QuotezeuszorHe said that most of the information in Wendy's book is "patently false" (his words) or "grossly exaggerated" I love all of these blanket denials and wholesale dismissals. If Pete, John, or anybody at Trinity, knows of anything material in the book that is false or misleading, I would ask them to please contact us about it and we will correct it in any futu
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Not that I know of. Like I said, I think it was a careless error on Ole's part, and since Glenna did not use any of that information (except for it may have added to our credibility by helping her understand the hotseat process) and has since returned it to Ole, I don't know what there would be to contact Trinity about. If any of them are reading this thread they can take all this int
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

She saw the notes, read them, and then asked me what they were. When I saw that Ole had given those notes to her I went bat shit. She promised me she wouldn't do anything with them, and she just handed them back to Ole when she returned all the other material. Again, I think this was just carelessness on Ole's part, but it is something he needs to be careful about. It was just the
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I understand, zeuszor. Your post about your encounter with P.E. is fascinating. As far as what happened at the hot seats remaining in the room, I have been scrupulous not to say anything about anyone's "stuff"--not Ole's, not John's, not Gary's--nobody's. The only person who has said anything inappropriate about any of that is cherenuff1. But I think t
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotezeuszorUntil you do read the book, please keep your comments to yourself. I find your insensitivity very upsetting and offensive. If Nathan is being pusposefully insensitive or if he is willfully trying to push people's buttons, then he is to be faulted for that. However, the fact that you are offended is more your problem than his. I do not wish to see him go away or stop posting,
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Before you come back to me with a quote from Ole, John, or Gary where they say something disingenuous about them admitting their mistakes all the time, let me preempt you by saying that I know they are good at those CYA statements. However, that is not the same thing as actually taking responsibility for the harm they have done. To my knowledge, they have never once sought the forgiveness of anyo
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Nathan, you make a fair point, and I would have to agree with you if the only basis for this discussion was simply Wendy's and my perspective. However, as I have pointed out, our perspective is shared by many other former members of Trinity Foundation. Wendy contacted numerous former members of Trinity—many that she had never met before. This is a direct quote from Wendy's book: &
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteHaving said that, I wonder if he has crossed lines that are not good. I wonder if he has reacted so strongly to happenings within the church that he has lost some balance. I wonder if the radical views at Trinity have sometimes fed a sense of uniqueness that is not healthy. I think you are more than wondering, Nathan. A part of you already knows, but you don't want to admit that you
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteI am not entirely sure what I think. I have seen Ole as a prophetic voice in the past. Certainly he has ruffled feathers on talk shows and the like, I am not sure if it is for good reasons all the time. Do I see him as "Jesus"? I don't think so. You don’t think so? QuoteI do though have strong inclinations to believe the spirit of Christ has been revealed in him in a rare
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Ole himself refers to himself as an apostle--or at least he used to. I do not know if he is still doing it. I have heard him say that his role is the same as Paul's (yes, Paul the Apostle).
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteI don't equate following Trinity with following Christ. It is certainly possible that one could leave there while following Christ. I suppose the idea I am positing is that Ole is making sure someone is there because they are following Christ and not for some other reason. I’m sure that is what he would say. Ironically, he has managed to have run off most of the people who were really
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteNathanAI think he may mean that he is trying to make anyone leave who has a divided committment about following Christ. I can remember him in a Bible Study saying things to the effect of "You still wanna live a good life? You wanna be successful? You still believe you've got something do? Then GOOD-BYE." So in one sense, I suppose he does try to push those called "almost
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteNathanAVery interesting you say the "guy" Bloom was talking about was you. Do you know where he got the information about Cult Watch then? You don't think Bloom saw into the organization enough to realize TFI was a destructive cult? Bloom's writing is often pretty incisive, and generally seems to confront the issues. It is interesting too how you speak of Bloom as one of
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I don't know how much Bloom was responsible for the teaching on the high places, etc. Ole certainly led me to believe that it was all his own research, but he may have used Bloom as a sounding board while he was going through it. For whatever responsibility Bloom has for that wicked aspect of the doctrine and the dark places it led us to, he has much to answer for. There are those who thi
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotezeuszorSo what exactly was the nature of Joe Bob's involvement in TFI's formative years? Didn't he have a role in the development of certain TFI doctrines, the High Place Identities (I never once heard the term "High Place Identity" while I was around, BTW) in developing a rational for why the Hot Seats were necessary, etc.? Bloom was Ole's friend whom Ole ma
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteDoug, you must know friend of TFI and Door editior John Bloom Of course. QuoteMiraculously, most of the people who once wanted to murder Ole – or at least rough him up a little – remain members of Trinity Foundation today, and for the most part are peaceable non-weapons-bearing elders. One guy, who was convinced Trinity was a cult, would come to every Bible study armed with questions su
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotezeuszorIn case you were wondering: the man who replaced me was taken in through a friend-of-a-friend kind of thing; he was not taken in from a local shelter. Same with the woman referred to in the Lockwood cotton-candy piece...she was displaced and taken in by TFI, but not through a shelter. She knew somebody that knewsomebody that knew Ole. Same with Frank Bono. Thet were all taken in b
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotezeuszorOf course TFI can't single-handedly (so to speak) solve the problem of homelessness and vagrancy in the barrio. My point is, they tend to represent themselves as if they are advocates for the poor and displaced, a fully qualified 501-c(3) organization, when in reality, they as a body do little; nobody from TFI ever took any homeless into their homes while I was around. They rea
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotezeuszorIt's just that I'm pissed off that I was replaced by a man who really was taken in, and is in more of a position to be made materially and psychologically dependant on TFI than I was. When I worked for them, I had a substantial savings in the bank and my involvement with them was never a matter of my needing a place to stay. He did need a place to stay and he isn't ev
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I can speak with some authority on this because I helped found the Dallas Project and was its first Executive Director. The idea was never for Trinity to take in all the homeless people, but rather to challenge the churches to do so. It is unfair to say that Trinity is responsible to deal with all of the homeless people displaced by whatever insensitive thing the city is doing at Fair Park.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteThe strongest point you make Doug is the one about Ole. He does not appear in the Bible Studies to have peers always. As you say, he has disciples. In all the hours I have spent listening in, I can't remember ever hearing Ole back down on an issue. I did question Gary on this point, and again I can't repeat what he has said. This is just personal to me, but he actually gave me a pr
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteOkay, I admitt I was a little put off when I wrote that last post. I thought I would let you know exactly how I felt. Just having an emotional reaction however is not right. I am in the wrong for that. I do think my intentions are misunderstood though. I did have a point I wished to make. I think it does have value which is not insulting or for the sake of just bothering people. For one, I w
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

From the Wikipedia article on flaming: A flame may have elements of a normal message, but is distinguished by its intent. A flame is typically not intended to be constructive, to further clarify a discussion, or to persuade other people. The motive for flaming is often not dialectic, but rather social or psychological. Sometimes, flamers are attempting to assert their authority, or establish a
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I agree with wizeone. My wife and I were in an abusive group, the Trinity Foundation of Dallas, Texas (there is another thread about them on this message board). Part of the process of our healing has been us speaking out about what happened to us--my wife even wrote a book about it, I Can't Hear God Anymore" Life in a Dallas Cult. It has a kind of chilling effect on people who need
Forum: Destructive Churches

QuotezeuszorYou're right...what else to say? I am ready to let this thread fizzle out, unless Trinity comes up with another official spokesperson. I guess cherenuff1 is tired of the job, and she certainly has other things to do. Nathan is someone who I would be happy to correspond with via email, but since he really does not know Trinity his defense of them on this thread rings hollow.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Makes perfect sense to me. :)
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteNathanAAll I am saying is that a genuine faith has to be your own, and not something attached to the actions of someone else. Well, of course. QuoteI agree that it is shaking when someone you trust spiritually ends up being proven as a fake. And that is our point. Earlier cherenuff1 said something about us being upset about Ole having a little money. That is a good example of a str
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

This is something Wendy wrote just a few months after we first left Trinity Foundation. I thought it would be appropriate to share it at this Christmas season: How the Grinch Stole Christmas Once upon a time on the isle of Columbia there was an old Grinch. The Grinch was ruthless and overbearing and cut the hearts of his followers whenever the urge arose. The inhabitants of the isle
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Recently Wendy and I received a revelation from God. Throughout history, God has chosen certain people to bestow a unique communication. We are His chosen ones for this age and time. God has given us a new truth that has never before been made known. Due to the uniqueness of this message, Wendy and I have decided to quit our jobs and devote all of our time and money to getting the message out. In
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteNathanAI have a question Doug. This is partly the heart of the issue. You have described the hot seats as spiritual rape. What was the nature of the damage done? You say that some former members do not believe in God after leaving TFI. That holds little weight though, as everyone should have a faith that is their own and not contingent on someone elses actions. Did they become incapable of
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"