I can't get too specific about my experiences (where, when, etc) at UPW because I don't want to break my anonymity, but I just want to say that I went with my partner and a few others recently. My partner is a HUGE HUGE fan of TR's. I've listened to CD's in the car with him on trips. Some of what he said was interesting. Nothing earth-shattering or new but the way he said it was good! Although, his voice grates on my nerves.

My parnter and I have separate bank accounts. He has saved quite well over the years and pays for the major expenses so he normally doesn't run anything past me nor does he need to. I use my money to pay for house releated things so I barely pay attention to what he's doing - esp if he can call it a business expense. Let's just say I had no idea how much they 'got' him for over the past 7 years! OMG I was FURIOUS when I found out how much Mastery University cost and how conniving they are at getting people to sign up! He went to Mastery University a few months before I went with him to UPW. He started making some drastic diet change before UPW and was getting a little wierd but things have been UNBEARABLE since.

SO, about UPW. At the UPW, I saw right through this crap immediately. The stories he was telling were over the top - an 85 year old nun running triathlons with a broken leg? Come on, really???? I started googling some of this garbage on my phone in the middle of his monotonous, narcissistic rants and couldn't find back-up info. I just laughed it off - ok he's trying to make a point. Let it go.....

I think the moment when the rage started to rise up in me was when I looked at my parnter and at the people around the room and saw a bunch of brainwashed manic crazy people - esp my partner - I swear I could almost hear him 'bahhhhh'ing and I think there was a red-juice ring around his mouth. I was not engaged at all. I refused to get up and jump up and down and don't you DARE give me a friggin' massage, weird stranger!

I tried to get involved at some points but it was so STUPID - the whole thing was just ridiculous. And, peppered throughout the entire thing - ESP when everyone was in a deep trance state - were sales pitches for Mastery University. It was SICKENING! I thought buying a car was bad! The cheesy lady trying to sell me undercarriage coating wasn't as sleezy as Tony and Joseph!

All kidding aside here is the part that enrages me - my partner stopped taking his meds. He is going 100000 miles an hour. He is not sleeping, he's exercising manically. He barely eats and the only thing he does eat is raw food. He is working three times more than ever. Some of what he is doing is good but some of it is unsustainable. This is not who he was before Tony Robbins. The energy is so uncomfortable to be around. He is unbearable. He talks really loud in public so people around us know he is STEPPING UP! Sometimes he's very lucid and I think "ok maybe it's me and he's just doing great" but other times I think his energy is NOT normal. It's NOT healthy and I think he might be spiraling towards a psychosis. His level of grandiosity is delusional!

He has told me that if I do not STEP UP we need to get divorced. So, I'm doing the raw food thing when he's around. I'm working out (I look good already and I have a wonderful life - not sure what he thinks needs to change but I'm doing whatever he thinks I need to do because I do not know what else to do right this second). I'm just afraid that he is going to lose everything if he keeps going down this path.

One more thing - at UPW I told him I don't appreciate being mind-f*cked which is exactly what I felt like was happening. He didn't talk to me for WEEKS! I can't believe he doesn't see it or question it. Lord, help us. Thanks for letting me vent. I left shaken because I was very sensitive to the attempts to be brainwash and it FREAKED ME OUT! I hated every second of it. I can't believe people LIKE THIS STUFF!

Hi Mamadrama,

I am not a fan of NLP - I was involved in my teens to the level of master practitioner - whatever that means. I left most of it behind by the time I was in my late teens.

Now that I'm examining why I became involved with someone who was in a cult (with the help of an exit counselor), I've had to examine my attraction to NLP in the first place.

It may interest you that my exit counselor relayed a story: that at one of the ICSA ( www.icsahome.com ) conferences, one of the speakers began using NLP during their presentation. Shortly thereafter, the room went "bat-shit" (the therapist's term) - because cult leaders often use techniques that are similar / close to NLP / Ericksonian hypnosis, a majority of former members in the room started experiencing anxiety. Once someone recognized what was going on, the speaker was removed and the room returned to normal.

There are some things that I think are OK about NLP - understanding that different people process the world differently - I think that's useful information. My line is drawn when it comes to using hypnosis outside a therapeutic context - in NLP's case Ericksonian hypnosis - as far as I know, NLP / TR is still using Erickson's techniques and teaching them to lay people.

I'd like to see the regulation of hypnosis (it is not regulated in most states), and its teaching to lay people made illegal.

Best,

Sadly what is happening here, happens every week.
Vulnerable people get whipped into a manic-trance state, and spend tens of thousands on Tony Robbins seminars.
Some get cleaned out of hundreds of thousands of dollars for other schemes they have running.

If a person has a past with mania, they can easily be flipped into mania.
And everyone knows where that ends, with a total breakdown.

Decades ago, Tony Robbins learned the advanced NLP techniques to manipulate and influence people, and he's just running the same patterns.
Many broken people lie in the ditch as collateral damage.

And they just keep getting away with it, as the media does not have the skill to dissect and explain what is being done to people.
But its all explained in these forums.

And when people are manic, they are very likely to go on spending sprees.

For more on this see what's here on Google

[www.google.com]

Thanks for your responses. To update you - he crashed and is back on his meds and in a outpatient treatment program. Tony Robbins should be ashamed of himself. I'm devastated - I'm worried about him and that his business is going under. We could lose everything. I despise what Tony's methods have done to him. How can that man sleep at night????? If you could see what this has done to my family, especially our little boys, it would break your hearts. And I hold a security clearance - if we have to default on our mortgage or go bankrupt I could lose my job! What did we do to deserve this? he can't work - he can barely function. But I'm sure Tony would spin this as my husband's choice.

Robbins and his crew know this happens all the time, at every Event people are getting seriously psychologically damaged and hurt.

Robbins stands up there and claims he can reintegrate "multiple personalities" on the spot from the stage. Of course, he is just repeating bullshit from Richard Bandler and some NLP nonsense. He makes all sorts of nonsensical psychological claims, with no training, education, experience, or even a shred of honesty or integrity.

Anyone who approaches the Robbins corp after events about the psychological damage they have sustained will be ignored and referred to their lawyers. Its a totally ruthless business.
And of course they will blame the victim.
And attack those who point this out.
Various people have put up websites over the years criticizing what goes on at the Robbins seminars, and they have been forced down.

These intensive LGAT seminars can be extremely psychologically dangerous to certain people. Many people flip into psychosis or mania.
In fact, the LGAT seminar leaders try to push people into hypo-mania, as that is when people will spend their entire credit line on some worthless products.

The harsh reality is that the people running these LGAT seminars that damage people, do not care. They know most people get no benefit, and many get hurt, but they don't care. They blame the victim, or just block it out of their mind.

These are the same kind of people who can stand up in front of people, and tell bald-faced lies, over and over again, for years on end. They don't have a normal conscience. Their conscience only extends to me, myself, and I, and their girlfriends and kids.

Its terrible what happens to all of these people who get hurt.
Hopefully he can get some good medical treatment, and get back to where he was before.

How to stop these damaging LGAT seminars?
The government doesn't care, unless people die during the seminar, and even then sometimes there are no charges as its ruled an accident or suicide.
Perhaps only large class action lawsuits by groups of people can be effective?

Tony Robbins unpaid "Crew" = pay to work for a for-profit company [forum.culteducation.com]


A new thread was just started in the LGAT section about Robbins looking for unpaid workers.
These "Crew" "jobs" are unpaid.

You notice the legalese language buried in the text. "you are NOT sales people" is protection against Robbins Inc violating labor laws.
They just use paying customers to do all the work, and they don't have to pay staff.
Get people to work for free and to PAY TO WORK for you.

They also get them to force people to sign the releases, or people can't attend the event.
The entire thing is disgusting.

Quote
A new thread was just started in the LGAT section about Robbins looking for unpaid workers. These "Crew" "jobs" are unpaid.

Times must be tough if they can't afford to pay workers. (Sarcasm intended.)

A pity media isn't covering what truly happens at these events and afterwards. I've noticed when any of these New Age/Self Help gurus come to town they receive lots of free promos/advertorials in the guise of supposedly legit articles.

These LGATs have used unpaid labor for many years. Increases profits for the LGAT leader immensely.
It also identifies "followers" of the LGAT who will come back over and over to the same seminar, and spend tens of thousands on various junk for sale.
And work 18 hours a day for free....actually they PAY to work 18 hrs a day, as they pay their own expenses.

Mixed in with the naive working for free, are various hucksters looking to sell their MLM, real estate, or investing scams to the LGAT seminar attendees.
Its a LGAT seminar shark feeding frenzy of cash...literally.

The unpaid volunteer labor (aka meat puppets) is also a human asset that generates wealth--but cannot be taxed.

Damned clever.