Just to be clear, to clear up the plain-text miscommunications.
..I did not intend on discounting anyones feelings, ignoring anything, or saying JJ wanted to turn this forum into a cult! :-)

I was just saying my 2 cents, that's all. No more, no less.
I think perhaps some things are triggering everyone..sometimes its good for everyone to take a bit of a break at times.

JJ, I thought we were on the same side, just trying to find the truth, think, and be honest? I have no ill-feelings toward you in the least.
Sadly, coming out of this stuff takes a long time for all of us...

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jj52
I am really angry, and was very angry when I wrote that post, you're right about that. With who? Anticult, for discounting my feelings, ignoring my request, and making implications that I was somehow trying to turn this forum into a cult. I responded to Anticult, obviously, I was really angry with him.

-jj

Well, you aren't someone who came here fresh from The Work, are you? I'm so pissed off by now, civility has gone out the window.


JJ, You just did the very thing you are accusing us of doing: defending our lack of civility.

Looks like you're on the right board after all!

That's a joke, a joke.

Anyway, I'm not trying to convince you to stay. Nor am I lecturing you, I was simply explaining my perspective because I was one of the people giving Willis a hard time, so I figured your anger was also directed at me.

If Jon Willis is not a real troll, hopefully he'll come back and listen to what people have to say instead of spending most of him time defending Byron Katie and saying he doesn't care whether she's a fraud or not.

PPPPPPPPS:

also, to be very clear, some of my stronger posting has a method to it. I personally think that sometimes very strongly generalizing can be helpful when dealing with such slippery Thought-Reform LGAT systems.
One could debate the BK stuff for months...all the little details, and get sucked right in. You can't win. The 4 Questions are rigged, its a trick, I luckily due to training, could see that in seconds.

But if one stands back 10 steps, looks at all the falsehoods, etc, and consciously makes a powerful generalization to BLOCK the entire thing, that can work.
It might sound like throwing out the baby with the bathwater, but what if there is no baby in there?
What if the baby is Damien?

So, I do think that a powerful generalization to REJECT the entire thing in ONE piece, can be helpful. That's what I think.

Also, in the past, we have all seen so-called trolls derail entire threads...and eventually be banned, time and time again. anyone who can almost knock a thread down in a few little posts...hmmm

Part of the problem is that so many people are in different places regarding their involvement with these groups. Some are still very much involved, others are totally out and recovering, others have recently lost someone to a group and are seething in pain over that, others lost people long ago and are counseling the new folks with pure understanding.

It really is difficult to know sometimes when someone is still pretty brainwashed and unaware that they're spouting jargon, and when they're a manipulative troll sent by the guru to infiltrate with LGAT memes.

Again, if Jon Willis is not a troll, I hope he comes back ready to help with the purpose of the Board, which is not to defend BK or the Work. What is the point of doing that here?

Still and all, I don't personally think the threads should be broken up to reflect these different groups, because despite how hairy it might get at times, this board is generating incredibly powerful and important dialogues in part because of the conflict that can occur here.

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vlinden
Anyway, I'm not trying to convince you to stay. Nor am I lecturing you, I was simply explaining my perspective because I was one of the people giving Willis a hard time, so I figured your anger was also directed at me.

I think he deserved to be given a hard time, and I gave it to him too. Being an apologist for the work and knowing what this board is about, he had to have known that he would likely meet with some sort of resistance.

I notice that I breathe a lot easier when there are no apologists/trolls engaged in the discussion here.

To clarify . . .

I can see that some defending of a group or person could happen, if someone is still involved and unsure. Again, it's just hard to tell sometimes whether that person is really a troll out to deceive.

I think he deserved to be given a hard time, and I gave it to him too. Being an apologist for the work and knowing what this board is about, he had to have known that he would likely meet with some sort of resistance.

Yeah, I hear you. I think the real anger toward him came when it seemed he had been dishonest. That made him look like a text book troll.

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vlinden
To clarify . . .

I can see that some defending of a group or person could happen, if someone is still involved and unsure. Again, it's just hard to tell sometimes whether that person is really a troll out to deceive.

If someone shows up here to defend BK out of a sincere belief in the efficacy of her work, they're still trolling, albeit unconsciously, brainwashedly. Know what I mean?

Well, it seems JJ had some personal interaction with Jon Willis that made her think he was really getting something out of this board. But I don't recall that at any point he claimed he was having a problem with BK at all, he seemed to really like The Work, he had no gripes.

That's why I asked him what he was doing here at all.

JJ, on the other hand, has never once appeared to be a troll or apologist, she has been sincerely looking for answers about BK, to understand her problems with The Work, and everyone here has treated her with great respect and with appreciation for her input.

Back to the purpose of this thread . . .

I think it would be interesting to contact women's groups, rape counselors, incest counselors, etc, and send them clips of BK's twisted approach to dealing with these kinds of serious trauma. Maybe that is one way to build an awareness movement.