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Re: SGI-USA members SGI "training" = SGI-Programming = SGI-brainwashin
Posted by: tsukimoto ()
Date: December 16, 2009 06:33AM

Quote
The Anticult
_____________QUOTE_______________________
[www.sgi-usa.org]
"Is it OK to try the practice even if I’m not sure I believe in it?"

Of course, if you are very new to chanting Nam-myoho-rengekyo, you might not have experienced any conspicuous actual proof yet. But at SGI-USA activities, you have no doubt heard members’ experiences of having received benefit as well as explanations of how the practice works. This can be your starting point—instead of blind faith, you can begin with an expectation that the practice works and therefore be willing to try it.

Actual proof means that the teaching actually changes people’s lives for the better, that there is undeniable improvement that anyone can see.

As Nichiren Buddhists, we develop ever-deepening faith through our own experience rather than simply accepting our beliefs from others. Ours is a philosophy of proof, and new members can expect to see actual proof from their practice soon after starting.
____________________________

Like others who've posted here, I too was never taught how to do street shakabuku. We were told to just do it. I heard other members approach people and say things like "Have you heard of Nam myoho renge kyo?" "Can I talk to you about happiness?" "Would you like to go to a Buddhist meeting?"

As Nichijew says, members pretty much told their targets things like "Oh, sure, you can still believe in Jesus Christ/Allah/the Flying Spaghetti Monster and still chant!" (And yet my leaders came to enshrine my new Gohonzon and insisted that I discard my statue of the Virgin Mary.)

Potential members were also told things like Anticult quoted from SGI's website -- that you would never understand the practice unless you actually did it. Don't think, just join SGI, start chanting, and life will be wonderful!

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Re: Former SGI members
Posted by: tsukimoto ()
Date: December 16, 2009 07:12AM

Regarding shakabuku, Rick Ross's archives has a good article on persuasive techniques: it's an excerpt from "Cults in Our Midst," by Margaret Thaler Singer.

-----------Beginning of Quote---------------------------------------------------------------------

---------------------Beginning of Quote, "Cults in Our Midst: Psychological Persuasion Techniques"-----------------------------------

Emotional Manipulation

According to Cialdini, the majority of the thousands of different tactics that compliance professionals use fall into six categories, and each category is based on a psychological principle that directs human behavior. These six principles are:

Consistency. We try to justify our earlier behavior.

Reciprocity. If somebody gives us something, we try to repay in kind.

Social Proof. We try to find out what other people think is correct.

Authority. We have a deep-seated sense of duty to authority figures.

Liking. We obey people we like.

Scarcity. If we come to want something, we can be made to fear that if we wait it will be gone. The opportunity to get it may pass. We want to take it now - whatever is being offered, from an object to cosmic consciousness.
------------------------------------------End of Quote--------------------------------------------------------------

So how does this apply to SGI?

1. Consistency: SGI pushes you very quickly to make a commitment to SGI -- go to one meeting and you will be hounded to join. Why? Because if you have made a commitment, you are likely to feel bad about breaking it. Quitting shortly after joining is admitting that you made a poor decision when you joined -- and that's hard to do. Who ever likes to admit making a mistake?

Sending members out to do shakabuku is also a way of pushing members to be consistent. Leaders will say, "Well, you are practicing -- if you think this is valuable, don't you think that other people should have the chance to try this too?"

And also, if you've been trying to shakabuku your family, friends, neighbors, coworkers and even compete strangers -- how do you then admit -- to yourself or other people -- that you have doubts about the practice? You can't, without feeling like a hypocrite or fool. I used to try to get friends and relatives to come to meetings. When I began to consider leaving, I wondered, "What do I say to people that I used to try to shakabuku? How do I tell them that I'm sorry I tried to convert them -- and that I'm sorry I joined!"

2. Reciprocity: In the beginning, when members are trying to shakabuku you, they may drive you to meetings, watch your kids so you can go to a meeting, maybe even have a special meeting just for you, love-bomb you -- you feel guilty accepting all this attention and help and then telling them that you're just not interested.

3. Social Proof: In SGI, you are surrounded by people who seem to unquestioningly accept that President Ikeda is the wisest man in the world, chanting enough daimoku can change anything, and it's great to give a lot of time and money to SGI. And if you get involved in a lot of activities, as SGI encourages you to -- most of your time WILL be spent hanging around with people who believe these things. You can almost forget that there are people who don't! It's hard to be different than those around you. You can feel like the problem is you, instead of that they believe some weird things!

4. Authority: SGI is very top-down and makes senior leaders, especially Ikeda, sound very wise and special. SGI makes Ikeda sound like a combination of God, Jesus Christ, Buddha, Gandhi and King, and that title --- President!? Presidents generally are ELECTED! Nobody elected him! The choice to call him "President" was interesting.

Even other senior leaders are, or at least were, promoted heavily. When they come into town, it's a huge deal. Or we've got to travel a long distance to go to see them, and that's presented like it's a great honor -- that they're coming to our state or region. We're encouraged to "get guidance" from them, as if they're actually going to tell us something that the local yokels wouldn't know.

5. Liking: When you're a prospective, or new member, other members love-bomb you and make a huge fuss over you. Superficially, SGI members can certainly seem very friendly, and thrilled to see you....stay in awhile and you'll realize that this "friendliness" doesn't go very deep.

6. Scarcity: SGI presents themselves as being the only true religion, and the only correct Buddhist sect -- they're your only chance to change your karma, they say. You've got to try it! Now! You're wasting time that could be spent having wonderful experiences!

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SGI, the person would go mentally insane and split into seven pieces
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: December 16, 2009 09:24AM

Many sects and cults use the exact same threats on their own people.
In this very forum, Royal Way told their perceived critics they would suffer what happened to Judas in the bible...that is, your guts would blow up, and/or suicide.
Royal Way and Judas [forum.culteducation.com]

They try to use those supernatural sounding threats to scare superstitious people.

Also, the reason Ikeda and his people told people not to take what he said literally, as it was so extreme, would be because there are different levels of SGI involvement.
Ikeda sends his extreme message to the hard-core SGI shock-troops, he wants them to be miltant and extreme, those are those brown shirts of the movement, the lifers who sacrifice everything to SGI.
But of course there are also a large base of more casual members, who are there to buy things, give money, and recruit. So they tell the more casual people not to take Ikeda literally in his extremist ideas.

But that is a mistake. There is no evidence Ikeda is really thinking about future generations, he's thinking about himself, his fake Honorary Degrees, his billions, his ego, putting his name on buildings.
Guys like Ikeda always hold onto power until they are dead or incapacitated.

And the SGI street-recruiting, its very interesting how SGI just pushes people to do it. Again, very smart, keep it simple.
Hopefully a former SGI leader will post here, and talk about the process of coverting people to SGI that occurs after they get them into the SGI meetings.

And SGI is not the only sect to claim it can travel to other planets...The Raelians and countless others do the same.
The cult leaders know that humans can literally believe anything.


Quote
sushigrl
A really cool teaching was that if a person went against the SGI, his head would split into seven pieces and his back would split open and flames would come out...meaning that the person would go mentally insane and experience horrible illnesses. I have known ardent members who have died of painful illnesses and have mental illness, but of course, they are "changing their karma" and will reach "eagle peak" through the divine intervention of "shoten zenjin" or the powerful positive forces in the universe. Wow. God and his angels. One leader even told us that if the world blew up, we could choose any planet we wanted to live on and do shakubuku there...that it was stated in the Gosho. Wow.

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Re: SGI, the person would go mentally insane and split into seven pieces
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: December 16, 2009 09:26AM

Excellent summary from Cults in Our Midst.
That is a great book, everyone should get a copy for the bookshelf!

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Re: Former SGI members
Posted by: evergreen ()
Date: December 16, 2009 11:51AM

"Guys like Ikeda always hold onto power until they are dead or incapacitated" - The Anticult


I just remembered that one of the millions of dialogues Ikeda has had and published was with Fidel Castro. I remember that I didn't like all the people he had dialogues with, and yet I couldn't admit that openly. Now I see why he would like Fidel - it looks like they have a lot of similarities - they won't leave the planet unless they are forced to.

Lately all of the dialogues seem strange to me. Lofty, otherworldly, inappropriate, disjointed. Ikeda will meet with anyone then throw the mentor disciple thing into the mix, and the people will in turn answer him. Then Ikeda will jam his point down everyone's throats. Its almost like the people are saying to him "OK whatever, this is a little off putting don't you think. As I was saying." Ikeda abruptly pounds his fist on the table and starts with "the relationship between a mentor and his disciples is in accord with what you are saying about ______"

Fidel Casto? WTH

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Re: Former SGI members
Posted by: sushigrl ()
Date: December 16, 2009 01:36PM

I think this impression by Polly Toynbee, Arnold Toynbee's granddaughter really sums it up for me ( I found it on this website)

Years after Prof. Toynbee's death, and to their great surprise, Polly Toynbee and her husband were invited to visit Mr. Ikeda in Japan.

POLLY TOYNBEE: Everything that we did was formal; huge, formal gatherings; meetings, with different people; meetings with the women of Soka Gakkai; meetings with different groups, people associated in their minds with my grandfather in some way or another, and we found it very oppressive; very alarming; and certainly by the time it came to the meeting with him, by then we had formed a very clear idea of this extraordinary, militarily run organization. Phenomenal power, wealth, and a sinister level of obedience.

INTERVIEWER: Did you get any impression of Ikeda, "the great spiritual leader"?

POLLY TOYNBEE: I think it would be hard to imagine a less spiritual man. He was in every way earthy. A powerful megalomania; we got this aura of power from him that was extremely alarming. We then went, on another day with him, to some huge Nuremberg style rally in a stadium, where everything was to the greater worship of him. And again, what he really liked was this feeling of power.

He met with thinkers and politicians who didn't even know who he was really, all to promote himself around the world. How sad.

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Re: SGI, the person would go mentally insane and split into seven pieces
Posted by: DrJesusEsq ()
Date: December 17, 2009 12:34AM

Quote
The Anticult
Also, the reason Ikeda and his people told people not to take what he said literally, as it was so extreme, would be because there are different levels of SGI involvement.
Ikeda sends his extreme message to the hard-core SGI shock-troops, he wants them to be miltant and extreme, those are those brown shirts of the movement, the lifers who sacrifice everything to SGI.
But of course there are also a large base of more casual members, who are there to buy things, give money, and recruit. So they tell the more casual people not to take Ikeda literally in his extremist ideas.
/quote]

If you like to hear brown shirts in SGI, here is something I can give you.

In the SGI, there is something called the Gajokai (protectors of the fortress). For awhile, to me it seemed like an overblown term since here (at least in CT) most of the time gajokai just watch the center and sit in the reception area asking people to sign in. If they have the time, they would clean the center.

Apparently, and I was just told this, in Japan it is more serious. They are the corp d'espirit. In order to get in, not only do you have an interview process, but you are also to read both the Human and the New Human Revolution, Ikeda's personal manifesto.

Who knows what else they have to do. Who knows what else they do when they are in.

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Re: SGI, the person would go mentally insane and split into seven pieces
Posted by: quiet one ()
Date: December 17, 2009 02:19AM

Quote
DrJesusEsq

In the SGI, there is something called the Gajokai (protectors of the fortress). For awhile, to me it seemed like an overblown term since here (at least in CT) most of the time gajokai just watch the center and sit in the reception area asking people to sign in. If they have the time, they would clean the center.

Apparently, and I was just told this, in Japan it is more serious. They are the corp d'espirit. In order to get in, not only do you have an interview process, but you are also to read both the Human and the New Human Revolution, Ikeda's personal manifesto.

Who knows what else they have to do. Who knows what else they do when they are in.


Where we live, there were never enough people willing to do Gajokai. When people did sign up, they often didn't show up at the scheduled time. When my husband used to do Gajokai, he would get several phone calls prior to his shift to remind him to come. Even with lots of reminders, people would blow it off. My husband was sometimes requested to call people that hadn't shown up and find out what the problem was! It used to be that only men were Gajokai, but since they couldn't get enough men to do it, now they have both men and women (and youth) sitting in the reception area and watching over the kaikan.

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Re: Former SGI members
Posted by: evergreen ()
Date: December 17, 2009 03:05AM

DrJesusEsq- what are brown shirts?

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Re: Former SGI members
Posted by: sushigrl ()
Date: December 17, 2009 03:13AM

Hi Evergreen, I think Anticult was referring to the Hitler Youth style of training (they wore brown shirts) that the gajokai and even byakuren receive as youth division. More specifically he's referring to the really die hard members who would actually do dangerous and stupid things for "the sake of Cousin Rufus"; the people higher up in rank who either work for SGI or devote themselves entirely to activities. Those are the brown shirts, the marching ranks.

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