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jlynneda63
Hey People,
I haven't posted in ages! Been doing well! This week got an email from a member I practiced with long ago. We moved away from there in fact.This woman always was on the outs with organization & she made it seem she wanted to share! I thought it was ok. I was told the she "respects my autonomy", she asked to send me a card. Yesterday I get a manila envelope & inside is a copied page of guidance from Living Buddhism! A letter that told me how my friend can chant for me now like I did for her.!! I am so mad! Should have seen it coming!! I sent her an email & blocked her.

The cult org. has been administering the kool-aid in the interim, it's also common for (ex-)members to bounce back-n-forth, in-n-out of the cult org.. Sounds like she's back in, has a new "mission" and is out to "make a cause." She'll eventually lose interest and move on to something else.

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jlynneda63
Never FORGET, ALWAYS AN AGENDA!!

Absolutely 100% correct. They shall forever want you back, if given half a chance. Never be surprised.

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Shavoy
One of the issues I'm still trying to wrap around is the push for Mentor/Disciple. Why, why, in the last few years has this push gone mad??? All great minds here, I'd like opinions about this, please!

The "Master/Disciple" thing was always there, but it went completely no-holds-barred once the cult org. was completely excised from its perceived legitimacy umbrella of nichiren shoshu. It's a desperate circling of the wagons and a reflection of cult org. insecurity and organizational mental illness (i.e., The Dear Leader's madness and delusions of grandeur); the last strings connecting them to reality have finally been cut.

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The gakkai cult freak show continues, with the cult org. getting in on the on the viral meme bandwagon (before it dies down) to proselytize and manipulate its "YOUTH!" (to participate in meaningless cult activities - gajokai & byakuren).

[www.youtube.com]

Oddly, I find the clip strangely appropriate for gakkai cult members.


- Hitch

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TaitenAndProud
I think the problem was in thinking that the Japanese model would work overseas in a country with a completely different cultural heritage. Boy, was THAT an ignorant boner of a move!! Fail, Sensei!!

While living in Japan, I came to realize just how deeply biased and prejudiced Japanese really are. Because their society is so polite, something like racial prejudice doesn't seem very apparent at first glance. But there is a strong undercurrent of bias that flows deeply in thier society. Foreigners are not trusted or respected, and that common attitude is clearly reflected in the mindset of SGcult's top leadership.

So by not trusting and giving respect to American leaders, the Japanese dominated SGI continuously "cuts off it's nose in spite of its face". Could you ever imagine an American (non-japanese) becoming cult President? HA! How about vice-president? No way! Maybe general director? Don't hold your breath! And don't EVER expect to get any kind of vote - on anything.

Spartacus

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Shavoy
@Spartacus--My jaw dropped a little reading your description of Mike Kimakura giving you that jacket after that young man passed away. Cold-blooded. And this guy was swept under the rug without a sympathetic word. Because Bad Things Happening are Bad Business for the SGI.

Just to clarify - Kikumura gave me the jacket before the young man's passing, not after. But the throw away nature of people by the SGcult is ugly and despicable.

Spartacus

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Shavoy
Is it solely charisma? What is it that makes people go all mushy deferment to one guy?

Could there be a more obvious answer? BRAINWASHING! Psychological manipulations at every turn! Dear Leader garbage input - Dear Leader garbage output.

A warm welcome to Opendoor.

_{I have read this thread from the first page to the last and I check in every few days to read new posts. There is no doubt that this forum has helped me tremendously in leaving the SGI. But my almost obcessive desire to keep up with this forum has me a bit worried}.

A man dying of thirst may exhibit an obsessive desire for water... until his thirst is finally quenched.

So many posts here are as water dousing the flames of our pain, like medicine to cure our ills, providing needed relief from the guilt that plagues hearts and minds. No wonder we can't wait for the next fix.

Emotional scars run the deepest. As so many of us here know, it takes a lot of time for someone victimized by a cult to heal completely. Please be patient with yourself and allow the gently healing to continue. The important thing is your effort to keep moving forward and making progress.

Spartacus

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Spartacus

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Shavoy
Is it solely charisma? What is it that makes people go all mushy deferment to one guy?

Could there be a more obvious answer? BRAINWASHING! Psychological manipulations at every turn! Dear Leader garbage input - Dear Leader garbage output.

I always wondered about this, people have always mentioned his charisma, but where have they experienced it? Only through others claiming that he has this aura and charisma, as hardly anyone has met him, and if they do, the idea of Sensei has been blown out of all proportion to a God like status. He's done nothing (except run a business disguised as 'This Buddhism' and says nothing (ghost writers), but his supporters give him adulation for everything.

The typical way a dictator keeps power is by paying off those whose support he requires. I have no doubt that this happens in the upper ranks, both here and in Japan. They call these "salaried positions". But you can bet that the "salaries" in question are princely sums. Some, like Linda Johnson, have other jobs as well - she's a lawyer - but I haven't quite figured her out.

So the functionaries who are promoting Ikeda at home in Japan are paid handsomely to do so. I'm sure they're chosen in part on their ability to influence others - successful salespeople need apply. People's contributions make them feel like they're a part of it, so beyond a certain circle, you don't need to pay for people's loyalty.

The problem in a democracy, by comparison, is that you can't afford to pay off EVERYBODY. So there, the people have to feel like the leader they're voting for cares about them, represents their interests, and will take action for their well-being. I suspect that people's donations feel sort of like a "vote" to them, like they're participating in some (meaningful) way. Also, they are *promised* that THEIR President Ikeda is so concerned about them that he's *constantly* working on articles to clarify how to get the most out of this Buddhism that he understands better than *anyone* on earth!!

LOL

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In the past week specifically, I've wondered why dictators go bad. It can't happen that the leaders of dictatorships are inherently 'evil', that would seem silly to me. So what type of environment cultivates that kind of behavior? The decline of human rights? What conditions have to be present for a country to go bad?

A dictator with easily rigged elections is likely to have a large 'selectorate' (piece of the population that has a potential voice) and a small winning coalition-- so the leader only has to pay off a small number of influential people to stay in power. But in a democratic institution, the group who selects the leader is large--but so is the winning coalition. In America's case, the winning coalition would be either the Republicans or the Democrats, and can you imagine if the winning party had to dish out extra cash to every single Republican or Democrat when they won? As the size of the winning party increases, the private goods allocated to them decline.

So in a democracy, you wouldn't end up with much. Probably around 5 bucks in private goods and party loyalty wouldn't be too significant. So how, in democracies do they "pay off" their party? They have to get in office some how!

Through public goods. If you ask people whether they'd rather take $5 or have public policy benefitting them, they're likely to take the public policy (because hopefully that's worth more than $5).

But with the dictators, the only difference is the size and influence of their winning party--they're able to pay off their close group with ease and any contestants can't wager state funds to an already loyal coalition because they're not in power. This creates less competition, and a ridiculously high loyalty rate of those being paid off.

But then is it just chance that many political figureheads in dictatorial or military rule countries are "bad people"? I honestly don't know.

But my guess is that they didn't start out 'bad', their institution gave them the freedom and ability not to get caught while maintaining their lavish lifestyles--then it grew into their habit of how society works. [www.personal.psu.edu]

Capitalist dictatorship has many similarities to fascism, but differs from it in lionizing not the workers of the nation but the entrepreneurs of the nation. Fascism seeks a mixed economy, whereas capitalist dictatorship privileges the corporate sector and attacks the non-military public sector. But both try to subsume class conflict under a hyper-nationalism. Both glorify military strength and pick fights with other countries to whip up nationalist fervor. Both disallow unions, collective bargaining and workers’ strikes. Both typically privilege one ethnic group within the nation, marking it as superior and setting up a racial hierarchy. [www.juancole.com]

Lionizing the entrepreneurs? "Three Presidents" and pioneers - check! Privileged corporate sector? Leaders get the best stuff (see "cho" comments in above post on John Astin) - check! Picking fights with others to whip up nationalist fervor? The priesthood issue - DOUBLE CHECK!! Disallow unions etc.? Nondemocratic - members simply nod and obey - CHECK! Privilege one ethnic group?? My check-o-meter just broke...

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TheVoid

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Spartacus

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Shavoy
Is it solely charisma? What is it that makes people go all mushy deferment to one guy?

Could there be a more obvious answer? BRAINWASHING! Psychological manipulations at every turn! Dear Leader garbage input - Dear Leader garbage output.

I always wondered about this, people have always mentioned his charisma, but where have they experienced it? Only through others claiming that he has this aura and charisma, as hardly anyone has met him, and if they do, the idea of Sensei has been blown out of all proportion to a God like status. He's done nothing (except run a business disguised as 'This Buddhism' and says nothing (ghost writers), but his supporters give him adulation for everything.

The first time I saw The Dear Leader in person, it was in the motherland, on tozan-kai, I saw him twice during that trip. Once, was at a distance during the CULTural festival, my very first thought, was that he was short, nothing more. The second time during that same trip was at a garden party, just a few feet away from me (I also watched him eating at a table near mine) - this was when it first hit me --> "what's so special about this guy?!" I literally remember thinking to myself at that instant, "what's the big deal?!" I just didn't get it, he certainly didn't live up to the hyped image that was planted into my mind.

I think the so-called "charisma" probably predates my (and most of us here on this board) time in, going back to Ikeda's firebrand days when the gakkai cult was being established in the motherland and perhaps up to a point in the early 60's when it was just getting a foothold in America. Once the cult org. was up and running, all you need is organized persuasion by paid minions/sycophants to keep the hot-air ballon myth afloat.

Just a guess here, because I'm assuming that the "charisma" was actually there and existed at one time, maybe in the beginning, because I certainly didn't see any sign of it in person during my time in. Also, maybe I just didn't swallow as much kool-aid as others, but I do remember some of my fellow members around me during that trip being overcome with ecstasy, trembling with emotion and tears pouring down their cheeks. I saw some crazy whacked out zombie member sh** on that trip, too.

What's going on today and what the gakkai cult org. has unleashed from the box that they used to keep it in, is an outward reflection of The Dear Leader's inner psychopathology (an insatiable need for glorification and legitimacy acknowledgement). The cult org.s deep pockets is what keeps the con-machine humming along and is the source of its power.


- Hitch

Thanks to all of you who responded to my post about putting this whole SGI thing out of my (our) mind and getting on with life. I understand that really letting it all go is a process. The most helpful thing about this forum, for me at least, has been in the human testimony which I needed to validate my own impressions about SGI. I mean, I was leaving anyway-- before I found this forum. The SGI was like a bad marriage that maybe was good for a time but had started to be so suffocating and limiting and crazy that you knew you had to get out. It was such a relief, though, to find this forum -- I guess I was about 6 months out of the organization-- and suddenly and finally to be reading other people-- lots of other people-- who had the same feelings and experiences I had. That was tremendously helpful.

One of the problems that I am having is that I have maintained a friendship with a few people who are still in the cult-- deeply, 30 year, die-hard in the cult. These women have been good friends to me for years, and although I don't want much contact, I do feel an obligation of sorts to maintain the friendship. Both of them are older and in poor health-- no one in SGI pays much attention to them at this point because their usefulness to the organization is pretty much over. Both of them are lonely and a bit isolated because they haven't got anything else but the organization. When we are together, my leaving SGI is the big elephant in the room-- even though I haven't attended any activity for almost 3 years, both of these women sort of pretend that nothing has changed really-- they mention activities and benefits and all that stuff in front of me but have never asked or confronted me about why I stopped.

I think the "strategy" behind this behavior is to maintain the friendship, avoid unpleasant confrontation, and be ready to reel me back in when my life falls apart, which they undoubtedly believe it will because I have stopped the magic chant-- will lose my "fortune", blah blah blah. I am sure that my situation and their "strategy" in dealing with me has been the focus of several leaders meetings, because I was a district leader in my area for 13 years until I "suddenly" refused to hold meetings and dropped out. I feel sorry for these two women who have also been and sort of still are leaders in the cult-- one of them spends 2 to 4 hours a day chanting to win the Publishers Clearing House!! That is what you learn about Buddhism when you spend 30 plus years with the SGI!! I could go on forever about the unhealthy choices and magical thinking of these women-- I find it maddening and pathetic but I know that it is useless for me to say anything-- I can't imagine where I would even begin !!
So my relationship with them is the major source of my imaginary dialogue with members about the stupidity and upside down Buddhism of the SGI cult.

"I feel sorry for these two women who have also been and sort of still are leaders in the cult-- one of them spends 2 to 4 hours a day chanting to win the Publishers Clearing House!! That is what you learn about Buddhism when you spend 30 plus years with the SGI!!

So my relationship with them is the major source of my imaginary dialogue with members about the stupidity and upside down Buddhism of the SGI cult."

At a point a few years back, I arrived at the conclusion that all the world religions are like selections at a grand smorgasbord (that's "buffet" to you Midwesterners). You take your tray, and you are free to take anything you like - and as many as you like. Most people in the world hold more than one religion at the same time - classic example is the "Three Treasures" of China, Buddhism, Taoism, and Confucianism. Most households have three altars, one for each. In Japan, it is not uncommon to see households with a Buddhist altar and a Shinto altar. The Nichiren school is a rare intolerant sect of Buddhism; most of the others are far more magnanimous and respectful of individual needs.

So you've got people mixing and matching from the available choices - or not taking anything, because nothing that is available appeals to them!

Your ladies are under the unfortunate delusion that what they have selected is so very tasty and delicious that EVERYBODY should want it for themselves! YOU should want it for yourself! It's like you go out to lunch together, and they insist on ordering their favorite entrée for you, and won't accept any argument!

In cases like this, I find it helpful to regard them as crotchety oldsters, set in their ways, and to indulge them as one would a child. There is no need to "fix" them or "teach" them - they are where they are on their individual paths, and all they need is for you to leave them alone. The same thing you need from them, you'll notice! But their minds are too confused for them to recognize that your path is yours to walk in the way only you know how.

What's funny about the intolerant is that they want YOU to change, but they would be outraged at the suggestion that THEY change. Just be consistent within your own mind and your own life (which I am confident that you are), and let their craziness just roll off like water droplets off a duck's feathers.

What I have found in my relationship with an elderly racist devout Christian of a father is that the best thing I can do for him is to just accept him as he is. Laugh at his jokes, or perhaps smile wryly, sigh grandly, and roll my eyes with a shake of my head "*tsk* That's my dad!". He's not going to change, and it would be disrespectful and unkind for me to make it clear that he is not acceptable to me unless he does. These two elderly ladies have few social connections, it sounds like to me, and really value (and need) your indulgence. They're not going to change, but you'll be doing a valuable humanitarian service if you continue to be involved with them. If it were me, I would try to limit my time at each other's homes (as that's where the Buddhist practice takes place) and, instead, go to movies, out to lunch, to the library or running errands as need be. If you're out and about, they won't be asking you to chant with them, for example, and you won't find yourself in a confrontational situation that nothing good can possibly come out of. Let them natter away about activities and "benefits" and all that stuff, and smile and nod and say, "Uh huh" and "Wow!" and "That's great!" and "Really?" as appropriate :) And just love them. The fact that you're there and giving them the opportunity to express themselves is proof of that. And that's the best thing to offer them - that human connection.

Remember, it's not your job to change them. Sure, they're crazy old ladies, but you can still love them and allow them to be themselves - the same thing you'd like THEM to offer you. But perhaps they can't at this point in their lives - maybe they never could. But YOU can. And you will continue to feel an overwhelming sense of relief that you're where YOU are and not still where THEY are. I don't mean that in any sort of disrespectful sense, but the fact is that they're "stuck" to some extent. That's THEIR path. And if you can accept them and love them in spite of them being in a different place, you're a great spirit. To be able to accept someone else exactly as he is, without *wanting* him to change, is true friendship and love.

I think it would really help if you could watch the "This Valley Of Terror" episode of the Kung Fu TV series (early 1970s, with David Carradine): [www.youtube.com] The actress is Sondra Locke, perhaps best known as Clint Eastwood's girlfriend whom he made orangutan movies with :) I'm serious - watch this.

Here are the other installments:

Part 1: [www.youtube.com]
Part 2: [www.youtube.com]
Part 3: [www.youtube.com]
Part 4: [www.youtube.com]
Part 5: [www.youtube.com]
Part 6: [www.youtube.com]

A quote: "You have found what you were seeking: peace for yourself. It was once said to me that if I shared a journey such as yours, at the end, I might find something of value for myself."