Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by:
anon27
()
Date: June 05, 2018 11:19AM
To help anyone who still fears Peter Young, I thought it might be helpful to give more insight into Peter Young’s fundamental emotional and psychological weakness.
I hope this shows why he should be pitied, not feared. And also why he should be avoided.
Peter Young himself recounted the story that one of his teachers told him, over 25 years ago, to forgive his father. His response was to proudly declaim: “My father was never there, so there’s nothing to forgive!”
With that profoundly ignorant dismissal, he inevitably descended into playing out the role of the shadow-father: bullying, violent, aggressive, obsessed with status and being worshipped, helplessly drawn towards power for the sake of power, uncaring of the hurt he inflicts on others, and despicably cruel to those who place their trust in him.
Peter Young treats his students like fools, because he knows within himself that he is just a damaged child. Peter Young knows that anyone who seeks to learn from a damaged child must be a fool.
This is why Peter Young cannot stand any criticism, however constructive, however honest, however positive, and however much good it will do him.
Any hint of anything less than total worship drives him insane with rage, because to him, all he feels in that moment is his father’s (perceived) rejection of him.
I once saw him get into a literally insane cycle of denial, becoming more and more aggressive at every turn, when a very loyal (totally brainwashed) student was trying to very politely and gently tell him that there was a typo in a document.
This student kept pointing out the typo becuase in her brainwashed state, she couldn't concieve that Peter Young was more interested in being worshipped than seeing the truth of this tiny, insignificant error.
He finally overwhelmed the student with his aggression, and she fell silent, entirely confused.
Peter Young was literally unable to even accept the presence of a typo, as it hinted he was not perfect. He didn’t think about this – he immediately reacted with violence, and locked into that, as his damaged child was frozen in agony inside himself.
Peter Young cannot stop himself from denigrating his students, both in class, and to anyone around him.
I witnessed a Tulku gently reproach him for being so mean to his students, to which Peter Young reacted angrily (which is very bad behaviour towards a Tulku), and then went into an unstoppable rant about how worthless his students were. Peter Young went as far as to say that his students might give the impression of not being entirely worthless, but to trust him on this, as he knew his students better than anyone.
The Tulku fell silent.
Peter Young is entirely blind to the fact that any teacher who feels that he must constantly denigrate his own students, because he genuinely believes them to be incompetent morons despite years of “learning at his feet”, is, by definition, a bad teacher.
That this shows him to clearly be a bad Buddhist, and a bad human being, also doesn't ever occur to him.
Peter Young is to be pitied, for he is entirely driven by the damaged child within himself that still cries out for his father’s love and approval.
He experiences no satisfaction and no love.
None of his students love him, they all fear him.
Peter Young feels that fear is the best he can possibly hope for from anyone, because he cannot experience love, because that damaged child within himself feels eternally rejected, and is enternally in fear of further rejection.
Peter Young only ever feared his father, because his father was always absent, and so Peter Young always felt rejected or the threat of rejection.
In taking on the role of a father figure to his students, Peter Young has no experience of love to draw on.
Peter Young is tortured by the fear of the damaged child that the reason his father was absent was because his father did not love him.
Penor Rinpoche consistently refused to allow Peter Young to show off his martial arts or other skills to him, despite Peter Young doing everything he could to get the chance to.
I heard Peter Young say that he’d been trying for years to get the opportunity to do so, and failed every time.
Peter Young complained bitterly about this, and could not understand why Penor Rinpoche showed zero interest in Peter Young’s “powers” – to the point where Penor Rinpoche would ‘accidently’ miss appointments during which Peter Young planned to show-off in front of him.
Peter Young is a huge disappointment to his teachers, his students, and himself.
And, deep down, he knows it.
This is why he has become more and more erratic, desperate and despotic over the years.
He is locked in a self-destructive cycle by the damaged child he clings onto inside himself.
He drags everyone around him into that destructive cycle, because he cannot face the essential emotional truth of his life and come to peace with it.
The only dangerous thing about Peter Young is that he believes the big lie he has told himself: that if he attains enough power over others (by any means he can) his daddy might finally love him.
This is why he constantly lies to everyone around him, and even to Penor Rinpoche, as witnessed by another commentator in the other thread about Peter Young on this forum.
No matter what one thinks of Penor Rinpoche, to anyone who knows something about Tibetan Buddhism, and Tibetan culture, to be called a liar, in public, by the person who one calls his root guru is perhaps the most shameful thing that can possibly happen.
It really is very clear evidence of who Peter Young is.
The Chinese community in Newcastle, who Peter Young has tried to engage with and impress many times over the years, refuse to have anything to do with him.
The Tai Chi Union of Great Britain refuse to have anything to do with him.
From the little information I have, the Tibetan Buddhist community, including Palyul, Nyingma and Namdroling Monastery, refuse to have anything to do with him now that Peror Rinpoche is gone.
Every institution (like Newcastle University) or group who hired out spaces for Peter Young to teach in over the years, more or less quickly refused to continue to rent him their space.
All the students I saw over the years who had some talent and intelligence, got as far away as possible from him, as quickly as possible, after they’d spent some time with him.
Everyone of any value, from every walk of life, refuses to have anything to do with him.
The only students who remain are brainwashed, obsessed with obtaining power themselves, or in such fear that they dare not leave.
These are the people who surround him.
Peter Young is very clever, and cannot fail to see and understand this.
Peter Young is however, entirely blind to the reason for it. He has told himself that it is because he is such an advanced being that no one understands him.
Peter Young therefore lives out a life of constant rejection by anyone who could give him a sense of self-worth.
He relives again and again the fundamental rejection-trauma he experienced through the absence of his father when he was a child (and throughout the rest of his life).
This is his own personal hell, that he creates everyday for himself.
The last 15 or so years he has built a new persona based on his supposed “perfect” understanding of Buddhism ... yet he even gets 4 Noble Truths totally wrong.
The 4 Noble Truths are the most basic and easy to understand introductory level of Buddhist thought. A child can understand them.
Peter Young gets them totally wrong because he has interpreted them to feed his lust for power.
Peter Young claims to be a Vajrayana expert (as well as Hinyana and Mahayana expert, of course) ... and yet is still ridiculing his own senior student, in public.
The senior student has been with him for more than 20 years.
Peter Young is so blind to his own shortcomings that he cannot see that if his senior student “deserves” this ridicule as part of “Vajrayana advanced practice”, then it is Peter Young who is at fault, who is incompetent.
Peter Young is no different to Donald Trump - reduced to puffing himself up with blatant lies backed up by the most puerile bullying of those around him ... and totally unaware that anyone with half a brain recognises him clearly, and with ample data-driven evidence, as a total fool and incompetent.
Like Donald Trump, Peter Young is dangerous, and to be avoided, but at the same time pitied for being a sham of a man.
This is the truth of it.
I hope this shows why he should be pitied, not feared. And also why he should be avoided.
Peter Young himself recounted the story that one of his teachers told him, over 25 years ago, to forgive his father. His response was to proudly declaim: “My father was never there, so there’s nothing to forgive!”
With that profoundly ignorant dismissal, he inevitably descended into playing out the role of the shadow-father: bullying, violent, aggressive, obsessed with status and being worshipped, helplessly drawn towards power for the sake of power, uncaring of the hurt he inflicts on others, and despicably cruel to those who place their trust in him.
Peter Young treats his students like fools, because he knows within himself that he is just a damaged child. Peter Young knows that anyone who seeks to learn from a damaged child must be a fool.
This is why Peter Young cannot stand any criticism, however constructive, however honest, however positive, and however much good it will do him.
Any hint of anything less than total worship drives him insane with rage, because to him, all he feels in that moment is his father’s (perceived) rejection of him.
I once saw him get into a literally insane cycle of denial, becoming more and more aggressive at every turn, when a very loyal (totally brainwashed) student was trying to very politely and gently tell him that there was a typo in a document.
This student kept pointing out the typo becuase in her brainwashed state, she couldn't concieve that Peter Young was more interested in being worshipped than seeing the truth of this tiny, insignificant error.
He finally overwhelmed the student with his aggression, and she fell silent, entirely confused.
Peter Young was literally unable to even accept the presence of a typo, as it hinted he was not perfect. He didn’t think about this – he immediately reacted with violence, and locked into that, as his damaged child was frozen in agony inside himself.
Peter Young cannot stop himself from denigrating his students, both in class, and to anyone around him.
I witnessed a Tulku gently reproach him for being so mean to his students, to which Peter Young reacted angrily (which is very bad behaviour towards a Tulku), and then went into an unstoppable rant about how worthless his students were. Peter Young went as far as to say that his students might give the impression of not being entirely worthless, but to trust him on this, as he knew his students better than anyone.
The Tulku fell silent.
Peter Young is entirely blind to the fact that any teacher who feels that he must constantly denigrate his own students, because he genuinely believes them to be incompetent morons despite years of “learning at his feet”, is, by definition, a bad teacher.
That this shows him to clearly be a bad Buddhist, and a bad human being, also doesn't ever occur to him.
Peter Young is to be pitied, for he is entirely driven by the damaged child within himself that still cries out for his father’s love and approval.
He experiences no satisfaction and no love.
None of his students love him, they all fear him.
Peter Young feels that fear is the best he can possibly hope for from anyone, because he cannot experience love, because that damaged child within himself feels eternally rejected, and is enternally in fear of further rejection.
Peter Young only ever feared his father, because his father was always absent, and so Peter Young always felt rejected or the threat of rejection.
In taking on the role of a father figure to his students, Peter Young has no experience of love to draw on.
Peter Young is tortured by the fear of the damaged child that the reason his father was absent was because his father did not love him.
Penor Rinpoche consistently refused to allow Peter Young to show off his martial arts or other skills to him, despite Peter Young doing everything he could to get the chance to.
I heard Peter Young say that he’d been trying for years to get the opportunity to do so, and failed every time.
Peter Young complained bitterly about this, and could not understand why Penor Rinpoche showed zero interest in Peter Young’s “powers” – to the point where Penor Rinpoche would ‘accidently’ miss appointments during which Peter Young planned to show-off in front of him.
Peter Young is a huge disappointment to his teachers, his students, and himself.
And, deep down, he knows it.
This is why he has become more and more erratic, desperate and despotic over the years.
He is locked in a self-destructive cycle by the damaged child he clings onto inside himself.
He drags everyone around him into that destructive cycle, because he cannot face the essential emotional truth of his life and come to peace with it.
The only dangerous thing about Peter Young is that he believes the big lie he has told himself: that if he attains enough power over others (by any means he can) his daddy might finally love him.
This is why he constantly lies to everyone around him, and even to Penor Rinpoche, as witnessed by another commentator in the other thread about Peter Young on this forum.
No matter what one thinks of Penor Rinpoche, to anyone who knows something about Tibetan Buddhism, and Tibetan culture, to be called a liar, in public, by the person who one calls his root guru is perhaps the most shameful thing that can possibly happen.
It really is very clear evidence of who Peter Young is.
The Chinese community in Newcastle, who Peter Young has tried to engage with and impress many times over the years, refuse to have anything to do with him.
The Tai Chi Union of Great Britain refuse to have anything to do with him.
From the little information I have, the Tibetan Buddhist community, including Palyul, Nyingma and Namdroling Monastery, refuse to have anything to do with him now that Peror Rinpoche is gone.
Every institution (like Newcastle University) or group who hired out spaces for Peter Young to teach in over the years, more or less quickly refused to continue to rent him their space.
All the students I saw over the years who had some talent and intelligence, got as far away as possible from him, as quickly as possible, after they’d spent some time with him.
Everyone of any value, from every walk of life, refuses to have anything to do with him.
The only students who remain are brainwashed, obsessed with obtaining power themselves, or in such fear that they dare not leave.
These are the people who surround him.
Peter Young is very clever, and cannot fail to see and understand this.
Peter Young is however, entirely blind to the reason for it. He has told himself that it is because he is such an advanced being that no one understands him.
Peter Young therefore lives out a life of constant rejection by anyone who could give him a sense of self-worth.
He relives again and again the fundamental rejection-trauma he experienced through the absence of his father when he was a child (and throughout the rest of his life).
This is his own personal hell, that he creates everyday for himself.
The last 15 or so years he has built a new persona based on his supposed “perfect” understanding of Buddhism ... yet he even gets 4 Noble Truths totally wrong.
The 4 Noble Truths are the most basic and easy to understand introductory level of Buddhist thought. A child can understand them.
Peter Young gets them totally wrong because he has interpreted them to feed his lust for power.
Peter Young claims to be a Vajrayana expert (as well as Hinyana and Mahayana expert, of course) ... and yet is still ridiculing his own senior student, in public.
The senior student has been with him for more than 20 years.
Peter Young is so blind to his own shortcomings that he cannot see that if his senior student “deserves” this ridicule as part of “Vajrayana advanced practice”, then it is Peter Young who is at fault, who is incompetent.
Peter Young is no different to Donald Trump - reduced to puffing himself up with blatant lies backed up by the most puerile bullying of those around him ... and totally unaware that anyone with half a brain recognises him clearly, and with ample data-driven evidence, as a total fool and incompetent.
Like Donald Trump, Peter Young is dangerous, and to be avoided, but at the same time pitied for being a sham of a man.
This is the truth of it.
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by:
anon27
()
Date: June 06, 2018 12:21AM
Other facts about Peter Young (PY) that show who is really is:
1. PY teaches that fear is the opposite of hope.
The Dalai Lama says that hope is very important.
So do all other authentic spiritual authorities.
PY teaches his students to therefore abandon hope if they wish to free themselves from fear.
PY does this deliberately to depress the emotional and mental states of his students, to rob them of any sense of a better future for themselves.
Because it is based on lies, this method, of course, never works. It just gives PY more and more control over his students as they sink into depression.
In addition, it is agreed by everyone that fear is actually the opposite of love.
The opposite of hope is actually despair.
PY teaches his students to despair of everything in the past, present and the future, so that he can then present himself as their only salvation.
PY teaches his students that if they still feel fear (which he deliberately inflicts on them at every opportunity), then they should work even harder to abandon all hope.
As mentioned previously PY uses fear, and is driven by fear, because he does not know what love is, and is incapable of inspiring love in anyone.
This is why he teaches that fear is the opposite of hope. If his students realised that fear is the opposite of love, then they would quickly realise PY is actually treating them with the opposite of love.
2. PY teaches that human rights do not exist.
The Dalai Lama says that human rights are very important.
PY teaches this to give his students the impression that they do not have any human rights, which enables PY to treat them as less than human.
PY does this so that when he abuses his students, they feel that is it not a bad thing, that they deserve it, and most importantly that any sense his students might have that being abused should not be tolerated, is an illusion.
If human rights do not exist, then what rights could his students claim to have not to be abused?
3. PY teaches that violence against children is correct and should be encouraged.
I (and many other students) witnessed him endorsing violence against child-monks at Namdroling monastery.
I witnessed Penor Rinpoche (PR) asking his monks to stop using violence as a form of discipline against the child-monks. PR did this several times.
(It is well known that there is an a very sad, culturally driven, tendency in many Buddhist monasteries in India and Tibet to resort to violence as a means of discipline. The Dalai Lama speaks often about one of his tutors who used violence against him when he was a child).
PY specifically and repeatedly contradicted PR, saying violence was necessary.
PY openly stated that PR didn't know what he was talking about.
For PY to contradict the direct teaching, and instruction, of PR shows the lack of sincerity PY has for the person he claims was his root guru.
Additionally, all educators and experts in child behaviour say that, in a nutshell, if an adult finds themselves reduced to using violence against children, they have already lost all authority and respect they might have had.
It has also been scientifically proven that motivating children through violence is counter-productive.
In the bigger picture, encouraging violence against Buddhist monks, whether they are children or adults, is utterly in contradiction to all Buddhist (and spiritual) teaching.
PY says violence against child-monks is correct and to be encouraged, in order to make his students feel that when he is violent with them, it is correct and to be expected. PY justifies his violence against his own students, and makes his students feel that PY's violence is correct, and useful.
4. If you want to know what real, recognised and endorsed by proper authorities think of Peter Young’s methods of teaching martial arts, and the way PY abuses his students, please contact Master Lam Kam Chuen.
Master Lam is originally from Hong Kong, as was PY.
Master Lam has known, and known of, Peter Young for many years.
Master Lam is very clear about the destructive outsomes of PY's methods.
(http://www.lamkamchuen.com/lamkamchuen.com/News_%26_Events/News_%26_Events.html)
1. PY teaches that fear is the opposite of hope.
The Dalai Lama says that hope is very important.
So do all other authentic spiritual authorities.
PY teaches his students to therefore abandon hope if they wish to free themselves from fear.
PY does this deliberately to depress the emotional and mental states of his students, to rob them of any sense of a better future for themselves.
Because it is based on lies, this method, of course, never works. It just gives PY more and more control over his students as they sink into depression.
In addition, it is agreed by everyone that fear is actually the opposite of love.
The opposite of hope is actually despair.
PY teaches his students to despair of everything in the past, present and the future, so that he can then present himself as their only salvation.
PY teaches his students that if they still feel fear (which he deliberately inflicts on them at every opportunity), then they should work even harder to abandon all hope.
As mentioned previously PY uses fear, and is driven by fear, because he does not know what love is, and is incapable of inspiring love in anyone.
This is why he teaches that fear is the opposite of hope. If his students realised that fear is the opposite of love, then they would quickly realise PY is actually treating them with the opposite of love.
2. PY teaches that human rights do not exist.
The Dalai Lama says that human rights are very important.
PY teaches this to give his students the impression that they do not have any human rights, which enables PY to treat them as less than human.
PY does this so that when he abuses his students, they feel that is it not a bad thing, that they deserve it, and most importantly that any sense his students might have that being abused should not be tolerated, is an illusion.
If human rights do not exist, then what rights could his students claim to have not to be abused?
3. PY teaches that violence against children is correct and should be encouraged.
I (and many other students) witnessed him endorsing violence against child-monks at Namdroling monastery.
I witnessed Penor Rinpoche (PR) asking his monks to stop using violence as a form of discipline against the child-monks. PR did this several times.
(It is well known that there is an a very sad, culturally driven, tendency in many Buddhist monasteries in India and Tibet to resort to violence as a means of discipline. The Dalai Lama speaks often about one of his tutors who used violence against him when he was a child).
PY specifically and repeatedly contradicted PR, saying violence was necessary.
PY openly stated that PR didn't know what he was talking about.
For PY to contradict the direct teaching, and instruction, of PR shows the lack of sincerity PY has for the person he claims was his root guru.
Additionally, all educators and experts in child behaviour say that, in a nutshell, if an adult finds themselves reduced to using violence against children, they have already lost all authority and respect they might have had.
It has also been scientifically proven that motivating children through violence is counter-productive.
In the bigger picture, encouraging violence against Buddhist monks, whether they are children or adults, is utterly in contradiction to all Buddhist (and spiritual) teaching.
PY says violence against child-monks is correct and to be encouraged, in order to make his students feel that when he is violent with them, it is correct and to be expected. PY justifies his violence against his own students, and makes his students feel that PY's violence is correct, and useful.
4. If you want to know what real, recognised and endorsed by proper authorities think of Peter Young’s methods of teaching martial arts, and the way PY abuses his students, please contact Master Lam Kam Chuen.
Master Lam is originally from Hong Kong, as was PY.
Master Lam has known, and known of, Peter Young for many years.
Master Lam is very clear about the destructive outsomes of PY's methods.
(http://www.lamkamchuen.com/lamkamchuen.com/News_%26_Events/News_%26_Events.html)
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by:
Dondrup is powerhungry imposter
()
Date: June 06, 2018 09:48PM
Keep talking
Keep talking...
In so glad you are doing so.
I am being continuously assaulted in my energy field..
some kind of black magic or astral travel and abuse they are doing. Maybe voodoo.
But anyway, them extracting my life-force from me. Fucking assholes.
I need a fucking withdoctor this is crazy.
This man should be burned for his withcraft.
Its costing me to miss many appointments and to fail with inportant things.
Which i think his aim is. wants to destroy my potential, as i have gained good results in past times, this he is viciously trying to take away from me.
This is their daily practice about.
At least his..
When have you last contacted namdroling Monastary about PY may i ask?
I have contacted them about 7-8 times, and have no response!..
To me it seems like they are either in a state of denial-ignorance, or afraid of this dude! What could it be?
I am STILL suffering from continuous attack.
And objective is to DRAIN my energy!
It seems a very very dark practice, as my energy-field is totally fucking PIERCED!
this is the kind of “Compassion” that the man practices....
My lord. I need a fucking excorcist.
Excuse me my language.
But this is só só frustrating!
Keep talking...
In so glad you are doing so.
I am being continuously assaulted in my energy field..
some kind of black magic or astral travel and abuse they are doing. Maybe voodoo.
But anyway, them extracting my life-force from me. Fucking assholes.
I need a fucking withdoctor this is crazy.
This man should be burned for his withcraft.
Its costing me to miss many appointments and to fail with inportant things.
Which i think his aim is. wants to destroy my potential, as i have gained good results in past times, this he is viciously trying to take away from me.
This is their daily practice about.
At least his..
When have you last contacted namdroling Monastary about PY may i ask?
I have contacted them about 7-8 times, and have no response!..
To me it seems like they are either in a state of denial-ignorance, or afraid of this dude! What could it be?
I am STILL suffering from continuous attack.
And objective is to DRAIN my energy!
It seems a very very dark practice, as my energy-field is totally fucking PIERCED!
this is the kind of “Compassion” that the man practices....
My lord. I need a fucking excorcist.
Excuse me my language.
But this is só só frustrating!
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by:
anon27
()
Date: June 06, 2018 11:00PM
Hi dear Friend,
I do understand you, and your frustration.
Yes, the reason I am putting more information on the web is to help you and everyone else who has been damaged by Peter Young.
I'm glad it's helping.
Namdroling:
The Buddhist hierarchy are proven to be totally unwilling to self-police.
This is partly cultural, and partly self-interest.
There are many proven cases where so-called teachers, even well established and connected ones, have been allowed to act in very bad ways for a very long time (Sogyal is just one recent example).
The fact that Namdroling is not responding is actually a sign that they do NOT recognise, and do NOT endorse Peter Young.
If they did recognise him, or wish to defend him, they would respond.
By saying nothing, they are saying you are correct.
This is a Tibetan way of doing things.
They have not yet grown culturally enough to understand that self-policing is required. It will come in time.
The attacks you feel:
1. Getting and wearing a dzi stone is the traditional Tibetan way of defending yourself from energy attacks.
They are said to be a very powerful defensive measure.
(You can find them on the web)
2. You may wish to find a real Tibetan Buddhist Geshe and talk to them about what's going on. They may be willing to do a Tsog offering for you.
You will have to be calm and respectful, like you are going to a doctor, or they will get scared.
3. At least part of what you are feeling is PTSD, it is not psychic attack.
Find a trauma recovery specialist, and follow their advice.
It will help much more than you can believe right now.
Trust me on this.
Do it as soon as possible.
4. As Corboy says, also get a medical check up.
The stress you've been through may have upset balances in your body.
Addressing these may also make you feel a lot better than you can believe right now.
5. My strong advice is to avoid all witchdoctors and all similar people when trying to fix this problem.
The bottom line is we can't trust any of them.
They will use your current state of weakness to extract money from you.
6. I recognise that PY has developed certain abilites.
However, most of it is "stage magic" (NOT real); part of it is hypnotism; and part of it is psychological / social programming.
He is MUCH WEAKER than he makes himself out to be.
The bottom line is: By believing he has this power, you give him this power.
This is proven.
7. Read as much as you can about recovery from being in a cult.
There's good information on this website, in books and on the web.
You will find that what you are experiencing is very common.
It is 99% due to the emotional, psychological and spiritual damage and pain he has put you through.
Once you understand this, you will see that it is not "energy attacks" in the way you describe here.
It is an attack on your energy, yes, but he has already attacked you.
The damage has been done.
You now need to recover.
Now you are away from the cult, he can no longer attack you.
It's like he broke your leg, but you are only just realising.
You are finding you have difficultly walking now, so it feels like he is attacking you now.
No - your leg was broken whilst you were in the group, but you didn't notice.
You are noticing now, because you are walking free.
Do you understand how that works?
It is very important to understand this.
8. Something I've recently become aware of is that "spiritual damage" is very real.
This is something that can be healed, but you need to begin to heal the emotional and psychological damage first.
I have been surprised to find that the Christian tradition understand this very well. Find yourself a well-recognised, down to Earth, Christian priest, and talk with them about the spiritual abuse you've been through.
DO NOT seek an exorcist or something like that.
You don't need someone like that.
You need someone very down to earth, practical, well established, well reocognised and well thought of by everyone in their community.
Someone who gains their power through simply caring about others.
9. Eat well, and do exercise.
10. The more time you spend thinking about PY in this way, the more power he continues to have over you.
Change your focus.
It is difficult and takes time, because PY is expert at programming his victims.
It is possible, and you will amazed at how much better you feel.
This is part of the path of you regaining power over yourself.
You gave that power to PY when you were in the cult.
TAKE YOUR POWER BACK.
11. Read Rick Ross' book.
12. Read other people's experiences on this website about what they go through when they get out of cults.
You will find that everyone has similar experiences to what you are going through now - and that is from all sorts of cults, from all sorts of cult leaders, most of whom do not claim the psychic powers that PY claims.
This proves what you are experiencing is not due to PY continuing to attack you.
13. Stop focussing on the person who broke your leg.
Take action to heal your broken leg!
It's that simple, but I know it's very difficult to feel the truth of that right now.
Trust me, and trust the experience of others who have recovered from cult abuse.
This is the way to do it.
14. All cult leaders do their best to convince their victims they are more powerful than they are.
The effect of this is what you are experiencing right now.
It is a total lie.
PY is weak. Remember that.
He does NOT have the power to attack you in this way.
This is the truth of it.
The more you believe he does have that power, the more you will feel bad.
He has programmed you to believe he has that power.
You need to de-progam yourself.
There are people who can, and will, help you do this.
As you go through the de-progamming process, which you have started, you will find that it feels like he is attacking you, or trying to stop you de-programming yourself.
This is a good sign that the de-programming is working.
Cult leaders know how to program people in such a way that we feel bad when we clean ourselves of their programming.
They make their progamming "sticky", so when we clean ourselves, it resists, and pulls at our skin.
This is entirely psychological and emotional, nothing else - but, when you are going through it, it doesn't feel just psychological and emotional.
This is because cult leaders work on the subconscious.
Have faith that many of us have succeeded in freeing ourselves from cults, and have faith that your are strong enough to do this.
I know you are strong enough, because you got out.
The one's who are still there are the ones who are too weak to help themselves.
15. A big part of healing / freeing yourself is to recognise why you were attracted to PY in the first place. You must be very honest.
This is very difficult to admit to oneself, but is essential.
When you let go of that motivation, you will find you have made a huge leap forward.
With PY, most people he attracts want power.
He uses that to trap them.
I am thinking of you. Stay strong.
Be gentle with yourself.
I do understand you, and your frustration.
Yes, the reason I am putting more information on the web is to help you and everyone else who has been damaged by Peter Young.
I'm glad it's helping.
Namdroling:
The Buddhist hierarchy are proven to be totally unwilling to self-police.
This is partly cultural, and partly self-interest.
There are many proven cases where so-called teachers, even well established and connected ones, have been allowed to act in very bad ways for a very long time (Sogyal is just one recent example).
The fact that Namdroling is not responding is actually a sign that they do NOT recognise, and do NOT endorse Peter Young.
If they did recognise him, or wish to defend him, they would respond.
By saying nothing, they are saying you are correct.
This is a Tibetan way of doing things.
They have not yet grown culturally enough to understand that self-policing is required. It will come in time.
The attacks you feel:
1. Getting and wearing a dzi stone is the traditional Tibetan way of defending yourself from energy attacks.
They are said to be a very powerful defensive measure.
(You can find them on the web)
2. You may wish to find a real Tibetan Buddhist Geshe and talk to them about what's going on. They may be willing to do a Tsog offering for you.
You will have to be calm and respectful, like you are going to a doctor, or they will get scared.
3. At least part of what you are feeling is PTSD, it is not psychic attack.
Find a trauma recovery specialist, and follow their advice.
It will help much more than you can believe right now.
Trust me on this.
Do it as soon as possible.
4. As Corboy says, also get a medical check up.
The stress you've been through may have upset balances in your body.
Addressing these may also make you feel a lot better than you can believe right now.
5. My strong advice is to avoid all witchdoctors and all similar people when trying to fix this problem.
The bottom line is we can't trust any of them.
They will use your current state of weakness to extract money from you.
6. I recognise that PY has developed certain abilites.
However, most of it is "stage magic" (NOT real); part of it is hypnotism; and part of it is psychological / social programming.
He is MUCH WEAKER than he makes himself out to be.
The bottom line is: By believing he has this power, you give him this power.
This is proven.
7. Read as much as you can about recovery from being in a cult.
There's good information on this website, in books and on the web.
You will find that what you are experiencing is very common.
It is 99% due to the emotional, psychological and spiritual damage and pain he has put you through.
Once you understand this, you will see that it is not "energy attacks" in the way you describe here.
It is an attack on your energy, yes, but he has already attacked you.
The damage has been done.
You now need to recover.
Now you are away from the cult, he can no longer attack you.
It's like he broke your leg, but you are only just realising.
You are finding you have difficultly walking now, so it feels like he is attacking you now.
No - your leg was broken whilst you were in the group, but you didn't notice.
You are noticing now, because you are walking free.
Do you understand how that works?
It is very important to understand this.
8. Something I've recently become aware of is that "spiritual damage" is very real.
This is something that can be healed, but you need to begin to heal the emotional and psychological damage first.
I have been surprised to find that the Christian tradition understand this very well. Find yourself a well-recognised, down to Earth, Christian priest, and talk with them about the spiritual abuse you've been through.
DO NOT seek an exorcist or something like that.
You don't need someone like that.
You need someone very down to earth, practical, well established, well reocognised and well thought of by everyone in their community.
Someone who gains their power through simply caring about others.
9. Eat well, and do exercise.
10. The more time you spend thinking about PY in this way, the more power he continues to have over you.
Change your focus.
It is difficult and takes time, because PY is expert at programming his victims.
It is possible, and you will amazed at how much better you feel.
This is part of the path of you regaining power over yourself.
You gave that power to PY when you were in the cult.
TAKE YOUR POWER BACK.
11. Read Rick Ross' book.
12. Read other people's experiences on this website about what they go through when they get out of cults.
You will find that everyone has similar experiences to what you are going through now - and that is from all sorts of cults, from all sorts of cult leaders, most of whom do not claim the psychic powers that PY claims.
This proves what you are experiencing is not due to PY continuing to attack you.
13. Stop focussing on the person who broke your leg.
Take action to heal your broken leg!
It's that simple, but I know it's very difficult to feel the truth of that right now.
Trust me, and trust the experience of others who have recovered from cult abuse.
This is the way to do it.
14. All cult leaders do their best to convince their victims they are more powerful than they are.
The effect of this is what you are experiencing right now.
It is a total lie.
PY is weak. Remember that.
He does NOT have the power to attack you in this way.
This is the truth of it.
The more you believe he does have that power, the more you will feel bad.
He has programmed you to believe he has that power.
You need to de-progam yourself.
There are people who can, and will, help you do this.
As you go through the de-progamming process, which you have started, you will find that it feels like he is attacking you, or trying to stop you de-programming yourself.
This is a good sign that the de-programming is working.
Cult leaders know how to program people in such a way that we feel bad when we clean ourselves of their programming.
They make their progamming "sticky", so when we clean ourselves, it resists, and pulls at our skin.
This is entirely psychological and emotional, nothing else - but, when you are going through it, it doesn't feel just psychological and emotional.
This is because cult leaders work on the subconscious.
Have faith that many of us have succeeded in freeing ourselves from cults, and have faith that your are strong enough to do this.
I know you are strong enough, because you got out.
The one's who are still there are the ones who are too weak to help themselves.
15. A big part of healing / freeing yourself is to recognise why you were attracted to PY in the first place. You must be very honest.
This is very difficult to admit to oneself, but is essential.
When you let go of that motivation, you will find you have made a huge leap forward.
With PY, most people he attracts want power.
He uses that to trap them.
I am thinking of you. Stay strong.
Be gentle with yourself.
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: June 07, 2018 10:55AM
Small suggestion:
When you get a medical check up, tell your physician what you've
been through and name your abuser.
Make it clear others have been harmed, are scared to speak out
and some report feeling terrified and suicidal.
If more of us describe this to physicians, dentists and other health care providers this educates them.
A battering relationship is a battering relationship, whether its an abusive
parent, partner, horrid boss -- and especially if it is a cult as described here.
Cults always begin with lies.
If PY had told you at the very beginning, this is how you will feel after X years of trusting me as your leader -- none of you would have become involved with him.
The glory and danger of being human is we adapt to and can normalize anything if we remain in a situation long enough.
This has enabled our ancestors to survive disasters - war, conquest, the terror of repeated bubonic plague and smallpox epidemics century upon century and not giving up.
And this same resilience and adaptability is used against us very cleverly, by cult leaders, tricking us to enter band situations and continue remaining in those situations by making it difficult for us to quit -- this is what is termed
increasing the exit costs.
Result is we stay in bad situations long enough to get used to ever increasing increments of abusive behavior from the leader.
Note: that same adaptability enables students to adjust to the ordeal of medical school and law school and emerge as physicians and attorneys; it enables others to adjust to the ordeal of military training and become combat ready.
And cult leaders knowingly use this adaptability against us.
You've not married PY you've not engaged to marry him, you have the right to end the relationship without him issuing threats or worse.
We actually forget we have rights.
Basic human rights - whether from God or if we are secular as defined by the United Nations or the laws of our country.
Customer/consumer rights. If you pay PY you have the right to get quality service in return
The right to change your mind
When you get a medical check up, tell your physician what you've
been through and name your abuser.
Make it clear others have been harmed, are scared to speak out
and some report feeling terrified and suicidal.
If more of us describe this to physicians, dentists and other health care providers this educates them.
A battering relationship is a battering relationship, whether its an abusive
parent, partner, horrid boss -- and especially if it is a cult as described here.
Cults always begin with lies.
If PY had told you at the very beginning, this is how you will feel after X years of trusting me as your leader -- none of you would have become involved with him.
The glory and danger of being human is we adapt to and can normalize anything if we remain in a situation long enough.
This has enabled our ancestors to survive disasters - war, conquest, the terror of repeated bubonic plague and smallpox epidemics century upon century and not giving up.
And this same resilience and adaptability is used against us very cleverly, by cult leaders, tricking us to enter band situations and continue remaining in those situations by making it difficult for us to quit -- this is what is termed
increasing the exit costs.
Result is we stay in bad situations long enough to get used to ever increasing increments of abusive behavior from the leader.
Note: that same adaptability enables students to adjust to the ordeal of medical school and law school and emerge as physicians and attorneys; it enables others to adjust to the ordeal of military training and become combat ready.
And cult leaders knowingly use this adaptability against us.
You've not married PY you've not engaged to marry him, you have the right to end the relationship without him issuing threats or worse.
We actually forget we have rights.
Basic human rights - whether from God or if we are secular as defined by the United Nations or the laws of our country.
Customer/consumer rights. If you pay PY you have the right to get quality service in return
The right to change your mind
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by:
Rinpochehelpedme
()
Date: June 14, 2018 12:03AM
Hi,
I'm a previous student of PY but I have to say I feel very sad that you have had a
bad experience as I never did and would like to stand up for him in case other people miss the opportunity to meet him because of this forum.
I met Rinpoche, when he went by the name Sifu about 15 years ago. By the sounds of it he has stayed true to his personality, which is kind of like a drill sergeant.
I believe there are many different types of teachers out there to suit the personalities of the students.
All I can do is give my account with him, which is this (I will refer to him as Rinpoche as a sign of respect):
I came to him, very broken, from a life of abuse and I was only making it worse for myself. I remember crying to him when I first met him saying I was scared of where I would end up when I died as I had done so many bad things. True to his word he told me to stick with him and he would help me. And he did. He taught me about energy, he taught me about buddhism. He showed me kindness and compassion which is what buddhism is about. I eventually moved out of the country and whenever I have needed him, I have emailed pathgate, always got an answer and always got advice. Of course Rinpoche tried to encourage me to stick around and become a nun as that would have fast tracked my spiritual journey but that is not what I wanted, I mean I did want to fast track but I wanted a family some day. But he didn't stop contact with me afterwards and was always there, even when I was only attending 1 teaching a year for example. I messaged pathgate last week actually asking for advice, and got excellent advice back within 2 days which has helped a lot.
I have been alone with Rinpoche before, and he was lovely and caring and actually professional as his position as a teacher. '
Now - Has he shouted? Yes, many times, that's his thing I think, but it's not abusive as far as I remember. I've had him shouting down the phone at me before where I was shaking with adrenaline, shitting myself, but when I saw him after he was lovely to me. I saw it as when a parent see's their child heading for danger, what do they do? They get that childs attention. He never hit me, hurt me, stole from me, he did nothing but help me.
I am not saying that the experience you had with him was not real, it was your own but I just want to say that it was not my experience. The tools he gave me all those years ago helped me to the point that I now live in a beautiful part of the world, I feel very much at peace, obv not all the time but it's a work in progress and I have a very comfortable life most of the time.
Yes Rinpoche started taking donations, maybe now he charges, I don't know but you go to eckhart tolle, or tony robinson or any of the spiritual workshops and you will pay money. OF course it sucks to pay money when it comes to spiritualism BUT he's teaching all the time so he can't do it for free. As for how much he charges, I never experienced this, so I can't comment.
As for violent against kids, that is shocking, can you back that up? Were you there? Did you see him lay a hand on a child? I find that difficult to imagine as i've seen him around kids and he is very playful! That's not to say it didn't happen but again, I have never seen him do this.
Again, all I can write about is my experience. Is pathgate a cult? I don't know, maybe it is, but no more than any other organised religion. You can leave, you can come and go, that was my experience.
I really think that you either understand what his aim is or just don't go to his teachings, no one is forcing you. I've had times when I didn't want to go so I didn't, I just waited until I was ready again, and then went, I was never turned away.
If someone is reading this who is unsure if they want to go, I would say, go and if you don't like it, then just don't go back lol.
I don't understand all this talk of enlightened and power hungry etc, I went to him for Buddhist teachings, and that's what I got, and those teachings helped for the last 15 years. If you go to him, it's for a personal journey, not to get caught up in what you think he is or is not, just go there for the answers you are looking for, if you don't find them, then keep looking in your life. Simple as.
I honestly found the whole Newcastle experience totally mind blowing, full on and life changing. It's not for everyone, don't expect to go there and feel great about yourself straight after LOL, that's not what he's for. I left Newcastle feeling like a totally shit person, but I was! I was a horrible person to everyone around me. But it was because Rinpoche was so good to me that I never forgot what he was trying to teach me and as a result turned my life around. There are some people who learn by being cuddled and told how wonderful they are but I was not one of those, I met people who tried to do that with me and I walked all over them, I needed someone like Rinpoche to not take any of my shit and just say "hey, you're being an asshole to people, here's how you can stop" xD
You want to say i'm brainwashed then that's your choice, but i'll tell you, i'm a single mum, with a good relationship to my sons dad, i'm living abroad and I feel very strong and I owe a lot of that to Rinpoche.
I'm a previous student of PY but I have to say I feel very sad that you have had a
bad experience as I never did and would like to stand up for him in case other people miss the opportunity to meet him because of this forum.
I met Rinpoche, when he went by the name Sifu about 15 years ago. By the sounds of it he has stayed true to his personality, which is kind of like a drill sergeant.
I believe there are many different types of teachers out there to suit the personalities of the students.
All I can do is give my account with him, which is this (I will refer to him as Rinpoche as a sign of respect):
I came to him, very broken, from a life of abuse and I was only making it worse for myself. I remember crying to him when I first met him saying I was scared of where I would end up when I died as I had done so many bad things. True to his word he told me to stick with him and he would help me. And he did. He taught me about energy, he taught me about buddhism. He showed me kindness and compassion which is what buddhism is about. I eventually moved out of the country and whenever I have needed him, I have emailed pathgate, always got an answer and always got advice. Of course Rinpoche tried to encourage me to stick around and become a nun as that would have fast tracked my spiritual journey but that is not what I wanted, I mean I did want to fast track but I wanted a family some day. But he didn't stop contact with me afterwards and was always there, even when I was only attending 1 teaching a year for example. I messaged pathgate last week actually asking for advice, and got excellent advice back within 2 days which has helped a lot.
I have been alone with Rinpoche before, and he was lovely and caring and actually professional as his position as a teacher. '
Now - Has he shouted? Yes, many times, that's his thing I think, but it's not abusive as far as I remember. I've had him shouting down the phone at me before where I was shaking with adrenaline, shitting myself, but when I saw him after he was lovely to me. I saw it as when a parent see's their child heading for danger, what do they do? They get that childs attention. He never hit me, hurt me, stole from me, he did nothing but help me.
I am not saying that the experience you had with him was not real, it was your own but I just want to say that it was not my experience. The tools he gave me all those years ago helped me to the point that I now live in a beautiful part of the world, I feel very much at peace, obv not all the time but it's a work in progress and I have a very comfortable life most of the time.
Yes Rinpoche started taking donations, maybe now he charges, I don't know but you go to eckhart tolle, or tony robinson or any of the spiritual workshops and you will pay money. OF course it sucks to pay money when it comes to spiritualism BUT he's teaching all the time so he can't do it for free. As for how much he charges, I never experienced this, so I can't comment.
As for violent against kids, that is shocking, can you back that up? Were you there? Did you see him lay a hand on a child? I find that difficult to imagine as i've seen him around kids and he is very playful! That's not to say it didn't happen but again, I have never seen him do this.
Again, all I can write about is my experience. Is pathgate a cult? I don't know, maybe it is, but no more than any other organised religion. You can leave, you can come and go, that was my experience.
I really think that you either understand what his aim is or just don't go to his teachings, no one is forcing you. I've had times when I didn't want to go so I didn't, I just waited until I was ready again, and then went, I was never turned away.
If someone is reading this who is unsure if they want to go, I would say, go and if you don't like it, then just don't go back lol.
I don't understand all this talk of enlightened and power hungry etc, I went to him for Buddhist teachings, and that's what I got, and those teachings helped for the last 15 years. If you go to him, it's for a personal journey, not to get caught up in what you think he is or is not, just go there for the answers you are looking for, if you don't find them, then keep looking in your life. Simple as.
I honestly found the whole Newcastle experience totally mind blowing, full on and life changing. It's not for everyone, don't expect to go there and feel great about yourself straight after LOL, that's not what he's for. I left Newcastle feeling like a totally shit person, but I was! I was a horrible person to everyone around me. But it was because Rinpoche was so good to me that I never forgot what he was trying to teach me and as a result turned my life around. There are some people who learn by being cuddled and told how wonderful they are but I was not one of those, I met people who tried to do that with me and I walked all over them, I needed someone like Rinpoche to not take any of my shit and just say "hey, you're being an asshole to people, here's how you can stop" xD
You want to say i'm brainwashed then that's your choice, but i'll tell you, i'm a single mum, with a good relationship to my sons dad, i'm living abroad and I feel very strong and I owe a lot of that to Rinpoche.
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by:
anon27
()
Date: June 15, 2018 02:23AM
Hi,
First off, I totally respect your journey, and the part you feel Peter Young played in it.
Overall, I think there’s a few things that are important to note, because I agree with much of what you say, but see it in a different context:
1. Drill sergeants behave the way they do in order to program their soldiers into certain behaviours.
Teachers behave differently, because they are looking to educate.
This is objective fact.
2. Peter Young’s openly aggressive tendencies, that you note several times, are also clear proof of his profound misunderstanding of Buddhism.
The Buddhist way sometimes does require sharpness, but it is done in private, and it is done very rarely. In Buddhism, attacking students in the way Peter Young does is a sign of very low teaching ability, or of personal issues, exactly as it has been found to be by western pedagogical scientific analysis.
The Dalai Lama is also very clear about this.
3. Yes, some people need this kind of kick in the backside at some point in their lives.
If Peter Young was presenting himself as some kind of shock-therapist for addiction / trauma recovery, I wouldn’t have a problem.
However, he presents himself as a fully realised master of all forms of Buddhism, and other esoteric arts, and therefore worthy of life-long devotion.
The problem is, because he presents himself as a fully realised guru rather than shock-therapist, he never stops kicking people.
This is precisely where short-term shock-therapy turns into a lifetime of abuse. This is where a mentor turns into a tormentor.
4. As you note, there’s not much difference between the few useful things Peter Young does, and what can be found on YouTube with Tony Robinson or Tolle, or many others, however:
(a) An important difference is Robinson, and those like him, refuse the label of guru, and refuse being worshipped.
Peter Young makes his students believe he is a fully realised master, and that the only thing they need to do to reach enlightenment is devote themselves utterly to pleasing him. He teaches them that he is not just a guru, but THE guru, a mega-guru as spoken of in the anicent stories.
He teaches them that the only reason they are not already enlightened, or just about to be, is because their devotion to him is not absolute enough.
(b) An important difference is Tolle, and those like him, don’t claim to be teaching by authorisation of a properly lineaged system. It’s their own system they are promoting.
Peter Young claims lineage from Palyul and Nyingma, yet both organisations refuse to acknowledge him. He uses this affiliation to lend an air of credibility to his business of exploiting people.
5. Peter Young was given an honorary Lama degree.
I doubt even he would claim to have followed the official study program, because it’d be easy to prove he didn’t, and he believes he doesn’t need to.
The reality is therefore that he isn’t qualified to be doing what he says he is doing. He has awarded himself the ability to teach Tibetan Buddhism.
He says he teaches at the highest levels, the most profound truths, in the clearest possible ways.
This objective measure of the man’s hypocrisy should give anyone pause for thought.
This lack of real qualification shows itself in many other ways:
(a) No practitioner of the path of Tibetan Buddhism would have to do this: “I've had him shouting down the phone at me before where I was shaking with adrenaline, shitting myself ...”.
There are other, much more effective, methods available to properly qualified Lamas.
(b) No practitioner of the path of Tibetan Buddhism would have reduced you to this: “I left Newcastle feeling like a totally shit person”.
Doctor Robert Thurman (recognised around the world and directly by the Dalai Lama as an expert in theory and practice of Buddhism, for about 50 years now) says the fundamental point of Buddhism is to that recognise we, as people, are worthwhile. This recognition then spreads to our appreciation of others. This is the essential foundation understanding.
Without this real sense of self-worth, nothing in Buddhism can be understood or practiced.
It's why they talk so much about "precious human rebirth". It's not to guilt people into practicing (as Peter Young teaches), it's to get us to understand how valueable we are!
Peter Young’s “destroy the person and their problems are also destroyed” method is very clumsy, and proven to be less effective than the Buddhist method of building a person up.
The “build up” method also happens to be the one recognised by western science as the most effective for most people.
Amongst other negatives, the “smash them down” method is recognised to be an almost guaranteed pre-cursor to dependency.
That's why soldiers will kill or die when told to by their sergeants.
That’s why people find they need to keep going back to Peter Young, exactly as you say you do. He deliberately builds dependency.
Additionally, being very nasty then very nice is a classic tool used by cult leaders to indoctrinate their followers into accepting higher and higher levels of abuse over time.
This is proven, objective fact.
The susceptability a human has to being manipluted in this way is also recognised in Stockholm syndrome.
Needless to say, applying such methods is against Buddha’s teaching, and Tibetan Buddhism, because the teacher is supppsed to be freeing the student.
(c) Peter Young teaches the 4 Noble Truths incorrectly.
His version is one we find in a lot of books, but it is wrong. Again Dr Thurman is very clear about this.
I have sympathy for most teachers in the West who have received the words of the Buddha wrongly translated, but Peter Young presents himself as a fully realised master of many (if not all) aspects of Buddhism, including the most esoteric.
This is a key claim, because otherwise his clearly despotic behaviour cannot be justified.
But here's the thing: How can a fully realised master get the most basic teaching so totally wrong?
A fully realised master would have got the correct translation – especially since it’s available with only a little digging.
Dr Thurman’s even on YouTube giving the real translations.
And then: How could a fully realised master have achieved full realisation if his understanding of the most basic teaching is totally wrong?
He couldn't.
Therefore his lack of qualification to be doing what he says he is doing is very clear.
6. About his attitude towards children:
I saw and heard him say, repeatedly and clearly, that he supported violence against the child-monks.
Many others were there and witnessed this too, including some of his current students. The inference that he would not hesitate to use violence against us was clear.
You yourself note that he becomes aggressive whenever he decides it’s appropriate – that it’s part of his personality.
You can easily see then how this part of his personality carries over onto children, and his own students, whenever he decides aggression is justified.
7. That he wanted you to become a nun, so opened the door to you, is NOT the way it is done.
It is what I have seen him do to many of his students. He does it to trap them into becoming his long-term worshippers.
(a) In every tradition, the desire to become a monk or nun should arise in the person.
It is not the teacher’s place to introduce the idea, or give any indication of support or non-support, before the person is 100% sure in themselves they want to do it. The Christians call it “a calling” for good reason. It doesn’t come from the Lama, ever.
That Peter Young usurps this common sense and always adhered to tradition is a clear warning sign. Many “teachers” in the East use this method to trap students. This is the only reason it is ever done. It is very effective.
(b) Since Peter Young is not a qualified Lama, one wonders by what authority he ordains monks and nuns?
Did he clearly explain to you what lineage and authority he was inviting you to be ordained into? Did he discuss with you what options you had with vows, lineages, practices and progression?
By not talking with you about these, very real, totally normal, things, do you see that even putting that option in front of you was done in a fake way?
The Buddhist religious / academic is very well established, and vast. Becoming a monk or nun should open access to a whole new world of teachers and places. Buddhist monks and nuns choose what lineage to go into, they travel, and they have multiple teachers. If they do not, there is something very wrong.
Peter Young forbids his students from seeking contact with other teachers, or even read books on Buddhism. He openly tells his students that they are so dumb that even if the other teacher said something useful (which in Peter Young’s view, they almost never do, because they are all inferior to him), the student would never understand it anyway.
Of course, the reason Peter Young forbids his students contact with other Lamas is that if they ever got more than a glimpse of real Buddhism, they would see this personality cult for what it is.
8. That he made you believe becoming a nun would fast track your spiritual journey is also another classic tactic he uses, and a good example of how he operates.
He trades people’s hunger for enlightenment or power to gain their total obedience.
He uses people’s ignorance against them.
For example: In Buddhism it is well known that being a monk or nun is NOT a fast track to enlightenment. In fact, the fast track is recognised by everyone as being: living in the world!
You thankfully weren’t that hungry for enlightenment – you had other things in your life.
Many have been caught by this empty promise.
I hope this helps you ensure you keep healthy boundaries, whatever you decide those boundaries to be.
First off, I totally respect your journey, and the part you feel Peter Young played in it.
Overall, I think there’s a few things that are important to note, because I agree with much of what you say, but see it in a different context:
1. Drill sergeants behave the way they do in order to program their soldiers into certain behaviours.
Teachers behave differently, because they are looking to educate.
This is objective fact.
2. Peter Young’s openly aggressive tendencies, that you note several times, are also clear proof of his profound misunderstanding of Buddhism.
The Buddhist way sometimes does require sharpness, but it is done in private, and it is done very rarely. In Buddhism, attacking students in the way Peter Young does is a sign of very low teaching ability, or of personal issues, exactly as it has been found to be by western pedagogical scientific analysis.
The Dalai Lama is also very clear about this.
3. Yes, some people need this kind of kick in the backside at some point in their lives.
If Peter Young was presenting himself as some kind of shock-therapist for addiction / trauma recovery, I wouldn’t have a problem.
However, he presents himself as a fully realised master of all forms of Buddhism, and other esoteric arts, and therefore worthy of life-long devotion.
The problem is, because he presents himself as a fully realised guru rather than shock-therapist, he never stops kicking people.
This is precisely where short-term shock-therapy turns into a lifetime of abuse. This is where a mentor turns into a tormentor.
4. As you note, there’s not much difference between the few useful things Peter Young does, and what can be found on YouTube with Tony Robinson or Tolle, or many others, however:
(a) An important difference is Robinson, and those like him, refuse the label of guru, and refuse being worshipped.
Peter Young makes his students believe he is a fully realised master, and that the only thing they need to do to reach enlightenment is devote themselves utterly to pleasing him. He teaches them that he is not just a guru, but THE guru, a mega-guru as spoken of in the anicent stories.
He teaches them that the only reason they are not already enlightened, or just about to be, is because their devotion to him is not absolute enough.
(b) An important difference is Tolle, and those like him, don’t claim to be teaching by authorisation of a properly lineaged system. It’s their own system they are promoting.
Peter Young claims lineage from Palyul and Nyingma, yet both organisations refuse to acknowledge him. He uses this affiliation to lend an air of credibility to his business of exploiting people.
5. Peter Young was given an honorary Lama degree.
I doubt even he would claim to have followed the official study program, because it’d be easy to prove he didn’t, and he believes he doesn’t need to.
The reality is therefore that he isn’t qualified to be doing what he says he is doing. He has awarded himself the ability to teach Tibetan Buddhism.
He says he teaches at the highest levels, the most profound truths, in the clearest possible ways.
This objective measure of the man’s hypocrisy should give anyone pause for thought.
This lack of real qualification shows itself in many other ways:
(a) No practitioner of the path of Tibetan Buddhism would have to do this: “I've had him shouting down the phone at me before where I was shaking with adrenaline, shitting myself ...”.
There are other, much more effective, methods available to properly qualified Lamas.
(b) No practitioner of the path of Tibetan Buddhism would have reduced you to this: “I left Newcastle feeling like a totally shit person”.
Doctor Robert Thurman (recognised around the world and directly by the Dalai Lama as an expert in theory and practice of Buddhism, for about 50 years now) says the fundamental point of Buddhism is to that recognise we, as people, are worthwhile. This recognition then spreads to our appreciation of others. This is the essential foundation understanding.
Without this real sense of self-worth, nothing in Buddhism can be understood or practiced.
It's why they talk so much about "precious human rebirth". It's not to guilt people into practicing (as Peter Young teaches), it's to get us to understand how valueable we are!
Peter Young’s “destroy the person and their problems are also destroyed” method is very clumsy, and proven to be less effective than the Buddhist method of building a person up.
The “build up” method also happens to be the one recognised by western science as the most effective for most people.
Amongst other negatives, the “smash them down” method is recognised to be an almost guaranteed pre-cursor to dependency.
That's why soldiers will kill or die when told to by their sergeants.
That’s why people find they need to keep going back to Peter Young, exactly as you say you do. He deliberately builds dependency.
Additionally, being very nasty then very nice is a classic tool used by cult leaders to indoctrinate their followers into accepting higher and higher levels of abuse over time.
This is proven, objective fact.
The susceptability a human has to being manipluted in this way is also recognised in Stockholm syndrome.
Needless to say, applying such methods is against Buddha’s teaching, and Tibetan Buddhism, because the teacher is supppsed to be freeing the student.
(c) Peter Young teaches the 4 Noble Truths incorrectly.
His version is one we find in a lot of books, but it is wrong. Again Dr Thurman is very clear about this.
I have sympathy for most teachers in the West who have received the words of the Buddha wrongly translated, but Peter Young presents himself as a fully realised master of many (if not all) aspects of Buddhism, including the most esoteric.
This is a key claim, because otherwise his clearly despotic behaviour cannot be justified.
But here's the thing: How can a fully realised master get the most basic teaching so totally wrong?
A fully realised master would have got the correct translation – especially since it’s available with only a little digging.
Dr Thurman’s even on YouTube giving the real translations.
And then: How could a fully realised master have achieved full realisation if his understanding of the most basic teaching is totally wrong?
He couldn't.
Therefore his lack of qualification to be doing what he says he is doing is very clear.
6. About his attitude towards children:
I saw and heard him say, repeatedly and clearly, that he supported violence against the child-monks.
Many others were there and witnessed this too, including some of his current students. The inference that he would not hesitate to use violence against us was clear.
You yourself note that he becomes aggressive whenever he decides it’s appropriate – that it’s part of his personality.
You can easily see then how this part of his personality carries over onto children, and his own students, whenever he decides aggression is justified.
7. That he wanted you to become a nun, so opened the door to you, is NOT the way it is done.
It is what I have seen him do to many of his students. He does it to trap them into becoming his long-term worshippers.
(a) In every tradition, the desire to become a monk or nun should arise in the person.
It is not the teacher’s place to introduce the idea, or give any indication of support or non-support, before the person is 100% sure in themselves they want to do it. The Christians call it “a calling” for good reason. It doesn’t come from the Lama, ever.
That Peter Young usurps this common sense and always adhered to tradition is a clear warning sign. Many “teachers” in the East use this method to trap students. This is the only reason it is ever done. It is very effective.
(b) Since Peter Young is not a qualified Lama, one wonders by what authority he ordains monks and nuns?
Did he clearly explain to you what lineage and authority he was inviting you to be ordained into? Did he discuss with you what options you had with vows, lineages, practices and progression?
By not talking with you about these, very real, totally normal, things, do you see that even putting that option in front of you was done in a fake way?
The Buddhist religious / academic is very well established, and vast. Becoming a monk or nun should open access to a whole new world of teachers and places. Buddhist monks and nuns choose what lineage to go into, they travel, and they have multiple teachers. If they do not, there is something very wrong.
Peter Young forbids his students from seeking contact with other teachers, or even read books on Buddhism. He openly tells his students that they are so dumb that even if the other teacher said something useful (which in Peter Young’s view, they almost never do, because they are all inferior to him), the student would never understand it anyway.
Of course, the reason Peter Young forbids his students contact with other Lamas is that if they ever got more than a glimpse of real Buddhism, they would see this personality cult for what it is.
8. That he made you believe becoming a nun would fast track your spiritual journey is also another classic tactic he uses, and a good example of how he operates.
He trades people’s hunger for enlightenment or power to gain their total obedience.
He uses people’s ignorance against them.
For example: In Buddhism it is well known that being a monk or nun is NOT a fast track to enlightenment. In fact, the fast track is recognised by everyone as being: living in the world!
You thankfully weren’t that hungry for enlightenment – you had other things in your life.
Many have been caught by this empty promise.
I hope this helps you ensure you keep healthy boundaries, whatever you decide those boundaries to be.
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by:
anon27
()
Date: June 15, 2018 04:19AM
The final point I thought was worth raising is Peter Young’s use of the title “Rinpoche”.
Peter Young will say he doesn’t use it, that it is his students who insist on calling him that, in exactly the way you do here.
The thing is, by allowing, and passively encouraging (which I’ve seen him do), his students to call him Rinpoche, he is once again proving his lack of respect for, and understanding of, Tibetan Buddhism.
In Tibetan Buddhism, Rinpoche means something more than the translation “Precious one”.
An idea of its meaning in Christian terms would be “cardinal”. The title is always and only bestowed by higher authorities. It is like “Tulku” in many respects. One cannot announce oneself a Tulku, only recognised authorities can do so. Having written evidence of being recognised as such is entirely the norm, and has been for centuries.
For this reason, and unless he can produce evidence to back it up, he shouldn't be allowing you to call him that.
“Rinpoche” is also not an honorific students can bestow out of respect or affection.
In Tibetan Buddhist culture, students do not have the right to bestow this title.
It would be like a congregation of a village church starting to call their local vicar “cardinal”.
Peter Young knows this very well.
That Peter Young allows his students to do this is damaging, because it reduces the value of the office, and gives him status he has not earned.
When you hear of a real Rinpoche, you will think they are like Peter Young. They are not.
Simply on the practical level of studies undertaken and authority awarded by objective hierarchies, they are far more than he is.
In the Tibetan Buddhist system they are also thought to have special status, similar to Tulkus.
When others hear Peter Young is known as a Rinpoche, they will ascribe to him all sorts of authority and recognition he does not have.
People will also assume a level of accountability that Peter Young does not operate within. Rinpoches are held very closely accountable to their hierarchies, their lineages and often responsible for entire monasteries of people. Calling him Rinpoche means, certainly within Eastern cultures, people will assume that a certain level of external assurance has been applied to Peter Young. It simply has not been.
It should also be noted that one of Peter Young’s Western students told me that they started to call him Rinpoche only after students from Eastern cultures joined the group, and were calling him that.
The Westerners felt they would be seen to be showing less respect than the Easterners if they didn’t start calling him that too, because it is one of the highest titles around.
It didn’t arise out of joyful overwhelming feelings of admiration.
However, to truly understand this, we need to understand something about the reality in Eastern cultures:
Because “Rinpoche” (like cardinal) indicates very high social status, there is a big temptation to ascribe the title to one’s teacher.
It’s the difference between having the local priest or a cardinal as one’s spiritual director, if one was Roman Catholic, and lived in a Roman Catholic country.
In the East, Lamas are very common. However, in those cultures, if one can say one’s teacher is a “Rinpoche”, then there’s an immediate increase in status that has real-world impacts.
It’s virtue-signalling (and self-reassurance), as a Rinpoche would only pick top students to work with.
It’s also a message about influence: direct access to a Rinpoche means the person will likely have other high-level connections.
In the East, these things are super important.
So, how much self-interest there was in this, should be carefully considered.
The bottom line is that it’s actually disrespecting Tibetan Buddhism to call Peter Young Rinpoche.
Whether that’s culturally relevant in the West, or not, can be debated.
What can’t be debated is that if he was who he says he is, then he wouldn’t allow you to call him Rinpoche.
He knows it's not a title he can accept without betraying some fundamental, if invisible to most people, rules.
In the same way, if he was who he says he is, he simply couldn’t advocate violence, or use aggression as much as he does.
These facts expose a hypocrisy that cannot be denied.
He does claim plausible deniability, by saying his students call him Rinpoche of their own volition ... but is this really credible when he is so aggressively controlling in every other respect?
To me, it just reveals a deeper level of deception.
Objectively, that he allows his students to call him Rinpoche shows his need for external affirmation overrides his respect for the system he says he is part of.
This tendency becomes dangerous when allied to cult-building techniques.
Peter Young will say he doesn’t use it, that it is his students who insist on calling him that, in exactly the way you do here.
The thing is, by allowing, and passively encouraging (which I’ve seen him do), his students to call him Rinpoche, he is once again proving his lack of respect for, and understanding of, Tibetan Buddhism.
In Tibetan Buddhism, Rinpoche means something more than the translation “Precious one”.
An idea of its meaning in Christian terms would be “cardinal”. The title is always and only bestowed by higher authorities. It is like “Tulku” in many respects. One cannot announce oneself a Tulku, only recognised authorities can do so. Having written evidence of being recognised as such is entirely the norm, and has been for centuries.
For this reason, and unless he can produce evidence to back it up, he shouldn't be allowing you to call him that.
“Rinpoche” is also not an honorific students can bestow out of respect or affection.
In Tibetan Buddhist culture, students do not have the right to bestow this title.
It would be like a congregation of a village church starting to call their local vicar “cardinal”.
Peter Young knows this very well.
That Peter Young allows his students to do this is damaging, because it reduces the value of the office, and gives him status he has not earned.
When you hear of a real Rinpoche, you will think they are like Peter Young. They are not.
Simply on the practical level of studies undertaken and authority awarded by objective hierarchies, they are far more than he is.
In the Tibetan Buddhist system they are also thought to have special status, similar to Tulkus.
When others hear Peter Young is known as a Rinpoche, they will ascribe to him all sorts of authority and recognition he does not have.
People will also assume a level of accountability that Peter Young does not operate within. Rinpoches are held very closely accountable to their hierarchies, their lineages and often responsible for entire monasteries of people. Calling him Rinpoche means, certainly within Eastern cultures, people will assume that a certain level of external assurance has been applied to Peter Young. It simply has not been.
It should also be noted that one of Peter Young’s Western students told me that they started to call him Rinpoche only after students from Eastern cultures joined the group, and were calling him that.
The Westerners felt they would be seen to be showing less respect than the Easterners if they didn’t start calling him that too, because it is one of the highest titles around.
It didn’t arise out of joyful overwhelming feelings of admiration.
However, to truly understand this, we need to understand something about the reality in Eastern cultures:
Because “Rinpoche” (like cardinal) indicates very high social status, there is a big temptation to ascribe the title to one’s teacher.
It’s the difference between having the local priest or a cardinal as one’s spiritual director, if one was Roman Catholic, and lived in a Roman Catholic country.
In the East, Lamas are very common. However, in those cultures, if one can say one’s teacher is a “Rinpoche”, then there’s an immediate increase in status that has real-world impacts.
It’s virtue-signalling (and self-reassurance), as a Rinpoche would only pick top students to work with.
It’s also a message about influence: direct access to a Rinpoche means the person will likely have other high-level connections.
In the East, these things are super important.
So, how much self-interest there was in this, should be carefully considered.
The bottom line is that it’s actually disrespecting Tibetan Buddhism to call Peter Young Rinpoche.
Whether that’s culturally relevant in the West, or not, can be debated.
What can’t be debated is that if he was who he says he is, then he wouldn’t allow you to call him Rinpoche.
He knows it's not a title he can accept without betraying some fundamental, if invisible to most people, rules.
In the same way, if he was who he says he is, he simply couldn’t advocate violence, or use aggression as much as he does.
These facts expose a hypocrisy that cannot be denied.
He does claim plausible deniability, by saying his students call him Rinpoche of their own volition ... but is this really credible when he is so aggressively controlling in every other respect?
To me, it just reveals a deeper level of deception.
Objectively, that he allows his students to call him Rinpoche shows his need for external affirmation overrides his respect for the system he says he is part of.
This tendency becomes dangerous when allied to cult-building techniques.
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: June 15, 2018 07:11AM
On the previous page two persons identifying as former students of PY wrote:
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by: Dondrup is powerhungry imposter.
Date: May 28, 2018 12:05AM
and
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by: anon27
Date: June 01, 2018 07:58PM
In response,
Rinpochehelpme wrote: (quoted from above)
Just offering my two cents:
Several people have written saying they felt deeply harmed, to the point of having
suicidal thoughts.
"then just don't go back lol."
So, that is all one can say in response to these kinds of harm reports?
"lol"?
A very strange manifestation of bodhichitta, very strange, indeed.
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by: Dondrup is powerhungry imposter.
Date: May 28, 2018 12:05AM
Quote
I hope you are now completely free of his mindcontrol games! This people still chasing after me, EXACTLY! Feeling SUPERIOR!
CONSTANTLY amitofu’ing me, probably even REALLY THINK they are somehow helping me?
Even though they have COMPLETELY FUCKED UP my life since (around end) 2014 till YESTERDAY, and nearly caused me to go for suicide!
and
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by: anon27
Date: June 01, 2018 07:58PM
Quote
also doubt any of those who got out would even want to be contacted about this.
I'm pretty sure they're all still too shamed and scared, and just want to bury it.
Intuition tells me this, and the fact that I've seen so many people be shredded emotionally / mentally / spiritually by PY, yet there's nothing on the web apart from this forum where anyone has spoken up.
Even I still get unwarranted fear-feelings when talking about it.
Another aspect is, like "Dondrup is powerhungry imposter", I too was driven to near-suicide, and part of me is concerned that many of those who have left have actually gone and done it.
It wouldn't surprise me to learn that PY deliberately programs his victims to go towards suicide when they get out.
In response,
Rinpochehelpme wrote: (quoted from above)
Quote
If someone is reading this who is unsure if they want to go, I would say, go and if you don't like it, then just don't go back lol.
Just offering my two cents:
Several people have written saying they felt deeply harmed, to the point of having
suicidal thoughts.
"then just don't go back lol."
So, that is all one can say in response to these kinds of harm reports?
"lol"?
A very strange manifestation of bodhichitta, very strange, indeed.
Re: Lama dondrup Dorje / Peter Young FAKE
Posted by:
anon27
()
Date: June 15, 2018 10:21PM
Thanks Corboy, you raise a very important point.
The thing is, I don't hold "rinpochehelpedme" at fault there.
It is rather further evidence of the way Peter Young does not teach compassion.
Peter Young's need to inflict aggression and violence alongside his "care" is very clear from her description.
"but it's not abusive as far as I remember. I've had him shouting down the phone at me before where I was shaking with adrenaline, shitting myself,"
I hope this lady re-reads this several times, to see how it contradicts itself.
Sadly, this is typical of many cults.
I know for a fact that many of Peter Young's students have normalised his abusive behaviour to the point where shitting yourself and shaking with adrenaline - objective signs of intense fear - no longer mentally fit into the "abuse" category.
These sad statements show how a person can be made to openly contradict themselves, which means lie to themselves, without even realising, even about bad things that are being done to them.
Peter Young did that.
Peter Young says being abused by him is part of the process, exactly as she describes she felt was the case, and still feels is the case.
This cruel to be kind method is now completely debunked by Western science and psychology, and has always been rejected by Buddhism, because it is ineffective.
This method simply cannot lead to compassion (bodhiccita), because from it's very basis, it contains lack of compassion (cruelty).
I commend "rinpochehelpedme" for for her honesty, bravery, and open-mindedness.
This did make me think of a few other points that might be of interest:
“Now - Has he shouted? Yes, many times, that's his thing I think, but it's not abusive as far as I remember. I've had him shouting down the phone at me before where I was shaking with adrenaline, shitting myself, but when I saw him after he was lovely to me. I saw it as when a parent see's their child heading for danger, what do they do? They get that childs attention. “
This is what psychologists call “infantilisation”.
Peter Young puts adults into a frame of mind where they accept being treated like naughty children.
Peter Young even justifies this by using the same example this lady gives.
The bottom line true reality is: adults with real issues, or seekers on the path, are not naughty children.
Treating them as such is ineffective. Western mind sciences and Buddhism both agree on this.
The reason it is ineffective is that whatever disciplines or practices the person undertakes, they will continue to feel themselves to be a “naughty child” that is now doing well, but might act-up at any moment.
An effective method results in the person accepting that part of themselves that is a “naughty child”. In doing so, that “naughty child” transforms into a healthy adult version of itself.
The experience on the inside is completely different, and the effects of this method are permanent and totally positive.
This transformation is entirely possible without any aggression – in fact cannot work by aggression.
This is also not some esoteric hard to find method. In fact, any trauma recovery therapist of any school would recognise this method, because it boils down: to treat adults like adults.
The reason Peter Young and most cult leaders actively enforce infantilisation as their method, is that once an adult has accepted being treated like a child on one occasion, it is proven psychologically that the same adult is more easily treated like a child on a second occasion, and on a different subject. This leads straight to mind-control.
“The tools he gave me all those years ago helped me to the point that I now live in a beautiful part of the world, I feel very much at peace, obv not all the time but it's a work in progress and I have a very comfortable life most of the time.”
Here’s what I've found: The tools he gave you didn’t need to come with the shouting and aggression.
In fact, the shouting and aggression reduced their effectiveness.
You’ve developed, and overcome, but you would have done so with far less struggle, no need for continued “top ups”, and far faster, had you been taught those things by a truly authorised and properly trained person.
In some other ways, what he did was overwrite your existing abuse with new abuse.
I agree this seems to be effective in the short term, as the person becomes more scared of the new abuse than the old abuse, so the effects of the old abuse are painted over.
However, it is not truly effective. When the person loses their fear of the new abuser, the old patterns will re-emerge. In this way, it creates dependency in the trauma survivor on the new abuser to maintain a threat of abuse.
Without the threat of more abuse, the trauma survivor ends up feeling they might “revert back”.
This seems to be what you describe you experience some of the time.
This is exactly how Peter Young justifies continuing to shout at students that have been with him for 20+ years.
What he effectively says is that people can be scared all the way into enlightenment. This is patently stupid.
The effective method is to empower the trauma survivor to integrate their bad experiences into a healthy sense of self.
Then there is no possible “reverting back”, and the trauma survivor is truly free of the trauma, and the PTSD.
You can find these methods through trauma recovery specialists, they’re very easy to find these days.
“There are some people who learn by being cuddled and told how wonderful they are but I was not one of those, I met people who tried to do that with me and I walked all over them, I needed someone like Rinpoche to not take any of my shit and just say "hey, you're being an asshole to people, here's how you can stop" xD”
I hear you.
The issue is he would have continued to treat you in the same way had you become a nun. This is what he does to his students, forever.
No matter what you did, he would have continued to make you believe you were an asshole.
Ask any of his students what they honestly believe Peter Young thinks of them.
You want to say i'm brainwashed then that's your choice, but i'll tell you, i'm a single mum, with a good relationship to my sons dad, i'm living abroad and I feel very strong and I owe a lot of that to Rinpoche.
I don’t think you are brainwashed. You've kept enough of a distance to understand many things about Peter Young his inner circle have totally lost sight of.
I do think you owe yourself all the credit for that strong feeling and the good things you have in your life.
Peter Young makes his students feel that the good things they achieve are thanks to him, and so without him the good things might stop happening.
Again, the dependence.
The true bottom line reality is that you are responsible for these good things, not Peter Young.
I fully recognise that he encourages you to feel he is responsible in some way for your progress, and whether that's true or not could be debated.
What can’t be debated is that Buddhism doesn’t agree with this way of thinking.
By feeling you “owe a lot of that” to Peter Young, you are actually robbing yourself of responsibility, and therefore capability to act for the good in the world.
By fully accepting you did these good things for yourself, your concrete belief in your capacity to do good for others will increase.
Your experience of, and sense of ownership of, a healthy sense of self will be stronger. You will literally feel yourself to be a better person that you feel right now!
Therefore you will do even more good things, for yourself, and for others. This is Buddhist thought, in a nutshell: You are responsible, so enjoy it.
A student of course feels grateful to a teacher for their insight and guidance, but are clear that they owe their progress solely to their own efforts.
A real Lama would have made this clear to you in many different ways.
Believing someone else is largely responsible for our progress is both factually incorrect, and actually slows us down.
On this, again, Western science, common sense, and Buddhist findings are in perfect agreement.
The thing is, I don't hold "rinpochehelpedme" at fault there.
It is rather further evidence of the way Peter Young does not teach compassion.
Peter Young's need to inflict aggression and violence alongside his "care" is very clear from her description.
"but it's not abusive as far as I remember. I've had him shouting down the phone at me before where I was shaking with adrenaline, shitting myself,"
I hope this lady re-reads this several times, to see how it contradicts itself.
Sadly, this is typical of many cults.
I know for a fact that many of Peter Young's students have normalised his abusive behaviour to the point where shitting yourself and shaking with adrenaline - objective signs of intense fear - no longer mentally fit into the "abuse" category.
These sad statements show how a person can be made to openly contradict themselves, which means lie to themselves, without even realising, even about bad things that are being done to them.
Peter Young did that.
Peter Young says being abused by him is part of the process, exactly as she describes she felt was the case, and still feels is the case.
This cruel to be kind method is now completely debunked by Western science and psychology, and has always been rejected by Buddhism, because it is ineffective.
This method simply cannot lead to compassion (bodhiccita), because from it's very basis, it contains lack of compassion (cruelty).
I commend "rinpochehelpedme" for for her honesty, bravery, and open-mindedness.
This did make me think of a few other points that might be of interest:
“Now - Has he shouted? Yes, many times, that's his thing I think, but it's not abusive as far as I remember. I've had him shouting down the phone at me before where I was shaking with adrenaline, shitting myself, but when I saw him after he was lovely to me. I saw it as when a parent see's their child heading for danger, what do they do? They get that childs attention. “
This is what psychologists call “infantilisation”.
Peter Young puts adults into a frame of mind where they accept being treated like naughty children.
Peter Young even justifies this by using the same example this lady gives.
The bottom line true reality is: adults with real issues, or seekers on the path, are not naughty children.
Treating them as such is ineffective. Western mind sciences and Buddhism both agree on this.
The reason it is ineffective is that whatever disciplines or practices the person undertakes, they will continue to feel themselves to be a “naughty child” that is now doing well, but might act-up at any moment.
An effective method results in the person accepting that part of themselves that is a “naughty child”. In doing so, that “naughty child” transforms into a healthy adult version of itself.
The experience on the inside is completely different, and the effects of this method are permanent and totally positive.
This transformation is entirely possible without any aggression – in fact cannot work by aggression.
This is also not some esoteric hard to find method. In fact, any trauma recovery therapist of any school would recognise this method, because it boils down: to treat adults like adults.
The reason Peter Young and most cult leaders actively enforce infantilisation as their method, is that once an adult has accepted being treated like a child on one occasion, it is proven psychologically that the same adult is more easily treated like a child on a second occasion, and on a different subject. This leads straight to mind-control.
“The tools he gave me all those years ago helped me to the point that I now live in a beautiful part of the world, I feel very much at peace, obv not all the time but it's a work in progress and I have a very comfortable life most of the time.”
Here’s what I've found: The tools he gave you didn’t need to come with the shouting and aggression.
In fact, the shouting and aggression reduced their effectiveness.
You’ve developed, and overcome, but you would have done so with far less struggle, no need for continued “top ups”, and far faster, had you been taught those things by a truly authorised and properly trained person.
In some other ways, what he did was overwrite your existing abuse with new abuse.
I agree this seems to be effective in the short term, as the person becomes more scared of the new abuse than the old abuse, so the effects of the old abuse are painted over.
However, it is not truly effective. When the person loses their fear of the new abuser, the old patterns will re-emerge. In this way, it creates dependency in the trauma survivor on the new abuser to maintain a threat of abuse.
Without the threat of more abuse, the trauma survivor ends up feeling they might “revert back”.
This seems to be what you describe you experience some of the time.
This is exactly how Peter Young justifies continuing to shout at students that have been with him for 20+ years.
What he effectively says is that people can be scared all the way into enlightenment. This is patently stupid.
The effective method is to empower the trauma survivor to integrate their bad experiences into a healthy sense of self.
Then there is no possible “reverting back”, and the trauma survivor is truly free of the trauma, and the PTSD.
You can find these methods through trauma recovery specialists, they’re very easy to find these days.
“There are some people who learn by being cuddled and told how wonderful they are but I was not one of those, I met people who tried to do that with me and I walked all over them, I needed someone like Rinpoche to not take any of my shit and just say "hey, you're being an asshole to people, here's how you can stop" xD”
I hear you.
The issue is he would have continued to treat you in the same way had you become a nun. This is what he does to his students, forever.
No matter what you did, he would have continued to make you believe you were an asshole.
Ask any of his students what they honestly believe Peter Young thinks of them.
You want to say i'm brainwashed then that's your choice, but i'll tell you, i'm a single mum, with a good relationship to my sons dad, i'm living abroad and I feel very strong and I owe a lot of that to Rinpoche.
I don’t think you are brainwashed. You've kept enough of a distance to understand many things about Peter Young his inner circle have totally lost sight of.
I do think you owe yourself all the credit for that strong feeling and the good things you have in your life.
Peter Young makes his students feel that the good things they achieve are thanks to him, and so without him the good things might stop happening.
Again, the dependence.
The true bottom line reality is that you are responsible for these good things, not Peter Young.
I fully recognise that he encourages you to feel he is responsible in some way for your progress, and whether that's true or not could be debated.
What can’t be debated is that Buddhism doesn’t agree with this way of thinking.
By feeling you “owe a lot of that” to Peter Young, you are actually robbing yourself of responsibility, and therefore capability to act for the good in the world.
By fully accepting you did these good things for yourself, your concrete belief in your capacity to do good for others will increase.
Your experience of, and sense of ownership of, a healthy sense of self will be stronger. You will literally feel yourself to be a better person that you feel right now!
Therefore you will do even more good things, for yourself, and for others. This is Buddhist thought, in a nutshell: You are responsible, so enjoy it.
A student of course feels grateful to a teacher for their insight and guidance, but are clear that they owe their progress solely to their own efforts.
A real Lama would have made this clear to you in many different ways.
Believing someone else is largely responsible for our progress is both factually incorrect, and actually slows us down.
On this, again, Western science, common sense, and Buddhist findings are in perfect agreement.
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.