Current Page: 5 of 11
Re: Debunking Samael Aun Weor
Date: August 20, 2011 12:11PM

Hi everyone,

Lone Flame here. I thought I would update everyone with a little teaser after having finished moving in to my new apartment...

I think I have found a HUGE hole in the Samael Aun Weor doomsday prediction. It's so big that it will be very hard to hide after I get through with it... :-)

A hint/teaser: It has something to do with the "mixed" nature of Hercolubus.

It'll require a few more days (up to a week) of research to definitely confirm but it will be well worth the wait and anticipation. I'm getting excited as my research gets airtight.

Get ready! :D

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Debunking Samael Aun Weor
Date: August 25, 2011 02:18AM

Here it is… The big reveal!

Where is the hole in Samael's prediction? It's as big as the grand majority of the body of his work (or as big as this imaginary planet called "Hercolubus"): a hole that's 24 years big. Let me explain.

So, if we look at the grand majority of Samael Aun Weor's work, we see something missing. What is it? You guessed it… Hercolubus.

As far as my research has taken me, from "The Perfect Matrimony" written in 1950 all the way up to its first mention in "The Secret Doctrine of Anahuac" in 1974, there is NO MENTION of Hercolubus, just the cyclic destruction of human "root races." It's only in "The Secret Doctrine of Anahuac" in 1974 that he first mentions it. I have crossed referenced this from the original Spanish and versions translated from various groups.

So what is this "mixed" nature of Hercolubus which I mentioned?

We all know about the 2012 scare that's floating around the Internet right now. For the most part it takes advantage of a couple of primary sources:

1. - Zechariah Sitchin's "Nibiru".

2. -And most importantly: old scientific speculation about "Nemesis": thought to fling comets earthward every 26 million years

Here, the theories get mixed. The Nemesis theory appeared in 1984, with the original article found at this link:


Here, modern "gnostics" will say: "But Samael knew about it before the scientists discovered it! His prophecy predates the scientific find!"

But oh, what a little inquiry can do… SAW's theory does not come from (and cannot be backed by) any scientific basis, but from Notsradamus' s "King of Terror" quatrain.


“In the year 1999, in the seventh month, a great king of terror will come from the sky”

Hasn't 1999 passed already? We see this in the Youtube video already posted in this thread. His terrible prediction has not come true (and he distrusted science anyway: his groups cherry-pick anyway)

Here's the whole text from this section (from "The Secret Doctrine of Anahuac") in English:


Michel Nostradamus, extraordinary seer, notable astrologer, who lived between 1503 and 1566 in France, says: “In the year 1999, in the seventh month, a great king of terror will come from the sky” See the first two verses of the Century 10-72.
According to astronomic calculations, there will be only two total solar eclipses in the twentieth century: one on February 4th, 1962 and the other in August 1999.
The terrifying disturbance of the orbit and motion of planet Earth is scientifically justified by the same seer, Nostradamus, through the approach of another star that for seven days will appear as another sun.
St. John’s Apocalypse cites the above star, calling it “wormwood” (bitterness).
We refer to this gigantic planet with the name “Hercolubus.” Many call it “The Cold Planet,” and others call it “The Red Planet.” It is unquestionably a lot bigger than Jupiter, the colossal giant of our solar system.

Only two solar eclipses in the 20th century?


I don't think so. (I can hear them denying this now: "But NASA lies to prevent a mass psychosis!")

Then, until he passed away, SAW ran with the Hercolubus stuff until his death in 1977, mentioning it mainly in interviews. Had he been an all-knowing "master" he would have mentioned it in "The Perfect Matrimony."

And so, when this Nemesis theory came along 7 years after SAW passed from this mortal coil, it provided an opportunity to infuse what was then a legitimate scientific pursuit (there's a huge debate if Nemesis truly exists or not) with pseudoscientific theories. I have a nagging suspicion that Zechariah Sitchin's works (with "The Twelfth Planet" first published in 1976) allowed some "gnostic" groups to have more "proof" of their claims. All this flowed and fused together to make the fear story we know today.

That's what I have found thus far. I had to be as diligent as possible in examining this stuff.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/25/2011 02:22AM by Lone_Flame_of_Eternity.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Debunking Samael Aun Weor
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: August 25, 2011 10:25PM

Note: Just in case Sam A W referred to texts by 'Hermes Trismegistus' claiming the Ancient Egyptians were the source of wisdom, those Hermetic texts, which were thought to be pre-Christian were actually dated as written in later Roman times (1st and 2d sectury) beginning with textual analysis done by Isaac Casaubon and published in 1611.

According to Frances Yates, this undercut the position of these Hermetic texts as being sources of pre-Christian 'Egyptian' wisdom.

And the assumption that heiroglyphic scripts were potent magical symbols was refuted by Chapollion's decoding of them as script for a merely human language--the Rosetta Stone was written in hieroglyphic Egyption, demotic Egyption and Greek, showing the transition between the three scripts and made it possible to decode and demystify heiroglyphics.

With this, Hermeticism changed from being a mainstream philosophy and moved into the marginalized sidelines, where it remains today among those who crave mystery and authoritarianism based on mystery--and who for that reason, dislike modern science.

Frances Yates book, Giordano Bruno and the Hermetic Tradition is well worth reading for anyone recovering from time spent in occultist/hermetic groups. There are legitimate disagreements concerning Yate's analysis of Giordano Bruno (he was a very elusive personality) but as one reviewer put it, "Regardless, the book is indeed valuable as an overview of hermetic and esoteric thinking, and its status as a classic work that would challenge scholarship of religion and history stands to this day. "


Check and for prices if you wish to buy a copy and also to see whether any new editions have been issued.

The Esoteric Quarterly36Copyright ©

The Swiss classical scholar and philologist,Isaac Casaubon (1559–1614), used emerging methods of textual criticism 20 to demonstratethat the classical Hermetic texts were not nearly so old as previously believed. The vo-cabulary was relatively modern, and the texts referred to events in the early Christian era.

The implication from Casaubon’s findings was that whoever wrote the texts did not predate Moses and Plato but postdated Christ!

The“prophecies,” which so fascinated the church fathers were not prophecies at all; they were written by people familiar with emerging Christian doctrine.

Academic historians nowbelieve that the texts were written in the firstthree centuries CE. We also know now that thetitle “Trismegistus” was itself comparativelymodern.21 The realization that the Pseudo-Hermes was not the “Gen-tile Prophet” of Old-Testamen ttimes destroyed any expectation that the Hermetic teachings might have some-thing valuable to contribute to Chris-tianity. ....

(Corboy)However, when emotional needs are met, evidence, no matter how well sourced and argued, will be ignored. Here is a modern analogy: many who still buy into Wakefield's arguments about vaccination causing autism, despite the thorough and devastating discreditation of both Wakfields reseach and his loss of a license to practice medicine.)

(the author continues)
Despite these unfavorable developments, many people were unfazed in their interest in Hermeticism. Robert Fludd and Tommaso Campanella were most productive in the early decades of the 17th century, and the study of alchemy peaked at about the same time. As lateas the 1650s, Athanasius Kirchner—a member,no less, of the Society of Jesus, which was founded to spearhead the Counter-Reformation—published his Oedipus Aegyp-tiacus containing numerous references to the Hermetic literature.23 Kirchner surmised thatEgyptian hieroglyphics, which Hermes (theinventor of language) must have designed,were sacred talismans. 24 Kirchner was neverpersecuted by the Roman church, but he was nearly killed by an advancing army of Protes-tants for whom Jesuitswere anathema.Individual Protestantstook an interest in Her-meticism, ignoringnegative attitudes tomagic on the part ofecclesiastical authori-ties. For example, Ja-kob Böhme was a Lu-theran; and the Rosi-crucian Manifestos were published in theCalvinist Rhine Palati-nate.

Perhaps the very demystification o fProtestant beliefs andpractices spurred com-pensatory interest in Hermeticism among those with a hunger for mystery.25The longer-term impact of the deterioratingenvironment of the 17th century was to driveHermetic studies underground. Whereas Her-meticism had long been a topic of open dis-course, it retreated more and more behind theclosed doors of private salons or occult socie-ties. Some of them eventually evolved intoMasonic or Rosicrucian lodges.The first reference to Freemasonry, in anythinglike its present form, can be found in the min-utes of a 1598 meeting in Edinburgh, Scot-land.26 Elias Ashmole, whose role in the RoyalSociety has already been mentioned, was in-ducted into a Masonic lodge in Warrington,England, in 1646.27 Within 100 years, multiplebranches of Freemasonry operated throughout Reductionist science challenged notions of universal, organic in-terconnectedness. And Enlight-enment rationalism branded the Hermetic teachings as medieval superstition. Hermeticism was forced onto the defensive, but it never died out. The teachingswere preserved in Rosicrucianand Masonic organizations.They also influenced the arts, asexemplified by the plays ofShakespeare, the music of Mo-zart, the writings of Goethe, andthe poetry and art of William Blake.

(Corboy note: And in the spectacular career of Girolamo Caglostro, who became so famous his portrait was sculpted by Houdon, the same sculptor who gave iconic portraits of Voltaire, Mirabeau and whose splendid sculptured portrait busts of George Washington and Thomas Jefferson still adorn US coins.)

The Esoteric Quarterly36Copyright ©

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Debunking Samael Aun Weor
Date: August 26, 2011 12:16AM

I thought I would alert everyone to the recent happenings on the "Hercolubus, Planet X, or Nibiru" blog which is Rabolu (making it ultimately Samael) based:


I found the perfect antidote to claims that this object at 09h 47m 59.0s +13º 18' 53.3" in Google Sky is Hercolubus.

From the "Hercolubus, Planet X, or Nibiru" blog's August 19th entry:


In Google Sky you can see this massive object (viewable only in infrared using the IRAS telescope, and invisible otherwise) located at 09h 47m 59.0s +13º 18' 53.3"

They then go on to show pictures from Google Sky claiming this dim object is Hercolubus. However, a very serious amateur astrologer has identified this object as the carbon star CW Leonis (August 26 entry).


Here is a link to all this guy's Nibiru/Hercolubus debunking articles:


There is no naming of the hypothetical planet by the name "Hercolubus" on this blog, but Nibiru is being used as an alternative name for Hercolubus. I have a feeling that after 2012 the "gnostic" groups are going to change the date to 2043 and try to cause another big scare. I'll be there to debunk them every step of the way.

And as always, corboy, your contributions are invaluable. Thank you very much for helping on this thread.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/26/2011 12:17AM by Lone_Flame_of_Eternity.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Debunking Samael Aun Weor
Date: December 13, 2011 05:55PM

Hi everyone,

My research crawled to a standstill this semester, as I had a lot of work to do at university.

I thought I would get started again by lighting the flame about the Tibetan exercises, today called the Five Tibetan Rites. Samael Aun Weor mentioned these in his books, especially his book Exercises of the Lamasery. He talks about the "Colonel" who went to Tibet an old man and came back youthful after *GASP* transmuting his sexual energies!

This raises a red flag for me, especially after having spent years in those SAW cults that teache how to "transmute" the sexual energies (if you don't, you'll get cancer for having orgasms!) The original book, which SAW never acknowledges by name and originally called "The Eye of Revelation" now sold as Ancient Secrets of the Fountain of Youth: Books 1 and 2 (Book 1 was so good and solved all your problems it needed a sequel, as seen on Amazon's page for Book 2!), says this:


In order to become a superman or superwoman this powerful life force must be conserved and turned upward, so that it can be utilized by all the vortexes, especially the seventh. In other words, it is necessary to become celibate, so that the reproductive energy can be rechannelled to a higher use.

Now turning this vital life force upward is a very simple manner, and yet through the centuries people attempting it have usually failed. In the West, whole religious orders have tried this very thing and failed because they sought to master reproductive energy by suppressing it. There is only one way to master this powerful urge, and that is not by dissipating or suppressing it, but by transmuting it, and at the same time lifting it upward. In this way, you have not only discovered the elixir of life, as the ancients called it, you also have to put it to use, which is something the ancients were seldom able to do.

You know, I think it's funny that at the beginning of the books is a disclaimer about how it's not to be a substitute for Western medicine. Let's continue looking at the text:


Please understand that in order to perform rite number six, it is absolutely necessary that an individual have active sexual urge. He or she could not possibly transmute reproductive energy if there were little or nothing to transmute. It is absolutely impossible for a person who has lost sexual urge to perform this rite. He or she should not even attempt it, because it would only lead to discouragement, and more harm than good. Instead, such an individual, regardless of age, should first practice the other five rites until they regain a normal sexual urge. When this is achieved, he or she may then go into the business of being a superman or superwoman.

Also, an individual should not attempt rite number six unless he or she is genuinely motivated to do so. If an individual feels incomplete in terms of sexual expression, and must struggle to overcome its attraction, then that individual is not truly capable of transmuting reproductive energy and directing it upward. Instead, energy will be misdirected into struggle and inner conflict. The sixth rite is only for those who feel sexually complete, and who have a real desire to move on to different goals.

Wow, this eerily reads like a SAW text, especially with a phrase like "then that individual is not truly capable of transmuting reproductive energy." I wonder how many people in the past before the Internet tried desperately to make this work and aged, wondering why they kept on aging, despite their best efforts to fight their own sexuality.

Most people would be drawn in by the rave 4 or 5 star reviews, but we know that people who have been brainwashed by this stuff will jump on places like Amazon and write laudatory reviews at the sign of the smallest gains.

The author, about whom a Google search cannot even yield information about, makes the disclaimer that most people would have a hard time against fighting their sexuality:


For the great majority of people, a celibate life is simply not a feasible choice, and they should perform the first five rites only. However, in time the five rites may lead to a changing in priorities, and a genuine desire to become a superman or superwoman. At that time, the individual should make a firm decision to begin a new way of life.

Such an individual must be ready to move forward without wavering or looking back. Those who are capable of this are on their way to becoming true masters, able to use vital life force to achieve anything they desire,

"I repeat, let no man or woman think of turning sexual currents upward until he or she is prepared to leave physical needs behind in exchange for the rewards of true mastership. Then, let that individual step forward, and success will crown his or her every effort."

It sure sounds like a dialect similar to Samaelspeak to me, especially the word "mastership."

Here's the "biographical information" about Peter Kelder, the author from this webpage (


Peter Kelder was raised by adoptive parents in the midwestern United States, and while still in his teens he left home to embark on adventures that took him around the world to many distant and exotic lands. He became an educated, polished, and articulate man, conversant in many languages, and throughout his life he maintained a love of books, libraries, words, and poetry.

Kelder asserts that Colonel Bradford—the pseudonym for his book's main character—was a real individual who did travel to Tibet and whom he did meet in the 1930s in southern California where his book was written.

However, Kelder is an intensely private man who does not wish to reveal more to the public than these brief details. He feels that his book speaks for itself and that issues concerning himself and Colonel Bradford can serve only to detract from the validity of the simple, straightforward message which is his offering to the world.

While he does not reveal when he was born, Mr. Kelder is very much alive, well, and productive today, nearly sixty years after his book was first published.

Even the Wikipedia article on the Five Tibetan Rites ( says that there is hardly anything known about Kelder. The 1946 edition says:


You are holding in your hands a most intriguing book. It was first published in 1939 by Peter Kelder, a man we know next to nothing
about. Mr. Kelder tells a tale of a mysterious British Army Officer, a Colonel Bradford, who located a hidden monastery in Tibet. There the Lamas taught secrets of health and rejuvenation through a simple system of exercise.

A 1985 Harbor Press edition has this thinly veiled caveat from the editor of the book:


I cannot promise that the rites will erase 50 years from your age, transform you overnight, or make you live to 125. But I
do know that they can help anyone to look and feel years younger, and to gain a greater sense of well-being.

He then goes to continue:


If you perform the rites daily, you should begin to notice results in 30 days or less. In about ten weeks, you'll probably start to see more substantial benefits. Whatever the pace of your progress, it's always a thrilling moment when friends actually begin to comment that you are looking younger and healthier.

Then the real kicker (right after the above quote)!


If the five rites really work, the big question is how?

From "sure" to "not so sure" within a paragraph (hell, practically a sentence)?

The editor then goes on to talk about Kirlian photography and how we all have auras that are either strong or weak (which has been debunked, by the way). Check out this scientific article:


The 1946 edition states that over 2 million copies had been sold by then. By plugging 10 cents (let's say that was the fixed price in 1946) into an inflation calculator, we find that in 1946 it is equivalent to $1.16 in 2011 US Dollars. $2,320,000 in today's money. There would still be a tidy sum left over after taxes and paying some overhead costs.

If this book was so good, why has it gone out of print and revived a few times over the past several decades since 1939?

Food for thought!

Lone Flame out!

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/13/2011 06:23PM by Lone_Flame_of_Eternity.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Debunking Samael Aun Weor
Posted by: Stoic ()
Date: December 14, 2011 12:17PM

Lone Flame, golly I missed you. Come back, come back, the pipes are calling!

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Debunking Samael Aun Weor
Date: January 27, 2012 04:49AM

The 2012 Doomsday "gnostics" are at it again, this time with laughable math.


The graphic on their frontpage (with a depiction of Hercolobus' orbit superimposed on the Solar System) says:


1983: 50 billion miles

1992: 7+ Billion miles

2012: The time is over!

A plus sign is just a plus sign.

Isn't it amazing how Hercolubus traveled 43 billion miles in just 9 years and then politely slowed down 20 years ago to give us time to awaken ourselves?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/27/2012 04:52AM by Lone_Flame_of_Eternity.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Debunking Samael Aun Weor
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: January 27, 2012 10:39PM

Welcome back, Lone Flame.

We put in a thread on 2012 Fear Driven BS


Please feel free to add your post to that thread to keep it current. If you run into any new items, put em on in.

All over the country people teaching astronomy are probably reaching for the Maalox.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Debunking Samael Aun Weor
Date: February 02, 2012 02:17AM

It looks like I struck a raw nerve or they got wind they were being debunked. The 2012 "gnostics" have now set up their page where only invited readers can view the blog.

Just another closure of something "gnostic" when the pressure ramps up against their house of cards.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/02/2012 02:18AM by Lone_Flame_of_Eternity.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Debunking Samael Aun Weor
Posted by: pB2wO6dC1r ()
Date: February 03, 2012 05:48PM

This is the thing to do, keep on harassing, and drive them into closed forums. Then they can indulge in the sense of persecution just like in the old days.

The Hercolobus thing is just ludicrous. How on earth anyone can buy that junk, with all the astronomers of the world scanning the sky, is beyond me.

Although Lone Flame, it appears that SAW first mentions Hercolobus as part of one of his Christmas Messages from the '60s. Can't remember which one. It seems to be inspired(surprise,surprise) by the ramblings of a "seer,mystic,clairvoyant,channeller" woman called "Ramatis" who spoke of a comet due to visit Earth's neighbourhood and do lots of naughty things to us and the planet.

As for the Lamasery book. Sure, its just another cheap rip off of a rip off !
The Five Tibetan Rites are a fragment of a teaching named Yantra yoga (Tibetan- trulkhor) which is a yoga which has a genuine lineage of transmission back to Padmasambhava.
Our Sam has just taken the exercises and mixed them up with his gnostic jargon and sent it back into the world. He does this telling us he is a member of the "Sacred Order of Tibet" and yet his "experiences", as noted in the book "My Return To Tibet" appear to be remarkably similar to those of another author/poet Salvador Diaz Miron in his work "Epistola". Word for word in certain sections. Maybe SAW travelled with the book of Senor Miron in his astral baggage and read it on the way, got altitude sickness in Tibet, got confused about who did what and the outcome is all a genuine mistake. Somehow I doubt it.
It is a much more sinister and calculated plan to deceive the unwary and it has worked well, until the days of the internet. SAW didn't prophecize that one!!

See you, and keep up the good work.

Options: ReplyQuote
Current Page: 5 of 11

Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
This forum powered by Phorum.