I find it interesting and soemwhat unsettling that people. I don't think anyone should have to do the forum as a condition for employment--or a condition for anything. It is wrong--see I am not totally indoctrinated.

Interestingly enough I thought about the whole empowernment before. And I do not have an answer. I can tell you that I am a powerful person in both yeilding results and in personality and as a result I take responsibility for that and when I am having a bad day I know to keep to myself else destroy those whom I come in contact with.....as my commitment is not to leave a wake of destuction in my life.

I can tell the empowerment exercise bothers you. I guess it wasn't a big deal to me....I didn't cry. I think that was one of the thing I chose not to play full out with....

When did you do the forum.

i did the forum in jan 96.

i have a question for u. obviously u didnt
start wailing and screaming and crying
like some of the people did but this is
their empowerment process. they used
to call it the danger process.

what did u get out of it ?

just what did the wailing and screaming
and crying of the other people do for u ?

and when that part is over and then they
start over and talk about how u are doing
the terrorizing to the other people and then
the crowd even goes into hysterical laughter,
what did that do u for ?

Quote
patrick-darcy
i did the forum in jan 96.

i have a question for u. obviously u didnt
start wailing and screaming and crying
like some of the people did but this is
their empowerment process. they used
to call it the danger process.

what did u get out of it ?

just what did the wailing and screaming
and crying of the other people do for u ?

and when that part is over and then they
start over and talk about how u are doing
the terrorizing to the other people and then
the crowd even goes into hysterical laughter,
what did that do u for ?

They must have changed the focus of the forcus of this process because it was all about how irrational it is to be fearful. I didn't really understand why the people around me were wailing. The exercise was like a pindrop in my landmark forum so i can't really say that it did anything for me.

They changed a lot of the landmark forum a few years ago. And when I say changed I mean rewrote the source document. They no longer "clear" partipants before they enter a room if they are late. And from what I've heard set aside other methods of humilation.....

if landmark is a good thing and
not a bad thing, why do u think
they humiliated people for many many
years ?

what do u think the humilitation
accomplished for landmark ?

It has given landmark a lot of cleaning up to do.

I don't really know because I took the new Landmark Forum and the only people I know from the old days are people who have been involved with Landmark. So I cannot really speak about why....because I don't know what happened. All I can tell you is that they have changed the format.

Quote
express
It has given landmark a lot of cleaning up to do.

u didnt answer my question. i asked
u what about the millions and millions
of people that they did abuse, assuming that they no longer do this.

what about the other people ?



I don't really know because I took the new Landmark Forum and the only people I know from the old days are people who have been involved with Landmark. So I cannot really speak about why....because I don't know what happened. All I can tell you is that they have changed the format.

some of the forums are different
is some ways. if microsoft or some
other company is paying or is expected to reimburse their employess
for the classes then the forum is shifted
towards the business. they have an
uncanny knack for making little
clones out of their employees.
happy little people with no right or wrong.

some forums are shifted if not paid
for by corporations then shifted to
the crowd. with all the information
people give out then the forums are
changed to match the crowd. dont
get me wrong they use some of their
tactics i would say practically all their
forums but they can lean then to
being creative. creativity. or they
can lean them more to taking
responsibility, or they can lean them
more to it dont matter stuff.

not all forums are the same. people
i have spoken to in the past have
verifiied this, usually when i have
a discussion with a grad they say
"that didnt happen in my forum "
i have had conversations with several
grads at once and had them talking
back and forum to each other saying
that certain things didnt happen in their
forum. they are not all the same.


because not all forums are the same,
doenst make stripping people of their belief system any more right.

Can we for a moment talk about Dr. Phil? His approach can be considered abusive. In fact, he did Est.

I can't answer your question....

First of all, I don't even think millions and millions af people have taken the Landmark Forum and Est combined.

Also, out of the participants I would venture to say only a fraction of them felt abused. That fraction is a vocal fraction. For example, the two Brothers who wrote the Matrix did the entire program and wrote the the movie as a hommage to the work--be a cause in ones life but nobody talks about that. The guy who wrote Fight Club still participates but noone reallt talks about that. Because these are people who just out there livin their lives. Dr. Phil did Est but No one ever mentions that. The Breast Cancer Walk is inspired by the Self Expression and Leadership Program. These are people clearly making an IMPACT on the world. So the effect of the Landmark Forum is out there in many positive ways. T

Every Forum is different in so far as the conversations that take place inside the distinctions. A business man brings a different concern to the room than a retired school teacher than a college student.

fill me in about dr phil :)

and then if u would please answer
my question.

what about the millions and millions
of people that have been manipulated
by landmark in the past.

what about them ?

fill me in about dr phil --

Doctor Phil did Est in the 1970's. Ever watch him--he's changed the lingo but it's there. He talks about listening through a filter. He even did some class trhough Oprah that lasted way longer than the forum and was stricter.

and then if u would please answer
my question.

what about the millions and millions
of people that have been manipulated
by landmark in the past.

what about them ?

I anwered your question by saying I don't know how to answer that. I did state that it is not millions and millions.