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Gurdjieff groups in the SF Bay Area--mid-seventies
Posted by: lyleb ()
Date: December 06, 2003 10:39AM

Interested in contact with any who may have fallen victim to Robert Burton or Alex Horn in the period from 1973-76.

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Gurdjieff groups in the SF Bay Area--mid-seventies
Posted by: pitcow ()
Date: December 29, 2003 03:26AM

In 1981 I joined a Gurdjieff group in the California Bay Area. This group was lead by Henry Korman, and had no name. Many of the group members had moved from New York to the Bay Area with Henry in the late 70's. If you are enquiring about other groups such as this one, let me know.

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Gurdjieff groups in the SF Bay Area--mid-seventies
Posted by: lyleb ()
Date: December 29, 2003 10:39AM

Sorry, but I have no knowledge of Korman. I hope that your experience with him was rewarding, and, if not, that you departed quickly.

Sadly, when I experienced this Gurdieff phenomemon in the early to mid-seventies, there wasn't an objective standard available for measuring authenticity, so the default was good old-fashioned "faith," in most cases a very dangerous path.

The psychological "truths" of Gurdieff/Ouspensky are extremely fertile fields, both for those who would explore them, and for those who would exploit them. There is no justification for "faith" in this exploration. If "faith" is demanded then you are on the wrong track--get out as fast as you can!

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Gurdjieff groups in the SF Bay Area--mid-seventies
Posted by: pitcow ()
Date: December 30, 2003 01:45AM

Unfortunately, I stayed in the Korman "Gurdjieff" group for 10 years. I also went to "therapy" with Korman's wife, an unlicensed therapist. When it was over I was kicked out for insufficient devotion; my 'therapist' denounced me to the rest of the members as having no integrity. She had graduated me from therapy 'with honors' a week prior to this.
I went into a year of clinical depression, gained 150 pounds, lost my job and my marriage. That was 1992.
Now I've lost the weight, am friends with my ex, and have a new life. But my spiritual life is dead.
Korman and his wife used the members of the group to externalize their own psychological problems, which were never discussed. Instead we were encouraged to criticize each other, analyze each others' behavior, and follow the Kormans' model of cruelty. In the end, the Kormans accused the members of the group of alienating them from their children. At the time, most of us denied this. Now, I hope it's true; because if it is, we will have done those beknighted children a great favor.

The Kormans are members of another Gurdjieff group now, and continue to 'study' the Work, which lends itself to exclusivity, superiority, and cruelty. The poison continues.
Pitcow

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Gurdjieff groups in the SF Bay Area--mid-seventies
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: January 16, 2004 03:06AM

There is additonal contextual data on a thread that started with a question from someone concerned about the welfare of a good friend who had been recruited into Sharon Gans/Alex Horn group.

The title of the thread is

'Try to identify a group named "The Work"'

[board.culteducation.com]

It traces the 'geneology' of various Fourth Way derivatives using information from the book 'Taking With the Left Hand' by William Patrick Patterson--a history of 3 groups/movement which use material from Gurdjieff work but are not endorsed by anyone in the lineage.

Patterson's chapter entitled 'How the Enneagram Came to Market' in the book 'Taking With the Left Hand' Page 32 gives additional information. The book is readily available in stores and online.

For those who want to research this area, Patterson's book is essential reading.

**Information on issues that come up in Small Groups,whether Fourth Way or not, can be found here:

[board.culteducation.com]

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Gurdjieff groups in the SF Bay Area--mid-seventies
Posted by: pitcow ()
Date: January 16, 2004 08:31AM

Korman is extremely intelligent and charming. However, once you become friendly with him you will see that he has a way of influencing you.

I met someone recently who didn't know anything about his past and ended up working with him. She told me "this guy really seems to be an expert about everything... But without me asking him, he started to advise me about xxx (a personal matter). He also took credit for a lot of my colleagues' work, simply because they had consulted him. That's when I decided he was a drag more than a help, and had to let him go."

Her experiences are typical of mine from years ago. He has not changed.
Pitcow

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Gurdjieff groups in the SF Bay Area--mid-seventies
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: August 21, 2004 04:55AM

We have found and posted two articles from the psychological/psychiatric literature on the dynamics of psychotherapy cults. Persons who wish to evaluate the health of their groups, (whether Fourth Way or some other tradition) or who want to keep their group in a good place may find the articles a helpful resource.

(Note, some links had to be cut in half to keep the page readable
and within margins. If a link doesnt work when you click it, cut
and paste it into your browser)

[board.culteducation.com]

The articles can also be accessed, respectively, at

[www.ex-iwp.org]
of%20the%20Therepeutic%20Relationship.htm

[66.102.7.104]
/misc/Factnet/BOLAND92.CSJ+hazards+temerlin&hl
=en&ie=UTF-8

This thread covers a specific confusing inducing method called 'gaslighting'

[board.culteducation.com]

This may contain material relevant to those interested in G work or in recovery

The author does not give a list of persons or groups. Instead he offers material designed assist people in developing their own powers of discrimination.

[spiritual-health.org]

There is an article in this collection about Gurdjieff. The author met persons who had studied with G.

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Gurdjieff groups in the SF Bay Area--mid-seventies
Posted by: pink ()
Date: December 05, 2004 08:33AM

i know a whole host of people who fell victim to alex horn. my parents and all their friends. allmy friend and childhood companions parents. they all left and went to horn's ex wife, anne haas, who didnt turn out much better. our parents paid hundreds a month to benefit from her psychological abuse. we didnt pay anythign to recieve it but we got it anyway. not to mention physical abuse.

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Gurdjieff groups in the SF Bay Area--mid-seventies
Posted by: Blue ()
Date: December 26, 2004 08:58AM

I am trying to contact other people who have been hurt by Alex Horn. Names can be kept anonymous. I am remembering things from my chilhood in his cult. 1963-1966. In Mexico and US. These memories are very disturbing, any replies would be appreciated.

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Gurdjieff groups in the SF Bay Area--mid-seventies
Posted by: mxkitty ()
Date: December 31, 2004 06:24PM

I was exposed to the Horn/Haas group at age 16 months just before the group moved to Red Mountain and Horn's split from Haas (maiden name Burridge) and his subsequent marriage to Sharon Gans. At that young age I was exposed to 3 and 4 year olds who were encouraged to copulate with one another, according to my mother who left me there anyway. The adults also copulated in front of the children. Who knows what else I witnessed - my memories are fuzzy because I was so young, and probably traumatized as well.

I have heard that Haas has "retired". I do not know if this is true, and if so, who is running the group now, but it is still going. I have met several people who were raised in the group and all are troubled. I'd like to help them, as I have sought my own recovery from this cult and feel much better now.

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