An exchange between Diddly and J. Lobur. Apologies for the formatting errors in the first post.
Guru Watch cannot respond with first hand experience. I can. You too, John, have very little
first hand experience as your communications and involvement has been primarily through
the online group and at a few retreats. I, on the other hand, had consistent and contintual
interaction via the groups, phone calls, Skype sessions, emails and retreats. Not to mention
I did her "counseling".
Yes it is my personal opinion that this teacher is realized. The evidence is ultimately, and
admittedly, sub jective, and I have no desire to try and convince anyone of the veracity of
something I personally take as no longer a matter of b elief.
As a matter of FACT, you DO have to take it as b elief. Prove to me, John, her "realization".
Her "realization", too, is a subjective matter in as much as your belief is subjective. While it's
a convienient and comforting belief, it is still only a b elief.
All are free to make their own determination. All who have ever left were wished well (and I
personally sincerely wish them well) and, as far as I know left completely alone, as is only
right, ethical and proper.
I am not alone. Alone, perhaps, in the sense that I am not allowing someone with claims of
something I cannot prove to dictate my life while their very own life is in shambles. Then,
yes, I am not following any such person any longer. But "being alone" is a rather naive
statement, as if the people that leave then wander aimlessly without any support, direction
You, too, John are wished well. All of those that remain are wished well. Even your teacher
herself is wished well. What is no longer wished for is "wishful thinking" or denying the
obvious contradictions, concerns, quite valid questionable behavior that has and remains to
be a very serious happening with said teacher. Contrary to what you might believe and wish
to assume, people have been hurt by her in ways you aren't able to fully grasp or
comprehend right now simply because, if you were to do so, it would mean the very person
you are following could no longer be followed. I know that desire (to see her as untouchable)
and fear (to question her behavior). I lived it long and well.
Just b ecause the teacher is very difficult does not make them a fraud.
Have you not seen the concerns posted here outside of her "crazy wisdom", anger or rage?
The FACT is there are endless examples of behavior that she has never answered
adequately (not to mention how strange it is that you must come here to answer for her.
Have you stopped to wonder why your teacher can't clean up her own mess, but relies upon
the fears of her students to do so for her?) and which fail even the loosest maesurement of
People go to physical fitness "b oot camps," don't they? Nor is it expected for the teacher to
work for free Some very charitab le people insist on payment just so that the service
rendered will b e valued and the instruction followed. Some teachers can b e quite difficult
John, you are using her speech and justification. How do I know? Becuase I've heard the
very thing from the horse's mouth. Please, I beg of you (sincerely, from my knees, John), to
use your reason, logic and judgement. I know you are capable, John! You are intelligent,
successful in business and such a sincere man. I've know and have long known this about
you. And I KNOW the temptation to sweep the horrible displays of contradictions,
inconsistencies, moral and ethical violations under the rug. I have lived them, so please
know that I understand. I don't want to insult you, John. Not now and not ever. If I ever did,
please accept my sincerest of apologies. But, I am here to simply speak what I know, first
hand, to be true and am no longer afraid to allow the good public (including all her students
past and present) to see. And I know you want the truth; you are earnestly seeking it! To find
the truth, you must be willing and able to criticize even the "most high" or "most holy". Why?
To ensure that you aren't under some delluded fantasy, chasing ghosts or hiding behind
mirages of spiritual hopes and ideals. Please, John, please ... be willing. Just be willing.
The use of Clonazepam, was openly stated b y the Guru long, long ago. There are no
surprises here, and realized b eings still have nervous systems. The psychological effects of
PTSD are gone b ut the Guru has, for a long long time, stated that certain things still trigger a
physical response, just that there is no mental/emotional residue attached to it.
That's quite convienient and still does not warrant a) her belittling, mocking, condeming
and/or mocking those that are on / have been on / are seeking to be on something of similar
kind for similiar or even various reasons, and b) for acting as doctor, psychiatrist, nurse,
psychologist, therapist WITHOUT a license, with NO training and NO education (for not only
persuading others to get off or not take said medications, but also "treating" in home a
student and taking him off them herself). Reason, John. Logic. Common sense. USE THEM!
I have personally seen (very) many students turned away b ecause there were psychological
issues revealed and the Guru felt that they were not suited that their condition was too
complicated, and that for reasons of safety and health they were b etter off with another
I have, too. Remember, I was there. However, where you now see "compassion", I see
"calculation". These good folks were often the ones that reacted most sharply to her
behavior and, barring that she couldn't keep them quiet or restrained, she sent them on her
way. Has she acted unethically in every single circumstance? No. But, even serial killers
have good qualities.
The Guru has stated that the disab ility (what percentage, I do not know) received from the
Govt. is military disab ility due to PTSD trauma suffered from horrific sexual ab use while in
And? Is she still suffering? Yes? Then, she is not a "guru". Is she no longer suffering? No,
she isn't suffering? Then she should not be taking disability. What she went through WAS
traumatic and horribly debilitating. I have DEEP compassion and understanding for that.
What she needs is TREATMENT if she is suffering and should, purely on ethical and moral
considerations (let alone the likelihood of horrible consequences for herself and others),
stop acting as a "guru". If she is not suffering, then she needs to be HONEST and get off of
disability. For everyone that wronged any of us in our lives, should we profit or benefit from
them or that for the rest of our lives? She should know better than most about forgiveness,
letting go, moving on. You can try to twist it any way you want, but it won't stand up in court
and certainly falls flat in the face of even the most rudimentary valuation using common
I have b een with the group for a while and will say this:
I will not judge those who have left. Many, many people (b eyond counting) leave, for what
seems to b e a variety of reasons.
I have personally never witnessed or experienced anything unethical. Have I seen the Guru
give people a hard time? Yes. Have I seen people have difficulties with the Guru's
It's a start, but you've got a long ways to go to catch up with the reality of what is happening.
Please, KEEP GOING!
I will not speak for those who may have left, b ut from what I have ob served, for those who
leave with resentment it usually seems to come down to two things (or a comb ination of the
1. They feel personally disrespected b y the Guru's teaching style. The crazy wisdom
modality is b asically an insult to the ego from top to b ottom. SwamiG's own Guru acted in
this way to her and the story is wellknown to anyone with a little time on their hands.
John, she acts that way to everyone, not just her students. Is she a "crazy wisdom guru" to
the waitor, the clerk, the server? Nope, but she treats them as horribly and in the same way
she treats her students; rudely, with contempt, bitterness and irritation. How do I know? I
been sitting right next to her (numerous times) when it's happened. Should we all start
treating people as poorly as her, even in our normal day to day activities? Can you imagine
the world we would live in? We'd all end up killing one another simply out of spite, anger,
rage and bitterness all in the name of "crazy wisdom".
Recall, too, that at the most prestigious and respected Zen monastery in Japan (eiheiji) life
is very hard. The novice monks are treated like dirt. They undergo what we would consider
physical and psychological torment and the senior monks smack their faces if they so much
as look them in the eye (I do not exaggerate). This is well documented in the b estseller Eat
Sleep Sit. I have never seen the Guru expect any student to undergo anything of the kind.
In the Christian world, b eing a monk is not always easy, and, for example, for the Monks on
Mt. Athos one takes a vow never to leave. Visitors are hissed at for folding their hands
improperly in prayer. Are we to consider this ab use as well?
You'd have to ask those involved. Those people also aren't under question in this thread,
your teacher is.
2. The Guru's lifestyle and deportment does not conform to what they personally consider a
Guru's lifestyle should b e note this does not mean they witness anything actually improper
or unethical. It means they are turned off b y the fact that the Guru wears makeup and
jewlery, dotes on her pet dog, plays an instrument or two, likes to sell cellphone covers,
b uys a motorcycle, takes Clonazepam, had gastric b ypass surgery, likes to eat meat,
watches Jerry Springer, enjoys listening to Barb ara Streisand, dances Flamenco. . . That sort
of thing. If anyone wants to add to the list, they are free to do so as I am prob ab ly forgetting a
thing or two. I do not think that any of these things makes one a fraudand they are, indeed,
openly displayed, not hidden. One never finds revealed a discrepancy b etween pub lic and
private life. Much of it too has to do with the fact that holiness does not mean conforming to a
set of external criteria it is, at times, a lesson in itself.
It is interesting, though not at all surprising to me, that you have failed to address the very
real, moral and ethical concerns. Again (and because it isn't YOUR job to answer them, no
matter how she may guilt any student to go and answer for her or not matter how much a
student may feel the need to defend their ideology):
1. Does she have PTSD? Does she get funds under the pretense of a phsychological
2. If she is not disabled, why is she taking monies under a false pretense and not working?
3. If "guruing" is her job, why is she still taking disability monies (considering, by her
activities / acquisitions, she has plenty of money to survive without it)?
4. Who pays for her housing, her bills, her day to day expenses?
5. Who pays for her expensive (she spent a few grand on a violin late last year ... one
instrument among many) instruments, jewelry, the Rolex, the business ventures, the
motorcycles, the cars?
6. What does she claim or file for taxes? Does she claim on the funds she receives (as
stated above) in her taxes?
7. Does she have a license, edcuation and training to practice medicine? Is she licensed to
treat someone to get off of their meds?
8. Does she have a license, education and training to counsel, treat addiction, treat
9. She treats addiction, yet herself is addicted to food. Her health problems, not to mention
her admitted inability to stop eating (which is called "addiction") actually required gastric
bypass surgery, bought and paid for by a former student.
Should we go on? I have more, if those items still look too "innocent" or "ethical" for your
What seems to b e never mentioned is the fact that this Guru's personality is not always
difficult b ut also displays great concern, compassion and tenderness too when this is
This is no measure of aptitude. Even the most degraded of all people have good qualities.
Anyway, that is all I have to say for now. And please, I do respect the fact that people have a
right to their opinion and to express it wherever they may please. I just hope that what I have
written adds a different perspective in a constructive manner.
I do appreciate your coming here. I appreciate your predicament and truly wish you the best.
Do what you will, just take good care of yourself as much as you are able.
My best to you and all.
am all too painfully aware that the teacher in this instance has long trained her students to regard anything as "ego driven". With that said, we shall then just look to behaviors and actions, which themselves speak more loudly than any ideal or fantascial claim ever will:
In addition to every thing listed above (1-9), here are some further examples:
10. Said teacher had 8 "sages" and one additional "guru" (or "realized beings") at one time in her group (Sarojini, Dharma, Jyoti, Udit, Barindra, Amrit, Gurudutt and Siddhananda, respectively). None of the "sages", not a single one, remains in her group. Siddhanada remains, although herself demoted and/or dethroned from "guru" status. In every single instance, each and every single one, it was the said teacher in this thread that "appointed" them. Not a single one of them ever approached her after their "experienced" and declared to her that "I am realized"; it was the teacher that "recnogized" the consciousness and "appointed" them. Then, when the behaviors / actions / doubts / further experiences raised by them came to the surface, she one by one denounced their "realization" status. This coming from the woman that long claimed "only a Realized Being can recognize another Realized Being" (which directly contradicts John's claim that he can "know" his teacher is a "realized being" when even she can't know who is a "realized being" or not). This is not at all uncomon, considering her "lineage", which has long appointed person's as "realized" when their behavior (and often their later admission) reveals the reality of something qute the opposite. Her lineage is that of Andrew Cohen (look up his "legacy" within the Rick Ross Forum or search for accounts of his former students found on the web), and Gangaji (who readily and publicly admits that she was commissioned to go forward as a guru long before she felt she was ready, having later to apologize for telling people to "destroy their personal stories"). The teacher we are discussing was pronounced the same by her guru, then sent out only two weeks after that pronouncement. Let those of us that realize any "commission" or ability to identitfy a "realized being" as completely impossible to simply allow the facts, for those that can't rely upon reason, to reveal the reality.
11. The teacher in this thread followed (by video) and then met, many years ago, a guru named Nithyananda. She publicly (you can find her comments on the web) proclaimed him as a "great realized being" doing great things in the world. Only after his own scandals became public did she suddenly take to critcizing him. Again (for John and others who wish to believe they can "know" their teacher's realization), her failure to "recognize" a "realized being" has proven completely inadequate, ineffectual and impossible.
12. There is a favorable student, one near and dear to her heart, that once attempted to break free from her (said teacher wanted this person to leave their state / residence and move cross country into her home with her). When the person all but refused, she went to her home (in WA) and demanded that she return with her or be kicked off of the path for good. Is this a choice or a threat? Said person travelled with the teacher, on the back of her motorcycle, and moved in to the teacher's home (in FL); leaving behind her home and her family.
13. Said teacher was married at the time of her "realization" (search the web, all of this information is readily available in various places). Said teacher, after her "realization", eventually divorced. Not a huge deal; however, said teacher now claims that in order for "realization" or "liberation" to be possible for ANYONE, one must be a celibate. She, too, is a renunciate; having become a renunciate AFTER "realization" (which seems about as logical as a flashlight in broad daylight). She seems to have forgotten her marital status at the time of her "realization".
14. Said teacher now refuses to give one to one guidance to anyone that is either a) not a renunciate, b) not planning on becoming a renunciate, or c) not paying for her counseling service (again, does she have a license to practice?).
15. Said teacher speaks to "unwavering devotion and surrender" to her, the guru. Said teacher never could stay with one teacher, one teaching or one ideology throughout her entire journey. Her last guru she was with for no time at all... and then he commissioned her ... blah blah ... the rest is stated above.
And, sadly, this is only but a scratch on the surface.