I found the quote referred to in the Landmark and litigation thread online: QuoteErhard's heavenly aspirations may have reached their climax in the fall of 1977 when he appeared at a meeting of est seminar leaders at a beachside retreat near Monterey. Flushed with enthusiasm about the transforming power of doing Werner's work, some of the leaders asked Erhard where he placed himself
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

to elucidate for those un-familiar the "he who sent him" comment refers to Werner Erhard's self-identification with "he who sent" Jesus, as quoted in Outrageous Betrayal. speaking of which, riddle me this, Batman... why didn't Pressman not get sued Outrageous Betrayal?
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoterichardmgreenI found out that the yoga positions used during meditation are actually based on prayers to Hindu deities. So that may cause some cognitive dissonance for some people. don't see how it would. cognitive dissonance means the stress of having to believing two contradictory ideas.
Forum: Celebrities associated with "cult-like" groups

QuotenutrinoQuote One of the warnings that is given to practitioners of ritual magick is that if they do their cermonial acts precisely right they will gain tremendous power over the WILL (make note of that idea) of other people, however, if they don't do them right, the force they unleash will gain tremendous power over them. mrrrm, not exactly. western traditional magic doesn't
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

based on what older people have told me, by the end of the 1970's the evangelism of a lot of est graduates and supersaturaing the market (plus bad publicity) had turned off a lot of people. when I bring up the topic of Landmark they won't know what I mean. when I say Landmark used to call itself est, then they roll their eyes knowingly, smirk and say, "oh that..."
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

back to the original topic of discussion, I have had it said by one grad that (paraphrasing) "comparing est to Landmark is like comparing a Model T to a sports car" so you can ready yourself for the rejoinder. also for the "LEC doesn't have anything to do with Werner Erhard".
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

oh, the authorized biography, Werner Erhard: The Transformation of a Man, quotes Erhard as singling out the church for praise. as I have mentioned elsewhere online and perhaps even on this messageboard, my sister quoted to me, "what's true is what is true for you", a statement that L. Ron Hubbard made. she hadn't taken any LEC courses until 2004. that indicates that, even a
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuotekathDoes anyone know any good tactics to break down a cult and speed it on its way to non-existence? the obvious ones: a) inform members of the demographic the cult targets and b) document the abuses and inform the cops.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteEther DragonThanks Jeannie, I love to hear that. My wife was just like you, skeptical for the first two days, but she decided to ride it out and go the third day. Its obvious from the huge turn-around she had that the third day is when they really hit you. The first two days are just spent worming their way into your head. I wouldn't underestimate the effect of just the two days ei
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

I heard about their using the Karate Kid clip. it bothers me particularly because they skillfully use it to evoke anxiety in the viewer that LEC wants to exploit them and then using humor the defuse the fear. the clip has the protagonist doing a "spiritual exercise" for the guru who admits that he scammed the hero, but it doesn't matter because in the end the guru has the pro
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

my sister told me that during the Advanced Course the leader annouced that they would reveal the truth or the secret of everything or somesuch, and then showed everyon a Monty Python video. the latter courses also push the idea of promoting Landmark. they have a course that as far as I know dangles in front of graduates the promise that, yes, they can teach a course, play a larger part in the
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Landmark wouldn't have a official position and why would they, unless the film specifically praised or denigrated Landmark. LEC does not try to justify itself scientifically. if it did, it would limit its message, anyway. it won't or can't go into the mechanism of how, for example, you caused your own birth at a particular time or place or caused the past before your birth. a
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

WE got heavily influenced by a writer named Alan Watts, who he personally knew. in Watts' described the universe as, essentially, a game or pastimes enacted by God (or Godhead) in which God splits him/herself into people and to have more fun, forgets about the game all the better to enjoy the game. Watt's writing definitely contains much more than this, however this contains a se
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteLandmark = Existentialism (atheistic) + New Age Philosophy (Polytheistic) = logical contradiction?!!!! new age belief systems (not the plural) go from pantheistic to animist to monotheistic to soft polytheism, which beliees in multiple manifestations of God/Godhead to hard polytheism, which believes that deities have individual existence. you may even atheistics and agnostics. while sta
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Acid Reindeer now very sorry for trying to make a joke.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

midonov123, Landmark doesn't have gurus, not in the classic sense. a guru-chela relationship consists of the teacher (guru) and a student or acolyte (chela). more broadly, a guru can mean a spiritual teacher who may have influence on followers he or she has never met. pretty much by definition, a guru has their own school or at least their own branch of an existing school. the Forum Le
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

that's crazy talk!
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Wikipedia has changed its policy so that anyone can edit an entry but only registered users can create a new entry. authorized users can also get notified of changes to articles. so that if a user tries to redress some of the bias present in the Landmark article (the article currently has a lot of bias, with all criticisms rebutted and glosssed away) that they can go and restore it.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteVicarionThe book has been described as part pulp sci-fi adventure. more anti-adventure. or anti-literature. most accurate summary there, though, Vicarion. for further information, a skeptic named Martin Gardner has written a book called Urantia which came form Prometheus Books. if copying took place, BTW, I would not necessarily put it down to conscious borrowing. a lot of forgot
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

maybe I might've specified that I meant full scholarships. I know they do that thing where at the end of the basic course they offer the advanced course at a discount.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

after she had done the Basic Course, my sister phoned me up and tried to use my fear as a way to induce me to go the graduate's meeting. said with a laugh that maybe I could show up and "save" her.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteSL1993What's the Newsgroup? I'd like to view that thread. alt.fan.landmark, probably.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

thank you for the information there, sonnie_dee. ISTR that even salaried clergy got to attend for half off. or maybe that just happened in est.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

forgive me, but I would like some data from current or ex-members not a rant. specifically, I would like to know, do graduates contribute money which goes to the scholarship or does LEC itself pay for the scholarships? the way LEC operates I suspect the former, at least in some cases. I would like to have my suspicion confirmed or denied, if possible.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Landmark, BTW, has a free scholarship available to all Katrina survivors from now until next summer as well as clergy (I thought that only gave clergy half off the basic course?) and firefighters and police. I would like to know about the other kind of scholarship, given out to select others who don't belong to these categories. does anyone know about these and how they work.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteDynamixWell, you do make a few good points. We are all brainwashed into this great collective of a society. Gaaaaahhhh! Did no one read that part of my post?! Where I defined brainwashing according to its techincal definition? People! You have sorely disapointed me.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

brainwashing has gotten so over-used and mis-used that it could mean pretty much anything, for which reason I tend not to use it. in its formal, original meaning, brainwashing has a couple of characteristics (I take these mostly from BATTLE FOR THE MIND by William Sargant. first, isolation. second, slowly mounting pressure, persuasion and evidence that: one, the previous worldview contai
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

re-editing this post, now to take out the sarcasm, out of sympathy. I just trawled through your (foodguypdx's) older posts and saw you had posted anti-Landmark posts initially. either someone has started to borrow your account now or we have the first (that I can think of) example of an anti-Landmark to Landmark convert who has posted here. I want to say that seem not to realize the
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuotefoodguypdxIf you have taken the Forum or Advanced Course and had a bad experience, then you had a bad experience, much like at a restaurant. If you have participated and have realized positive results then it is the same as a good restaurant experience. It is all in how you take it and where you take it. bad analogy, dude. if you go to a restaurant that serves tainted food, you could end
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

some of the work on that entry, I did myself, speifically looking for a mix of positive, negative and mixed links for it to balance it out and make neutral. I don't like looking at that entry. it depresss me. earlier, un-censored versions of the entry did get copied and distributed throughout the web. with a little Googling you can locate them. such as here. EDITED TO ADD: I did, actually
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"