genez

Understand that by attacking me personally you won't change the facts about Theime. What your missing is that I said that when Jesus was alive christianity, was not a cult. The cults were after Jesus. Your just harrassing and disrupting this forum. There is no way, that ex-Thiemites could go onto a Pro-Thieme forum and be able to harrass and disrupt conversations like this. I think the moderator is being very liberal with you.

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This is a joke!. Thieme was a wimp, he just had the HOUSTON POLICE DEPARTMENT TO BACK HIM UP! LOL.

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You mean the same police department that had training in cult practices? During that time parents were kidnapping their children out of cults?

Spin it again. Thieme was only brave when he had the authority of legal use of deadly forces behind him.

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Thieme was like the wee little man behing the curtain in the "Wizard of OZ" I have a friend who wrote Thieme a letter in 1982. He challenged Thieme to trial by combat. You know what Thieme's HEROIC response was? Thieme read the letter to the Berachah congregation (where my friend's family still attended) in an attempt to embarrass THE FAMILY of my friend. The mother and sisters of my friend cried. T H A T IS YOUR "DOESN'T TAKE ANY GUFF" THIEME. Thieme also got his attorney to look at the letter to see if he could file CHARGES!

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Your friend was right? Threatening letters like that? You do seek legal council. Your friend could have been sued.

I think from what Thieme teachings did to my friend's life, if Thieme would have sued, he would have immediately counter-sued. My friend would have had plenty of eye-witnesses. Besides the reason Thieme could not sue was because it was a challenge to fight, not a threat.

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My friend was too smart and worded it just right. No charges were filed.

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So? You have always been a trouble maker. Nice to know the friends you keep.

To people like you, I will always be a trouble.

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Thieme was a gutless coward like many cheeseballs who cheese thier way through life, grabbing "positions of authority" and pervertedly enjoying positions of authority over people like the BTK killer enjoyed. Yeah Thieme was "tough" though when the Houston police Department had his back. Oh yeah real tough lol. AND IT WAS THIEME THAT WAS SHOCKED THAT DAY, PAL.

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Wonder why the Houston Police respected him so highly? At a time when many were calling the police "pigs." All authority was under attack at that time in American history. At your age. You were probably born into it. You have no idea how authority was once respected in this nation.

As so authority should have been attacked. Nixon was trying to turn the USA into a right-wing fascist Imperial empire, just like Bush today. Oh and we lost Vietnam and Communism didn't follow us over here. So the "Domino lie" for corporations to get rich off war (same as today) was nothing but empty rhetoric. Same thing as Bush's fictitious War on Terror. Which Bush has never defined.

read about the right to rebel against authority. [www.gospelplow.net]

The bible even speaks of good authority and bad authority.

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Don't mischaracterize me. I said I thought they were CULTIC christians. One thing that happened, and everybody can see this too, is the difference in the way you reacted when you thought you had something to hide and they way I reacted here, from the History Channel revelation. What it showed was that you were evasive when you thought you were caught doing something wrong. And my reaction showed that even though it didn't look good on me I STILL TOLD THE TRUTH! So who is more credible about Thieme? Someone who runs from telling the truth or someone who tells the truth even though it looks bad? People will decide for themselves. Besides I thought Thieme was supposed to have trained you to have character? Oh well just goes to show, some things can't be trained, they need to be learned.

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Really? believing in the virgin birth is cultic?

I never said that.

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(how does your foot taste? The one that's always in your mouth?)

My foot is not in my mouth.

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Don't mischaracterize me. I said I thought they were CULTIC christians. One thing that happened, and everybody can see this too, is the difference in the way you reacted when you thought you had something to hide and they way I reacted here, from the History Channel revelation. What it showed was that you were evasive when you thought you were caught doing something wrong. And my reaction showed that even though it didn't look good on me I STILL TOLD THE TRUTH! So who is more credible about Thieme? Someone who runs from telling the truth or someone who tells the truth even though it looks bad? People will decide for themselves. Besides I thought Thieme was supposed to have trained you to have character? Oh well just goes to show, some things can't be trained, they need to be learned.

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True! For you did not provide any sources... You just through out alleged quotes of mine. Once you did provide the source? And, others could see the entire thread in its context? I welcomed others to view. You? You deny your intent, and I did provide links from the start.

You did not provide links from the start. Here's what you said from the start

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"I do not know what that is from. Since you do not give the forum and post? I have no idea. Do a search. [u:cf9c72416b][b:cf9c72416b]There is more than one GeneZ[/b:cf9c72416b][/u:cf9c72416b], out there. If you refuse to give a link? I have no idea what that's about. I have no idea if it has not been edited, either.

Run Forrest Run! Admit your intent. You need some barbecue sauce?
lol and Would you show us all the other genezs out there?


Don't mischaracterize me. I said I thought they were CULTIC christians. One thing that happened, and everybody can see this too, is the difference in the way you reacted when you thought you had something to hide and they way I reacted here, from the History Channel revelation. What it showed was that you were evasive when you thought you were caught doing something wrong. And my reaction showed that even though it didn't look good on me I STILL TOLD THE TRUTH! So who is more credible about Thieme? Someone who runs from telling the truth or someone who tells the truth even though it looks bad? People will decide for themselves. Besides I thought Thieme was supposed to have trained you to have character? Oh well just goes to show, some things can't be trained, they need to be learned.

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You believe there was no virgin birth. That, is a sign of a cult, by the way.

It is not a sign of a cult. It's a sign of a non-believer. You need to review what a cult is.

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And? You claim Paul was a false apostle.

I am very skeptical of Paul.

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That ground you are standing on? Is it shaking? Or, is it your knees?

I'm solid. It's your imagination that's insecure because deep down you know you hate who you are and your afraid Thieme is wrong.

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There is no hope in christianity becuase it does not exist. It was a virgin-saviour bedtime story that went from Egypt to Persia and throughout the regions of that time. The Gnostic christians were persecuted in the 1st century becuase the knew christianity was a myth. The Literalist christians - Roman orthodox christians were stupid enough to take it literally. The Romans caught on that it was a religious way to subjugate and persecute people by getting them to do it to themselves - self-persecution - through thier own faith. Wow what a slick way to control people! The Romans were the 1st fanatics of christianity. Just look at the blood lust of the Coliseum. And now the modern day fanatics easily slip in and control.

That was directed only towards cultic Christians? LOL!

Yes. I wanted the cultic christians to re-evaluate what they believed, so I gave them much to think about. I am not requiring anyone to submit to my authority or follow me. What I say is for people to think for themselves, not submit unquestioningly to me. I am merely a witness offering information. By the way have you ever read Gibbon? [www.ccel.org]

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Here's a little barbecue sauce for that foot of your's.

Don't need any.

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You must be getting very tired of its tastes by now.

It is not happening like you want. Thieme is the one that has both feet in his mouth. The facts about Thieme are not going to change, and Thieme's downfall is that it's all recorded.

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In Christ, GeneZ

Yeah "in Christ genez" who hasn't once tried to e-mail personally at Truthtesty@hotmail.com to try to evangelize me, since he doesn't believe I am christian.

Truthtesty

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Truthtesty
genez

Understand that by attacking me personally you won't change the facts about Theime.

Exposing.... Not, attacking.

I believe I have given you enough attention. You have had your say.

People can read through the tread and see what was said, what you believe, and what attitude you take. I need to say no more to you.

Evangelize you? At this point? Why? What could I possibly tell you that you have not already heard?

In Christ, GeneZ

These are the facts genez with the tape recorded message date stamp 26 December 1975. Get the tape and listen to it for yourself. Thieme devaluated christians learning the bible for themselves. FACT. It's not going to change after your spin. Watch before and after spin.

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Per Dr. Wall's dissertation:

"Phil 3 via 11 Timothy 4:8 Doc/Surpassing Grace (SG3),” Philippians, magnetic tape reproduction of message preached at Berachah Church, Houston, Texas, 26 December 1975. He says that if you read the Bible, "you're not going to get anything out of it ... you'd better come to Bible class . . . or listen to a tape." See also Thieme, Super-grace, p. 1.

Ok now genez's spin

genez spin quote

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No Good. Uhh uhh. Philippians 3, and 2 Timothy? Were both written by that heretic, Paul. Remember? You think Paul is anti-Christ? A part of a collection of writtings put together by a cultists emperor?

How can you slam Paul as being anti-Christ one second? And, then use Paul for proof of being right the next? TT? You are in a quagmire of your own making.

Ok now the facts

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Per Dr. Wall's dissertation:

"Phil 3 via 11 Timothy 4:8 Doc/Surpassing Grace (SG3),” Philippians, magnetic tape reproduction of message preached at Berachah Church, Houston, Texas, 26 December 1975. He says that if you read the Bible, "you're not going to get anything out of it ... you'd better come to Bible class . . . or listen to a tape." See also Thieme, Super-grace, p. 1.

You see? It didn't change. That tape is still there. You attack me, but the tape is still there.

genez YOUR SPIN DID NOT CHANGE THE RECORDED FACT THAT THIEME TOLD THIEMITES "you're not going to get anything out of it ... you'd better come to Bible class . . . or listen to a tape" THIS MADE MANY WHO BELIEVED AND TRUSTED THIEME WITH THIER INNOCENT FAITH THAT THEY COULD NOT GET MUCH OUT OF THE BIBLE, BY STUDYING IT FOR THEMSELVES. THIS IS NOT TRUE. THIS CONTRIBUTED TO THIER CULTIC EMOTIONAL DEPENDENCE ON THIEME.

THIEME IS NOT GOD AND DOESN'T CONTROL GOD OR WHEN THE HOLY SPIRIT SPEAKS.

Truthtesty

genez qoute

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I realize that. But I wish to take the wind out of his sails because his approach and attitude needs to be toned down. His sense of overconfidence needs balancing. His attacks need to be shown from what kind of person he is.

That will never happen.

AND if Thieme wasn't cultic in the first place and hadn't attacked my family, then this conversation wouldn't be taking place. I don't start fights I finish them.


Truthtesty

rrmoderator, as someone mentioned earlier, Thieme has only been published in house. If you want to get idea of what Thieme was about, take a look at the late Dr. Eugene Scott. Thieme is the militaristic version of Scott.

Thieme's theology was essentially scholasticism:

[i:7b12f73860]Scholasticism originally began to reconcile the philosophy of the ancient classical philosophers with medieval Christian theology. It is not a philosophy or theology in itself, but a tool and method for learning which puts emphasis on dialectical reasoning.The scholastics would choose a book by a [b:7b12f73860]renowned scholar[/b:7b12f73860], called auctor, as a subject of investigation, for example the Bible. By reading the book thoroughly and [b:7b12f73860]critically[/b:7b12f73860], the disciples learned to appreciate the [b:7b12f73860]theories of the auctor[/b:7b12f73860]. Then other documents related to the source document would be referenced, such as Church councils, papal letters, anything written on the subject, be it [b:7b12f73860]ancient text[/b:7b12f73860] or contemporary.[/i:7b12f73860]

In this case, Thieme is the renown scholar, the critical reading is textual criticism, the theories of the auctor is the non-biblical vocabulary and philosophical teaching models, and the other source documents is the critical/minority/Nestle-Alland/Westcott-Hort/ text.

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Truthtesty
These are the facts genez with the tape recorded message date stamp 26 December 1975. Get the tape and listen to it for yourself. Thieme devaluated christians learning the bible for themselves. FACT. It's not going to change after your spin. Watch before and after spin.

1975? How many years after then was he still teaching?

1975? Almost 10,000 messages ago?


Like I said earlier.

They do not edit his messages. Mistakes and all. He corrected this several times in later messages by qualifying what he meant. He meant when you are first starting out and do not have enough doctrinal foundation? Then we need to be taught by someone qualified.

We all needed a teacher to show us what the Bible teaches in many areas. After one matures? Then you will be able to read the Bible for yourself and grasp a great deal of it. That's what he taught officially.

He was against the subjective erroneous thinking that happens commonly by young believers who think they are qualified to know what the Bible says.

Basic stuff? Yes. Advancing doctrine? That's were many get in trouble.

We have church splits and many denominations because of faulty Bible interpretation.

Now That I jumped back in to clarify your charge? I gladly jump back out.

Anything else that requires details which you misrepresent, I will jump back in. You want to keep accusing with the word Cult? Be my guest.

In Christ, GeneZ

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Truthtesty
My foot is not in my mouth.


Don't mischaracterize me.

Would that be evil, if I did? Its wrong to mischaracterize someone?

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[u:e4b40e56fa][b:e4b40e56fa]There is more than one GeneZ[/b:e4b40e56fa][/u:e4b40e56fa], out there. If you refuse to give a link? I have no idea what that's about. I have no idea if it has not been edited, either.

Run Forrest Run! Admit your intent. You need some barbecue sauce?
lol and Would you show us all the other genezs out there?

That's disengenuous. How did you find me in the first place in another forum? Do what you did the first time. Put in a search for GeneZ. See how many pages are not me.


If I did not have the page link you were quoting? And? I could not see the context? How could I know its what I really said? How could anyone else? I was not even sure what the context was when I first read it.
I gave links to all your quotes.


Thank you for giving me the time to clarify what confuses you.

In Christ, GeneZ

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Truthtesty
genez qoute

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I realize that. But I wish to take the wind out of his sails because his approach and attitude needs to be toned down. His sense of overconfidence needs balancing. His attacks need to be shown from what kind of person he is.

That will never happen.

AND if Thieme wasn't cultic in the first place and hadn't attacked my family, then this conversation wouldn't be taking place. I don't start fights I finish them.


Truthtesty

Well... let's get to the truth of the matter.

How did he attack your family?

Keeping an open mind... GeneZ

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Truthtesty
I think from what Thieme teachings did to my friend's life, if Thieme would have sued, he would have immediately counter-sued. My friend would have had plenty of eye-witnesses. Besides the reason Thieme could not sue was because it was a challenge to fight, not a threat.

You had Thieme in a situation where you could have sued? And, you backed down? My..... this is interesting. You could have had your man? And, you let him off the hook? If he was all you said he was? It would have been your duty to sue.

In Christ, GeneZ

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Truthtesty
To Forum:

BUT according to Thieme, you were supposed to distance yourself from those who wouldn't listen to Thieme.

You were to withdraw from those who were trying to draw you away from learning the Word of God. It did not mean you rejected anyone who did not like Thieme. Friends want you to go out and party? And, skip Bible class? You withdraw from them. That is, if you want to grow in grace and truth. If you do not? The withdraw from Bible study. You a kid? Have parents? They tell you to go? We are to obey our parents until we are old enough to be on our own.

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So the parent either had to either kick thier young adults out of the house before they were ready for the world or force them to listen Thieme.

My Dad had rules if I wanted to stay under the same roof when I became a young adult. If I did not like his rules? I was free to go and find a place to live for myself. Did I like it? No.

Was he within his rights? Yes. I was no longer a child. He did not have to keep me under his roof if he so chose. If my behavior was not what he wanted? I had no right to claim to live there. That's life, sir. Its a part of growing up.

In Christ, GeneZ

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