dbc Wrote:
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> "Was one of the 5 streams the
> movement of William Branham? Branham and JRS
> seemed to be very similar."
>
> No, not that I am aware of. I've never heard of
> any connection between Branham and JRS. Branham
> died in 1965 and there were rumors that his body
> had been frozen or preserved (sound
> familiar?).Some hoped he would be resurrected and
> he wasn't buried until after the following Easter
> .... just in case, I suppose. There is a decent
> account of his life and ministry in God's Generals
> by Roberts Liardon. (The first book in the series
> is very poorly written but the rest benefited from
> a good editor.They are a good and informative
> read. You'd be amazed at how little in CLW is
> original.)
>
Thanks for that dbc. There had been some discussion of sources (probably on factnet) that seemed to suggest that JRS had met up with Branham and that their gifts of revelation and discernment about personal lives were similar. Here's an interesting piece on Branham from a book I have call The New Charismatics by Michael G. Moriarty, 1992, page 122.

"Even in the early days of his ministry Branham's life was marked by pride and immaturity. In her book, My Diary Secrets, Freda Lindsay reveals how Branham was puffed up by self-seeking flatterers: When men would get around him and say great things about him, even though in public he appeared to shun them, in his private conversations it was apparent that he thrived on their flattery."

You know you try to figure some of these guys out, were they of God or not of God? Did their ministry feed some emotional need that propelled them to possibly con the public? I don't have the answers of course, but I thought that Freda Lindsay's observation was telling.

I've finally caught up with you guys! That was a lot of reading.

I think you'd find Riss' thesis (it's about the Latter Rain and Evangelical revivals from the late 1940's on, including some insight into figures like Billy Graham) an informative read. God's Generals too - it frankly (if a bit dogmatically) assesses some major failings of historic ministries.

On another note - lots of talk about John Miller. He led the APCO team that set me outside of the fellowship. I was "an enemy of the church" and furthermore "would never be a successful member" - I would "drift from little movement to little movement" for a year or two at a time for the rest of my life.

dbc wrote: “On another note - lots of talk about John Miller. He led the APCO team that set me outside of the fellowship. I was "an enemy of the church" and furthermore "would never be a successful member" - I would "drift from little movement to little movement" for a year or two at a time for the rest of my life.”

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Thanks dbc for the Miller info. Miller was like best buddies with the controlling shepherd in Salt Lake City. It’s all beginning to make more sense now. I never could understand why there was so much going on that wasn’t God. Honesty, sincerity and love for God meant nothing to these people. It was all about who would be a “yes man” for the shepherd’s personal ministry; who would be a follower (flatterer) that they could count on.

I would have been better off joining a desert “four-wheeling club” than CLW. At least a “four-wheeling club” isn’t out to deceive, destroy, rob, malign and exploit in the name of God.

dbc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> On another note - lots of talk about John Miller.
> He led the APCO team that set me outside of the
> fellowship. I was "an enemy of the church" and
> furthermore "would never be a successful member" -
> I would "drift from little movement to little
> movement" for a year or two at a time for the rest
> of my life.
__________________________________________

I say this in love...What kind of punk 30 something history teacher says those things to a brother or sister in the Lord? I guess he thought he was John the Revelator, but he was nothing more than John the Hatchetman. I think FcSLC is right on, those APCO men were not men of God. Thanks for speaking out. BTW, I hope you took some CLW property with you after you cleared out your desk.

I can understand how you feel about Miller. And say what you must, but consider this: Miller did you a favor. He got you out of there. I wish he had kicked me out. Long before I finally left. : )

am I really on this site? been trying forever, I was in the walk for 9 years, back in the early 70to 1981, our paster told us to burn all our tapws and books and took a road trip and I never saw him again!I moved to Maine,tried to find anyone from the walk and then got on with lige. but one day I simply typed u in. i was so shocked and happy to find I was not the only one who survied this. I went to church9x a week and worked in the churches, moving from Oregon to Wyoming to Ohio and visiting Shilo and Seattle!! I loved the church as I knew it. So happy to have foind u

hello, I am so happy to have found you! I was in the church for 9 years early70 till 1981.I've been looking for you.

“Submission”. “The Line is Drawn”. “You Don’t Have Many Fathers”.

Without the above three phrases, the shepherds in Salt Lake City would have been dumbfounded.

No wonder it was so devastating for those who left or were kicked out because with a scriptural diet of this nature, no one would be prepared for “life alone” in the world.

This forum is wonderful. With all the excellent posts and references to “outside critiques/reports,” I have been able to reformulate and “get a handle” on the nature of the Walk. My hindsight isn’t 20/20 yet, but the emotional part has become quite manageable. This forum has made “life alone” in the world okay.

Latter day super apostles and apostolic companies have diminished in significance for me. Returning to the Bible and sound theological thinking along with a more thorough, in depth analysis of what the Biblical authors were intending is providing a means to actually develop an independent spirituality.

Here is one of my fantasy dreams: “Standing up in boldness and declaring with authority to my former shepherd, “Not only do we not have many fathers, we don’t have any!! There is only One, and He’s in Heaven.”” -------- Not to be insanely stuck in the past, this could be classified as destroying heretical, apostate, wrong emphasis teachings still lingering in parts of my brain-washed memory banks.

paleface Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I can understand how you feel about Miller. And
> say what you must, but consider this: Miller did
> you a favor. He got you out of there. I wish he
> had kicked me out. Long before I finally left. :
> )


Exactly. I wish I followed the advice of a shepherd friend, and left when it was easier. He didn't buy into Marilyn and Gary's directive to pray for John return, objected to it in a letter sent to Apco, and some time later received a "good riddance" counseling session. Although with his departure he missed out on at least a couple more years of screaming and heavy drinking...I'm convinced he made the right decision.

FCSLC, the message always thrown at me was "What Would You Choose?".

The ultimate "shut up and get in line" sermon. I did a lot of tugging on the leash over those messages. Finally turned around and slipped out of the choke collar. : )