A.D.

The time of Miller’s removal was late 2012.

Please refer to my Dec. 27 post regarding the smear campaign surrounding this. It is important to remember the culture of fear that is bedrock to the fellowship. Rocking the boat or exiting the church have serious consequences.

Miller’s ‘leaving’ (being removed) was the most significant event in the fellowship in decades, which is why the leadership was ‘manning all stations’ in complete panic-mode. After his removal, he no longer had a pulpit. The folks were fed a new ‘party-line’ the way the leadership wanted it spun. Miller was nephilim, and completely off limits. Any contact with him was to be completely avoided, leaving him no opportunity to convey his side of the story. He was also bound by a ‘confidentiality agreement’ to disclose no details of his removal if he still wanted to receive the paltry severance pension he was to receive. As far as the folks knew, Miller decided to leave on his own and pursue ‘selfish endeavours’--TLW be damned.

When you have a culture that basically believes what they are told from the pulpit, it doesn’t matter what the truth is. One of Miller’s closest friends who decided in favor of the ‘report’ over his relationship ended up having a complete nervous breakdown over the situation. When you are told to deny your relationship (remember the This Week: By Report or Revelation), you are going incur a psychiatric break somewhere down the line which is what eventually happened. This situation was it's own local scandal.

All that said, great efforts were initiated to quell any revolt among the fellowship. Communion Kool-Aid was passed around once again to make sure the troops would stay in line.

With regards to Brent Finney, he continued on with his life outside the fellowship. He and Miller reunited in recent years, but aside from that I know very little.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/29/2015 09:43PM by kBOY.

The Hargraves really have been superb through the years of spinning truth--getting people to believe what they want them to believe, while simultaneously covering their own misdeeds...some bordering on criminal (I'm playing it safe here).
I've directly experienced some of this, and have witnessed people I respected and felt close to--get pummeled in the fellowship, based on on calculated misinformation coming from the top of the authority chain. BTW, denying ministries severance pay, after they've given close to 40 years of service, is beyond callous. Adding insult to injury...wasn't Miller responsible for bringing Gary into the fellowship? Oh my.
Anyway, time to lift my mood...perhaps I'll look at pics of this year's Christmas truck!!

With all due respect, I don't have the same warm fuzzy feelings for John Miller. He is no different from any of the other members of the "Apostolic" Company. It's easy to be amiable when you're popular and the sheep hang on your every word. He gave words and direction that hurt people's lives. (Ours included--I was married at the time.) Many shepherds (me included) and sheep gave forty years and weren't lauded for their service to TLW. Neither did they receive pensions (even modest ones). John set people out of the fellowship too. Maybe he's getting a taste of his own medicine. Was he really that naive? Ellen Miller put in 40 years too. Did she receive a modest pension? Too often the wives of TLW ministries and dare I say it, "Apostles," when deemed unequally yoked, faded into the background while their husbands went on to greater glory in TLW. The sheep are in a real transition and it wouldn't surprise me at all if John finds himself with his own flock. Sheep do tend to go back to what they know. All of that said, my brother still worships Marilyn and believes the lies being told that "nothing has changed." If not for all the harm Gary and Marilyn have inflicted on so many, I would say they are absolutely laughable. No one in the real world could ever take them seriously!

SLANDJT:

Thank you for your candid contribution. There is little doubt that the landscape of TLW is littered with trainwrecks. Your situation sounds like a pattern we are all familiar with. My sincere condolences.

Having been in fairly close proximity to Miller over the decades and still to this day, I can tell you, as a result of many long conversations with him regarding this very subject, that Miller’s heart is to rectify any and all such situations, especially the ones he is unaware of. Unlike TLW leadership as a whole, who wouldn’t give a flying rat’s ass to make amends for any infractions, Miller is not of that ilk. Over the last handful of years since his expulsion, he has been devastated to find out how many people like yourself feel this way towards him. He has made a concerted effort to address every situation he has been made aware of.

Being the ‘dutiful little soldier’ he had always been during both the JRS and G&M eras caused him to be the delivery-boy for much unwanted news. No one was more loyal in delivering the ‘party-line’ of the day, both personal and at-large. It caused him to develop serious blind spots as to the effects it had on individuals, couples, and entire churches. He has now come to painfully recognize this fact. I do not believe there was any honest intent to harm (even though harm was done), but a blind loyalty to a person and doctrine that trumped LOVE to everyone it harmed.

I would heartily encourage you to make contact with him. You will not find a cold-shoulder nor a deflecting justification for actions taken, but an honest and sincere desire to right any wrongs that were committed. This suggestion, of course, is up to you. But know fully that SACRED is the ground where all conflict has been relinquished and PEACE returns.

Thanks for your input, Slandjt. I understand your viewpoint regarding John. My wife was pastored by him when she first came into the church, and his zeal could run over people's lives. But, as kBoy pointed out, there is a quality in John that separates him from most of the rest of Apco, in that he actually is reflective on his impact on those he has shepherded, and willing to be accountable. Also, unlike those presently in charge of TLWF, monetary considerations haven't driven his decisions.
I've mentioned before that I was in the fellowship for 21 years, a "shepherd" for most of that time period. However, my real function, and that of my wife, was to use the talent of our hands to maintain whatever church we were stationed...so that eventually it could be sold, and the Hargraves would have the opportunity to direct the proceeds in a way that would better serve the Kingdom ;)


<Many shepherds (me included) and sheep gave forty years and weren't lauded for their service to TLW. Neither did they receive pensions (even modest ones).>
TRUE
If I had control over TLWF finances, which is basically impossible, I would make sure that people like didn't experience financial hardship as a result of your years of dedication. I think somewhere is the scriptures this attitude is justified.

I guess if anything was learned since I left the Walk over thirty years ago I guess now, is that they seem to understand that the Walk, if anything, may be PART OF the Body of Christ instead of being THE one and only exclusive Body of Christ aka Christ in the Earth. Now, I see the leadership trying to pal up with the Catholics, and I hear Gary got interested in one of the Wham Bam men, can't remember his name, the guy with the tatoos. Hell who knows who they will buddy to next, the Moonies I guess or whoever.

I hope from time to time John Robert Stevens can take a look back into this LEVEL and see how things turned out. After all, he is the one that set in the leadership.

A.D.

Whatever street cred TLW may have had within Christian circles began to decline significantly following JRS’ passing. When you remove the focal point and split the baby in two with schisms, there is not much left to hang your hat on. Since none of what was to come to pass ever came, all were left without any cohesive vision. Those who remained were a heavily invested faithful who had no backup plan.

The ensuing G&M era witnessed a meandering journey of multiple attempts at redefining a fellowship that had lost any definitive direction. We went from the McDougal diet, to Franklin Planners, in and out of Country music, Marilyn Farms, being all about Brazil, trips to Israel (and becoming more Jewish), striking up associations with feathers & gold dust, miracle healings, Bible software, Shiloh U., and cozying up to the Vatican. All this occurred while witnessing the reduction of churches, declining membership, a shrinking tithe base, and many subtle attempts at distancing ourselves from our ‘glory days’.

Simply becoming ‘normal’ seems to be the new norm--not an altogether bad alternative to the outrageous abnormalities of our past.

kBOY when did you finally call it a day with the Walk? I know you were in a long long time, all the way back to the saw mill sweat shop days. What year did you finally decide to get off the sinking ship and start hoping to be there to help others when they finally took the leap? I know you care about the people still in there.

I really hope they will get it together too. But I think to get it together they must at least make an honest statement of accountability. Not the young people in there now, no the older ones, the "elders" that are still there trying to pretend that lots of damage was done under their watch, and I speak here mainly of Gary Hargrave.

I believe God will certainly pick them up and give them direction if they stop pretending to be something they are not. The bible gives that warning, for a man to not think more of himself than he is. I have had to swallow that bitter pill myself. In truth, that bitter pill is a miracle cure, when we realize that we can walk with God if we will stop trying to lead the way.

kBOY Wrote:
> The ensuing G&M era witnessed a meandering journey
> of multiple attempts at redefining a fellowship
> that had lost any definitive direction. We went
> from the McDougal diet, to Franklin Planners, in
> and out of Country music, Marilyn Farms, being all
> about Brazil, trips to Israel (and becoming more
> Jewish), striking up associations with feathers &
> gold dust, miracle healings, Bible software,
> Shiloh U., and cozying up to the Vatican. All
> this occurred while witnessing the reduction of
> churches, declining membership, a shrinking tithe
> base, and many subtle attempts at distancing
> ourselves from our ‘glory days’.

What a long, strange trip it's been. The span of John's ministry in the Walk, and that of G & M's "ministry" in TLWF were roughly the same...64 years total.
Here's to people taking a long-term break away from outrageous abnormalites!

A.D.

I crossed over to the other side in late 2009, after logging in 35 years of dedicated service. Unlike most here on this forum, my exit was not due to adverse circumstances, but followed a glimpse of life beyond the reservation, after which, I cashed in all my chips and snuck out after dark. I was long gone before anyone even realized I had left.

As one would expect after such a long commitment, it took me a couple of years to regain my bearings. Neither during my years in the fellowship nor the years I just referenced did I view TLW as negative, but merely too constricting. It was only after gaining some separation and crossing paths with expats whose experiences were not nearly as positive, that I started to learn something was rotten in Denmark. To this day, I hold no animosity towards anyone in or out of the fellowship, but as with many here on this forum, wish for all to see the light of day and find their way to a life of much greater abundance.

Being one of those who always resided in the cheap seats, I can tell you that more integrity lies with the little people than has ever resided on the platform. For the leopard to change his spots this late in the game is highly unlikely. I’m not saying it couldn’t happen, but it would probably take a major temblor along the San Andreas fault to see that development.

The school of hard knocks has always involved learning to be led rather than lead. Venturing out on our own has usually only delayed finding our way HOME.