Comparison Game-- Impact Anathema

I’m coached on a regular and irritating basis to get out of the comparison game. Impact hates comparisons. I admit to using comparisons a lot, but that works for me, so it’s right, right? Impact teaches trainees to have clear intentions when communicating. Is it any wonder that “Communications” comes before “Enrollment?” They want you to be at cause and forceful and enroll as many Quest trainees as possible. What I was thinking about when using the quiver/arrow analogy was what would work for limiting, with “lethal” effectiveness in comparison to stinging effectiveness, Impact’s malignant, deceptive manipulation and coercive control methods. To use their own teachings, what works or what will work is right. A better comparison I hope follows: Quest is to Impact as air and water are to an animal. From Animal Planet I get that the most effective method for a cheetah to bag a gazelle is not to try to rip out its heart in a bloody fight, but to bite its trachea or wind pipe and be patient. In similar fashion anything that would reduce Quest enrollment would … well, you see what I mean.

On the religious issue I get that each “family” going through the core trainings is asked to declare their individual religious beliefs at some vague level. This comes at least twice in the Core process. To get a more statistically significant sample I asked a person of proven reliability on the subject how many persons in multiple observed core trainings denied belief in God, whatever that meant to them. Others may remember more in detail how this went. The answer was very, very few, on the order of one person per group. Perhaps a poll on this forum would be helpful if anyone cares. If it is true that those entering Quest have an almost unanimous belief in religion of some kind at some level, then targeting with religious arguments are likely to have intended results.

Impact is religious syncretism. This is its roots and what it is born of. It resulted from the mingling of previously existing religious systems created by the reconciliation and union of a host of different principles, practices and beliefs. It satisfies, at least temporarily, the innate religious longings of humans. This is its trachea as well as the reason for its profitability.

Hopeful

I am very similar to the friend that army mentioned she was frustrated with. I finished Lift Off this year and felt like I had a very positive experience. I had been talking to one of my closest friends about it since before I went. I was fascinated by the experience of a friend. I was presented with the opportunity to go and I jumped on it. Because I only had until Saturday at 1:00pm urh.

I approached the trainings very much like I approached philosophy classes I took in college. They presented ideas for discussion and I chewed on them for a while. I thought about whether I believed them or not. Much of the time I asked myself if there was another way to think about what they were saying that made more sense to me. Sometimes there was, and sometimes there wasn’t and I spat it out. There were definitely some things that I spat out and chose to ignore at Impact. But I was also able to take some good things away from it and thus deemed it as a positive experience and wanted the people I knew to experience it as well.

Finally the friend I had been talking about it with was able to go and she had an awful experience. When she finally started telling me in detail about her experience I was horrified and terribly confused. Believe it or not the arcs were actually a positive experience for me. I don’t know if they took it easy on me or what, but there was one big thing they hit right on the head and I found it very insightful. It’s been a while but that was all I really remembered about the arcs. Don’t get me wrong I was totally sobbing from the things they said, and maybe I’ve just forgotten but nothing else really stuck. Then my friend started telling me some of the things that were said to her and I was blown away that it was such a negative experience. Then we started talking about all the problems with theories presented and discussed in the training, most of which I either molded or ignored. I was again shocked and sickened at the realization of what they were really doing and how detrimental it could be.

I am so grateful that this particular friend went because her experience has stopped me in my tracks and saved me from convincing several other people that I know from going. At the same time I feel HORRIBLE for subjecting her and some of her family members to that place.

I am so embarrassed too. I haven’t really had to explain my disillusionment with Impact and the fact that they brainwash people to anyone besides my husband yet, but it will be inevitable. My husband always cracked cult jokes about Impact referencing “the leader” and likening it to the Simpson’s episode where they join a cult. I finally sat down with him and told him everything I could about my experience and what my friend and I had been discussing. He started to make another Leader joke and then stopped and got wide eyed with a smirk on his face and said “Hah! I was right all along; they are just like that Simpson’s episode!” (an episode I definitely want to see again soon) He has been having a lot of fun cracking jokes about the “blue flame of protection” and how one day we can sit down and say “do you remember that one time when you joined a cult?”

While my husband is very good at lightening the mood, I still am so confused. I am in a very weird place right now because it has only been a few days since the big realization. I still find myself defending them or at least defending what I got out of it. Because of the way I approached impact I feel like I was able to ignore a lot of the crap they injected. I never viewed Impact as a completely trustworthy source because in the very beginning they were talking about things that I knew I disagreed with. I wasn’t going to go back, but my buddy offered to pay for me to go to Summit and I decided that I could handle picking it apart and taking what was good for me out of it and leaving the rest. I guess I don’t really feel like they got to me, like I was actually able to go all the way through Lift Off and not be completely brainwashed. Do you guys think that is possible, or do you think I’m in denial? A big reason why my friend decided to go was because she saw some positive changes in me, but said that I was still myself and totally normal.

I hate that there is still a part of me that wants to defend them because of my positive experience. I know that they are despicable. I am angry at how stupid I look having recommended it to people I care about. I am furious at the recklessness with which they operate and the lives they have destroyed. Maybe it just hasn’t hit home yet because the things that really infuriated me were things I have read on this board and a few other LGAT boards and not necessarily personal experiences. Or maybe I just need some more time for the dust to settle.

I wanted to take a minute and let this forum know that my earlier post stating my apology was an inadvertant mistake. I received a PM from a member on this forum trying to help me understand the copyright laws in exposing Impact Trainings. I misunderstood the content and responded without enough information. I was also unable to respond with a PM back because I had not been given the rights to do so yet.

I appreciate this member's concern for me. I understand that when posting information from the trainings...and I do want to expose Impact for the teachings taught there..that there could be copyright laws. As of now, I have been unable to actually find my folders from the trainings but will continue to look for them. My memory just doesn't seem to pull up all of the different experiential things we went through.

I have so appreciated the information in this forum. I continue to process out the teaching of Impact and want desperately to heal. Again, I want to be able to be here and post as I feel I can. Thank you.

outofimpact,

What have you learned about copyright laws as far as they pertain to Impact? I am genuinely interested!

I have found this to be a helpful website for guidelines on "fair use" when reproducing materials created by someone else.


[fairuse.stanford.edu]

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Disenchanted
Sometimes there was, and sometimes there wasn’t and I spat it out. There were definitely some things that I spat out and chose to ignore at Impact. But I was also able to take some good things away from it and thus deemed it as a positive experience and wanted the people I knew to experience it as well. My husband always cracked cult jokes about Impact referencing “the leader” and likening it to the Simpson’s episode where they join a cult. I finally sat down with him and told him everything I could about my experience and what my friend and I had been discussing. He started to make another Leader joke and then stopped and got wide eyed with a smirk on his face and said “Hah! I was right all along; they are just like that Simpson’s episode!” (an episode I definitely want to see again soon) He has been having a lot of fun cracking jokes about the “blue flame of protection” and how one day we can sit down and say “do you remember that one time when you joined a cult?”

While my husband is very good at lightening the mood, I still am so confused. I am in a very weird place right now because it has only been a few days since the big realization. I still find myself defending them or at least defending what I got out of it. Because of the way I approached impact I feel like I was able to ignore a lot of the crap they injected. I never viewed Impact as a completely trustworthy source because in the very beginning they were talking about things that I knew I disagreed with. I wasn’t going to go back, but my buddy offered to pay for me to go to Summit and I decided that I could handle picking it apart and taking what was good for me out of it and leaving the rest. I guess I don’t really feel like they got to me, like I was actually able to go all the way through Lift Off and not be completely brainwashed. Do you guys think that is possible, or do you think I’m in denial? A big reason why my friend decided to go was because she saw some positive changes in me, but said that I was still myself and totally normal.

I hate that there is still a part of me that wants to defend them because of my positive experience. I know that they are despicable. I am angry at how stupid I look having recommended it to people I care about. I am furious at the recklessness with which they operate and the lives they have destroyed. Maybe it just hasn’t hit home yet because the things that really infuriated me were things I have read on this board and a few other LGAT boards and not necessarily personal experiences. Or maybe I just need some more time for the dust to settle.

Disenchanted: Ah, yes, the Leader episode of the Simpsons. Homer singing the old batman theme song with the staff tricking him into replacing "batman" with "leader", his collection of lima beans that look like the leader (when shown an actual picture of the leader, Homer says “but…he looks nothing like the beans…), and his liberal use of the term "jerkass". I love that episode.

Let me also suggest to you a "possibility" although I still shy from the use of the term. You say you still defend Impact notwithstanding your enlightenment of their foul play. And you also claim to have had a positive experience in feedback arcs. Is it possible that the mental conditioning actually worked on you? If it did, you may not be aware of the complexity of the trauma. I thought that feedback arcs was the greatest thing to ever happen to me, and when I look at it now, I get sick to the stomach from the pain it still causes me. You say your "breaking free" is recent, and I am glad for your new realizations, but also know that to not be willing to introspect (with a professional if possible) on the possible damages you have been heretofore unaware of could be self-defeating. I am not saying this is necessarily the case, I am saying it is possible, and perhaps likely. Looking back, I cannot see anyone looking fondly upon the feedback processes without having succumbed to the conditioning and trauma that always precedes and follows them. I am not trying to get you to box at shadows, I am merely concerned. But also elated for your personal discoveries and progress.

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outofimpact
I wanted to take a minute and let this forum know that my earlier post stating my apology was an inadvertant mistake. I received a PM from a member on this forum trying to help me understand the copyright laws in exposing Impact Trainings. I misunderstood the content and responded without enough information. I was also unable to respond with a PM back because I had not been given the rights to do so yet.

I appreciate this member's concern for me. I understand that when posting information from the trainings...and I do want to expose Impact for the teachings taught there..that there could be copyright laws. As of now, I have been unable to actually find my folders from the trainings but will continue to look for them. My memory just doesn't seem to pull up all of the different experiential things we went through.

I have so appreciated the information in this forum. I continue to process out the teaching of Impact and want desperately to heal. Again, I want to be able to be here and post as I feel I can. Thank you.

As far as compiling details of the trainings, Rick has given me the green light, it will take some time however :wink:

I really look forward to your sharing with everyone the details of the trainings. We are very fortunate to have your willingness to share with us what you know. I know that my responsibility is to recognize and process all of the ways I (and others) were manipulated and coerced - and most of that happened without the knowledge of what was happening. It is only in looking back, with time away from my experience that I am able to see it for what it is. It is more than mind blowing. What I experience is how I knew that I was uncomfortable but I still went through with the whole experience because I was being promised so many things. What I couldn't see was that my being there was really serving the trainers. Everytime a money issue came up, it was like they had an answer for every thing I was uncomfortable with. And the most unsettling to me is how easily I was swayed and I conformed to doing what they wanted. It was like my reasoning checked out and I sucked into this black hole where I didn't think for myself. I sucked into wanting to please the trainers much like a child trying to please a parent. ICK. It really does make me nauseous.

outofimpact:

If you have not done so yet? I encourage you to read the many topic threads on other LGAT's and look at this from a broader perspective in seeing all of these companies operating on the same foundational belief system.

They are so connected at the foundation of philosphy that it has been very beneficial for me to read the bigger picture.

It has brought much clarity to the lies, and the deceptions of the LGAT core beliefs and philosphies.

Wisdom and common sense will go along way in protectiny us from psychological harm. If only we do not disconnect the internal warning system that is within ourselves.

Critical thinking. This is our early warning system. We need to leave it on, and not turn it off. Especially in regards to LGAT's.

outofimpact, you got me thinking :) You know, I came upon something while I was compiling the core and TIT training information yesterday. Impact indoctrinated me with the idea that I was the source of all my happiness and that I was enough by myself and that I did not need to have anything or anyone else in order to be joyful. That joy was a state of being, not something you own. Not only was I enough, but I was also a god, a divine creator that was absolutely accountable for everything I did, allowed, said, thought, observed etc. The world was either my oyster or my shit-hole if I so wished.

But then they talk about "reasons" or "results", and that you have one or the other, you have either the results you want or you have reasons as to why you don't have them. Then they expand this idea into showing that you can find out what your results are by asking other people what they are. They are the mirror of your life if you want to know what you have been doing in that life. They then expand this idea again and ask you to introspect and see if you are successful in business, relationships, money, your profession etc. It is YOU and your limiting, ego-mind bound beliefs that make you poor and unhappy. Then in Summit, you are told that you have a divine purpose, and to the extent that what you do in your life aligns with that purpose, you will have joy.

And in Lift-Off you are given this “The Secret” like maxim to go forth and create what it is that you do not have, and this mentality does not stop in TIT, in fact it expands because as you become aware of your divinity, you are better aware of your capabilities to create, and your limiting beliefs should become fewer and smaller. There would be so many people who would stand up in TIT that would talk about the miracles they created and the success stories would go on and on and on. But then people would stand up (oftentimes after having given the previous testimonial) and say how unhappy they were and how they keep on working on being a Master but when they fail they get disheartened. Then they would be coached by a trainer to the effect of, “that is the process of mastery, you are on the correct path, keep going, you are doing great,” and so on.

Where I am going with this is that Impact continually tells you that you are enough for your own for your happiness. AND you have to look to other people to find out if you are happy. AND you also have to continually be actively pursuing wealth and joy and purpose in your professional and personal life that you are DIVINELY ENTITLED to. Can you see the paradox? If you are enough on your own, why pursue anything? Why look to anyone or anything else at all? Introspection should be enough given Impacts “intrinsic god” premise, which makes the trainings ultimately unnecessary. But also, if you are not happy and joyful inside, how can you find it looking for that happiness and joy in anything extrinsic if you are enough intrinsically? You are to be continually making your external reality align with your divine purpose. Impact continually prods you be entitled and materialistic, and at the same time, you have to continually look to Impact for your results, but not your answers.

Let me be more concise. I reject impact’s “intrinsic god” theory, but I do subscribe to the idea that nothing extrinsic or material can make a person truly happy ON ITS OWN if one does not learn how to be intrinsically happy (via parents, therapy etc.). But while Impact has you adhere to this “intrinsic joy” principle, in the same breath they urge you to do EVERYTHING POSSIBLE THAT A GOD CAN DO to not only get what you DESERVE, but to also HEAL THE WORLD UTTERLY. Which essentially means, enroll in the trainings and chant mantras till your face turns purple. And if you don’t, you are a part of the problem. If that isn’t enough pressure to make one go mad, I don’t know what is. Impact tells you there is nothing to “do”, but there is everything to “be”. But all Impact is about is to have one continually DOING what the next thing is to grab your abundance. It is materialistic and so self-serving in the extreme, you are continually being forced to look outside of yourself for happiness and contentment and these questions run in the background of the mind of the trainee: Do the Impact trainers or staff or senior trainees approve, what is their feedback for me? Am I wealthy, and if not, what is keeping me from being wealthy? What is my purpose, what does God want for me…I mean, what do I want for me? Is my life in alignment with my purpose? And if not, it is my jobs fault or my marriage’s fault or my mind’s fault and I need to dispose of them so I can be on purpose and be happy. I need that status symbol to represent the divine abundance I have claimed for myself. Who, based on results, in this TIT group has more success than I? Who has more money, better relationships, more relationships, the European cars, confidence, self-esteem, better jobs, who staffs more often, who contributes more to the trainings, who is the trainer’s favorite busy bee. Nothing is ever enough, it is always about more, more, MORE. Continually comparing, which is what Impact tells you not to do, but mandates that it must be done so you can know where you are in your life.

It’s an insane tangled web of control through semantics. I am dizzy writing this, but I was positively mesmerized by it while I was in it. And everyone I saw in that TIT basically sounded like this: “Oh, you are so inspiring, I wish I could find the words like you can,” or “Oh, she is so in tune, I wish I could be like her” or “Please assist me, it seems like my life is going insane, but I still came to the meeting tonight even though I didn’t want to” or “My life is in the crapper” and then they would stand up in the training and say “my life is wonderful!!!” or “The LDS church is true, but Impact is true too, but they aren’t compatible, and the shelf I keep getting told to put what doesn’t make sense is overflowing my brain and I think I am going insane! So, I think I’ll just put that on the shelf…” or “My vision is expanding, I have everything I have dreamed. But I still have problems” or “I spoke to a squirrel today, and he told me to stop worrying all of the time…” or “Yes my daughter is gay, and although I am unconditionally loving, I wish she would give me grandbabies” or “Listen to the divine spark within, you have all of your answers. Now, are you open to some feedback?” or “I got the car I wanted and I am a god!” or “My interior decorator and I created the perfect space for me to do my light-work in my house. Things are super” or “I have cancer, and I want TIT to heal me. Oh crap, I died, but the training still works! Everything is in divine order” or “This morning I woke up and a dark spirit was hovering over my bed, and I asked him what he wanted and he said “love” so I hugged him with my divine light and a portal opened and he ascended to the light. Then I ate a bowl of Cheerios for breakfast.” or “I love the church, but I want to have sex out of wedlock, so I am going to do it anyway, I don’t need to be honest with my clergyman, I am at a higher level of enlightenment than he is and this serves a higher purpose” on and on and on.