Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by:
kBOY
()
Date: September 26, 2019 03:21AM
C H A N G E D
Just another example of cutting & running.
All of the primary TLW leadership see the legal storm clouds lining up in the distance and they are fleeing in search of shelter.
Just another example of cutting & running.
All of the primary TLW leadership see the legal storm clouds lining up in the distance and they are fleeing in search of shelter.
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by:
Onion
()
Date: September 26, 2019 08:22AM
I have posted before my opinion that the Amended Articles of Incorporation that each TLWF church signed in 1992 accomplished what amounted to turning the churches into a denomination. They each agreed to one, central, governing person(s) - the apostolic fathering ministry purportedly held jointly by Gary and Marilyn.
I was personally outraged because this skewed the corporations so far from the foundation described and intended by JRS. The foundation presented to all of us is part of why we wanted to be part of the churches.
I have to admit I had not read the corporate bylaws amended in 1992 until recently.
Here is one paragraph included in the 1992 Bylaws (which are NOT public record):
"Our founding Apostolic Fathering Ministry was John Robert Stevens, who laid the foundation for the churches in the fellowship of the Living Word and placed the mantle of authority on such ministries as he would designate. John designated Gary and Marilyn Hargrave as his successors to the Apostolic Fathering Ministry, and gave them the authority to designate their mantle of authority to others."
The Amended Articles of Incorporation from 1992 are filed with the Secretary of State for each church and are available online as a public record. The Articles do not spell out this transfer of mantle but only reference that the APCO is now (as of the 1992 amended filing) under Gary and Marilyn Hargrave. The Bylaws may be accessible under the law but would take effort and red-tape to obtain. I am sure careful planning went into the difference in wording. It was constructed carefully, as was every step they took; not always smart, but always carefully plotted.
I did not realize that the complete fabrication of the passing of the mantle was etched forever in church bylaws. When G&M had the final signature on the last set of changed Bylaws, they must have had a huge party to celebrate achieving the goal of their deception. They took over complete domination without firing a shot. And I hope everyone realizes the next goal was to pass the mantle on to Marilyn's children.
Please stop for a minute and imagine that. And I know personally, as told to me by G&M, face-to-face, their goal was for Rick and Marti to "inherit" the churches from them.
I was personally outraged because this skewed the corporations so far from the foundation described and intended by JRS. The foundation presented to all of us is part of why we wanted to be part of the churches.
I have to admit I had not read the corporate bylaws amended in 1992 until recently.
Here is one paragraph included in the 1992 Bylaws (which are NOT public record):
"Our founding Apostolic Fathering Ministry was John Robert Stevens, who laid the foundation for the churches in the fellowship of the Living Word and placed the mantle of authority on such ministries as he would designate. John designated Gary and Marilyn Hargrave as his successors to the Apostolic Fathering Ministry, and gave them the authority to designate their mantle of authority to others."
The Amended Articles of Incorporation from 1992 are filed with the Secretary of State for each church and are available online as a public record. The Articles do not spell out this transfer of mantle but only reference that the APCO is now (as of the 1992 amended filing) under Gary and Marilyn Hargrave. The Bylaws may be accessible under the law but would take effort and red-tape to obtain. I am sure careful planning went into the difference in wording. It was constructed carefully, as was every step they took; not always smart, but always carefully plotted.
I did not realize that the complete fabrication of the passing of the mantle was etched forever in church bylaws. When G&M had the final signature on the last set of changed Bylaws, they must have had a huge party to celebrate achieving the goal of their deception. They took over complete domination without firing a shot. And I hope everyone realizes the next goal was to pass the mantle on to Marilyn's children.
Please stop for a minute and imagine that. And I know personally, as told to me by G&M, face-to-face, their goal was for Rick and Marti to "inherit" the churches from them.
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by:
Onion
()
Date: September 26, 2019 11:37AM
I have posted in the past concerning my distaste for the manipulative and deceptive changes made to the church corporations in 1992.
I have also posted my personal knowledge that JRS NEVER commissioned Gary and Marilyn to take the Apostolic mantle.
Articles of Incorporation are available as public records through the Secretary of State of California (or the applicable State) online. The Bylaws are not so readily available.
The Articles refer to Gary & Marilyn Hargrave as the overseers of the APCO. The Bylaws are 41 pages. The Articles are less than 10. Here is the more detailed explanation contained in the Bylaws:
"Our founding Apostolic Fathering Ministry was John Robert Stevens, who laid the foundation for the churches in the fellowship of the Living Word and placed the mantle of authority on such ministries as he would designate. John designated Gary and Marilyn Hargrave as his successors to the Apostolic Fathering Ministry, and gave them the authority to designate their mantle of authority to others."
Keep in mind; it was always Marilyn's intent and Gary's promise to her that they would find a way to let Marilyn's children inherit the church. Close your eyes and imagine that.
There is so much more to take issue with in these bylaws, if anyone wants a copy, please give me your email in a private message through this forum or send me a message backchannel on Facebook and I will give you the full text.
I have also posted my personal knowledge that JRS NEVER commissioned Gary and Marilyn to take the Apostolic mantle.
Articles of Incorporation are available as public records through the Secretary of State of California (or the applicable State) online. The Bylaws are not so readily available.
The Articles refer to Gary & Marilyn Hargrave as the overseers of the APCO. The Bylaws are 41 pages. The Articles are less than 10. Here is the more detailed explanation contained in the Bylaws:
"Our founding Apostolic Fathering Ministry was John Robert Stevens, who laid the foundation for the churches in the fellowship of the Living Word and placed the mantle of authority on such ministries as he would designate. John designated Gary and Marilyn Hargrave as his successors to the Apostolic Fathering Ministry, and gave them the authority to designate their mantle of authority to others."
Keep in mind; it was always Marilyn's intent and Gary's promise to her that they would find a way to let Marilyn's children inherit the church. Close your eyes and imagine that.
There is so much more to take issue with in these bylaws, if anyone wants a copy, please give me your email in a private message through this forum or send me a message backchannel on Facebook and I will give you the full text.
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by:
kBOY
()
Date: September 26, 2019 03:28PM
O N I O N
It sounds like with these revelations (and others you have brought to light), we could have used your whistle-blowing exposures a lot earlier in the game and saved ourselves decades of heartache.
(Just kidding . . .)
I believe many of us who viewed the TLW 'inner world' from far out in the bleachers, these revelations are still a bit shocking. The lack of integrity on every level front the start was amazingly concealed and eloquently covered up by a 'word from God'.
A very impressive con.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/26/2019 03:30PM by kBOY.
It sounds like with these revelations (and others you have brought to light), we could have used your whistle-blowing exposures a lot earlier in the game and saved ourselves decades of heartache.
(Just kidding . . .)
I believe many of us who viewed the TLW 'inner world' from far out in the bleachers, these revelations are still a bit shocking. The lack of integrity on every level front the start was amazingly concealed and eloquently covered up by a 'word from God'.
A very impressive con.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/26/2019 03:30PM by kBOY.
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by:
Reepicheep
()
Date: September 26, 2019 09:20PM
Quote
Posted by: Onion
Date: September 25, 2019 09:37PM
Keep in mind; it was always Marilyn's intent and Gary's promise to her that they would find a way to let Marilyn's children inherit the church. Close your eyes and imagine that.
Well, that helps to explain a hell of a lot of suffering. Disgusting!
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by:
Reepicheep
()
Date: September 27, 2019 12:16AM
Quote
Posted by: kBOY
Date: September 24, 2019 01:18PM
C H A N G E D
Not one of the 1000 prophets ever saw the Center of the Universe turning into a white elephant.
Kingdom in '79, anyone?
kBOY,
I guess Shiloh was the center of the Universe to a few people pushing their delusional nightmare. Definitely a white elephant now.
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by:
changedagain
()
Date: September 27, 2019 12:34AM
Onion wrote:
I have also posted my personal knowledge that JRS NEVER commissioned Gary and Marilyn to take the Apostolic mantle.
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by: Apostle Dog
Date: August 10, 2015 07:05AM
One last thing, Changedagain, Marilyn said many times that she was going to show the video of John Stevens commissioning her to be head over Living Word, I don't remember if Hargrave was supposed to be in on that commissioning at that time or not. But she NEVER showed that video. I wonder if anyone of you ever saw such a video. I was there a week, in every single meeting and that video was never shown.
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by: larry bobo
Date: August 08, 2018 10:41AM
Onion said, "Larry Cotton was indeed included with G & M as a leadership role after JRS died. But Marilyn was onto Gary immediately and there were rumors it started long before JRS died. I have no information on that.'
My sister is married to Vere Thomas' son, Bruce. As a result, I've heard Vere's version of John's last days before he died. Vere also passed away a few years ago. Some posting here may know that John asked to see Vere many times in his last days, but G & M would not allow it. Finally, when Vere was allowed to see John, he was not allowed to be alone with him. Some thought this was because John might give Vere a leadership role, since they had been close since the early days. Vere was concerned about the way G & M were constantly huddled off together and thought their relationship was very inappropriate. There was obviously some future planning going on, even though they were both married to someone else at the time. Vere was sent out of the country, and when he returned was stripped of everything he had built in Des Moines, including a house that had been given to him personally by one of the members. He moved back to Hawaii with nothing.
I have also posted my personal knowledge that JRS NEVER commissioned Gary and Marilyn to take the Apostolic mantle.
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by: Apostle Dog
Date: August 10, 2015 07:05AM
One last thing, Changedagain, Marilyn said many times that she was going to show the video of John Stevens commissioning her to be head over Living Word, I don't remember if Hargrave was supposed to be in on that commissioning at that time or not. But she NEVER showed that video. I wonder if anyone of you ever saw such a video. I was there a week, in every single meeting and that video was never shown.
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by: larry bobo
Date: August 08, 2018 10:41AM
Onion said, "Larry Cotton was indeed included with G & M as a leadership role after JRS died. But Marilyn was onto Gary immediately and there were rumors it started long before JRS died. I have no information on that.'
My sister is married to Vere Thomas' son, Bruce. As a result, I've heard Vere's version of John's last days before he died. Vere also passed away a few years ago. Some posting here may know that John asked to see Vere many times in his last days, but G & M would not allow it. Finally, when Vere was allowed to see John, he was not allowed to be alone with him. Some thought this was because John might give Vere a leadership role, since they had been close since the early days. Vere was concerned about the way G & M were constantly huddled off together and thought their relationship was very inappropriate. There was obviously some future planning going on, even though they were both married to someone else at the time. Vere was sent out of the country, and when he returned was stripped of everything he had built in Des Moines, including a house that had been given to him personally by one of the members. He moved back to Hawaii with nothing.
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by:
changedagain
()
Date: September 27, 2019 03:05AM
Larry wrote:
There was obviously some future planning going on, even though they were both married to someone else at the time. Vere was sent out of the country, and when he returned was stripped of everything he had built in Des Moines, including a house that had been given to him personally by one of the members. He moved back to Hawaii with nothing.
Oneness?
There was obviously some future planning going on, even though they were both married to someone else at the time. Vere was sent out of the country, and when he returned was stripped of everything he had built in Des Moines, including a house that had been given to him personally by one of the members. He moved back to Hawaii with nothing.
Oneness?
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by:
Lilith
()
Date: September 27, 2019 05:14AM
Onion Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have also posted my personal knowledge that JRS
> NEVER commissioned Gary and Marilyn to take the
> Apostolic mantle.
I wonder what would have happened if just one person would have stood up in a service during their power grab and said that what they were doing wasn't what John wanted. Not to say what John did was really any better but would it have rocked the boat just enough. Would they have been murdered, because people were pretty crazy back then. Would anyone have listened?
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have also posted my personal knowledge that JRS
> NEVER commissioned Gary and Marilyn to take the
> Apostolic mantle.
I wonder what would have happened if just one person would have stood up in a service during their power grab and said that what they were doing wasn't what John wanted. Not to say what John did was really any better but would it have rocked the boat just enough. Would they have been murdered, because people were pretty crazy back then. Would anyone have listened?
Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens
Posted by:
Reepicheep
()
Date: September 27, 2019 09:48PM
Onion wrote:
I have also posted my personal knowledge that JRS NEVER commissioned Gary and Marilyn to take the Apostolic mantle.
Lilith wrote:
I wonder what would have happened if just one person would have stood up in a service during their power grab and said that what they were doing wasn't what John wanted. Not to say what John did was really any better but would it have rocked the boat just enough. Would they have been murdered, because people were pretty crazy back then. Would anyone have listened?
_________________________________
Lilith, unfortunately, any person standing up and telling the truth about the power grab for "the mantle" would undoubtedly have been ridiculed, harrassed and alienated. Anyone attempting to speak the truth at that time was publicly demeaned to such an extent that the implied warning was "stand with this person and you're next. And by the way, we have your children, your friends and your family. Don't think you'll get out of here with anything but yourself. And that's if you're lucky".
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/27/2019 09:50PM by Reepicheep.
I have also posted my personal knowledge that JRS NEVER commissioned Gary and Marilyn to take the Apostolic mantle.
Lilith wrote:
I wonder what would have happened if just one person would have stood up in a service during their power grab and said that what they were doing wasn't what John wanted. Not to say what John did was really any better but would it have rocked the boat just enough. Would they have been murdered, because people were pretty crazy back then. Would anyone have listened?
_________________________________
Lilith, unfortunately, any person standing up and telling the truth about the power grab for "the mantle" would undoubtedly have been ridiculed, harrassed and alienated. Anyone attempting to speak the truth at that time was publicly demeaned to such an extent that the implied warning was "stand with this person and you're next. And by the way, we have your children, your friends and your family. Don't think you'll get out of here with anything but yourself. And that's if you're lucky".
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/27/2019 09:50PM by Reepicheep.
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