My wife just returned from PSI7 this last Sunday and I am very, very, concerned. She came home for this seminar with a new found attitude towards me, our marriage and our children. She tried to talk me into taking this course ever since she got home. She has been talking about ‘playing” something called Pld (?) and getting people that we know into enrolling in the class. She is constantly on the phone shouting the praises of this group. She tried to talk our teenage daughter into taking this course. My daughter being somewhat computer savvy looked PSI up on the internet and found all this information about these groups. When my daughter, being somewhat a straight forward person, told my wife she had been “brainwashed by a cult” she started having a fit that she could not be influenced by anyone; that what my daughter found was made up bullshit by people who want to destroy PSI. Like there is global conspiracy against this organization. Now she is butting heads with our teenage daughter on every little thing that comes up. This causes me the problem of having to act as a mediator between the two of them. I tell my daughter to let things go and maybe my wife will “return to normal.” I tried to tell my wife that there is a lot of evidence out there that support the fact that she has been influenced by this group. The argument that ensued was the worse one in our 19 year marriage. She told me I wasn’t supporting her and I was taking sides with my daughter. I tried to explain to her that I wasn’t taking a side against her, rather I was agreeing with my daughter’s assessment that she had been influenced by this group. I told her that her new attitude was not something I liked and I suggested she rethink what she was doing with our relationship and the relationship with our oldest daughter. I guess that was the wrong thing to say because I got the cold shoulder on Tuesday and Wednesday.

Wednesday evening she returned home with all her things from the office and told me she quit her job for no apparent reason except she wants a change. No forethought whatsoever. She had thirteen years in the company and threw away her seniority, medical insurance, etc, for these new ideas that the universe is going to provide her with her wants and needs.

This shift in her attitude is costing us a lot of mental anguish and a large amount of money. She told me that she paid three thousand dollars for the 7 day seminar after attending the four day basic a few months ago. When she returned from California she tells me that she paid this organization another $3600.00 for a nine day leadership class. We don’t have the money for this and she doesn’t seem to care. Then to quit her job without any warning. She told me she is moving forward with her life and after reading some of the posts on here and other sites I am very concerned that I am going to lose my wife. The power of positive thinking is one thing but this is ridiculous.

I was wondering if anyone out there has some insight on what would happen if I were to make a complaint to the Attorney General or some other government organization so they could investigate this group and possibly close them down.

Please include Klemmer & Associates along with the other LGAT's when you talk to the Attorney General.

I agree that these LGAT's need to be shut down. Your story is far to common. I have different variables in my experience. Yet just as destructive.

Maybe we can get the Attorney General to read the posts on this website to maybe start a investigation on all LGAT's and as a group help in busting this wide open in the legal realm.

I am willing, and would love to see these LGAT's shut down legally.

I am really sorry about what your family is going through right now.
I did PSI Basic and I loved it. The way I knew about them was through work and not because a work mate told me but because the company I work for was offering to pay part of the cost of the basic. This company I work for has no relationship with PSI Seminars. It is a very successfull IT related midsize company that has been growing since it started. Many of the employees have taken these seminars and only one of them have left his job. In my case far from moving me to leave my job it helped me re-discovering it. I now go to work with a sense of being productive and the energy to improve it more and more every day.
PSI seminars do have value in it (a lot to me) and the fact that a successful company is willing to encourage its employees to take them shows support from a respectful source. I know you don't know the company I work for but I mention it because to me it was crucial. I would have never enrolled into this otherwise.
I am going to do PSI 7 soon but before I enrolled in it I needed my wife to do the basic as well. Now we are going together to PSI 7. Families are teams. They need to be in sync pulling all in the same direction. Do you see it coming yet? Well yes, I am going to recomend you to do the Basic but I am going to save you the usual PSI basic speech for why you should do it. I think you should do it because that way you would be experiencing first hand what your wife went through and that way you will be able to tell for yourself. Plus she would feel your are at least giving it a try. The basic is $500 and if you don't like it they give you back $450 (or 450 and 400 don't remember exactly). What would you be afraid of? A brain wash? How could they brain wash you? It is just people talking. Then there is the exercises which are nothing but more people talking although you are a little bit more exposed. However you do them only if you want to. Here is one fact: PSI Basic has been around for over 30 years. People do get value out of these seminars otherwise they would have been gone long ago. The thing with this kind of companies is that it is very difficult to discern the good ones from the bad ones so the only way is getting references about them. PSI Seminars is for real. So real that they are absolutely INperfect. For instance I hate the fact that they are extremely pushy when it comes to enroll you in higher seminars or get you to eroll other people in the basic. But hey! car dealers are worse and I still love my car. Get the stuff that helps and discard the rest. All you need to do is say no when it is no. Give it a try, if it does not work then you loose $50. But what if it does work? What if your family starts functioning better? Not perfect simply better, doesn't it worth it? I think it does. Good luck to you.

What is the possibility to get the Attorney General to address the psychological aspect of how LGAT's are messing around in the depths of people and their psyche at the depths that we pay professionals to help us sort out.

While LGAT's have participants sign waivers releasing companies of responsibility of any mental and emotional damages prior to attending seminars. I searched my paperwork from Klemmer to try and find the release that I signed for Klemmer & Associates and realized that they did not give me a copy of this release. I know I signed one prior to each of the four seminars that I attended. I remember the wording basically releasing Klemmer of liability before I could attend any of these seminars.

If doctors are not able to be kept from being held liable for malpractice lawsuits? Why can't we gather enough people within each LGAT and file a class action lawsuit agianst each one of these LGAT companies.

Not from a single person standpoint, but from a group stand point?

Just out of curiosity. Why can't we mobilize the people who have been destroyed by these groups and take legal action to put these companies out of business?

I am willing to join a fight agianst these companies. Anyone else?

Count me in the fight against lgats too.

Quote
skeptic
Count me in the fight against lgats too.

and me

EFE132,

Thank you for the concern for what my family is going through. I am very concerned as my daughters and I are the one’s living this nightmare. I would like to point out though that your statements about PSI are somewhat like what my wife is spouting towards me, my family and friends. Her new “PSI friends” discount everything I say and respond with the same verbal bullshit. “Take the basic,” “It will change your life,” and “resistance is persistence.” My wife asked me to come to her basic graduation last month and all I heard was a big sales pitch. I couldn’t understand what was so great about this seminar. I was approached by a couple of men who had just graduated and they were asking me if I was interested in this class. I was polite and told them no; I did not see what it had to offer me and the presentation told me nothing. They responded “you need to experience it for yourself.” You and all her PSI friends sound like a bunch of robots programmed to say the same thing.

One of your comments was “maybe you should do the basic?” Your statement “I am going to do PSI7 soon but before I enrolled in it I needed my wife to do the basic as well.” My question is WHY? Why does your wife need to take the basic before your go to PSI7? As for your comment about “families are teams. They need to be in sync pulling in all the same direction.” My wife and I have been married 19 years, were dating two years before that, and no major arguments or disagreements. The only fight I can recall in 19 years was where we where going on vacation 10 years ago. The family has been in sync up until her return from PSI 7 in California.

And what do you mean “Do you see it coming yet?” What exactly does that mean? What is “IT?” (And I don’t mean your IT company.)

Your statement that I need to experience “first hand” what my wife went though and “that way you would be able to tell for yourself.” I don’t need or want to climb to the top of phone poles, go over walls and stand on the edge of a cliff to experience life. I don’t need or want to stand in a circle by candlelight and look into the eyes of a stranger and make a proclamation to them that I want to be intimate with him/her or it. I am a MARRIED man and the only one I would do that with is MY WIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That’s if she comes to her senses. I don’t need to read a PSI Bible, one like the wife brought home, written by a dead man who didn’t have the sense to keep his feet on the ground as I read he died in a plane crash back in the 70’s. Maybe he didn’t believe this non-sense either as I am sure the “universe” would have allowed him to walk away from his “accident.”

As for you “saving” me from the usually PSI speech; I see you made it anyway. Why do I need to be “exposed” to strangers at a ranch in California? Why would I want to? If I were to go to PSI why would I stand in front of a group and tell them what I have hidden in my heart and mind? Those things make me what I am. I learned from my mistakes and moved on, so why be reminded of them? I live with them everyday. We all have something buried in our past that is best left forgotten. Why would I share that with a bunch of strangers? Why would I go to the ranch and attend a “barn dance?” What is the point? I have gone to several social functions over the years and danced with my wife and my friends. I even danced with my daughters even though it embarrassed the hell out of them. (Sorry that one made me smile for a second). But this brings me to a point. I have made a point of being a member of MY family; not some group mentality that doesn’t give due consideration to destroying a family to make a dollar. Not once have I come home from a training session for work or any other type of training and thought “I think I’ll leave my family because there’s something better out there.” I have sometimes thought that I would rather be at home with my family than at a training seminar.

What value does PSI really offer? Your statements make no sense to me and leads me to believe that you think I am closed minded. Believe me I AM NOT THAT CLOSED MINDED!!!!!! But I have made up my mind…. I have made my choices and they don’t include PSI………. I have seen the evil man can do to one another (and I don’t mean on the TV news) and I have continued to maintain a course for a healthy life and emotional wellbeing. That’s until my wife returned from PSI7. Now I am stressed out and fear that something is going to happen to her. I am stressed out that this is going to destroy my family. I am stress out that this is going to destroy my relationship with the woman I love and have loved for the past 21 years. I am stressed out this is going to destroy my wife’s relationship with her daughters. And believe me she is already on her way in the short week she has been back from PSI7.

Your statement “The thing with this kind of companies is that it is very difficult to discern the good ones from the bad ones so the only way is getting references about them.” Where did you get the references before going to PSI? You said you were sent by the company you worked for. I saw nothing to indicate that you checked PSI out before you attended this class/seminar. How do I know if you weren’t brainwashed? Have you considered the “possibility” that you were brainwashed? Are you willing to even admit that you might have been conned by this company and the only thing you got was some empty pockets and a warped sense of wellbeing? Are you looking at the world with rose colored glasses now that you’ve taken the basic? Or are you the one that is “closed minded” and willing to read what other people have written?

As for the references I have looked at this board and other posts on other web sites and I have found that a lot of people are VICTIMS of this group. I have only started to read the other posts and it’s very apparent that you DID NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!! If you checked PSI out before you attended the seminars I’m sure you wouldn’t have gone. The information is out there; all you need to do is read it. And don’t respond that these messages are from people who are disillusioned with PSI because I already know that. I see the pain this has caused the people who went and for the people who were left behind. And I haven’t even begun to scratch the surface of the information I have to look at. But with as much as there is out there you need to realize that PSI does cause people problems, very much like the problems I am experiencing. I have even read a threat on here from people who have gone to the training, returned and thrown their relationships away based on the power of this training only to later regret their decision. Some even admit that this training is a “CULT.” Oh wait; the fact that you posted here indicates you are reading the information people have provided and you’re still not getting “IT.”

“PSI Seminars is for real? So real that they are INperfect?” Is this more PSI Speak? What kind of statement is that? If they are imperfect why are you taking the seminar? Why are you attempting to sell me on this course (or curse)? “Get the stuff that helps and discard the rest?” You do that with any training you go to. If they’re pushy enough that you can equate them to “car salesmen” you need to wake up and get out while you still have your sanity and money.

And your comment “What if your family starts functioning better? Not perfect simply better.” My family has gone though most of the trials and tribulations that every family does; now to include this bullshit. My family is simply that; MY FAMILY!!!!! It does not belong to PSI…….. My family was fine, not perfect, but fine in the aspects that I enjoyed coming home every night to be with them until my wife’s returned from this PSI bullshit. I have two beautiful daughters whom I am very proud of. They are growing into responsible people and they don’t need to see their mother, the woman who helped raised them, throwing her marriage and family to side because PSI is now more important. If you believe PSI is the answer to your problems you are kidding yourself just like she is. If you saw the change in her in the SHORT time since she’s been back you would understand. No; I take that back, you wouldn’t understand because you sound just like her, but for the others reading this, the ones who have lived with/through this would. I rather place my money on that bet than I would shelling it out to PSI and getting “mindf*ked” for the trouble. (Sorry for my language.)

I am going to be “real” with you “EFE132” this BS is destroying my family and you are on this message board telling me that if I take these seminars it will correct the problems. Well I don’t think so. If you were stupid enough to be sucked into this scam that’s your problem. I have to deal with this, not you. You may have fooled you wife into taking this but at what cost? What if she trusted you enough to get her involved in this and she returns with a new attitude just like my wife? What happens when she returns from this and leaves you? What are you going to say then? Are you going to except the fact she just left to do what? Find her own path? Or are you going to except the responsibility for destroying your marriage because you (YES YOU) are the one who “enrolled” her in this program. If you don’t believe it could happen you are living in a dream world.

And I would like to wish you luck also; I think you’re going to need it because I don’t believe the lie of PSI and I am offended that you think I would.

PS: I am sorry if I offended anybody with my language, but I call it like it is. I would like to thank those of you who were influenced by these groups, had the courage to admit it and instead of remaining silent came forward, told your story in the hopes it would save someone the same trouble. I truly admire that.

And to those you who responded I thank you for your support.

Ghost Dancer,

That was a GREAT response. I agree with you 100 percent. I liked the line "Don't believe the lie of PSI."

I support your efforts. I hope things go well with your wife.

I'm not fully aware of PSI but in my experience, with my loved one, the reason they started drifting away from the family is because they weren't receiving enough attention.

If a loved one goes to a seminar and seems to be changing, you have to reach into your heart, and sincerely tell them you love them and that you are concerned about this.

I have spoken to a family friend who is a therapist, and many of her clients are people who became disillusioned with the seminars and LGATs. They get the rush from the Love Bombing and intense, vulnerable atmosphere there, but the high wears off over time, leaving them wanting another seminar. It is during this time that you must love them (remember lovwe is a verb, not just a part of a marriage phrase) Show them AND tell them you love them, and engage them in your life and their family, and your own family as much as you can. Let them know they are important and wonderful as they are.

The LGATs are a scam, but you can triumph over them with intellect, sincerity, and love.

Remember also, they are not trying to frustrate or scare you, they believe that they are going to change their life to their benefit, so give them what they are really seeking, comfort and love.

Ghost Dancer, Right on the mark!!!!!!!!!!!!

edt143 I read what you had to say and it reminded me of another post on another message board. I pasted it here for you to read. It was from another basic grad who was recruited by his/her boss.


Posted on Sunday, September 14, 2003 - 12:18 pm:
I went to psi basic 3 years ago because my boss at the time wanted me to go. i had no idea what to expect. [b:b90b1a6ee7]what i got was brainwashed[/b:b90b1a6ee7], pure and simple. that thing about the "rules" is all set up so that the leaders can have maximum control over what you do and when so that it ultimately [b:b90b1a6ee7]makes a person more vulnerable to suggestion.[/b:b90b1a6ee7] It's all an attempt to break you down and remove your own ability to think freely for yourself [b:b90b1a6ee7]to the point that some of the individuals wouldn't know what to think unless psi told them[/b:b90b1a6ee7] (building up). Most of the basic seminar is set up to achieve two things: to take you away from your friends and loved ones in an emotional sense (you are constantly being told in a manner of speaking that those around you in your normal life behave like a "crab pot" trying to pull you back to what your life was like and it is up to you ro resist this to achieve your true potential which pai claims it can help you realize. The second goal is to get you to continue on to psi-7 where among other things, you'll climb on ropes and jump off telephone poles onto a trapeeze bar as some symbolic way of achieving something. [b:b90b1a6ee7]It doesn't seem to bother most people who have been through this that spending ridiculous amounts of money to jump around like a monkey has absolutely NOTHING to do with real life by any stretch of the imagination.[/b:b90b1a6ee7] The question about it being a cult has been thrown back and forth for at least as long as I had first been to basic and i feel that its something that is best left to each person who has the [b:b90b1a6ee7]misfortune to experience this[/b:b90b1a6ee7] to answer. Personally, I do not think that it is a cult in the true sense of the word, but it has some extremely cult-like qualities and ideology that can be dangerous to relatioships and families. My advice to you then is this. If your wife is involved, take all of her credit cards and do everything that you can do to gain full control of your finances. This is the most practical step to take in the beginning and when she turns back into herself again she will probably thank you. As for the rest, don't judge her for what she says and for god's sake don't hold it against her. Most of what is coming out of her mouth has been put there by an organization that does not have her best interests at heart no matter how much she may think otherwise. Again, I say this because groups like psi can do such a slow burn on you psychically that relationships can be torn apart. Third, do as much research as you can about psi. I had contacted the better business bureau and found them to be an immeasurable help. If you can do these things and stay together, any potential damage done by psi or groups like it will be slight and will not last and I would predict that your wife will come out of this reletivele unscathed and a bit wiser about who she takes suggestions from in the future. Best of Luck.