Referencing my three or four personal encounters with John Miller all in Salt Lake City, I wish for the following: To hear him say, “And do not call anyone on earth your father, for One is your father, He who is in heaven,” rather than the over emphasized hierarchical supporting, “You don’t have many fathers” verse which he seemed to cling to. To hear that would be almost shocking and quite the release to say the least.

Well it's New Year's Eave in the South. Here it is just before midnite as I listen to the fire crackers and people shooting up their collard green patch with their new Christmas hunting rifles, and everybody hooting it up pretty good, I try to make a resolution or two. I personally go by the astrological calendar. If it was good enough for ancient Israel it is good enough for me. My new year starts on Nisan 1, which just happens to be 1 degree Aries.

But anyway, my mind just started to wonder, since I don't seem to be able to obtain a copy of Shape of Things to Come, somebody tell me which of the predictions came true. I know the one about the people wearing their drawers on the outside was one of them. I have been told even recently that ALL of it came true, but he mentioned that the Kingdom didn't come with observation or whatever., I guess it is for the spiritual elite to notice anything but the drawers on the outside of the trousers.

FCSLC, good point regarding Miller. He owes you an apology, as well as everyone else to whom he has represented himself as a messenger of God. kBOY says he is devastated and would like to rectify any harm he has done. I suppose if remorse had occurred prior to, and not coincided with the unfair way in which he was treated, it might seem more genuine. But he cannot change the timing, he is where he is, and can only go from here to make amends. Not having known Miller, I may be basing a lot on kBOY's assessment, but I can give him the benefit of the doubt that he is truly sorry for certain things. I am curious as to what, precisely, he is sorry for, but there is probably no way to ever know. There is also no practical way to be truly convinced of his sincerity. If kBOY's invitation to contact Miller is to be believed, that is the closest I should think anyone will ever get. Even if he had the unprecedented courage to post in this forum, considering that hardly anybody here sees anything the same way, most would not be satisfied.

I would like to point out that in my experience, Miller is the first and only member of walk leadership to apologize or attempt to shoulder responsibility for wrongs done at all. I guess I appreciate that. In my opinion, all the so-called apostles, pastors, elders, and prophets throughout the walk's history should admit, confess, and apologize for the times they pretended to know God's will for someone's life--which was every single time any of them ministered. Miller had no monopoly on the ministry of confusing and sometimes harmful untruths that we all had to deal with. It makes no difference whether it was done under the auspices of Stevens or Gary and Marilyn. By anyone's definition, false prophets abounded. They all misrepresented themselves; Miller did it a lot longer.

LS, you bring up a very interesting point. In a way, we are all like SS members that were gunho in carrying out the orders of Hitler. A lot of us took our turns running the gas chambers on the sheep.

Before we stone Miller, lets stop and think about our participation as well. Anyone who has served as an elder or who got involved in a DR has participated in this destruction of sheep and spiritual abuse.

I've certainly been in on some funky personal minestry and counceling. I've tried to repent to those I've touched wrongly. It's hard to reach them all, especially those who are still active LW members. I have spent much time on my face in prayer about this. It will be a continual process for the rest of my life.

FCSLC:

I was hoping you were following the recent discussions regarding Miller. As I suggested to SLANDJT, if you feel you were wronged at his hands in the past, that is something he has made great efforts to rectify. (It is interesting to note that the scriptures you quoted represent two distinct theologies; the teachings of Jesus on the one hand, and the religion of Paul on the other--but that is a discussion for another day.)

These days Miller would be the first to admit that the leadership of TLW has veered far off course. That does not mean he felt that way during the time period you reference, but nonetheless, when you are downing the Kool-Aid with zeal, your perception and equilibrium are definitely affected, and accidents with collateral damage are bound to happen.

As LAMPSHMAMP and PALEFACE both pointed out, abuses were part of the culture as a whole, and all who drank the Kool-Aid, both shepherds and sheep, were fair game. As with any abuse, physical or psychological, it is only after kicking the habit and gaining some distance, that one can properly assess infractions committed and lives adversely affected.

The ball is in your court if you wish to exchange your thorns for lilies.

Two distinct theologies. Put in those terms the delineation is like sunshine from heaven separating the way of thorns from that of lilies, the way of independence and free life from that of being fleeced and subjugated.

I suppose I can remove myself from the Hargrave/Miller/Court/Edvalson backed Salt Lake City black list version of shunned, rebellious, blind, contaminating, subversive souls since it all boils down to nothing more than humans preferring one theology over another. There was never any divine input or involvement at all, just religious people using proven formulas to make a living off of others.

FCSLC:

Religion is the unfortunate result of a lack of RELATIONSHIP, the very message that Jesus taught, and was then co-opted into a religion. We have all been members of some ‘club’ along the way, some more benign than others. We happened to join one that required demanding protocols and little tolerance for independent inquiry. When the place became too straight for us we simply did not renew our membership and continued on as best we could.

Hindsight being 20/20 and hopefully learning our lessons, however painful, one would hope that each finds their way to greener pastures and a brighter future, where LOVE & RELATIONSHIPS trump all doctrine forever.

I think I am going to call the Teamsters union and see if I can get them to go organize Shiloh's workers. If they go in there and cut off a few pinky fingers they'll make them see the light, boy.

A.D.

Speaking of a worker’s union, the workforce has dwindled to such an extent that there was actually a recruiting effort put forth last year to cover all the needs at the Shiloh summer camp. Apparently the loss of and the aging-out of the local population has left them short of covering all the needs.

Perhaps that is ‘The Shape of Things to Come’ you were wondering about.

Wow kBOY this might be our chance to get back in the upward flow. I wonder if the sawmill is still running. Maybe you and me could go up there and let them know that we are repenting for leaving them in a bind.


kBOY Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A.D.
>
> Speaking of a worker’s union, the workforce has
> dwindled to such an extent that there was actually
> a recruiting effort put forth last year to cover
> all the needs at the Shiloh summer camp.
> Apparently the loss of and the aging-out of the
> local population has left them short of covering
> all the needs.
>
> Perhaps that is ‘The Shape of Things to Come’
> you were wondering about.