Quotecherenuff1As for continuing defending Trinity, I'm just tired of it. I know my stand, my beliefs and you all do as well so I just don't want to waste my time defending something over and over again. It just gets tiring. Besides, the truth defends itself. If Trinity is what it claims to be, it shouldn't need defending. :wink:
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Quotecherenuff1Everyone here agrees that they should just go ahead and get rid of them if it gives you guys some peace and that's what we are going to do. Again, I basically see this as a positive development so I do not want to be too critical, but I do need to say something about the magnaminity here. Trinity needs to do this because it is an act of basic human decency, not some great a
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Quotecherenuff1Well, the notes are being addressed. Ole really doesn't care what we do with them and the leaders are going through the boxes to find all of them. I've asked Gary to coordinate with me so that I can be there and tell you truthfully that they are gone. I think that I'll just go through and shred them for you all and once done, I'll post back and let you guys k
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotecultawareCherenuf1, Any word yet on the hotseat notes? Have you had a chance to ask Ole about them yet. I really appreciate your offer to do so. Thanks. cultaware Have you heard anything about the hotseat notes from cherenuff1 yet, cultaware? If Trinity truly has any interest in any sort of "reconciliation" giving up the hotseat notes would be an appropriate first gesture. To
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Good point, Cultaware. I know that Wendy bent over backwards to be fair, and if there was a common criticism of her book among the former members it was that she went too easy on Trinity. However, it does not appear that anyone at Trinity is disposed to give the book a non-defensive reading and take an honest look at themselves and at what they may have done wrong. Instead, they are just playi
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotefireflyI was just wondering if other people still go on with religion after leaving a cult, or am i a rarity? Some do and some don't. My wife and I have, but in a very different form than what we experienced in the cult. Many of the other former members of the group to which we belonged have forsworn religion altogether. My wife actually wrote a book about our experiences entit
Forum: Recovery from Destructive Cults and Groups

I will be the most surprised guy in 14 states if Ole decides to give the hotseat notes to the people that they pertain to, but I am going to be very disappointed in cherenuff1 if she does not at least ask, like she said she would.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Something disturbing has happened. Yesterday, Wendy received a threatening message on her voicemail at work. She filed a report with the police, who are taking this very seriously. I do not think anyone in the leadership at Trinity would sanction this sort of thing—it goes way over the top. However, it is possible that someone loosely associated with Trinity could believe they are performing s
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteseekingI can imagine that it would be hard to change one's perspective/opinion - the paradigm shift. Yes, it is hard--it was hard for Wendy and me. When we first left Trinity we were not saying that it is a cult. All I knew when we first separated was that something was terribly wrong. It was only after a lot of prayer, therapy, reading into the cult literature, and becoming involv
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotewalnorIs the TRI an "off-centered" group? Yes. Nevertheless, their gripes should have been brought directly to TFI leaders, and especially to Ole Anthony. This was never done. Griping to a small number of former TFI leaders at a chance meeting does not fit the muster of Matthew 18. How many leaders of Trinity Foundation do you think there are? And, I think it is tacky to chara
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Quotecounselor47Are you just taking Trinity's work on this? That's a typo. I meant, "Are you just taking Trinity's word on this?"
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotewalnorIt is interesting that after some people brought their concerns to Anthony over various matters, Anthony listened and some changes were made. I don't know if this is true. What are you talking about, specifically? I imagine it is a case of Ole wanting to save face in front of someone in the apologetics community and feigning cooperation. I very seriously doubt it is a case o
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotewalnorMy wife, was an independent consultant for the Trinity Foundation in 1994, which went on for an 8 month time period. Well, just in the interest of accuracy, it was more like 1998 or 1999.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I am neutral in the controversy between the Alnors and Mark Scheiderer. My wife says she is neutral, too. We consider all of them to be our friends, though we agree with Seeking that the Alnors should make some appropriate attempt to go through the Matthew 18 process with Mr. Scheiderer.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteConcerning this "useful idiot": Let be very clear about one thing, Mark. I am not calling this person a useful idiot--I would never say that about her. I was just saying that is how I surmise that Trinity sees her. I've been on the inside there, and I know just how cynical they really are. QuoteIt has been reported that the u.i. was in Dallas a few weeks ago and met wi
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Yes, that is a good analysis of what is happening, Mark. The fact is, Trinity is not interested in reconciling with us or with any other former member. They have seized on this Matthew 18 thing because of the opportunity to do so provided by a person whom I'm sure they see as a "useful idiot." However, if they really do want to try to extend themselves and open a dialogue, I wou
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteWhy do you think Trinity is off? What do you have (besides a book) that tells you it is off. What about the Doctrine do you take umbrage at. What facts do you have that you can actually bring to the table. You continue to trivialize Wendy's book, but the book is the distillation of the testimonies of dozens of former members. In fact, I think it would be fair to say that it represen
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Quoteno one else is urging seeking or any other posters to read more, email or talk to anyone at Trinity to have a more balanced view. 95% of what has been written about Trinity has been positive--excessively so. Wendy and Glenna are the ones who have tried to bring some balance to the discussion. However, I do not think it is on them to try to make Trinity's case, as Trinity seems to be
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Hi, Cherenuff. Glad to have you back, but it would be nice if you had something new to say. Your post about "The Ten Warning Signs" is an exact copy of something you posted earlier on this discussion thread. Posting the same thing over and over again is not really conversing—it is more like an attempt to shout the other guy down. You have already said that you do not, based on your own
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Nathan, and others like you, my wife asked me to post this quote. “When I set out to write the book, I had no intention of starting a war with Ole Anthony or his group, I only wanted to write about my experience in order to provide an alternative perspective on the Trinity Foundation other than the one which has been publicized in the media. Additionally, I wanted to write something that would
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteHere is a commentary to give consideration to regarding this whole affair: Earlier in this thread, Nathan, you asked me if it would be okay if you posted a link to this thing that Jackie Alnor wrote. I told you that I did not think it would be appropriate, because that is just an extension of Trinity’s ad hominem attack on us. When a messenger comes to point out the problems in a cultic
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteThere are others who have visited who do not feel the same way you do. Robert Darden, Jackie Anon, and John Bloom are a few respectable examples. Yes, but none of those people were there as disciples. I can talk in detail about each of them, but suffice it to say that you are comparing apples to oranges. I have already said that Trinity is quite good at charming their visitors. To me,
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Glenna Whitley has posted another comment on the Dallas Observer blog. Here is what she has to say: I got an e-mail from cult expert David Clark about last week’s item concerning his upcoming seminar on Ole Anthony and the Trinity Foundation. Clark says, ya know, thanks and all, but he also says I mischaracterized his explanation of his involvement with 60 Minutes and Diane Sawyer when I wrote
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Nathan, it may indeed be that I am not doing a good job of communicating. It may also be that you are taking an excessively black and white approach to some things that have some shades of gray to them. Some of what Ole teaches is right, and some of it is wrong. However, I think the doctrine is ultimately heretical because it is out of balance. It places too much emphasis on man’s depravity an
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteFair enough. And yet there is an entire chapter of Wendy's book devoted to the "scripture twisting" done by Ole. That does not add up with you saying that the problems with the teachings themselves are not grounds for leaving. She has condemned Ole's teaching and not just his character. But you are saying the main problem lies in Ole's character and not his teaching.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Here is the latest from the Dallas Observer: Great title, "Sometimes You Feel Like a Cult, Sometimes You Don't"
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteI am happier with the way our conversation is going by the way. I am, too. I would like to point out, though, that the reason the conversation has changed is because of you. Now, it seems like you are being more authentic and trying to write some of what you really think and feel, and not just trying to put us down. I appreciate that. One thing I have to take issue with you on is that y
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteNathanAYes, I am part of a small community church I have been connected to all my life. Whoops! I guess I overlooked this little post. I am glad to hear this. :D
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteI can appreciate you communicating this clearly. Maybe I am just slow to understand you. If it is true their actions are not where their words are, I wonder what the truth of Jesus Christ living in you is then? That is the crux of the "mystery" Ole is teaching. Jesus Christ lives in you and everything else must be emptied. If the one teaching that is a liar, how am I to believe it
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Let me futher clarify that last point a bit. I realize that if you ask someone at Trinity Foundation if they think they are the only believers they will say, "No." They are very good at saying the right thing (as were the Pharisees), but not nearly so good at doing the right thing. The fact is, we were shunned and called apostate for leaving the group. In Trinity World leaving the g
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"