estie- I LOVE your commemoration page! Very funny!!!!! skeptic
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Sirtriz, When I commented on the very first part of your post, that was as far as I had read that day, then I went out of town. I just now read your whole post and I really relate to how you describe the program (when I say 'program', I think of a book titled "The Program" by Gregg Hurwitz, a thriller (fiction) about cults, who leads, who follows). I wanted to reply to yo
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteSirtriz But, if you do like I did, and say, "You know, there are some things about this 'program' I just don't get, and probably never will, because frankly, I don't think they make much sense" automatically you are seen as a rebel and not welcomed into the circle. Yep, as with LGATs, when you don't keep step in following the program, YOU are the pro
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteSirtrizI was, until recently, involved in Al-Anon for about 3 years due to an ex-girlfriend who is a recovering alcoholic (and now involved in Landmark wouldn't you know it). Easy segue, I'm afraid, from 12 step programs to LGATs. That was my experience, anyway. I've been looking back at clues for things I did that may have "set me up" to swallow the LGAT lie.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

I've been glancing over some of my old 12 step stuff, and the program uses groupthink (they speak in "we" and, as with LGATs, the followers are clone-like; individual thinking doesn't fit in). If you don't agree with the (b&w) program, or parts thereof, the problem is YOUR THINKING! Your will is in the way of surrender and your will is the problem! Your charact
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Because there are those who have been helped by 12-steps groups, does not mean they do not fall in the realm of cultic. When I first stumbled upon criticism of 12 step groups in terms of cultishness, I didn't want to read because I had been a big believer in the 12 steps. It took me months to muster the courage to peek at the "criticism", and then more months to go deeper and
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Byron Katie is as twisted, magical, illogical and irrational as any LGAT, per the glimpse I've gotten of her at one of her "workshops" (or whatever it was) and the CD we all got a copy of. Later, I'll try to post excerpts from the CD. She's verrrrrrry LGAT-ish, IMO.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

I continue to marvel at the same stupid, illogical "concepts" and the same stupid jargon and cliches that CONtext used that Landmark uses. UGH!!!!!!!!! What an uncreative, unoriginal bunch these LGAT leaders are.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteMylesQuoteskepticAnd that's the power and the danger of LGATs. Ya just can't think straight after being run through one. There's a lot of vocabulary being used here that I am not familiar with. Can you please define "LGATs"? I figured you might know, since this place where you posted is called "Large Group Awareness Training"
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Quoteupsidedownnewspaper Is it possible Landmark may lead to POSTITIVE results? It is an interesting question with regards a course that requires a $400-odd and 72 man-hour outlay. $400! Wow, what a deal. You can pay $5,000 to CONtext Associated (Randy Revell's Lifespring Offspring) for the same shit! Randy's dead now, but you'd never know it reading their webpages.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Maybe I'm naive (not skeptical enough), but I got the impression that Myles is here to hear this side of the story. That's to his/her credit! I wish I'd found something like this when I got involved. That said, I think it can be damn hard for some people to make an objective assessment once they've seen and experienced the "breakthroughs" and "transformations
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Myles, I was aggressively recruited (red flag at the time) by a spin-off of Lifespring. I spent six years believing in it. I've been out of it five years. While I could write a book about my experience and what I am still learning, I have just a few things to say to you. First, LGATs are NOT what they appear to be. You are truly inside an intentionally fabricated illusion, and I
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

In reference to an article in the American Journal of Bioethics, this excerpt says what I think: There are many great articles, including one by Richard Glen Boire that argues that the Fourth Amendment ought to protect the insides of our heads as much as the insides of our homes. From www.cognitiveliberty.org
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

I agree with Nutrino ~and~ I think that regulation is in order. As I heard Martin Luther King, Jr. say (on a tape): Even though morality cannot be legislated, behavior can be regulated. You see, the law may not make a man love me, religion and education must do that, but it can keep him from lynching me and I think that's pretty important also.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Thanks! I'm trying to discern the ways in which LGATs twist CBT. One twist: in "Feeling Good" (I'm still in the beginning), Burns' point is the issue of cognitive distortion. Isn't that exactly what LGATs "teach"? The first cognitive distortion Burns cites is: All-or-nothing, black-and-white thinking. Gee, that's what I learned to do in CONtext As
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

I'm interested to hear thoughts about Cognitive Behavioral Therapy. Is it what LGATs "teach"? If not, how is it different? I've just started reading "Feeling Good" by David Burns, M.D. and I see similarities with LGAT "tools". Is this another example of LGATs taking a good idea and twisting it into an unrecognizable version? Any thoughts? Thanks
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Quoteestie I don't know if you're asking how I got out of being involved with the group, or got out of being controlled by the mindset. They're two different questions. Recently I met someone who said she'd been involved with Landmark. I asked how she got out. She just drifted out, seemingly unaware of the true nature of Landmark/LGATs. I started to think: just because s
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

I think the problem mentioned is inherent in regulating any industry, and is not a reason to not regulate.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

estie, I think it's an excellent idea and is exactly what's needed. skeptic
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteDynamix I think in the end though, the same system that supports their growth will ruin it. Are they already on the decline? Where's the gain or investment, exactly, in putting children through it? Children aren't going to get into the business of recruiting, ya think? It is truly sick (and desperate?) to target children. But I wonder just how damaging it could be, in th
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Quotenettie Oh how the language of landmark goes around the real problem. It is like you cannot say the obvious; there is simply to little time to accomplish what has been said to be done. Thus a LOT OF INAUTHENTICITY. You had to make up a phrase that sounded right in landmark world but really only was a cover-up of what was true. (Ooops, hit "submit" too quick) Bingo, nettie! One
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Good points, lightwolf. The issue of self acceptance is involved in connection. LGATs, however, teach narcissism, which seems to be mistaken by some for self acceptance and is sold as self acceptance by LGATs. Another LGAT LIE. Lie # 8,943. Based on my experience and then watching my sister in an LGAT, I find it interesting that LGATs divide people in sophisticatedly subtle ways. It was
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Quotemidonov123 Personnaly, I don't trust any of this LGAT nonsense. And I doubt very much about your new self being emotionally stable and well balanced. I agree with midonov123. Based on my own experience of seeking and attempting to acquire a brand new "self" the LGAT way, what I thought I had attained turned out to be nuthin' more than a slick illusion. It took some h
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Randy Revell's bio still reads as if he's alive. Got scam?
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteConcerned Oz This is a prime example of the loss of human empathy for others at the cost of manic focus on "self" and the group. It took my father's death and another ugly situation for me to see this. None of my fellow lgat-ers, including the founder/teachers, displayed one speck of concern or empathy when the shit hit the fan for me. That very response from a group
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Quotenutrino Healthy, educated, well balanced people with good social lives don't need to lose themselves within simplistic one dimensional organizational structures, they don't need to take on jargonist vocabularies, they don't need to worship Leader-Demigod-Idol figures. I like how this is put. Well said!
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteRU?ingWith regard to the AA - its the placing of the power to change in a higher being, rather than the individual, that disturbs me. That is not an anti-religious/god statement, it is just I believe that there are alternatives that are perhaps more valid, in approach and results. True. The more I read about the cultic quality of AA the more I see that it operates toward the cultic side
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

I have been considering that perhaps "cult" is the default mode for humans. I don't know how or if this relates to humans but in the world of herd/pack/group animals, being apart from the group is unnatural for them. They are hardwired to do what it takes to stay in the group. This is why dogs are so easy for humans to train and dominate, for example. Are humans hardwired to r
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

More reading/sites: [12schrittefrei.de] Go to "12 step (English)"
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"