Re: "Jesus Christians," "cult", Dave McKay, the "Truth Believers"
Date: December 22, 2023 08:40AM

Christine (McKay's daughter).. is by now likely so completely psychologically invested in the narrative that McKay peddles as the 'greater reality' that she would have have seared her conscious' back to neural bed-rock... needling Ellicia in any way would have earned her a 'pat on the head' from McKay....

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Re: "Jesus Christians," "cult", Dave McKay, the "Truth Believers"
Posted by: XKRISHNA ()
Date: December 22, 2023 08:46AM

Psychologically fused to her leader, in a state of mindless obedience and childlike dependence, in the sense of approval-seeking. Same as Cherry, I think.

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Re: "Jesus Christians," "cult", Dave McKay, the "Truth Believers"
Posted by: matilda ()
Date: December 22, 2023 08:49AM


Satanist’: Melbourne ‘kidney cult’ YouTube sermon sparks defamation battle
Tom Cowie
ByTom Cowie
October 15, 2022 — 7.00pm

Renee Spencer remembers opening the mail to find her estranged daughter had returned the prepaid mobile phone she had once given her.

When the phone arrived, Spencer says she didn’t know where her daughter was – or if she was even still in the country.

Her daughter cut off contact after joining the Melbourne religious sect known as the Jesus Christians. Now Spencer is taking legal action against the sect’s leader, accusing him of defamation.

Renee Spencer is no longer in contact with her daughter after she joined Jesus Christians.
Renee Spencer is no longer in contact with her daughter after she joined Jesus Christians.CREDIT:LUIS ENRIQUE ASCUI

In the past, the Jesus Christians sect has been described as the “kidney cult” for encouraging members to donate their organs to strangers as an act of extreme selflessness.

Spencer has asked The Sunday Age not to name her daughter, who is aged in her 20s.

“In one of the last conversations I had with her, I asked whether or not she donated a kidney. And she said that she wasn’t opposed to doing so. But she hadn’t done it yet,” Spencer, 47, says.

Jesus Christians, who typically join as young adults, are urged to sell their possessions, donate the proceeds to the poor and live a life of poverty.

“When she joined and gave away everything, I held it together,” says Spencer, a teacher and mental health practitioner who lives in the Yarra Valley.

“I said, ‘this is your life. If this is what you want to do, it is your choice’.”

Initially, Spencer says her daughter discussed an interest in a community called “A Ship In The Desert”, rather than its better-known – and more-controversial – name, Jesus Christians.

Two months after joining in November 2017, she had married another member and taken a new name.

Spencer gave her daughter a cheap mobile and prepaid SIM. They used the phone to stay in touch when she went overseas.

But as she learned more about the group’s beliefs, which includes the imminent return of Jesus Christ and the end of the world, Spencer saw “red flags” and tried to convince her daughter to leave.

Renee Spencer.

Soon after, her daughter disappeared and returned the phone without much explanation.

“There was a little tiny note that basically said: ‘thanks, I don’t need it any more’,” says Spencer.

She believes her relationship with her daughter deteriorated because of the control exerted by David McKay, the leader of Jesus Christians.

According to court documents, Spencer claims that McKay engaged in a campaign to turn her daughter against her.

Spencer is taking defamation action in the County Court against McKay over videos that she says damaged her reputation. The videos were posted in July last year on the Jesus Christians YouTube channel which has more than 130,000 subscribers.

She claims McKay wrote a script which referred to her as a “devil worshipper” and a person who has “conspired with neo-Nazis and attempted murderers to terrorise and persecute a Christian group”.

The sermon, which is transcribed in court documents, refers to a “mother in Australia whose daughter married one of our members”.

David McKay and his wife, Cherry, in 2005.
David McKay and his wife, Cherry, in 2005.CREDIT:JON REID

“This mother is a Luciferian – a Satanist, if you like,” McKay wrote, according to court documents.

“She insists that her love for Lucifer does not interfere with her respect for anything that Jesus may have said.”

The video’s narrator went on to say that the woman had conspired with two other parents of Jesus Christians trying to get their children to leave the group, who he claimed sold “neo-Nazi paraphernalia”.

Spencer claims she was identified in a stylised image of her face with the name “Renee” written on top.

The description of a Satanist is “ridiculous”, says Spencer, and had originated from words taken out of context in an email she sent to her daughter.

A screenshot of a Jesus Christians video on YouTube.
A screenshot of a Jesus Christians video on YouTube.CREDIT:

“At this stage, I realised that none of the emails I was sending to her were confidential. Everything was screened,” she said.

McKay is self-represented in the defamation case. In his defence document filed in court, he claims that Spencer was not identified by the video and that the sermon had fewer than 4000 views.

He is also relying on defences of truth and honest opinion when referring to Spencer as a “Luciferian” and conspirator with neo-Nazis.

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In rejecting Spencer’s bid for damages, he wrote that her daughter was an “independent adult” and able to choose for herself what religion to believe.

“The defendant suggests that the problem has developed because the plaintiff is unaccepting of her daughter’s choices,” he wrote.

McKay, who lives in Lalor, declined to comment beyond what was publicly available in court documents.

Recently, Spencer received a video message from her daughter, the first contact aside from a few brief emails they have had since late 2020.

“It was beautiful to see her. But Dave McKay is a scriptwriter who enjoys putting words into people’s mouths,” she said.

“I’m not going to go down the path of saying she’s brainwashed or anything like that. It’s all about persuasion. It’s all about coercive control.

“I love my daughter and I’m scared shitless for her wellbeing every day.”

The case is listed for trial in May.

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Re: "Jesus Christians," "cult", Dave McKay, the "Truth Believers"
Posted by: XKRISHNA ()
Date: December 22, 2023 08:59AM

Pathetic. He is a terrible liar. He thinks the whole world is involved in a conspiracy against him. What a paranoid idiot.

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Re: "Jesus Christians," "cult", Dave McKay, the "Truth Believers"
Posted by: XKRISHNA ()
Date: December 22, 2023 10:14AM

Thank you for bringing this information, matilda, This makes me very happy, to know that David has been defeated in this instance. It fills me with joy!

And I'm not trying to preach, but I just want to thank the Lord for being so wonderful!

Get thee behind me, Satan!


"My greatest joy in life is this
To find in Him my highest bliss
Oh praise His Holy Name
He's so wonderful!"

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/22/2023 10:16AM by XKRISHNA.

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Re: "Jesus Christians," "cult", Dave McKay, the "Truth Believers"
Date: December 22, 2023 04:47PM

Thanks Matilda for posting the updates.

It beggars belief that McKay can be unaware of the 'satanic' prostitution of the biblical scriptures that HE routinely engages in....however when you orchestrate the removal of anyone who questions you ...and choose to surround yourself with those who will parrot whatever they believe placates you ...and so save themselves from the (Mao-like) obligatory personal self-criticism that the Jesus Christian's 'grievance process's have become..the method undergirding the self induced delusions of grandeur ...become clear.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/22/2023 04:49PM by Malcolm Wesley WREST.

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Re: "Jesus Christians," "cult", Dave McKay, the "Truth Believers"
Date: December 22, 2023 05:04PM

I am wondering if 'good David McKay' will now appear (ever so briefly) in order to 'prove' to the world how badly wronged this 'poor soul' has been and so 'cruelly' mis-judged by the wider evidenced by the recent court findings...

It's a psychological process akin to a wife-beating husband where brief spells of reasonable behaviour are intended to delude the victim into thinking that they are 'mis-judging' the man who otherwise assaults them on whim... and so prolong their servitude.

I too foresee the imminent (within a number of years) return of Christ...McKay himself and his cult being one of the 'false Christs' in the last days that the scriptures warn of...

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/22/2023 05:05PM by Malcolm Wesley WREST.

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Re: "Jesus Christians," "cult", Dave McKay, the "Truth Believers"
Posted by: XKRISHNA ()
Date: December 23, 2023 12:40AM

The Scriptures simply do not support a "peace at any price" or "hands off" position. False teachers like the McKays, and false doctrine destroy people spiritually.

Please consider the pastoral epistles where Paul calls out the false teachers by name.

Read about Hymaneus (sp?), Philetus (sp?), and Alexander (1 Timothy 1:20).

We can also look at 3 John where Paul calls out Diotrephes by name.

Then, of course, there is the entire book of Galatians in which Paul speaks directly to the false doctrines infiltrating the church there.

Jude 3 commands us to earnestly contend for the faith once for all delivered to the saints. The context of the passage makes it clear that we are contending against false teachers. 2 Peter says very similar things.

1 Corinthians 11 says that some divisions are necessary so that those who are approved by God may become manifest from those who are not.

2 Cor. 11 also has very strong statements about false teachers.

Another great passage is Acts 20:28-31.

Then there is my personal favorite passage on the topic, Ephesians 5:11-12.

And what about 1 Corinthians 5, where Paul tells the church there to deliver the fornicator to Satan for the destruction of his flesh?

Dave McKay is not qualified to be a leader according to the New Testament.

These are meaningful points to be raised in a supposedly Bible-based group.

Christians know that Dave McKay can be seen as a fraud, according to the Bible.

This is important considering that McKay uses the Bible like a weapon to manipulate people.

1Tim 3:1 ¶ This [is] a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
1Tim 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
1Tim 3:3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
1Tim 3:4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
1Tim 3:5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
1Tim 3:6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
1Tim 3:7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/23/2023 12:41AM by XKRISHNA.

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Re: "Jesus Christians," "cult", Dave McKay, the "Truth Believers"
Date: December 23, 2023 07:56AM

Oh...and of course, all kudos to the good Ms Spencer who was had the tenacity to follow this matter through an unenviable court process. She has bravely displayed genuine leadership in confronting McKay and I sincerely thank her.

(I actually think she will have 'strengthened her hand' in negotiating ongoing access to her daughter all tyrants (I would consider Trump an example)... McKay really only respects the exercise of power...and all the scriptures he prostitutes to ensnare the idealistic young...have very little meaning in themselves apart from ensuring this outcome ... so indignant bluster aside... McKay will now quietly perceive Ms Spencer as a force to be (deceitfully) reckoned with ....)

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/23/2023 07:57AM by Malcolm Wesley WREST.

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Re: "Jesus Christians," "cult", Dave McKay, the "Truth Believers"
Date: December 23, 2023 08:17AM

...Has David McKay been subject to .... or earned a 'Contempt of Court' order?

There is still no 'come back' on the JC website belittling the proceedings and impugning Ms Spencer,her legal advocates and the 'bias' of the courts .... I guess McKay is still licking his wounds ...the 'silence' is a little untypical though, I feel...

Were we able to get a Community Service Order out it as well??.. I have connections to an environmental organisation that could do with (minimally) Joseph's and Elicia's assistance local to the Melbourne base...collecting litter, weeding, spreading mulch and watering... These are of the course the Jesus Christians who claim that they work for free (...when they can generate media coverage off the activity for themselves).... Do get in touch soon won't you Joe and Elicia!!!

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/23/2023 08:19AM by Malcolm Wesley WREST.

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