Quote
tsukimoto
My question is, what exactly is the difference between persuasion, manipulation, 'skillful use of influence,' and brainwashing? Is it just a matter of degree -- persuasion is mild, manipulation is a bit more intense, brainwashing is the most intense? Or are there other differences?
... I can agree that I was manipulated, and that information was withheld from me, and other members. Brainwashed, though? That's too strong a word.
I don't like to use the word "brainwashing", as it brings up silly images from bad movies.
It was used by former SGI members, about what was being done to people by SGI. But the word brainwashing is a powerful word, and has its uses.
There is lots of information and research in the difference between general persuasion, all the way up to so-called "brainwashing". [
www.culteducation.com]
When one studies what "brainwashing" is, its not something mystical.
The 8 points listed above are all a part of "brainwashing".
In the classic Korean "brainwashing" experiments going back decades, it turned out the most effective of the brainwashing techniques, were very permissive, and quite subtle. It starts with a small agreement, then slowly builds up using many social influence techniques. Brainwashing is not about shining a light into people's eyes and waterboarding...its about becoming their "friend", giving them a cigarette or some herbal tea, or a pamphlet, getting a TINY agreement to maybe come to a meeting, then slowly re-engineering their belief systems, using dozens of techniques.
Even some current terrorist groups use many of the same methods, as guess who they learned those techniques from? They can start out very very permissive and lax, and only slowly modify the belief system in a way that seems "voluntary".
You know people are using mindwashing techniques when their #1 defense of what they are doing is...ITS ALL VOLUNTARY. (like Byron Katie, who is an expert in this).
This is because they know they are engineering consent, that appears to be voluntary. That is the best way to do it.
How that is specifically defined, would probably be up to each individual. But the term brainwashing, might be used when groups use specific techniques of ENDLESS REPETITION of aspects of their beliefs, as a way to re-engineer the thinking patterns and beliefs of their members.
SGI certainly does that, that is the core of what they do. Their brand of SGI chanting, certainly would be classified as a type of "brainwashing", as well as the other techniques mentioned.
Of course, that is a loaded term, and one can use the term Thought Reform.
There are a lot of very powerful techniques being used in SGI. Many people stay with it for many years, and are literally obsessed with SGI. They talk about it constantly, every minute.
The people who I see in SGI, who are obsessed with SGI-Chanting, SGI-karma, and SGI-recruitment, are certainly in the grips of very strong Thought Reform.
The key would be, for smart, objective former SGI people, to very very carefully intemize each technique being used by SGI on people, from recruitment, to joining, to retention, to exploitation for money, dishonesty, getting people back, etc. Each technique could be itemized.
And of course, the SGI-Chanting also needs to be carefully analyzed as well. The content of the chanting, the embedded meanings, the group chanting, repetitions, speed of chanting, and everything else.
Knowledge is power, and the specific techniques of SGI really need to be mapped out, just like they have been for other groups. This if course, has really nothing to do with the philosophic/religious side of SGI, that would really be a seperate study.
The above list by tsukimoto is an excellent start. [
forum.culteducation.com]
One could imagine after some work and research, that the main SGI techniques could be refined down to maybe 20 techniques, and these could be organized, and put in rough order.
The document could maybe be called something like...
SGI Explained
When people in SGI read it, and its accurate, that could be a real enlightening moment, for people who are just wrapped up in the chanting, and philosophy.
a couple more points might be...
- anti-intellectualism to suppress critical thinking. They encourage people NOT to think too deeply, or to do research into other areas of Buddhism, etc.
- Excessive Self-Blaming: they blame people for everything. Too much self-blame creates excessive Guilt and emotional disturbance. That is a fact known in current psychology.
- more on Confirmation Bias: if chanting doesn't work, its your fault. If it "works" its thx to SGI.
- Catch-22, Setting people up to fail: if chanting does NOT work, then the more you chant, the worse it gets...Catch22
- Deception: in recruiting, etc.
- worship of the Leader.
- social influence: this could be expanded a lot, about the meeting, the phone calls,
- media and print: the movies and materials they eventually use.
- the network marketing approach to getting referrals, how they encourage recruitment for "karma".
- donations and dues. what % of your income do they work at getting? 10% Are some people talked into giving large donations, to get more "benefits"?
There are all sorts of other ideas in the thread, and elsewhere.
Refinements could be taken from the general Warning Signs lists, where SGI seems to hit every one. [
www.culteducation.com]
It would be extremely helpful for people who are coming out of SGI, to put them together in a way that makes sense. Almost like an SGI-Wiki for former members?
If one could organize the main components of the SGI Thought Reform techniques, and have a nice list of maybe the 20 main methods explained, that would be very powerful and helpful to people.
One could just put their ideas into a document, and think about it, and refine it.
There is no reason why 90% of the techniques being used by SGI can't be explained in a couple of pages.
the public has a right to know what is being done by these groups to them.
(there is an old movie, Pelham 123, where a subway car is racing out of control. There is a woman Chanting and then saying STOP, trying to stop the runaway subway car. Finally the subway is stopped by a speed mechanism in the subway. The Chanter is seen on screen jumping up and down and saying...IT WORKED! IT WORKED! That sounds like SGI...if you chant long enough, you think it "worked", even when it had nothing to do with it. Or if it doesn't work, its your fault. That is a Catch-22)
SGI is really just a big Catch-22 in that respects.
Also, SGI might seem a bit dumbed-down from other groups, but is it? They have gotten quite large, and the leader has literally become a billionaire. That is far beyond most other groups.
I don't see SGI as being dumbed-down at all, quite the opposite. It does appear to have be quite carefully designed, at least in the west, to appeal and target a specific type of person, people who are willing to pay those dues, and give donations.
They make it appear to be "light" but it really seems that is done on purpose to reach a larger audience.
The CORE of SGI are lifers, but the casual members may come and go, but perhaps SGI is fine with that? The SGI "light" version is more easily marketed and less-threatening to people.
SGI was carefully re-engineered in the west, as they wanted to go mass-market.
But its still very powerful stuff they are using on people, even though it may not be as obvious.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/2009 06:27AM by The Anticult.