secret page (which I have been defriended from, thank God) I gave out some kind and thoughtful suggestions to help people heal. However, I was scolded about this. They didn't want to 'frighten anyone away'. They clearly did not refer people to get proper help, but wanted instead to contain the weak and emotionally vulnerable so that they could keep them under their guard. In fact noting except Greg quotes or videos was allowed to be suggested on this page.

If anyone questions Greg and his teachings people immediately come to his defence, shut up and/or walk away and will not discuss anything. He is like a god or divine leader to them - they worship him even though they don't realise they are.

The sneaky thing is that this PCSD condition has not been recognised as a bona fide condition in the states, and never will be. Greg admits this in his book on the condition. He states that they are not psychologists, when what they are doing is clearly psychological work. When people sign up they go through what is called an 'Intervention' which involves a whole weekend of being fully psychologically profiled and every deep emotional wound is pulled out of people - and a whole lot more. This costs a lot of money. This is also where people are requested to separate or break up too. But sneakily, these are only 'suggestions' because everyone keeps being told that they get to choose, the choice is always theirs. However, no one goes against the suggestions - they are all convinced that they made the decision. Further, if they don't follow suggestions they are told that they "are not taking RealLove seriously" or that they do not care enough about themselves, that they will not heal, that they will always and forever be wounded and never find real love, or unconditional love and will only keep repeating all the past bad experiences. That of course is enough for people to obey all they are told to do. I am concerned about people who are not trained psychologists doing such deep psychological work - even though what they are preaching (the PCSD) is their own made up stuff and therefore by not being acknowledged it is not real psychology so therefore they are not breaking the law. Get my drift? It is very cleverly worked out.

In the UK, as in the states, RealLove is registered as a charity. However, they do not do any bona fide charitable work. The only charity that they do give is to certain members of RealLove who are financially dependant (on benefits etc.) and cannot afford to pay the extortionate costs involved. This does not happen often though. They also fundraise. The front of the organisation sells itself as a Coaching program. However, it is not looking like a bona fide coaching program to me. There is no set of specific factors which will be determined, a plan drawn up, a set of time worked out, and a set cost defined. There is no end to RealLove. No one seems to get out. No one seems to get healed and healthy. The program is ongoing. Greg has morphed the concept of our life journey (obstacles, storms, learning) with our emotional wounds from life experiences and melded them into one 'lifelong journey' where our wounds will not be healed. Although I have stated to people in RealLove that our journey is forever, but our wounds do get healed - they do not believe this. Because Greg says ....

There is big money for the Intervention, big money for the annual fees for a daddy/mummy/coach, a fee for Gregs video chats, fees for the annual '12 month program' (which happens every year, and is just Greg's principles pushed and pushed and pushed), there is big money for the weekend or day long courses and workshops too! Small money for attendance to groups, plus the urge to fund raise too.

At some point people are told to go shopping for a religion. Another source of love to add to that of their daddy. Most RealLove adherents turn to joining the Mormons - because Greg is a Mormon, and because the principles of RealLove align most beautifully with Mormonism. I believe Greg might be the biggest recruiter of new Mormons by the sounds of things!

People in RealLove are requested to hug people tightly and for a longer period than necessary as well as to stare deeply into people's eyes. Both are a bit disconcerting as they fall out of ordinary acceptable behaviours.

People in RealLove are required to immerse themselves into all the RealLove materials as much as possible (to the exclusion of anything else). This means books, videos, chats, phone calls, conference calls, 12-month programs, courses, and anything and everything that Greg says or does. The narrow-mindedness that this creates in the people I know that are involved in this is quite scary. I feel that they are trapped in something and are too blind to see or hear what they are saying or doing. In fact they believe that I am in pain, suffering, hurting, and are insane. In fact, when I said (many times actually) that I did not want to do RealLove I was told in no uncertain terms that I would be unhappy for the rest of my life, always meet the wrong people and would never find real love. It hurts to hear that being said. I have also been told that I 'need a daddy' that 'I need to learn to receive love properly' from a daddy, and that when, and only the daddy says so will I be 'allowed' to date someone (who of course they will choose for me!). I have always been insulted and unimpressed by this. Love is felt in the giving, love is received in the giving. It is not something you buy from someone, or that some people have more of than others, or that some people know how to do properly and others don't. The RealLove way is a defined set of principles devised by one man, and does not constitute what real love is or does in the world - despite him telling us that RealLove is the only source of 'real' 'love'.

I could go on and on and on, but I will stop here. The front of it looks okay - the websites etc. Going to a group session, is okay to a point but most people run when they see the 'holding' process happening. Getting signed up changes everything - and that is when the true nature of this organisation comes out in full.

This organisation is creepy to say the least. It is very devious and plays on the broken hearts and minds of people who are enormously confused, hurt, sad, broken, weak and vulnerable emotionally. When we are like this our minds are like a little child's and so we are 'open' to suggestion and manipulation. This is the best type of candidate for RealLove, as the long 'slow poach' by people in RL leads to fully brainwashed adherents who know not what they are saying and doing - just following Greg blindly and ruining their lives, but believing that he is healing them.

Lets hope this organisation is exposed for what it really is and all those poor people who have been deceived and manipulated given the help and assistance to recover and find their true selves and become whole again.

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Posted by: corboy ()
Date: November 30, 2017 11:34AM

Those interested can find an earlier discussion thread on Real Love here:


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Posted by: DINGO ()
Date: December 13, 2017 06:04AM

Interesting. Reading the Real Love Terms of Agreement. Last updated October 2014. It clearly states that RL is "not a substitute for proper medical attention, diagnosis, or treatment, or for other professional mental health or medical services." Yet, what I have seen happening in groups, and what people have gone through with 'interventions' is exactly this.

While RL promotes itself as a coaching company it states in its description of service that "Neither Dr. Baer nor The Real Love Company, Inc. nor any Real Love Coach will be held liable for the use that anyone might make of the information or advice given." but signing up to a coaching program is solely about being given advice and information to act upon to make your life better. What is the point of paying all this money and making a trade of money for service/product when they are not prepared to stand by the advice and information that they give to clients. This looks like there is no confidence in the program being sold - to publicly state that they will not stand by their own advice? This is contradictory to the whole concept of life coaching

"The Client takes full responsibility for any and all actions resulting from Real Love Coaching, and will not hold The Real Love Company, Inc. or any of the Real Love Coaches liable for the Client's failure to achieve his / her personal, professional, spiritual, or any other form of life goals." Again, there is no responsibility for the provision of a product for a price in the service agreement. What are people purchasing if there is no guarantee of an end product?

"We reserve the right, at any time, to modify, alter, or update the terms and conditions of this agreement without prior notice. Modifications shall become effective immediately upon being posted on this website"

"All information that you share with your Real Love Coach is confidential." This is not the case!!!

Real Love UK website and facebook pages are closed down - no explanation given

Real Love UK courses and other activities are suspended - no explanation given

The Real Love 'intervention' provided when people join/sign up requires the person to get naked - to be reborn again - while being held and nursed like a baby. Is this really coaching? Will this make people better at being more of a loving person? What about the psychological consequences of people with serious issues having to get naked, or the guilt if they fight against it - forever feeling that they are not going to heal properly like the others because they don't take Real Love seriously enough?

Some Real Love coaches have suspended activities - no explanation given

One wonders where is all the money is going?

This is NOT coaching. Coaching provides a definite product that gives people practical skills from day one, that the person can use and see positive outcomes from that use. People around them see the change and the build up of confidence and self esteem. No one is worried about them. No one is feeling concerned that it doesn't sound right. No one is usually pushed away or pushed out of people's life when they are being genuinely coached. Everyone sees a positive difference, and the coaching comes to an end with the product delivered as specified and paid for.

"While The Real Love Company, Inc. and the client's Coach will always exercise every available resource to help the Client meet their life goals" This last, no one gets forwarded to any other resource other than guided to totally immerse themselves in Greg Baer resources only until they are so narrow minded that the person can only quote Greg stuff over-and-over-and-over without realising what they are doing and saying.

I am glad I did not allow myself to get pulled in so deeply.

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Posted by: ANON541 ()
Date: December 17, 2017 06:45AM

Hi Dingo, thanks for your posts. I'm curious if you know anything about why Reallove uk closed down?

Also, I had not heard about people required to get naked and be "reborn", is that a new thing? Did that have anything to do with why they had to shutdown the uk group?

Also, I hope people checking into Mormonism check out youtube on how much of Joseph Smith's crazy stuff has now been debunked, especially how he mistranslated ancient scrolls as per heiroglyphic experts, and new dna evidence shows his visions regarding native americans are scientifically false.

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Posted by: Coody ()
Date: December 29, 2017 05:22PM


My husband got into this about 4years ago. Ive had 4years of it. Its been do hard. He also became a mormon in december 2016 without my acceptance, but he gave them my blessing umm no. So i spoke to rhe bishop and aaid in your hand book under certain section if your partner wife, husband doesnt agree then u dont have the right to get blessed and certainly dont have the right to rob me of 10% of our salary.....he still was blessed and attends every sunday 10 til 1.30
He tild me after he joines he was taking my girls twice a week...umm no your not . when we met we were non religious people and when we had kids we both said we want them to choose certainly not Greg Baer telling my husband too.
I eas introuduced to the one and only Pete Uglow in 2014 my husband dint tell me really much he said we were going ti meet a guy who could help us with my first childs behaviour so i went ti find it was acomplete bashing on me . first i was obessed on cleaning umm no just like to tidy up as i have a small house and if u leave too much stuff out then it becomes a mess.
Secondly my married would be over withing 6 year. Whilst this was all happening my husband sat next to pete (his dad, daddy lol) and said notjing, nothing at all. Heart breaking. Then it got worse to the point the police were invovled and i was seeking rights of custody of my kids as he said he would get full custidy bascially saying i was incapable oflooking after them. Mind. U i gave up my job to become a full time mumny to save money.
He has told me unless i do a intervetion at 3,500 then he was going to force my hand at divorce!!
The nightmare continues . but to find out its been closed i wish i knew exactly why but dont... Its good im not alone as i have felt its been me. My husband told me once it. Was all my fault that he took to good at hurting my heart strings.
I believe that thry will try and set up something new i know as hes said.
My husband was made awise man then and then they asjed he was to become a main man and train up.. I could go on and on .
Also the about of them that have vecome Mormons how is this right they are all doing it because of real love and i they say do!!!
Please keep in contact .
> Hi Dingo, thanks for your posts. I'm curious if
> you know anything about why Reallove uk closed
> down?
> Also, I had not heard about people required to get
> naked and be "reborn", is that a new thing? Did
> that have anything to do with why they had to
> shutdown the uk group?
> Also, I hope people checking into Mormonism check
> out youtube on how much of Joseph Smith's crazy
> stuff has now been debunked, especially how he
> mistranslated ancient scrolls as per heiroglyphic
> experts, and new dna evidence shows his visions
> regarding native americans are scientifically
> false.

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Posted by: DINGO ()
Date: December 29, 2017 10:28PM

Hey Coody,

I really, totally and fully understand all you are saying! It is totally outrageous and as you can see RealLove is clearly NOT life coaching at all. It is a cult organisation using thought-reform techniques to alter people's thoughts and behaviours. RealLove is really quite evil and not loving by any stretch of the imagination.

I don't think that the UK version run by couple Pete and Nikki Uglow is actually closed down at all. I think that they have gone underground for a while to re-invent themselves, change stuff, cross the T's and dot the I's and maybe rewrite their charity status and hide some of the underhanded stuff they have been doing - as well as try to get more money to keep it going. They may break off from Greg Baer, as others close to Greg have done, and run an organisation of their own but entirely based on Greg's principles. It will still be a trade of "we'll sell you unconditional love for money". That will never change. We also must remember that Pete Uglow is a former policeman and there are active members within this organisation too.

I can see that when your husband was made a 'wise man' that this was the point you had totally lost him. People only get given this status when they are completely absorbed in RealLove and eat, sleep, drink, eat and think RealLove 24 hours a day. They like to draw in people who are in respectable jobs in which the public see them as decent and sane individuals (Doctors, Academics, Police, Healthcare, Lawyers, etc.) because this stops people from doubting what they are getting into. Greg wrote RealLove from a foundation of his Mormon religion - so it is no surprise that when people are told to 'go and find a religion' at some point in their RealLove Journey, that they will be just a little nudged towards Mormonism because "It aligns more closely with the RealLove principles". However, a coaching program is only a passing thing in our life, a short course to help us improve an aspect of our life, so why would anyone join a religion based upon the principles of a coaching program? That's because it's not a coaching program and people don't end up leaving.

Coody, there is another thread on the message board about RealLove, it is in the thread called 'Large Group Awareness Training: Human Potential' and you will see that there are others just like you with the same problem. Another member has posted an array of book reviews from Amazon about Greg's books too. Please also remember that the Dr part of Greg's title refers to him being a former eye surgeon - that's all. He read books on psychology and religions, and attended various 12 step and other programs as well as counselling and hypnotherapy etc and just developed his own RealLove program as he thought that nothing had helped him to recover from being an alcoholic, drug addict (who nearly killed patients during surgery). So he is not qualified in mental health practice - and neither are any of the coaches. No one is licenced to do this type of psychotherapy work - although they say that they are not doing this. Truth is, they ARE doing exactly that. Greg is not an expert in anything except his own sinister program - don't let the MD fool you!!

I am in the process of reading 4 major books on Cults, and so far everything I have read in the first two books shows that RealLove is 100% a cult organisation. I thought I was going crazy at one stage as I was being pulled in to all of this, but thankfully my gut instinct protected me and I didn't allow myself to pulled in any deeper than I was. It just didn't feel right or look right. You cannot challenge or question anything about RealLove or Greg without people walking away from you.

Just remember, what has happened is not about you. Greg has told everyone that only he and RealLove have proper unconditional love and that you have to go through them to get it. All the theories he proposes are contradictory and pain everyone not doing RealLove as being toxic, negative and giving love 'conditionally' (apparently when outsiders give love it is to get something and not real - only the love given by RealLove people is real). Your husband believes he has been saved. But remember, he has been subjected to a slow process of brainwashing called 'thought-reform', to being 'love-bombed' by people in Real Love and in the Mormon church (boy are the Mormons good at love bombing!). He will have been subjected to other forms of brainwashing without realising and will have become dependent over time on RealLove from his new daddy and mummy rather than the 'real' 'love' of the real world. He will hold within any stress or anxiety about people, situations, events etc that happen in his life, pushing the people who love him away, and saving it all up for a Group session, or visiting daddy, so he can be held and nursed like a little baby. It all sounds and 'is' totally bizarre, but not to the people doing RealLove. They are just led to believe that everyone else not doing RealLove are the crazy one's.

I am not sure what any of us can do to about exposing this organisation for what it truly is. How does one get a cult organisation out into the open so it can be publicly, professionally and openly scrutinised?

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Posted by: ANON541 ()
Date: January 01, 2018 06:04PM

There seems to be 2 reallove cult message boards but in case you have not read my previous post on how to get someone out of reallove here is what I wrote:
Suggestions if someone you know is involved with the reallove cult.

1. Do not attack or criticise reallove or Greg Baer. This only creates hostility and you will be seen as the enemy.

2. One of the principles of reallove is that couples totally agree on money decisions. You may need to be firm in not agreeing to big money being spent here if that is your truth. Remain in your integrity and truth.

3. From a place of fun and humour you can help your friend see the glaring falseness in paying big money to get “unconditional love.”

4. Be very clear yourself on what dependence is and what co-dependence is. If someone is dependent on Greg Baer or a reallove coach that is still co-dependence.

5. Get clear about “transference” and understand clearly why therapists have always refrained from providing the love that their clients need.

6. Give your loved one time in this. The Greg Baer “I will be your Daddy, sit on my lap and get a hug,” shtick wears off before long on anyone willing to maintain any self-awareness. It may be something that they need at this particular moment.

I will just add a few things that i think are helpful.

Do not make reallove evil or bad. These are just struggling people with real problems trying to find their way.

We humans want everything to be black or white. They are not. Reallove has some good principles and some crap. It's a mixed bag.

Truth has a way of winning. When, in a fun and happy way you point out the glaring inconsistencies in this group the truth has to win.

1. Paying money to Greg for "unconditional love" is a lie. It's not unconditional if you are paying $50 a minute. Wake up.

2. Stop trying to control others. Have your own boundaries on what you will do and let others, your son, husband, whoever do what they want. Adults get to do what they want, even be in a reallove cult.

3.If you are married you need to both agree on financial decisions and if it is money being spent on reallove the group will try to slide around their own principle on this but know it is there in their own material.

4. Understand the difference between love and approval. Love is what we feel internally. Approval is what we get from others. If it's coming from others and if you are looking for something coming from others, you are simply looking for approval. Approval is not unconditional love. Having someone say, "I love you," is getting approval not getting unconditional love.

5. If anyone thinks they are getting unconditional love from this group, stop paying money to them and see how long they care about you.

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Posted by: Coody ()
Date: January 06, 2018 04:37PM

Hi dingo

Thank u so much fir messaging me back with sure reassurance that its not me...

That u havent been going mad for four years....i really did get to the point that i thought hus daddy (pete uglow) was every thing to him.

Something needs to be done they cant be allowed to carry on in anyway.

Please keep in contact.


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How REAL LOVE works!
Posted by: DINGO ()
Date: February 27, 2018 05:30AM

This is a long post – but one that explains the beginning of how people initially and blindly get drawn into joining Real Love, and how the practices used and employed are ALL well-known, and well-used practices that ALL the large and small, known and unknown cult groups have used and do still do use to this day. Life Coaching does not employ these methods and neither do professionally trained and qualified psychological, psychiatric, mental health or other therapeutic practitioners. As this is long, I am breaking it up into more than one post, as there is a lot to digest. I share this first-hand knowledge for the simple reason to warn people what is really going on with this group and to stop any more families from being broken apart, relationship separations happening and all the other emotionally destructive stuff that takes over the people pulled into doing RL in full and not only ruining their lives but taking control of their minds without them realising it!

How do you find yourself being pulled into a cult?

If we’re strong willed, level headed and have a clue about what cult behaviour looks like we don’t get pulled into one. In fact, we run to the hills as fast as we can, we warn others and we stay away. If we’re going through some major life transition though or have a lot of confusion going on, are dealing with a relationship break up, or are vulnerable in some way and therefore not really at our best, we can EASILY get pulled-in. The most intelligent and savvy of people DO get pulled in – not always immediately but eventually. These are the most cherished people to have in a cult – particularly if you have a good job, are an upstanding member of the community etc. The emotionally weak and vulnerable can also be pulled in as they don’t really have their wits about them – but from a cult perspective, unless they are outwardly mentally unwell, they are great candidates for their minds are very easily manipulated. And sadly the most ordinary of people with nothing much going on in their lives and who are not vulnerable, not gullible, but are at a stage in their life where they may be ‘seeking’. For some this is mid-life. The seeking of more meaning to life, of answers to why so many bad things happened in their life, why they have made so many bad mistakes, etc. People who want to change, to be a better person, a better parent, a better friend; just a better human being all round. Seeking for a more relaxed, loving, whole, fulfilled life. All these are the types of people are drawn into a cult. And they are great fodder for cults because they either WANT change in their life, or NEED a change in their life (or both)!! And RealLove are more than happy to provide that change!

So, if we’re not the highly strong willed type and we don’t have our head screwed fully on at a certain period in our life then how do we tell if we are actually getting involved in a cult? We can’t. But, our family, friends, co-workers, children, extended friends and even complete strangers and acquaintances WILL be able to tell us that we are. They’ll pick up on things straight away and be suggesting, almost begging in some cases, for us to STOP our involvement. But we won’t believe them. The reason why we won’t believe them lies in what happens during our first few encounters with the cult group – this is why it is highly recommended that before engaging in joining a group of any sort (whether through ‘Meet Ups’ or other methods) that you check out the name of the group on cult websites – such as this one. If you attend a meeting without doing so you need to check the websites afterwards and ask around for advice about what you have encountered, what was said and done etc. and despite the fact that the ‘group’ were all ‘really lovely people’ and ‘very loving’ you need to listen carefully to these objective outsider viewpoints, and do your research! And if you never return then these lovely people won’t miss you as they’re used to most people fleeing anyway, and they’ll be more people going along for them to try and drag in to their net. So, PLEASE, trust the instincts of everyone in your life who know you and love you – NOT the total strangers in this group who have demonstrated this overwhelming show of love. It’s not real. Even if you’ve had the worst of family relationships your family will still tell you the truth about seeing a group as a bad or a good thing for you, and especially if they feel it is a cult. They DO have your best interests at heart. But the fact remains that once we’ve gone along to two sessions and we’ve made a decision to return – it’s too late. If we don’t run by the first or second group session then we’re well on the way to being GROOMED for full membership and all that goes with it. And we don’t realise that we are being pulled into a cult because of one massively BIG reason – which we ourselves cannot see or perceive. And this is because we are being subjected to MIND-CONTROL techniques – also known as coercive persuasion and psychological influence. Unless you’ve read up on this stuff and can spot it happening you are not able to identify these techniques and so fall victim to them. That is why you need to speak about them and what happened at a group meeting, so that other people can hear objectively about it all and share their objective perspective.

This is most definitely what happens in RealLove ©(Trademark, Registered). As has been clearly shown on this thread and the one in “Large Group Awareness Training: Human Potential” under the title 'quote, unquote "Real Love"-$$$' – you will understand that RealLove ©(Trademark, Registered) poses as a Life Coaching organisation, but actually does unqualified psychological therapy (psychological re-evaluation), is structured and operates as a cult, and all while disguised as a registered charity (or a Foundation in the UK).

Note that if ANY group meeting you attend uses ANY of the following techniques that they are indeed a CULT GROUP – bona fide organisations DO NOT use these tactics.

So, what happens in the very first encounters with RealLove ©(Trademark Registered) ? We may either have read the first book by the founder Dr Greg Baer (a former eye surgeon) and be inspired to seek a group to go to, to learn more about what’s in the book. We may have been given the book by someone ‘doing RealLove’ and they may be raving about it and all enthusiastic about how you NEED to have this organisation in your life etc. how it changed them for the better blablabla. Don’t believe anyone doing RealLove © (Trademark, Registered) as they are fully mentally manipulated. I will not and cannot say brainwashed, as that is a different technique and is enforced by force, torture etc. They may be quite pushy and forceful, and go on and on and on proselytizing non-stop. Don’t engage with them, just take the book and go along with them. You do not have to read it. But if you do, that is fine – take what resonates and embrace all that is useful to you, but remember that you do not need to do the groups, or purchase the whole program. You DO NOT need to get fully involved at all. There is very little to offer outside of the books. They entice you to believe there is more, which can only be found by doing the full RL program – but the reality is that by doing their program you will not find the ‘more’ you are looking for, because there isn’t any. There are no other special answers. It’s the same stuff from the books rehashed over and over again. Be careful because the books themselves are working to convince us that RealLove ©(Trademark, Registered) is actually genuine, perfect, unconditional love. Don’t fall for this ploy. Best just take what’s useful and hand the book back or better still, throw it away. This is not a book (or books) you’d want to keep on the bookshelf to read again. Except if you are ‘doing RealLove ©(Trademark, Registered)’ by which you WILL be reading them over and over as part of the full immersion process.

If you come to RealLove©(Trademark, Registered) through reading one of the books first you will end up at some point curious to attend a group session. Or, you may be looking on the ‘Meet Ups’ website and find an RL group. You may find this group without ever knowing about the books and be drawn in by the idea of having a better and more loving life – and most especially, if your life has been one that has been fraught with sadness, relationship disasters etc. However, there may be others who come to experience RL purely because they meet and start dating someone who is doing it. The person they are dating may be just doing RL groups or doing the full RL program and so at some point you might be pulled in to attend an RL group meeting. You may not feel drawn to even want to go, because you feel quite happy and content with your life. However, regardless of how together you are, how level-headed, how happy and loved you feel, how whole and content you are – the RealLove ©(Trademark, Registered) Group meeting will set out to CHANGE all that. You will be led to believe that your life is a complete sham and that you have NEVER been unconditionally loved in your entire life, and especially not now. You will be subjected to MIND-CONTROL techniques that will completely alter your sense of self and well-being to the negative. And there are people on both RL threads on this website who can attest to the power of what attending a couple of RL groups can do to completely change someone's life!

You go along. You get a lovely welcome at the door. Everyone is super happy to see you. I mean SUPER happy to see you. You are most likely going to be given a great BIG and LONG hug. It is one of the principles of RealLove©(Trademark, Registered). Everyone doing the group must each hug one another LONG and BIG before the group begins, and at the conclusion of the group. This is NOT by any means the genuine expression of hugging which is led by the heart to embrace someone and give them your love and energy. This is a process. The group begins with a ‘Check In’ where each person states how they feel there and then – what their day or week has been like, how bad they’ve been or felt or what they’ve said, and what they would like to share (usually a truth about them self) if they feel that they need to. As each person speaks up you feel straight away how much RealLove focuses on negative behaviours and how much RL jargon and loaded language is used to describe people’s behaviours, feelings, actions and attitudes. Rarely is anything positive and good shared – but when it is there is attached to it a sense of guilt and shame or some sort of negativity is pulled out. There is a lot of dwelling on past behaviours and events, situations and interactions with other people – not just for the day or past week, but within people’s lives in general.

The people who want to ‘share a truth’ start to tell their truths about their ‘Getting and Protecting Behaviours’ that they have used. Truths that should remain private in some instances, at least with close family or friends; or certain other truths that really should be dealt with by a health professional so that the person can learn to fully understand and come to terms with it. Sharing something deeply personal or shameful about yourself in a group setting can be freeing to some extent, but true healing will not take place without qualified help from health professionals. In the RL group situation the telling of truths means you are now free – you are accepted by others (despite your rotten deeds) – and therefore you are loved. This is the RealLove ©(Trademark, Registered) philosophy. Tell the truth – you are then seen – once you are seen for who you are you can be accepted (without criticism, judgement etc.) = you are loved. That’s it. If you are ‘doing RL’ then when you tell a truth, not only are you seen, accepted and loved, but you are ‘really loved’ which means ‘unconditionally loved’ which means that your RL daddy or mummy loves you so everything is alright. For example, you can state that you have been nasty and vindictive all day to everyone and caused a lot of hurt and heartache to everyone whose lives you touched – but that’s all completely okay because you weren’t loved properly as a child, but your RL daddy loves you, so everything is fine. You are not accountable. You are not responsible. You don’t have to study your behaviour. You don’t have to come to terms with it and how you affected others. You don’t have to understand it in order to avoid it happening again. No apologies. Nothing. No. Because you are LOVED by your RL daddy or mummy so ‘nothing else matters’. You are thus FULL of RealLove ©(Trademark, Registered) version of unconditional love so you are free and full. The truth telling in RL groups is NOT healing and at the end of the day no matter how long or short anyone stays in this cult group people will NEED to get the proper help to sort through some pretty heavy issues. Part of being in the RL group means that you are not to mock, shame, question, judge, criticise or engage with the person telling the truth. You just let them tell their truth. This can be uncomfortable to hear and to experience, especially seeing someone having a truth pulled out of them by RL people, when they really don’t want to tell that truth in the group setting. And of course the person will FEEL a whole lot better afterwards, just from having spoken it in words in front of others. They WILL feel lighter and better in their self. And apparently THIS is the magic that is RealLove ©(Trademark, Registered). Yet this process happens in all sorts of ways and settings anyway – except we talk about the really deep psychological stuff to trained professionals who KNOW how the mind works and can help us to safely navigate bringing up traumatic feelings and emotions and then safely bring us back to our self once again – NOT leaving us completely OPEN and more vulnerable to sharing more and more in this way in the WRONG setting. But RealLove©(Trademark, Registered) shuns any form of therapy and psychological help. Calling it rubbish and useless – stating that RL is the only way and the way that works!

So what actually ‘happens’ in a group other than talking and sharing? While you are in the group you’ll also be ‘Love-Bombed’ which incidentally is a trick used in every single cult organisation – large or small, regardless of type. My god the person attending the group for the first time will be fooled into believing that everyone in the group is so LOVING and wonderful and will be wanting them self to be just like this. This is over affection that is quite sickly and obnoxious when you can see it for what it is; but when you are weakened you will easily be totally fooled by it and actually BELIEVE that it is real. It’s not. It’s another one of the principles of RL. The other thing that you’ll see happen in groups is a lot of touching. Not just the obligatory holding of hands, one or both if possible especially if able to form a circle. That’s not too bad – but it is not spontaneous and genuine. There is also what the group call ‘skin’ and this is where people will touch or stroke each other while sitting in the group. It might be that someone has another person run their fingers through someone’s hair, or gently fondle their head, neck, shoulders etc. Arms might be placed around the shoulders or waist of the person sitting next to them. Bear in mind, complete strangers here – touching each other in ways that some people may not have experienced for a very long time. If someone has been single for a long time or has had certain relationship problems they will in some way be drawn to receiving the touch given by a stranger in this group setting. Almost looking forward to attending the next group and being love-bombed, hugged, joyfully welcomed, touched and stroked and being able to free their-self of some painful emotional shit that they’ve held in.

But there’s more…

There will be a point, if not in the first group attended, but very soon in the weeks ahead, where the notion of ‘holding’ will surface. In the biggest and most well-known cults in history this process is known as ‘cradling’. Greg Baer and his RealLove©(Trademark, Registered) have taken the exact same process and just given it another name. Basically, you are held prostrate ‘like a baby’ in the arms of a RL coach (daddy or mummy) or another RL person. Hugged, kissed, stroked and touched and nursed and spoken to like a little baby. Yep! And if you are strong-willed and whole, after seeing this happen in the group you attend, you’ll probably be running for the hills and never return to another RL group session. Wisely so! These are the ones who are saved from being drawn in to this cult group. Bless them for seeing through it all. Bless those who don’t see what is happening too. A very uncomfortable thing to submit to, and totally unnecessary for any form of healing – of past traumatic experiences, inner child, emotional immaturity or whatever – there is absolutely NO need for this. None at all – despite what RL and Greg Baer say to the contrary. This is part of the MIND-CONTROL and INFANTILISATION process which will draw you further and further in. For a lot of people who have been ‘doing RL’ for a long time – they have become addicted to holding. They love it. They crave it. They cannot wait for their group session in order to be ‘held’ like a baby. They will push away all the people actually ‘in’ their life and who are openly, willingly, and genuinely providing (or attempting to provide) love and support to help them through stuff in favour of waiting for ‘group’ to get babied like a baby. Thus is DEPENDENCE, CO-DEPENDENCE and ADDICTION built.

The RL groups make it all look and seem so very normal. But hey, unless done in jest no grown man would willingly lie in another adult man’s arms prostrate like a baby and call him daddy, and behave all baby-like! Seriously! This process is all related to Greg Baer’s idea that all our problems in life relate to ‘not being loved properly’ as children, and our parents failing to show us unconditional love etc. and so as adults we don’t know what unconditional love really looks or feels like. Apparently. No we didn’t get RealLove ©(Trademark, Registered) in our childhood’s (thank God!) but we have ALL, every single one of us received a lot of unconditional love in our lives – in all the manifestations it shows up daily. This is where people have to BE STRONG because you WILL be convinced that ALL your relationships with family are all wrong and unloving, that everyone in your whole life is only giving you their love conditionally. You WILL be made to believe that your life is a lie, that no one really loves you – except, of course, those in RealLove ©(Trademark, Registered). They are clearly the ‘ONLY’ ones who know how to properly love people. Why? Because Greg Baer said so. Also remember that EVERY SINGLE CULT group in history states the same things as RL – they draw us into the childhood thing and all the negativity, never speaking about any of the positive experiences or the love that WAS received in our childhood. RealLove©(Trademark, Registered) behaves EXACTLY in the same way as every other cult group – preaching the exact same things, doing the exact same processes and rituals. EVERYTHING is copied directly from other cult groups. All this ‘love’ and ‘affection’ and touching from the group meetings will lead people to, albeit falsely, ’feel loved’. However, it’s not ‘real’ ‘love’ at all, it’s just a process of principles enacted to deliberately massage your emotions, weaken your resolve to question and think clearly and to build a gradual reliance and dependence on the group. The weekly ‘group’ thus becomes like a drug – and slowly the addiction builds and builds. That’s how cults work – that’s how RealLove© (trademark, registered) works too!

Please, please, please don’t be fooled. Be strong and pull away while you can. But…… there’s more to the group meeting…

As the session progresses and different RL concepts are explored, jargon used and the loaded language specific to RL starts creeping out your curiosity will get hold of you. You will question certain things that are said in response to your queries and questions, and you’ll be given quite confusing answers. The confident and happy way they are delivered makes you believe you are the one in the wrong – that maybe it’s you, your own self who has it all wrong. WRONG. What is being delivered in the loaded language and the responses and replies is what is known as the ‘double-bind’. This is where RL will use analogies or metaphors that we all know and understand from the wisdom contained in them, but instead they are re-invented slightly and given a different and very distorted slant – which confuses you. The confidence in the way spoken to you (the old creepy salesman technique) leads you to doubt your interpretation. You are NOT wrong to challenge this or critically evaluate, but just remember that as you do so, you’ll be gradually subjected to some mockery and a feeling that you are showing to everyone present that you clearly are crying out to be loved, that you are in pain, that you are believing the lies, being a victim, or whatever else. The blatant double-bind works such that whatever way you look at it, it doesn’t work – there is no logic to it. You will leave the group doubting our own thinking, beliefs, values, life, future and your own self-identity. Every answer, point of view or perspective put forward will have been challenged and completely blitzed by RL ideology and so you leave all confused – because you’ll also be feeling the love, the affection, and the attention. Nature will be nagging at you to figure all this confusion out!

You tell your friends at work about the group and they all say it’s a cult, get out while you can. You don’t get to tell them everything that happened because they are so adamant about it and feel they would probably mock and shame you if you spoke about it all - so you hide the rest of what happened and keep it to yourself. The same thing happens when you tell family and anyone else in your life. But hey, you are still curious, because those other RL people ‘seemed’ to be happy and have their shit together. You also have that normal human in-built need to figure out the things that confuse and confound us, so deep down, you don’t tell anyone, but you decide to go to just one more group and then if it doesn’t answer your questions then you’ll leave. But hey ho! when you turn up to ‘group’ the next time, no matter how strong you plan to be, you will once again enjoy all the attention – as you would, anyone would! You go through the motions and then the challenges you have (some of them planted in your mind by all those WORRIED and CONCERNED family and friends!) are ready to be shared, expressed, questions posed etc. But the RL people know in advance what questions you’ll be asking. They know because it’s happened countless times before and they are stocked ready with all the answers to lock you down and block any form of critical debate. They have been expecting you – because you loved it so much at your first session and they could see the lost, lonely, hurt person inside of you. They are really quite excited now as this is the beginning of taking control of YOUR thoughts and changing them to a completely different mind-set – THEIRS! As you question, they’ll have ALL the answers. Every single one of them, from every angle and perspective – every analogy and metaphor, every explanation all worked out in advance. You are just one of many who have fallen prey. Most answers will be DOUBLE-BINDS which are meant to confuse you, and they will – but that is how it is meant to be in order to pull you in. You are meant to be confused. This is what RealLove©(Trademark, Registered) wants, because now you’re easily manipulatable, easily swayed to self-doubt and can start to be coerced into seeing the light – their light – the RL light, their way.

And there’s more to look for….. more to be aware of…. Of which I will share soon.

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Posted by: corboy ()
Date: February 27, 2018 10:22PM

"The most intelligent and savvy of people DO get pulled in – not always immediately but eventually. "

A **major** way even the savviest of us get recruited without our realizing we are getting recruited is through people we love and trust.

A beloved friend or relative or trusted acquaintance of ours may be in a cult - and not even be aware of it, because they have not yet been harmed badly enough to have their eyes opened.

These people may off handedly mention some "classes" they attend, or that their child benefits from. These people we love and trust may occasionally praise a therapist or yoga teacher who has done wonders for them or for their child.

Because of this trusted friend or relative you will slowly get accustomed to hearing the name of this "art group", theatre group, choir, therapist, teacher, yoga instructor, school, church.

Then, bang. Life happens. You are plunged into a crisis. Or your child is plunged into a crisis which means you are plunged into a crisis.

You are devastated, confused, bewitched, bothered and bewildered.

You get curious about this person or group your pal has mentioned over the years and which has come to be familiar to you......

This is how recruitment takes place. We are convinced we have chosen to do this, but did not know that our trusted friend or relative was unknowingly or knowingly under the influence of a cult and was an "agent of deployment"

This is how I got involved with an abusive therapist for 19 years -- and stayed with this person despite my being very knowledgeable about cults and exploitative organizations.

It all started with a beloved friend whom I trusted.

The most important thing to do is -- develop and maintain a wide array
of friends and acquaintances whom you can talk with.

It is so easy to be led into an exploitative organization.

What keeps us trapped in exploitative situations is when the exploitative entity
becomes the source of our social input and we discard our outside friends or we
fail to develop friendships outside of the exploitative relationship -- by their nature exploitative people and groups seek to monopolize our attention and energy.

The biggest tip off is if you sense a grinding feeling of unease at the mere possiblity that someone might fail to share your trust in the exploitative group or person, or worse you feel grinding anxiety at the mere possiblity that someone might criticise the person or group or tell you something you don't want to know.

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