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Re: Desteni
Posted by: dsm ()
Date: June 08, 2010 05:46AM

Are all those websites in Anticult's list owned by Desteni?

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Re: Desteni
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: June 08, 2010 10:56AM

Desteni probably don't own all of them, just posting their spam and links, trying to troll the internet with their bait-and-switch deceptive tactics
But they might own some of them.

All one has to do is do a WHOIS on each website, to see the registration details.

www.whois.net
whois.domaintools.com

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Re: Desteni
Posted by: Sandman ()
Date: June 08, 2010 03:50PM

Desteni members probably submit the material to any websites that will accept them and/or they have software for mass submission into web directories or some other search optimization methods are being used so that the articles/videos duplicate on various sites.

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Re: Desteni
Posted by: Citizendc ()
Date: June 09, 2010 09:30AM

Hi There,

I'm posting this to inform others who are thinking about joining desteni and those that are already there.
Learn from my experience.

Lets begin...

I was a desteni member for some time and went by the username CitizenDC.
As I had been around the block a few times with regards to religion, groups who channel etc..

After reading much of their material and videos I reduced my reasoning ability by
self brainwashing in order to get what they where saying. It worked.
I still think some of their ideas are ... ideal but not the way they are going about it.

I spent time away from desteni on two separate occasions, each time with great benefits.
The first time when I returned to their forum I immediately began seeing more inconsistencies and began to challenge what the portal had to say.
My questioning and challenges where met with redicule, abuse and a temporary ban.
After 'playing along' to the admin's demands, my account was re-enabled again.

I spent some time reading forum members experiences as I could no longer watch desteni videos or
read their material without finding serious problems with the portals credibility.
I left the forums and spent much time being silent, not thinking. Months went by and
really the quieting of my mind had helped me to remove much of the useless information their channeler had produced.

Months passed, I was on Youtube one day and watched a video by a user named, "destenitruth" and I really had
no gripe with Desteni at that stage, however this guy was doing something to prevent
others from falling into a similar trap I did. So I decided to checkout what the desteni forum
where saying about this guy which was the usual automated response by forum embmers, and because I can see both points of view I decided to
share a balanced perspective to show forum members that their judgements of DesteniTruth(Youtube) could be
reflected back at them if they where to come back down to reality and look at their situation.

What unfolded actually proved that their members do clearly believe anything the portal says. I have copies of the discussion if anyone here is interested.
Shortly after my 2 posts my account was banned and quite cleverly done. Instead of preventing me from posting like they do to regular members, they removed all my posts.
So how did they cleverly remove me. Well, in my first post I expressed myself, amongst other things, about how
one admin in particular (I did not name this admin) was obviously not following the process. I explained it in such a way that anyone I think could understand what I was seeing.

This admin in question decided to ban me with the excuse of me not using my real name on the forum.
At the time of my joining in 2008 you where allowed to not use your real name, Then it was not allowed, then it was allowed, then it was not allowed, then it was allowed, lol, desteni you will learn are very inconsistent...
So I proceeded to supply my personal details in order to get my account activated to reply to those who responded, no response. A second time, no response.
This confirmed to me that what I had said in my last two posts was far to probelmatic for them to allow my account to be reinstated.
Side Note: What I found rather amusing is that just a few weeks prior to my account being closed, their portal said that no ones accounts are to be deleted. This admin did it anyway.

I can see why they are being labelled a cult with their contradictions and their adversity to those who challenge and question what they say.
This is another reason why I am sharing my experience.

Understand that if you become an indoctrinated desteni member, you will likely want to cut ties with friends. This will further entrap you as you exchange your current support system for the desteni forum member support system.
Many top desteni members have said this too.
Be careful.

If you want to break free from this group or any group, all you need to do is get away from them and their members and stay away for a few months.
Then take what you learnt and share you experience about it.
They will attempt to attack you, but if you watch carefully, they are actually defending their beliefs and their actions. They will think that they are right and will not understand where you are coming from and so they will need to label you.

Understand that when you invest time and money into anything you will naturally want to protect it if someone attacks its value.
Many desteni members do not know how beliefs actually work other than what they are taught by desteni and co.
Heres a quick run down. Anything you repeat enough times through reading or saying will become a belief over time, a self running thought.
So when someone threatens desteni, their natural response is to defend themselves and their position.
This reaction comes from the urge to protect ones belief.

This group has some good points at face values, however there is ample evidence showing you that desteni does not walk its talk.

To conclude, I had a rule that I adopted when I was still going through channeled groups like popcorn, and that was to be honest with myself. Not to be confused with desteni's version of SELL-honesy [XmanosX].
When I see something wrong, speak up, do not look away. When something feels wrong, investigate it, no matter the consequences. Thats the type of honesty I'm speaking about.
If you are a desteni member reading this, take note when you see inconsistencies, challenge the portal information, understand its foundation is based on fiction until its proven otherwise.
If you catch yourself basing your understanding of the world on the portal information, realise that you are in reality basing your understanding on a type of fiction and that it owns you as you never tested it, never questioned or challenged it. And simply by being exposed to it over and over again, you will automatically begin forming a belief system subconsciously around it.
That cannot happen if you question, challenge and criticise any information. This also explains why groups like desteni will attempt to silence you if you do.

Regards,

C

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Re: Desteni is very much like Scientology, Bernard Poolman
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: June 09, 2010 09:00PM

@ Citizendc,

If you wanted, you could post relevant excerpts of those discussions in this thread so others can see what happened.

Its very important for former Desteni folks to make posts about what is really going on with Desteni. That way, current Desteni members with doubts, can look into the facts for themselves, from the privacy of their own computer.

As well, Desteni is trying to always force people to use their surnames, and to personally identify themselves, that way Desteni can target that person, and single them out, as shown above.
Any former Desteni member can post in a forum like this with a pseudonym, and post the facts of their experiences, as well as their viewpoints.

To the trained-eye, its very clear Desteni is running all sorts of cultic techniques on people, in many ways similar to other groups like Scientology.
Bernard Poolman is a cynical manipulator, posing as an idealist.


Quote
Citizendc
What unfolded actually proved that their members do clearly believe anything the portal says. I have copies of the discussion if anyone here is interested.

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Re: Desteni is very much like Scientology, Bernard Poolman
Posted by: Stoic ()
Date: June 09, 2010 09:23PM

Good to hear your experience, Citizendc, and the clarity that you have now gained regarding it.

There's life and hope after tangling with the Poolman's of this world.

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Re: Desteni
Posted by: Citizendc ()
Date: June 10, 2010 06:07AM

-------------------------------------------------------------------

From the desteni forum:
hxxp://desteni.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=61&t=16855&p=119893&hilit=thats+why+hes+attacking+desteni#p119893

1st reply in this topic.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

>>User Kenny:
>>lol
>>thats why hes attacking desteni cause he doesnt want to leave his angels and gods and face himself
>>hes a slave to his angels and god creation

Or maybe he see's something we are not. I have only desteni's word that there are no angels, gods and demons.
I cannot prove nor disprove that they exist.

I see desteni's point of view and I see this brits point of view.
I also have serious problems with how things are run on these forums. Let me explain.

What worried me when I first signed up on this forum is how desteni blew everything else except themselves out of the water.
They eliminated demons, chakra's, people who have out of body experiences, they say it all only exists in our minds now. By doing so making themselves sovereign as the only truth, any others are false and having the only means to know the truth, the portal. This is a problem for me.
But when I did research in the world to validate some of what desteni claimed, I found the results to be inconsistent.

Let me give you an example which raised red flags for me.
A short while after reading that desteni removed the demons, I decided to look for the physical result of their dimensional cleaning as doing something on that grand scale as eliminating all the demons must have a physical impact.
So I went onto statistic websites to look for a drop in the amount of murders, death and rape around the world, all of which have been somewhat attributed to demon possession or manipulation...
But the figures where the opposite of what I was expecting to find. All of these have increased.
How can this be I thought. Why is violent crime on the increase when the potential instigators where all converted to supporting humans.

Then I began looking at some of the portal interviews.
Many where on abstract subjects which I could not verify in the physical world.
So I began looking for the interviews where claims where made about the physical, those that I could research to check for consistency. After identifying several my research began and my results frustrated me as they where 180 degrees in the opposite direction of what the message was saying.
At that time I was conflicted because some of their message I found to be true and in great need, but at the same time I found some of the portal interviews, those that can be challenged, when tested not adding up with my research results...

This is when I felt I needed to be careful on what I do here, what I say, what I write and about exposing too much information about myself.
I cannot be completely open about myself on all subjects with others if I do not trust the place I’m in.

At that time I also decided that I need to let others know subtly that something is wrong, I didn’t have hard core evidence, nothing I can put into words at that time, but something was not 100% right.
And still right now, I feel something is not kosher.

So I put up my signature at the bottom of all my posts with the plan that any who read it will remain objective to the information, and hopefully challenge it instead of just accepting everything that is presented here. That makes sense right? If what is being presented is truthful, then it must stand being scrutinized and tested.

Quote

To non-critical readers, many texts offer the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
To the critical reader, any single text provides but one portrayal of the facts, one individual's "take" on the subject.

And really, back in 2008/09 some new folks where just blindly gobbling up this stuff up which was beginning to bother me.
I've seen people gobble up ideas and begin relaying them as if it is their own. I didnt want to see this here, people doing this here.
Because then it’s just another religion and that’s not what I see it as.
The moment you just accept what is being said, welcome to religion. It’s your responsibility to challenge anything and everything that is presented here, no matter who says it, no matter what the consequences are. So they ban you for voicing your perspective and you've invested 1000 posts into these forums, you are still responsible for yourself, your participation here and responsible for misleading others if you spread something you have not challenged or tested.

I have accepted information before without challenging it and I experienced the consequences quite a few times before I learnt.
The moment I allow myself to just accept anything I hear I have fallen into a potential trap.
Potential trap because not everything is a trap, but without challenging it, you dont know!
Its like walking on a mine field and hearing a click and ignoring it. When I hear the clicks, I now check it out.

When I started challenging things on the forum I felt very restricted. At the time people on this forum where very abusive towards one another.
I accepted it as part of forum folks process they where working through and continued. Challenging the content was often met with hostility and the behavior I felt was similar to what Christians did those rare times I let rip on their religion. I felt that people where protecting something as if it needed protecting.
What the British chap writes about the ego is true.
The ego will protect its beliefs, but not everyone here has completely removed their mask and will be prone to violent reactions when the one thing they are using to break through the mask is being attacked. This is understandable and must be taken into consideration.
But its not an excuse for us to loose control of ourselves and these moments can be used to help show us where we need work.

There are inconsistencies in the desteni message, and I am not the only one to see them. I know it. I've read many posts and I know you know sometimes something is wrong.
But if we all play the hiding game because we are afraid of the repercussions of our actions then what is use of doing all this when by not challenging the information, by remaining quiet, we are making the situation worse.
And there is no real harm in challenging, because if the challenged topic is true it will be infallible. It will not have a weakness; it will be in the best interests of all if we challenge information.
Many here already do it, and to me it’s valuable because it takes many different views to see an idea or piece of information from all angles. Then to see if that idea of information takes into consideration everything or if it is separating things.

Another matter I have a problem with is the admins. Namely one.
This chap has a seriously big ego problem yet he continues being allowed to be an administrator. All the other admins behave in a way that reflects who they are.
This chap reflects an ego that for some reason is still not under control. He sits indirect contradiction of what we are accomplishing here.
That is removing our ego's to show who we are. Lead by example you know?
Why is this being accepted and allowed? By leaving him in that position you are doing more damage to him and forum members.
To get a chap like that to really face himself, he's image needs to be taken away, but its being supported by allowing he's continued participation as an administrator, a role that carries with it power.
When and if the desteni project does move into a civilisation role I will not support or stand for individuals with clearly active ego's being put into positions of power. That is currently being done today with our governments and we all can see the repercussions.
This must end.


Finally to wrap this up.
Take the brits videos. He took the time to post these. He has definite concerns right?
Look at it, see what is being said and when he mentions something that you also have thought of as odd, bring it up, challenge it, so that we can get to the bottom of it and see where it leads.

That’s all.


~ note, my second reply/response in this desteni topic will be posted shortly.

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Re: Desteni
Posted by: Citizendc ()
Date: June 10, 2010 06:45AM

-------------------------------------------------------------------
From the desteni forum:
hxxp://desteni.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=61&t=16855&p=119893&hilit=thats+why+hes+attacking+desteni#p119893

2nd reply/response in this topic followed by forum ban.
I've added notes in brackets like so --> CitizenDC (notes 123)

Also note, slang use of the word brit was in reference to the DesteniTruth youtube member which was the cause of this Topic, no disrespect intended.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

>> User Ryan response to my firt post.
>> Angels don't exist anymore [I know this because we created and developed who we are as
>> 1 giant living being within the structure of energy as defined as the "purpose of life"],
>> it is also in the material, this is common sense = seeing how things work, how we've created ourselves.
>> Anything that is not in actual reality, is obviously not practical and should be disregarded.

CitizenDC(Notice how he is not aware of he's belief formed through reading of the material. He states no facts or sound logic, only recites what he was told...)

>> "So I began looking for the interviews where claims where made about the physical, those that
>> I could research to check for consistency. After identifying several my research began and my results frustrated
>> me as they where 180 degrees in the opposite direction of what the message was saying."

>> User Ryan Response to CitizenDC
>> Can you elaborate, or share exactly what you saw?

I have it on my computer, but the gfx card died a few months ago, working from my laptop now.
Once its fixed and I make the time, I'll consider presenting it here for discussion if it is still needed.
But let’s talk about the demons inconsistency I mentioned in my initial post.
Desteni claimed that there are demons, that they where directly involved in the manipulation of humans and made the claim that
many serving life sentences for acts in the past where controlled by demons at the time.
for example, from the Hitler article here is a quote: "we had all the power and control over humans on earth. Possession was a game for us."

So as I mentioned in my previous post I checked this out by analysing stats of violent crimes after I read this claim.
At the time demons according to desteni portal where the main instigators.
I reasoned that if they had all been removed and converted, my physical findings should reveal a similar change in human crime levels. Right?
But instead I found an increase.
This does not make sense. If external demons where possessing people and getting them to be violent, and now they are removed and assisting us, we should
see an obvious effect in our world.
It was not adding up and I kept finding these inconsistencies.
This was the problem, things where not adding up.

>> Angels don't exist anymore [I know this because we created and developed who we
>> are as 1 giant living being within the structure of energy as defined as the "purpose of life"],

Let’s look at one part of your statement and work through this for me to show you what I am concerned about.
“Angels don't exist anymore” but you cannot know this without first hand experience.
Have you spoken to an angel? If you haven’t does that mean angels don’t exist?
Similarly, because I can’t see bacteria with my unaided naked eye, does it mean they don’t exist?

Angels exist only as a possibility for us unless proof or evidence is presented to show otherwise.
Let’s take a look at what the basis are for believing in angels.
1. Does god and exist?
2. Did he create angels?
3. Do these angels behave in the best interest of man?

But fair is fair so we evaluate desteni the same way.

The messages coming through the portal are similar to the example above about the angels, they are possibilities based on many layers of unknowns.
1. Do the dimensions as described by the portal actually exist?
2. Are there beings in dimensions as described by the portal?
3. Does the portal exist as described by Desteni?

All these are only possibilities. The same for what the brit claims about he’s angels and god/God.
Now if I we lend credibility to the desteni channeled message, should we not also lend credibility to what the brit has to say. Or if we choose to ignore the brit should we not also ignore the portal messages as their foundations are the same.
As both are only possibilities, to me this makes sense that they should be equally ignored or equally regarded.
Doesn’t picking and choosing which flavor of unknown we are going to accept mean that we are biased?

Now lets look how we can get ourselves into believing or becoming biased when there is no evidence to support it.
I’ve done this numerous times in my life btw.

First I learn something, something that I know is right. Then next I’m exposed to something I do not know but its from the same source that shared the same fact that I know is right.
By indirect association, I now reason, because the first bit of information was right, the second source is ‘probably’ right too.
But this is a mistake. Each and every bit of information must be tested.
Because if the source is attempting to mislead me it can give me one truth, something it knows everyone knows deep down. Then it can give me another that I cannot verify, after some time it can give me more, so much so that I stop thinking about challenging the message altogether and begin building layer on top of layer of information which now is knowledge which acts to change my perception of reality.
I’m sure you can see how easy for us to fall into this trap and how essential it is to challenge and test whatever we accept.

>> User Ryan, response to my first post.
>> But what we CAN do is be self honest, and within that see that it is stupid to
>> just follow something because it has the shape of an angel, or to listen to things we find to
>> LOOK credible, or holy, or positive, or whatever.
CitizenDC(Again notice that he contradicts himself as he's first response shows that he has already baught the desteni material hook line and sinker.)
Exactly. This then also applies to any other information sources like portals and channels.


I'm going to be available again to post here over the coming weekend.
If there anything is unclear, let me know and we can discuss it further.

Bye

>> User Adam Sultun, response to my second post.
>> really the same idea can be applied to the material here as well. I think this man has a right to be skeptical and ask questions.

CitizenDC (shortly after he's reply, this user was banned)

>> User Ely, response to my second post.
>> If you can understand the truth about desteni ,then you will automatically understand, at a point, Desteni promotes skepticism. So continue your skeptics review as you read the material.

CitizenDC (Right... thats why your scepticle loving forum admin banned me)

>> User Cathy, partial response to second post (rest left out as its irrelevant)
>> It's interesting - you've been here since Aug, 2008 and still we don't know your real name.

CitizenDC (Exactly what the forum admin was waiting for, he could not just outright ban me as that would look way to suspect. He needed a reason)

>> Admin Darryl response
>> That's something I missed. CitizenDC, give it up. Your name, please.
CitizenDC (Two emails sent supplying my details, no response of course)

If you are a desteni member reading this, take a good look at the crowed you are hanging out with.
They do not want you to challenge their material, they prefer you to be docile and dependent on them feeding you their views.
Its time to start thinking for yourself.

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Re: Desteni
Posted by: Citizendc ()
Date: June 10, 2010 07:24AM

Hi The Anticult,

>> If you wanted, you could post relevant excerpts of those discussions in this thread so others can see what happened.

Okay, I posted my last 2 desteni-forum responses with comments from other members.

>> Its very important for former Desteni folks to make posts about what is really going on with Desteni.
>> That way, current Desteni members with doubts, can look into the facts for themselves, from the privacy of their own computer.

I completely agree.

>> As well, Desteni is trying to always force people to use their surnames, and to personally identify themselves, that way Desteni can target that
>> person, and single them out, as shown above.

Yeah, their argument about being self responsible and requiring the use of ones real name on their forums is not quite valid to me.
To me, a name is only a reference to a person as is an alias. A name cannot be self responsible, only a person can. Providing ones name proves nothing, names can change but the person remains the same.

>> To the trained-eye, its very clear Desteni is running all sorts of cultic techniques on people, in many ways similar to other groups like Scientology.
>> Bernard Poolman is a cynical manipulator, posing as an idealist.

Very unfortunate as I had high hopes for this group.
When I initially joined desteni I was looking at only their sales pitch which sold me. It took some time to realise what was actually going on.


cheers,

C

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Re: Desteni is very much like Scientology, Bernard Poolman
Posted by: Citizendc ()
Date: June 10, 2010 07:31AM

>> Good to hear your experience, Citizendc, and the clarity that you have now gained regarding it.

Glad to share it. My thanks to those who took the time to post their experience here and make youtube videos to educate folks about this group.

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