REAL LOVE
Posted by: DINGO ()
Date: November 30, 2017 06:07AM

Don't be fooled by Dr Greg Baer's 'Real Love' Coaching program to teach you how to be unconditionally loving. After learning first-hand and immersing myself in this organisation I can safely state at the end of 6 months, the same as I stated at the beginning that it is most definitely a cult. It ticks every box. Is very clever and deceptive in many ways. It is disguised as a 'coaching company' and cloaked in the façade of being a 'charity' but in reality it is neither any of these.

The organisation I am referring to is from America, and has been set up in the UK - so the activities I refer to are all happening over here. It is called 'Real Love' and was developed by former eye surgeon Dr Greg Baer. He has written several published books on his 'program' or 'principles' for learning how to be 'unconditionally loving'. However, the play of words he uses in the books distorts RealLove with 'real' 'love' and for people who are vulnerable they will potentially not be able to see through the distortion. For example one of his sayings is..


"With Real Love, nothing else matters; without it, nothing else is enough". What this is saying is that the RL program (trademark registered etc.) is what 'real' 'love' is and what we cannot live without. However, when you state the sentence without seeing them written you would agree, not knowing what it was actually referring to. These types of clever statements are rife in all the books. Everything anyone talks about in a group or over the phone is immediately referred to one of Greg's one-liners. This man has made so many over-arching broad sweeping statements and claims - none of which can be backed up, yet they are all whole heartedly believed to be true by all the followers in RealLove.


This is because it is stated that not a single person in the whole world knows what real love is, and the only people who do know are the 'RealLove' people, and it is only they, and ONLY they who can show you what it really is.


Everyone not doing RealLove is somehow perceived as being insane, a victim, in anger, in fear and living a life of lies. Only those doing RealLove are somehow doing the love and unconditional love thing properly. They state that love comes in buckets - every human has a bucket of love. Love runs out, via holes in the bucket and from being given away. Therefore we become 'empty' of love. So we then have to go to a coach or 'daddy' from RealLove who can 'love us' and therefore top up our empty buckets. Only they know how to love us properly, because everyone not doing RealLove is only being conditional and not genuine in how they express their love, kindness, compassion etc.


Until you have 'experienced' the real thing from a coach/daddy then you don't know what real love is. You pay for a 'daddy' and/or a 'mummy' who will love you unconditionally and whom you can call anytime. Using Greg's process of 'Truth > Seen > Accepted > Loved' process, people will tell the truth about something they said, did or thought to their daddy, which means that they have been seen, and in turn because the daddy will not reject or criticise them this means that they have been accepted and therefore loved. This process fills up the empty buckets. (However, I feel that this is the exact same process of counselling and psychotherapy, as I went through this process after having a complete mental breakdown several years ago). But, seeing as Greg says that no one in the whole world (yes! the whole world!!), knows what proper 'real' 'love' is and have never felt it or received it before only they can give this love to people. Greg believes we all have a mental condition called PCSD (Post Childhood Stress Disorder) which everyone doing RealLove, and not doing RealLove is diagnosed with having. Similar to PTSD. So, because our real parents didn't love us properly we are all diagnosed as being just 2 or 3 year olds who are seeking that love our parents didn't give us. What people have to do, is to submit to being 'held'. This process is laying down in the arms of a coach/daddy and being held like a baby and kissed relentlessly and cuddled and nursed like a baby. Apparently we need lots of this to learn how to be loved, and once we know how to be loved, we'll be allowed to give our love to others ...... one day!


Marriages and relationships are broken up. People are told when they can or cannot go dating. All people doing RealLove want anyone they meet to do it too, or feel that they cannot meet anyone outside of RealLove, because they will be damaged by outside people who don't know how to love properly, are fake and only love conditionally etc...


Upon submitting to the having of a mummy and/or daddy (aka coach) people are suggested to relinquish their own parents, who parented everyone wrongly and didn't really love them properly, and instead they are replaced with an 'emotional dad' or 'emotional mum' who takes on that role for them as a parent loving the adult properly. People are also advised to relinquish their own children, friends, work colleages and anyone else. Those doing RealLove therefore become their own little family - all safe and sound. I have seen people who really should be under the care of Mental Health Services being pulled into this organisation and literally mentally being a child and seeing their coach as their real daddy and acting and behaving all childlike. They need proper care by trained professionals. When I joined the facebook secret page (which I have been defriended from, thank God) I gave out some kind and thoughtful suggestions to help people heal. However, I was scolded about this. They didn't want to 'frighten anyone away'. They clearly did not refer people to get proper help, but wanted instead to contain the weak and emotionally vulnerable so that they could keep them under their guard. In fact noting except Greg quotes or videos was allowed to be suggested on this page.


If anyone questions Greg and his teachings people immediately come to his defence, shut up and/or walk away and will not discuss anything. He is like a god or divine leader to them - they worship him even though they don't realise they are.


The sneaky thing is that this PCSD condition has not been recognised as a bona fide condition in the states, and never will be. Greg admits this in his book on the condition. He states that they are not psychologists, when what they are doing is clearly psychological work. When people sign up they go through what is called an 'Intervention' which involves a whole weekend of being fully psychologically profiled and every deep emotional wound is pulled out of people - and a whole lot more. This costs a lot of money. This is also where people are requested to separate or break up too. But sneakily, these are only 'suggestions' because everyone keeps being told that they get to choose, the choice is always theirs. However, no one goes against the suggestions - they are all convinced that they made the decision. Further, if they don't follow suggestions they are told that they "are not taking RealLove seriously" or that they do not care enough about themselves, that they will not heal, that they will always and forever be wounded and never find real love, or unconditional love and will only keep repeating all the past bad experiences. That of course is enough for people to obey all they are told to do. I am concerned about people who are not trained psychologists doing such deep psychological work - even though what they are preaching (the PCSD) is their own made up stuff and therefore by not being acknowledged it is not real psychology so therefore they are not breaking the law. Get my drift? It is very cleverly worked out.


In the UK, as in the states, RealLove is registered as a charity. However, they do not do any bona fide charitable work. The only charity that they do give is to certain members of RealLove who are financially dependant (on benefits etc.) and cannot afford to pay the extortionate costs involved. This does not happen often though. They also fundraise. The front of the organisation sells itself as a Coaching program. However, it is not looking like a bona fide coaching program to me. There is no set of specific factors which will be determined, a plan drawn up, a set of time worked out, and a set cost defined. There is no end to RealLove. No one seems to get out. No one seems to get healed and healthy. The program is ongoing. Greg has morphed the concept of our life journey (obstacles, storms, learning) with our emotional wounds from life experiences and melded them into one 'lifelong journey' where our wounds will not be healed. Although I have stated to people in RealLove that our journey is forever, but our wounds do get healed - they do not believe this. Because Greg says ....


There is big money for the Intervention, big money for the annual fees for a daddy/mummy/coach, a fee for Gregs video chats, fees for the annual '12 month program' (which happens every year, and is just Greg's principles pushed and pushed and pushed), there is big money for the weekend or day long courses and workshops too! Small money for attendance to groups, plus the urge to fund raise too.


At some point people are told to go shopping for a religion. Another source of love to add to that of their daddy. Most RealLove adherents turn to joining the Mormons - because Greg is a Mormon, and because the principles of RealLove align most beautifully with Mormonism. I believe Greg might be the biggest recruiter of new Mormons by the sounds of things!


People in RealLove are requested to hug people tightly and for a longer period than necessary as well as to stare deeply into people's eyes. Both are a bit disconcerting as they fall out of ordinary acceptable behaviours.


People in RealLove are required to immerse themselves into all the RealLove materials as much as possible (to the exclusion of anything else). This means books, videos, chats, phone calls, conference calls, 12-month programs, courses, and anything and everything that Greg says or does. The narrow-mindedness that this creates in the people I know that are involved in this is quite scary. I feel that they are trapped in something and are too blind to see or hear what they are saying or doing. In fact they believe that I am in pain, suffering, hurting, and are insane. In fact, when I said (many times actually) that I did not want to do RealLove I was told in no uncertain terms that I would be unhappy for the rest of my life, always meet the wrong people and would never find real love. It hurts to hear that being said. I have also been told that I 'need a daddy' that 'I need to learn to receive love properly' from a daddy, and that when, and only the daddy says so will I be 'allowed' to date someone (who of course they will choose for me!). I have always been insulted and unimpressed by this. Love is felt in the giving, love is received in the giving. It is not something you buy from someone, or that some people have more of than others, or that some people know how to do properly and others don't. The RealLove way is a defined set of principles devised by one man, and does not constitute what real love is or does in the world - despite him telling us that RealLove is the only source of 'real' 'love'.


I could go on and on and on, but I will stop here. The front of it looks okay - the websites etc. Going to a group session, is okay to a point but most people run when they see the 'holding' process happening. Getting signed up changes everything - and that is when the true nature of this organisation comes out in full.

This organisation is creepy to say the least. It is very devious and plays on the broken hearts and minds of people who are enormously confused, hurt, sad, broken, weak and vulnerable emotionally. When we are like this our minds are like a little child's and so we are 'open' to suggestion and manipulation. This is the best type of candidate for RealLove, as the long 'slow poach' by people in RL leads to fully brainwashed adherents who know not what they are saying and doing - just following Greg blindly and ruining their lives, but believing that he is healing them.

Lets hope this organisation is exposed for what it really is and all those poor people who have been deceived and manipulated given the help and assistance to recover and find their true selves and become whole again.

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Re: REAL LOVE
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: November 30, 2017 11:34AM

Those interested can find an earlier discussion thread on Real Love here:

[forum.culteducation.com]

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Re: REAL LOVE
Posted by: DINGO ()
Date: December 13, 2017 06:04AM

Interesting. Reading the Real Love Terms of Agreement. Last updated October 2014. It clearly states that RL is "not a substitute for proper medical attention, diagnosis, or treatment, or for other professional mental health or medical services." Yet, what I have seen happening in groups, and what people have gone through with 'interventions' is exactly this.

While RL promotes itself as a coaching company it states in its description of service that "Neither Dr. Baer nor The Real Love Company, Inc. nor any Real Love Coach will be held liable for the use that anyone might make of the information or advice given." but signing up to a coaching program is solely about being given advice and information to act upon to make your life better. What is the point of paying all this money and making a trade of money for service/product when they are not prepared to stand by the advice and information that they give to clients. This looks like there is no confidence in the program being sold - to publicly state that they will not stand by their own advice? This is contradictory to the whole concept of life coaching

"The Client takes full responsibility for any and all actions resulting from Real Love Coaching, and will not hold The Real Love Company, Inc. or any of the Real Love Coaches liable for the Client's failure to achieve his / her personal, professional, spiritual, or any other form of life goals." Again, there is no responsibility for the provision of a product for a price in the service agreement. What are people purchasing if there is no guarantee of an end product?

"We reserve the right, at any time, to modify, alter, or update the terms and conditions of this agreement without prior notice. Modifications shall become effective immediately upon being posted on this website"

"All information that you share with your Real Love Coach is confidential." This is not the case!!!


Real Love UK website and facebook pages are closed down - no explanation given

Real Love UK courses and other activities are suspended - no explanation given

The Real Love 'intervention' provided when people join/sign up requires the person to get naked - to be reborn again - while being held and nursed like a baby. Is this really coaching? Will this make people better at being more of a loving person? What about the psychological consequences of people with serious issues having to get naked, or the guilt if they fight against it - forever feeling that they are not going to heal properly like the others because they don't take Real Love seriously enough?

Some Real Love coaches have suspended activities - no explanation given

One wonders where is all the money is going?

This is NOT coaching. Coaching provides a definite product that gives people practical skills from day one, that the person can use and see positive outcomes from that use. People around them see the change and the build up of confidence and self esteem. No one is worried about them. No one is feeling concerned that it doesn't sound right. No one is usually pushed away or pushed out of people's life when they are being genuinely coached. Everyone sees a positive difference, and the coaching comes to an end with the product delivered as specified and paid for.

"While The Real Love Company, Inc. and the client's Coach will always exercise every available resource to help the Client meet their life goals" This last, no one gets forwarded to any other resource other than guided to totally immerse themselves in Greg Baer resources only until they are so narrow minded that the person can only quote Greg stuff over-and-over-and-over without realising what they are doing and saying.

I am glad I did not allow myself to get pulled in so deeply.

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Re: REAL LOVE
Posted by: ANON541 ()
Date: December 17, 2017 06:45AM

Hi Dingo, thanks for your posts. I'm curious if you know anything about why Reallove uk closed down?

Also, I had not heard about people required to get naked and be "reborn", is that a new thing? Did that have anything to do with why they had to shutdown the uk group?

Also, I hope people checking into Mormonism check out youtube on how much of Joseph Smith's crazy stuff has now been debunked, especially how he mistranslated ancient scrolls as per heiroglyphic experts, and new dna evidence shows his visions regarding native americans are scientifically false.

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Re: REAL LOVE
Posted by: Coody ()
Date: December 29, 2017 05:22PM

Hi

My husband got into this about 4years ago. Ive had 4years of it. Its been do hard. He also became a mormon in december 2016 without my acceptance, but he gave them my blessing umm no. So i spoke to rhe bishop and aaid in your hand book under certain section if your partner wife, husband doesnt agree then u dont have the right to get blessed and certainly dont have the right to rob me of 10% of our salary.....he still was blessed and attends every sunday 10 til 1.30
He tild me after he joines he was taking my girls twice a week...umm no your not . when we met we were non religious people and when we had kids we both said we want them to choose certainly not Greg Baer telling my husband too.
I eas introuduced to the one and only Pete Uglow in 2014 my husband dint tell me really much he said we were going ti meet a guy who could help us with my first childs behaviour so i went ti find it was acomplete bashing on me . first i was obessed on cleaning umm no just like to tidy up as i have a small house and if u leave too much stuff out then it becomes a mess.
Secondly my married would be over withing 6 year. Whilst this was all happening my husband sat next to pete (his dad, daddy lol) and said notjing, nothing at all. Heart breaking. Then it got worse to the point the police were invovled and i was seeking rights of custody of my kids as he said he would get full custidy bascially saying i was incapable oflooking after them. Mind. U i gave up my job to become a full time mumny to save money.
He has told me unless i do a intervetion at 3,500 then he was going to force my hand at divorce!!
The nightmare continues . but to find out its been closed i wish i knew exactly why but dont... Its good im not alone as i have felt its been me. My husband told me once it. Was all my fault that he took to this....so good at hurting my heart strings.
I believe that thry will try and set up something new i know as hes said.
My husband was made awise man then and then they asjed he was to become a main man and train up.. I could go on and on .
Also the about of them that have vecome Mormons how is this right they are all doing it because of real love and i they say do!!!
Please keep in contact .
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hi Dingo, thanks for your posts. I'm curious if
> you know anything about why Reallove uk closed
> down?
>
> Also, I had not heard about people required to get
> naked and be "reborn", is that a new thing? Did
> that have anything to do with why they had to
> shutdown the uk group?
>
> Also, I hope people checking into Mormonism check
> out youtube on how much of Joseph Smith's crazy
> stuff has now been debunked, especially how he
> mistranslated ancient scrolls as per heiroglyphic
> experts, and new dna evidence shows his visions
> regarding native americans are scientifically
> false.

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Re: REAL LOVE
Posted by: DINGO ()
Date: December 29, 2017 10:28PM

Hey Coody,

I really, totally and fully understand all you are saying! It is totally outrageous and as you can see RealLove is clearly NOT life coaching at all. It is a cult organisation using thought-reform techniques to alter people's thoughts and behaviours. RealLove is really quite evil and not loving by any stretch of the imagination.

I don't think that the UK version run by couple Pete and Nikki Uglow is actually closed down at all. I think that they have gone underground for a while to re-invent themselves, change stuff, cross the T's and dot the I's and maybe rewrite their charity status and hide some of the underhanded stuff they have been doing - as well as try to get more money to keep it going. They may break off from Greg Baer, as others close to Greg have done, and run an organisation of their own but entirely based on Greg's principles. It will still be a trade of "we'll sell you unconditional love for money". That will never change. We also must remember that Pete Uglow is a former policeman and there are active members within this organisation too.

I can see that when your husband was made a 'wise man' that this was the point you had totally lost him. People only get given this status when they are completely absorbed in RealLove and eat, sleep, drink, eat and think RealLove 24 hours a day. They like to draw in people who are in respectable jobs in which the public see them as decent and sane individuals (Doctors, Academics, Police, Healthcare, Lawyers, etc.) because this stops people from doubting what they are getting into. Greg wrote RealLove from a foundation of his Mormon religion - so it is no surprise that when people are told to 'go and find a religion' at some point in their RealLove Journey, that they will be just a little nudged towards Mormonism because "It aligns more closely with the RealLove principles". However, a coaching program is only a passing thing in our life, a short course to help us improve an aspect of our life, so why would anyone join a religion based upon the principles of a coaching program? That's because it's not a coaching program and people don't end up leaving.

Coody, there is another thread on the message board about RealLove, it is in the thread called 'Large Group Awareness Training: Human Potential' and you will see that there are others just like you with the same problem. Another member has posted an array of book reviews from Amazon about Greg's books too. Please also remember that the Dr part of Greg's title refers to him being a former eye surgeon - that's all. He read books on psychology and religions, and attended various 12 step and other programs as well as counselling and hypnotherapy etc and just developed his own RealLove program as he thought that nothing had helped him to recover from being an alcoholic, drug addict (who nearly killed patients during surgery). So he is not qualified in mental health practice - and neither are any of the coaches. No one is licenced to do this type of psychotherapy work - although they say that they are not doing this. Truth is, they ARE doing exactly that. Greg is not an expert in anything except his own sinister program - don't let the MD fool you!!

I am in the process of reading 4 major books on Cults, and so far everything I have read in the first two books shows that RealLove is 100% a cult organisation. I thought I was going crazy at one stage as I was being pulled in to all of this, but thankfully my gut instinct protected me and I didn't allow myself to pulled in any deeper than I was. It just didn't feel right or look right. You cannot challenge or question anything about RealLove or Greg without people walking away from you.

Just remember, what has happened is not about you. Greg has told everyone that only he and RealLove have proper unconditional love and that you have to go through them to get it. All the theories he proposes are contradictory and pain everyone not doing RealLove as being toxic, negative and giving love 'conditionally' (apparently when outsiders give love it is to get something and not real - only the love given by RealLove people is real). Your husband believes he has been saved. But remember, he has been subjected to a slow process of brainwashing called 'thought-reform', to being 'love-bombed' by people in Real Love and in the Mormon church (boy are the Mormons good at love bombing!). He will have been subjected to other forms of brainwashing without realising and will have become dependent over time on RealLove from his new daddy and mummy rather than the 'real' 'love' of the real world. He will hold within any stress or anxiety about people, situations, events etc that happen in his life, pushing the people who love him away, and saving it all up for a Group session, or visiting daddy, so he can be held and nursed like a little baby. It all sounds and 'is' totally bizarre, but not to the people doing RealLove. They are just led to believe that everyone else not doing RealLove are the crazy one's.

I am not sure what any of us can do to about exposing this organisation for what it truly is. How does one get a cult organisation out into the open so it can be publicly, professionally and openly scrutinised?

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Re: REAL LOVE
Posted by: ANON541 ()
Date: January 01, 2018 06:04PM

There seems to be 2 reallove cult message boards but in case you have not read my previous post on how to get someone out of reallove here is what I wrote:
Suggestions if someone you know is involved with the reallove cult.

1. Do not attack or criticise reallove or Greg Baer. This only creates hostility and you will be seen as the enemy.

2. One of the principles of reallove is that couples totally agree on money decisions. You may need to be firm in not agreeing to big money being spent here if that is your truth. Remain in your integrity and truth.

3. From a place of fun and humour you can help your friend see the glaring falseness in paying big money to get “unconditional love.”

4. Be very clear yourself on what dependence is and what co-dependence is. If someone is dependent on Greg Baer or a reallove coach that is still co-dependence.

5. Get clear about “transference” and understand clearly why therapists have always refrained from providing the love that their clients need.

6. Give your loved one time in this. The Greg Baer “I will be your Daddy, sit on my lap and get a hug,” shtick wears off before long on anyone willing to maintain any self-awareness. It may be something that they need at this particular moment.

I will just add a few things that i think are helpful.


Do not make reallove evil or bad. These are just struggling people with real problems trying to find their way.


We humans want everything to be black or white. They are not. Reallove has some good principles and some crap. It's a mixed bag.

Truth has a way of winning. When, in a fun and happy way you point out the glaring inconsistencies in this group the truth has to win.

1. Paying money to Greg for "unconditional love" is a lie. It's not unconditional if you are paying $50 a minute. Wake up.

2. Stop trying to control others. Have your own boundaries on what you will do and let others, your son, husband, whoever do what they want. Adults get to do what they want, even be in a reallove cult.

3.If you are married you need to both agree on financial decisions and if it is money being spent on reallove the group will try to slide around their own principle on this but know it is there in their own material.

4. Understand the difference between love and approval. Love is what we feel internally. Approval is what we get from others. If it's coming from others and if you are looking for something coming from others, you are simply looking for approval. Approval is not unconditional love. Having someone say, "I love you," is getting approval not getting unconditional love.

5. If anyone thinks they are getting unconditional love from this group, stop paying money to them and see how long they care about you.

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Re: REAL LOVE
Posted by: Coody ()
Date: January 06, 2018 04:37PM

Hi dingo

Thank u so much fir messaging me back with sure reassurance that its not me...

That u havent been going mad for four years....i really did get to the point that i thought hus daddy (pete uglow) was every thing to him.

Something needs to be done they cant be allowed to carry on in anyway.

Please keep in contact.

Coody

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