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LearningPoint

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Brokenhearted
I've read through the books of Timothy several times in the last few days. I shared with my spouse what I though God was showing me. Thank you for posting that here, as it confirmed that I was in fact hearing from the Lord. :)

I was reminded the other day of the very first time I realized there was a poroblem at TP. I regret that I didn't step up and say/do more then, or the many time since then....Praise God for His grace.

Anyway, it was a few years back, after TP lost one of it's original deacons, Mitch. His widow needed some help around their home, as she was trying to sort out her new life w/out her husband. A number of people from TP had agreed to spend a day at her home, helping to go through some of Mitch's things, selling them, and getting the house cleaned up and organized. Well, two families ended up helping that day. Everyone else ended up at Pastor Mike's house to build him a new deck. According to some, it was *mandated* by Cyndi that Mike's disciples be there and help with the project. Pastor Mike later announced from the pulpit how honored he was, that when he arrived home that night some 100 people were out on his new deck. When someone went to Mike and expressed disappointment over the issue, it was blown off.

It's only gotten worse from there............

Should.have.seen.the.writing.on.the.wall.

Oh my! I didn't know about the deck being in conflict with helping Mary (Mitch's widow). Before this, do you remember--were you there--when Mary was crushed terribly by Mike refusing to come visit Mitch as he was dying in the hospital? I think Mitch or Mary sent for him (though I could be wrong about that part). Someone fill in the details here, because my memory is a bit fuzzy. But I DO remember Mike giving a justification (of his not going to see Mitch) to our membership class, saying something like he doesn't just run after people when they ask. THIS WAS A DEACON! This was a man who had thrown in with the congregation to support the ministry, and of course, presumably to be supported by those in it. (We assemble to encourage one another, as well as to worship God, don't we?) Mary was deepy hurt and left the church for a while. I don't know why she came back. Mike tries to turn people's disappointments and hurts that he causes through arrogance or neglect into spiritual sins the hurt person is committing by reacting to the pain.

Yes, I too should have seen it, Brokenhearted. I have never known any other pastor to respond this way to those in the congregation who are hurting, let alone dying. Why did I "buy" the justification? Honestly, I didn't, but I kept telling myself that I am probably just being judgmental. Ugh! Well from this perspective, I wish I would have been "judgmental" (discerning), instead of just plain "mental." My bad.

What do you think Mary would think of the church now if she heard about all this stuff?

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LearningPoint
Oh my! I didn't know about the deck being in conflict with helping Mary (Mitch's widow). Before this, do you remember--were you there--when Mary was crushed terribly by Mike refusing to come visit Mitch as he was dying in the hospital? I think Mitch or Mary sent for him (though I could be wrong about that part). Someone fill in the details here, because my memory is a bit fuzzy. But I DO remember Mike giving a justification (of his not going to see Mitch) to our membership class, saying something like he doesn't just run after people when they ask. THIS WAS A DEACON! This was a man who had thrown in with the congregation to support the ministry, and of course, presumably to be supported by those in it. (We assemble to encourage one another, as well as to worship God, don't we?) Mary was deepy hurt and left the church for a while. I don't know why she came back. Mike tries to turn people's disappointments and hurts that he causes through arrogance or neglect into spiritual sins the hurt person is committing by reacting to the pain.

Yes, I too should have seen it, Brokenhearted. I have never known any other pastor to respond this way to those in the congregation who are hurting, let alone dying. Why did I "buy" the justification? Honestly, I didn't, but I kept telling myself that I am probably just being judgmental. Ugh! Well from this perspective, I wish I would have been "judgmental" (discerning), instead of just plain "mental." My bad.

Wow LearningPoint & Brokenhearted
We have seen it all to often here.... That out of one side of Tony's mouth he will say people are eternal beings posing to love people but stop and question what Tony is teaching and immediately for Tony people are expendable.
Once Tony realizes that he cannot manipulate your life or coheres you out of your hard earned money nor can his elders twist your arm to stay at the Radiant Life they will demonize you and slander you.

Well, SOMA NW, what did you learn today?

Did you learn to #1 "Gather Information"???

Like spying on people who might not be loyal to your authority? Yeah that sounds just like something Jesus taught when he asked his disciples to stay here and watch while I pray in the garden. Jesus found them asleep. Did he demonize them there or cut them off? No

Did you learn to "Build Your Army"... This includes finding Sycophants who see you as being a mouth piece for God?

It is 10:20 PM
I wonder if the False apostle Mr. Tony released the SOMA NW students and TPC Elders & Staff from the "Strategic Advance" class to go home and get something to eat and or get some sleep?
Nothing Like Brainwashing 101

Thinking back at Tony's classes...
I have to chuckle at how Tony will use good unadulterated worship music to usher in his false teachings. It is like he used the music to walk in when all people are standing up worshiping....Worshiping Tony as he walks into the room? He uses music that he has not tainted to tug at peoples emotions. Tony uses this music to cause students and parishioners to let down their guard. You see the music helps justify Tony's existence and his teachings. Without the worship music and prayer chanting you simply have some goofy guy standing up there acting arrogant and religious just like the Pharisees. Teaching you to become more militaristic in your thinking?

Hey, did Tony teach you today that it is normal to have victims in war and in your ministry? That there are necessary casualties
Is that how he justifies e 500+ people leaving Radiant Life Church?
Is that how he justified the broken relationships with other churches in Sacramento?
Is that how he justified Radiant Life Church of Katy Texas renouncing Tony?
Is that How Tony justified Radiant Life Church of Laguna renouncing all that Tony teaches and renouncing Tony and changing the name of their church to Open Door Community?

People step back from the Cool-Aid

BraveHeart

David Luster is learning from Pastor Tony Cunningham, He IS a man of God!


(Davids facebook)

ARE YOU KIDDING ME????

I just found out Dave Luster has the same Birthday as I do! Maybe we can get together and celebrate and pluck some feathers!

TURNING POINT WORLD OUTREACH CENTER MARCH 1st SUNDAY Both Services: Ression-Proof Your Mindset : Please leave your Brain at the door before you come in! I wonder what nut case is going to give this message!
Get ready take notes because this could be some of that positive confession, name it claim it, prosperity false teaching. Watch out for words like think positive, speak the word, do not ever speak or think negative. Never think or speak fear and speak the word to create your own reality! The word faith will be used alot, a faith-mindset! I wonder who will be giving the message ! I am sorry if a normal person gives us some real Bible preaching!

Ok, this is the deal. People have to stop following people. Tony Cunningham isn't the problem, Satan is. Mike and Cyndi aren't the problem, Satan is. They have become so entranced by the vision and refelctions other's offer their narcissistic selves. Again, it is people buying the lie and worshipping the leaders. Only God can fight this battle. The battle belongs to the Lord. If there is one thing I have learned over the years it is if I am fighting the battle, God won't. Why would God fight this battle if I think I know best? It's all so crazy. But if you think of it in the context of who we are, sinners, it all makes perfect sense. I think that Jackie and Jeff Moors should start a church. I would go. I pray that Jeff follows God's heart and I believe God has great things in store for this young man. To the person who worries on not being nice, who cares? Be real. State the truth and live in freedom. Don't assasinate people, but just tell the truth. I think their salaries are 15,000 per month take home. (this is combined and doesn't include extra tag ons) I heard that somewhere, but can't remember where. They make a whole loooooot of money. But, whatever. I keep in my heart and guard my mind with the reality that I don't want my reward here. I want my reward in heaven. I do not want to store up goods here, but in heaven. Just think about it. Mike and Cyndi will need to downsize in the everafter.

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tell the truth
Ok, this is the deal. People have to stop following people. Tony Cunningham isn't the problem, Satan is. Mike and Cyndi aren't the problem, Satan is. They have become so entranced by the vision and refelctions other's offer their narcissistic selves. Again, it is people buying the lie and worshipping the leaders. Only God can fight this battle. The battle belongs to the Lord. If there is one thing I have learned over the years it is if I am fighting the battle, God won't. Why would God fight this battle if I think I know best? It's all so crazy. But if you think of it in the context of who we are, sinners, it all makes perfect sense. I think that Jackie and Jeff Moors should start a church. I would go. I pray that Jeff follows God's heart and I believe God has great things in store for this young man. To the person who worries on not being nice, who cares? Be real. State the truth and live in freedom. Don't assasinate people, but just tell the truth. I think their salaries are 15,000 per month take home. (this is combined and doesn't include extra tag ons) I heard that somewhere, but can't remember where. They make a whole loooooot of money. But, whatever. I keep in my heart and guard my mind with the reality that I don't want my reward here. I want my reward in heaven. I do not want to store up goods here, but in heaven. Just think about it. Mike and Cyndi will need to downsize in the everafter.

Would you say then, that in the Garden of Eden, Satan was the whole problem, not Eve's disobedience or Adam's very-knowing complicity?

Also, in the OT (or Hebrew Testament) even when the Lord said that the battle belonged to Him, most often He sent His people in to "fight" and take a stand; He put them into action. It's how we show for Whom and what we stand. If we are silent, people may assume we think what's going on is OK. If Jackie hadn't left, who would know she was NOT in agreement with what is going on? Battles will always belong to the Lord, but we can't stand idly by and take no action. I don't have any personal power, but I do want to declare my allegiance to Christ, and it is in His strength that I go forward to "fight."

I agree with you that people need to stop following people, but some of these people have never known another pastor. The pastor has a responsibility to point to Christ, to turn people toward the True Shepherd. There are lambs, little lambs, in the pasture who are vulnerable and naive. I will lift my voice in hopes that some of them might be helped out of this deception and into the truth of God's Word. I have nothing else to gain or lose by being on here. I have no personal ax to grind, no personal anything to gain, except that by telling the truth, someone else might get free.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2009 10:44AM by LearningPoint.

I realize that I'm a new comer here, so please forgive me if I'm overstepping, but I've noticed something in the last few days that makes me somewhat uncomfortable. I understand that people are hurt, but I don't think that the comments about Cyndi's voice, or her hair, or other petty little issues we may have with the leaders are relevent in this forum, I'm not sure that they ever are. Cyndi's hair could be purple, but if she were walking in truth, it wouldn't matter.

I know that I've had to be careful myself, in not fault finding. I've been hurt badly, and it's easy to be critical of every little detail, but the details are not the issue. I agree with a poster above, that satan is the enemy. Nit picking will only serve to open a door for the real enemy in our own lives.

We must fight this battle in Jesus name. His light must be what moves us forward. We must speak the truth. I think that we can do these things without being critical of things that really don't matter.

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Brokenhearted
I realize that I'm a new comer here, so please forgive me if I'm overstepping, but I've noticed something in the last few days that makes me somewhat uncomfortable. I understand that people are hurt, but I don't think that the comments about Cyndi's voice, or her hair, or other petty little issues we may have with the leaders are relevent in this forum, I'm not sure that they ever are. Cyndi's hair could be purple, but if she were walking in truth, it wouldn't matter.

I know that I've had to be careful myself, in not fault finding. I've been hurt badly, and it's easy to be critical of every little detail, but the details are not the issue. I agree with a poster above, that satan is the enemy. Nit picking will only serve to open a door for the real enemy in our own lives.

We must fight this battle in Jesus name. His light must be what moves us forward. We must speak the truth. I think that we can do these things without being critical of things that really don't matter.

I understand what you're saying, here, Brokenhearted. I think we do need to be careful about our motives as to WHY we say things.

I'm not sure that the symptoms of the disease are irrelevant, though. I mean, has there been a significant image makeover--toward a "power image"--that has come along with the territory of TPs getting off track? Is there an issue with holding on to a position and being control hungry even though Cyndi herself has said herself that she is not the best singer nor the ideal worship leader? Are these indicators or evidence of those deeper problems we're concerned about?

Also, I think we have people of different age and maturity levels posting here. Your concern about what we choose to focus on is valid, but for some, these "little details" were perhaps the only visible (most tangible) indicators they were able to point to to know there was a problem--these are what tipped them off that something had changed and was going in an unhealthy direction, even though they weren't yet sure how to articulate it or how to categorize it or define it. We'll have to have some grace for those who feel betrayed by the leaders who promised them heaven and then gave them the ways of the world instead.

So I'll take your admonition to heart for myself, but I don't want to discourage those (many of whom are young) who are starting to sort stuff out and have found a place here to begin. It might look ugly at first, but we can pray that we all land in that good place you are talking about, of the higher road of grace and truth.

Thanks for the reminder.