larry bobo Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Speaking of leadership styles, I’m reading a #1 > New York Times Bestseller entitled “Extreme > Ownership” written by a Navy SEAL about business > leadership....The main point of the book is to > encourage leaders to accept total responsibility > for what happens under their watch. You alone are
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

changedagain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > That would, unfortunately, > be the first instinct for many of them should > their church shut down. I have no sympathy for > those that have led them down this dead end path, > and continue to harp about their supposed lack of > dedication. They've suffered enough. They should > do
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

puddington Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I remember hearing a similar word given to the > sheep of a LW church that was being shut down and > sold off. They were being rebuked for having put > roots down in the city the LW church was in. > Never mind that many of the sheep had careers and > established businesses in that location. If t
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Sons Have Nowhere To Lay Their Heads...Uh oh! Here it comes! February 3, 2018 - by Gary Hargrave Still in Brazil, BTW When people told Jesus they wanted to follow Him, His response was, “The foxes have holes and the birds of the air have nests, but the Son of Man has nowhere to lay His head” (Luke 9:57-58). In this response, Jesus was showing us something significant about a walk with God.
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

puddington Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > When a church stops giving enough to the central > apostolic ministry, it’s time to close it down, > sell the assets off and move the funds into a > corporation that has ultimate ownership by the > “apostolic fathering ministry” (i.e. Gary) > > Seems like Shiloh probably runs in the red most
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

changedagain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Reepicheep Wrote: > > > Make of it what you will. My take is that the > > people will suffer. > > That's a safe bet given Walk/TLWF history. If > anything doesn't work out it's the people's fault, > sometimes the result of their connecting to > demonic for
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

changedagain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > excerpt from "Together, We Drink This Cup" > > "It is not enough that I alone drink the > cup the Lord is asking of me, but there must be a > people who enter into the same commitment to drink > this cup. It is time for each one of us to take the > responsibility for the Wo
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Here are the sermons that I believe TheycalledmeJonah mentioned. Make of it what you will. My take is that the people will suffer.
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

changedagain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Now for something completely different: > My 23andme results came back, and it roughly > confirms the ancestry.com results: > 56% British & Irish > 24% Ashkenazi Jew > 20% Other > My wife's take on this is that by combining the > British, Irish and Jew you invariably end up with
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

NickleandDimed Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Regarding the posts. About Gary and the cup. My > sources tell me. There is something serious going > on. The cup is not a joke. NickleandDimed, do you have any idea what it's about?
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Changedagain Wrote: ---------------------- > BTW, when I made an ill-advised > joke about the obvious special treatment that Rick > received, and it got back to G & M, I paid for it. > A public demotion followed by a couple years of > 'voluntary' labor on various church facilities and > ministry homes. I wish I could say I felt the > love in the discipl
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

changedagain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I recall the drive of G & M to monitor every > aspect of the local church via the requirement > laid out in the 'Fred and Ethyl books'. It seemed > like endless hours were spent in our local church > by a number of dedicated servants, striving to be > completely thorough. Meanwhi
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

changedagain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I always wondered about the dynamics of that > relationship--specifically, who has more > clout--Gary or Rick? Perhaps it depends on the > terrain. That is a good question, changedagain. Especially now with Marilyn gone. If Rick was anybody else's kid, I think he would have been out a long time
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

changedagain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------- > I suspect the people are so accustomed to being > beaten down by his "living word," the idea that > there is a God that is not driven to lay heavy > burdens upon them must seem like heresy (Matt. > 23:4) > BTW, as Gary transitions into spending more and > more time in Brazil, with its ob
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

changedagain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Really. I think Gary believes he a manifestation > of 'The Father' and that people need to work > harder to please him...a never-ending process. > I suggest the following title for his next word: > 'He Can't be Pleased--Give it a Rest!' Do you think Gary has graduated fro
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Our Ambition Is To Please The Father Oh, dear God, you mean those poor people haven't pleased you yet? Posted on January 28, 2018 By Gary Hargrave The drive and force (More hard work) behind the life of Christ was His motivation to live in His relationship with the Father and to love the Father with all of His heart, mind, soul, and strength. Gary: "If only you people could all be
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Off the subject...I was reading some old posts and cow bells were mentioned. I had an unpleasant flashback. Does anyone else remember those gawd-awful Marilyn Farms purple cow tags that they were selling for awhile? And the women wore them as earrings? Blech! Moooo! Changedagain, they not only consigned us to permanent slave labor status, they even turned us into cows!
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Ooops....I meant puddington!
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

puddington Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Cloudwatcher Wrote: > ------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > Is this Gary’s new GF? > > > > > > > > > > Yes > > > She looks a little like you-know-who. Isn’t she > from Maui? I thought the same thing about looks,
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Tknc, that really is a revealing part of Nichol's book. I was kind of shocked by that too. Changedagain.......... "wow--downplaying his lofty role in the fellowship to appear more normal, and win the favor of the court. So much for 'apostolic' integrity. Good thing he didn't mention Shiloh being the center of the universe--that probably would not have gone over too we
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

lily rose Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Perhaps JRS really believed he was called of God > but along the way as he gained our trust and > control over us, he justified using deception > (absolute power corrupts) in putting forth his > claims and revelations maybe convincing himself he > was the Apostle to the Kingdom. Think about the &g
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

lily rose Wrote: -------------------------------------------------- > Eventually absolute power and control can corrupt > an individual and they feel justified in using > deception. > > Perhaps JRS really believed he was called of God > but along the way as he gained our trust and > control over us, he justified using deception > (absolute power corrupts) in putt
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

TheJewel Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Most of these guys were natural salesmen with a > salesman’s flair and a well developed ability to > read people. The question for me has always been > is whether JRS and RD (the ones I knew the best) > did this deliberately or whether they had drank so > much of their own “Kool-Aid” that they decei
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Ahhh...the BMW! I remember that. And the carved turtle coffee table and the fabulous home in Hawaii where they couldn't decide how wide to make the walkway. There were several homes, all complete with slave labor. The perks of being a cult leader...
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

changedagain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > BTW, aside from weathering criticism from those > who lost their life savings in the mine > debacle...did John take a significant financial > hit? I recall an allegation in the divorce trial > that he was worth 30 million. Even if that number > was grossly inflated, and he was worth say 4-5 &
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

changedagain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Papa is his latest mark, apparently. Poor Papa. > > "A confidence trick is an attempt to defraud a > person or group after first gaining their > confidence, used in the classical sense of trust. > Confidence tricks exploit characteristics of the > human psyche, such as credulity, naïv
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Yes, I think so...
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

NARCISSISTIC MANIAC ON THE LOOSE ALERT: We Must Foster And Nurture The Holy Spirit’s Presence Posted on January 24, 2018 By Gary Hargrave On Monday, January 22nd, I was honored to speak to the leadership of the Catholic charismatic movement in Brazil. I began by expressing the deep oneness I feel with Papa Francisco and my appreciation for what he is doing to create oneness in the Body of
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

lily rose Wrote: -------------------------------------------- > Corboy I don't know if the walk had/has shrills. > It seems like most of us were just duped and when > we presented our involvement to others to get them > involved it came from a place of spreading kind of > a fairytale. Lily rose and corboy, I don't think that JRS used shills, that I was aware o
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

More Random Thoughts... In Nichol's book, the reason for the split in the Valley church was revealed to be related to rumors of a "spiritual marriage" between JRS and an elder's wife. Several elders in the church were becoming very suspicious about the situation. They were also upset about the "special" relationship between JRS and the group of women known as the
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families