Hi Concernedmother

I'm not too worried about whether this thread is amalgamated or not I was only wondering - I'm sure the moderators will decide what is best.

You are quite right about the postings from Out of It being related to problems in the Aylesbury branch.

If the posters on the Struthers thread are basing things on assumptions about what happened up north there may be genuine reasons for that.

The Aylesbury church leader is one of the 6 controllers of this tiny church with only 11 branches (some of which have less than a dozen attending) and about 300 members nationally. As such she is responsible for policies and direction affecting all the churches. Struthers is run from the top less like a small denomination but more like you would expect to see in a family controlled business.

There are only 2 Struthers branches in England with about 40 people attending in total. That might be another reason there are fewer postings than from Scotland.

The Aylesbury leader is from Glasgow and was 15- 20 years in the Glasgow church before moving south to take over Aylesbury.

Traditionally the Aylesbury branch members are encouraged to attend a summer camp in Scotland where the Scottish leaders take the lead role in teaching and ministry and where many people have indicated they have had problems.

No Struthers leaders including Miss Anderson have attempted to explain or apologise publicly for any mistakes or harm done in relation to any of the issues raised by the posters on the Rick Ross forum and until they do the fear is that they think these actions of theirs as reported are acceptable way to treat people and in some cases young people.

So if you talk to the Aylesbury leader and she shows some understanding of the concerns on the other forum there might be some safety. If she indicates she would not let any of the things which have happened at other churches or have happened to people in her own church in the past then there may be some reassurance. Unfortunately the only answers we are getting is that the Struthers leadership regard themselves as in all aspects correct and when they make mistakes they have never been known to admit that and apologise. If Miss Anderson disowns and has concerns about what is happening elsewhere please let us all know!

So that is why we are extrapolating that this is a national Struthers problem rather than just one confined to Scotland.

As indicated before that doesn't mean we are right about Aylesbury in that but hopefully the concerns we have make sense in that context.

I hope it all works out well for you and your family.

Hello Covlass,

re: “One question Id like to ask is, are your daughters friend and her family a part of the Struthers church?”

No, not currently at least.

re: " I would alsp ask to see a copy of their Safeguarding Children Policy and ensure that all youth/childrens workers are CRB checked. Any organisation that works with children and young people should have such a policy in operation. Personally I would steer well clear of an organisation thats doesn't. “

I’ll take note of that, as sounds like eminently good advice and i never realised there was such a thing.

Hello Concerned Mother
As Chesterk55 has posted above, the leader of the Struthers group at The Refuge is Scottish, from Glasgow, and spent 15-20 years in the Struthers Glasgow church before apparently receiving a call from God to move south and lead a group of people in the London area who had been coming up to Struthers Camps and conferences in Scotland for many years. She set up her group in a building known locally as The Refuge and it has been operating there approximately since the nineties. The leader of it was thoroughly schooled and trained by the previous Struthers church leaders in Glasgow and Greenock and is thoroughly schooled in Struthers ways and completely loyal to them and to the present leaders back in Scotland. The leaders, of which she is now one (appointed by other Struthers leaders), pride themselves on the complete and indissoluble unity which they all operate in, and that they get each others approval before making a move to do something. What I am saying is this, that the group at the Refuge is totally and completely Struthers, with the same teaching, same ethos, same approach to child-care, training children their way, and holding on to people to keep them in their own church and away from all other churches. It isn't and never will be different from the other Struthers churches, so I think you'd be advised to read the posts on the Forum about Struthers Mem Church. From my own lengthy experience in this church, I think it is abusive and unhealthy and I would strongly urge you to be very wary of letting your daughter become involved.

I am quite surprised to hear that your daughter has been invited to children's events there since I have not been aware of many children's activities going on at The Refuge and in fact, there are very few children of church families attending this group. It is quite a small group despite it being known as the Struthers London branch of the church, and it hasn't grown much since it was started at the Refuge. They will have a Child Protection policy document and the youth workers will be CRB checked. (they are in the Scottish branches anyway). That's not enough in this context though, as we're talking about subtle spiritual and emotional abuse, which can cause long-term damage to adults and children alike.

Although not from the Refuge , i think this post from the other thread bears being reprinted here, considering the original question concerned how Struthers threads their young children:

Take special note of the comment at the end where the poster says that after his experience in this church he felt resentment against christianity, but AFTER READING THE CRITIQUES on this forum, he now actually wants to start attending church again. It would appear that the poster had no idea that not ALL churches, pentecostal or otherwise are like struthers.

Quote
Anonymous43762

Hi. I discovered this forum after searching for Struthers Memorial Church. I wanted to find if anyone else had the same experiences as I had, and boy, did I find more than that. I attended this church in the 1980s on a regular basis as a young child upto my early teens. My family was very much indoctrinated into the SMC way of thinking. We were told that TV was evil, modern music was evil, certain clothing was evil, hairstyles were evil etc. As a result, I grew up in the belief that all these things were evil and would corrupt me and my life would be ruined. My family often told me to either bring my friends into the church or to shun them as they weren't in the church and as a result, I lost a number of good friends.

I attended Glasgow church on Sunday mornings / evening and Friday evenings. We attended Greenock on Saturday nights.

I do have some happy memories of visiting Wiston Lodge every year and 'doing the assault course' or 'doing Tinto', but as I grew older, I moved from the youth programme into the adult meetings at camp and that when it really started to get disturbing. The pastor at the time was Mr Hugh Black assisted by Miss Mary Black and there was someone called Miss Taylor and I remember being absolutely terrified from her. She seemed to be very disturbed and almost maniacal when she preached.

The indoctrination has lasted into my adulthood and I took a lot of anger and resentment about this church. I consider myself a christian and I try to follow a christian life, but I frequently find myself in conflict with the teachings I took as a child from this church with what my beliefs are now.

There were frequent occasions when I was a child when I questioned the church and the people who lead the church. This frequently resulted in severe whippings when I got home as questioning this church is considered sinful and evil and noone should ever question the guidance of the leaders of this church. I believe this is not what the bible teaches. Doesn't the bible teach us to question things and to love one another. Not beat them. I would then be bought before Mr Black who would then 'lay his hands' on me and 'heal me', even though there was nothing wrong with me.

Before I found this forum, I actually felt that all churches would be like SMC and, as a result, felt some resentment against christianity in general, however, now I realise that this is not the case and my resentment is only directed towards SMC. Trust me, when I discovered this forum, so many posts hit home and reading some of them had me in tears as I now realise I'm not the only one who feels this church abused it's position.

My family still attend. They are not well off, however, they feel they must contribute to the collection which I am aware pays for the private school which only the priviledge few are able to get any advantage from. Shouldn't this church be helping the local community with the fundraising they do and the contributions from the members?

I feel that if I discussed this with my family now, the conversation would go the way of me being sinful and the motives of the SMC should never be brought into question, but I tell you, this church works on the power that a small number of leaders have over the congregation and the amount of control they exert over their lives and they will never release that hold. This is completely out of line of the bible teachings.

A surprising result of finding this forum and reading the posts is that I would actually like to start attending church again.

ConcernedMother.

You should also be aware that prior to Pauline Anderson taking over the running of the Refuge in Wendover, back in the formative days of the Refuge group - in the 80s, Diana Rutherford moved down England to be with this branch and spent several years alongside another Struthers pastor - Joan Jewell to help run and minister to the small group of Struthers followers that was to become “The Refuge".

Both Diana Rutherford and Joan Jewell are now pastors of seperate Struthers churches up in Scotland, and it is this same Diana that is at the heart of many of the complaints raised in the other thread.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/14/2011 12:10AM by seekingsusan.

In connection with the above post by seekingsusan, you can read two posts about the above Buckinghamshire group, on the Struthers Memorial I P Church Forum on this website, on page 17, dated May 17th 2011 and posted by "Stephen" who says he attended there in the 80s.
Yes, it's the same church and same leaders.

Rensil – well done for spotting that –I remembered there had been some reference, but wasn’t sure where it was. Hopefully that and other recent posts will provide some of the info Concernedmother is looking for.

To all reading the forum, I still want to add something about how the overall organisation works however. It still seems to me that there is a danger that local experiences of one branch are used to evaluate whether this is a healthy church. That might be the right way to judge the local Anglican, Baptist or Pentecostal fellowship but it is, in my experience, not a useful measure in terms of the Struthers movement.

For example, I recall a situation where a person who was leading a local group making a promise about support to others then, on the instruction of the overall leaders of the movement (from a different town) simply did the opposite. When questioned, the response was “I don’t want to talk about it” - a response that was endorsed by the leaders. That’s it – no struggle, no conscience, no honesty or integrity, simple blind obedience. When the leader was asked about it the response was basically “it is more important to obey God than man”. Only people who accept this level of obedience are allowed to be members of branch churches.

In these circumstances, how the local branch is run cannot really be the sole criterion. The local leaders will accept being overruled by the hierarchy and will feel under no obligation to explain or apologise. It can be black one day and white the next and the only explanation is “God has told me it is white”. You will not even get agreement that it used to be black, that it was right to be black at the time or that it was a mistake to be black. Everything is irrelevant except for the discernment of the leaders, so you simply get, “It is now white. God has revealed this. You cannot argue with God. I am not prepared to discuss whether it used to be black or not.”

That’s the way it works. The authority of the overall leaders is absolute, and removes all obligation for discussion, reference to scripture, explanations of different decisions in the past or anything else. Under these circumstances, faith in local individual leaders is largely irrelevant.

As I have said elsewhere, this is not an opinion or an accusation, I am simply being a witness to what I have seen.

Here a condensed list of testimonies posted on the main Struthers thread:


Goldengirl

I have read with much interest all of the postings on this site and having been in Struthers church for a number of years, then left, I feel I can identify with many of the experiences shared here. First of all, as a teenager I started to go along to meetings with a few of my friends and very quickly changed from a happy outgoing child who belonged to various groups and organisations, to a teenager who felt worthless and inadequate and never quite good enough. The messages that came from the front via various people were that God's love only came through a lot of human effort which involved giving up friendships, hobbies and attending every meeting. This is how I tried to live my life, even as a very young teenager, but it was never good enough. I remember paying a lot of money to attend church camps and have some memories of the games and “fun times” being fun however being utterly miserable during the services where the message being forced upon us by testimony and preaching was condemnation and a need for deliverence. Often there would be an appeal for all the demon possessed to go to the blue room!! Then would come the Friday night service where the” breakthrough” would come. The immediate meetings following the camp would be the same faces testifying to the amazing change to their lives by receiving ministry, advice and often from the experience of the camp. Within a short period of time these same people often suddenly came across other issues in their lives that stopped them “getting through” to God and had to repeat the same process of more deliverance, ministry etc.

don't remember at any time being taught of the grace and the mercy of God's love. I don't remember being taught of the unconditional love of God nor do I remember this ever being displayed by any of the leadership or by those “in training” for leadership. I do however recall harshness and heavyhandedness and an awful lot of unhappy, miserable and very burdened christians.
The word of God tells us that “there is now therefore no condemnation in them that love Christ”

I thank God for my salvation. When I did leave Struthers I learned about the whole gospel of Christ and read the word for myself. I listened to teaching that was driven by both a love for God and others and was not judgemental. A leaders job is to deliver the unadulterated word of God not enforce it, it is to guide and to lead by example by allowing their ministry to be an extension of the lives they lead.
On reflection on this website, it makes me sad that the Struthers leadership has not responded to the testimonies of many people who have taken time to record how they were affected by poor leadership and poor representation of the gospel. I suggest that when these leaders are alone, perhaps before they go to sleep at night or even as they look back over their lives they may realise the harshness and poor treatment they have given out to others was wrong. This sight is giving the Struthers leadership a chance to respond to peoples hurts and confusion and to change their ways.

Pilgrimess

Hello. I have read the various comments over a couple of months, with interest.
My experience was years of commitment in Struthers, the last 10 or so where I felt bound in to something with a feeling of not being able to escape. It will seem incredible to anyone who has not been in this kind of situation to try to understand why I stayed in it for so long. It is a complex thing to be involved in such a machine.
I will introduce myself by sharing a few of the things which puzzled me. Why did Struthers always start a separate Christian gathering at Higher Education establishments? Why was the established Christian Union not considered good enough? Why, when women were doing almost everything in the 'meetings' did the female leader insist that when the sacraments were being given out it had to be done by one man and one woman, not 2 men?

Why, when Bible classes were run, were females allowed to lead the group (at that time comprising mostly young boys) on their own but when a male was on the rota he had to be accompanied by a female? (This was nothing to do with 'Disclosure' but to do with the church leader not trusting the spiritual condition of men.) I know some young men who have turned out to be strong and highly respected friends in their own part of society who were frozen out at a young age as they were considered 'dark'. So I have now introduced myself and explained my position!

scottishlassie2011

Having been "Saved" into this church at the age of 10, I grew up in one of the outlying branches. Despite this fact, I guarantee that not 1 person outwith the branch I was in knew my name. Indeed when I visited the main church in Glasgow, someone asked if I was a new member (this was after being in SMC for more that 20 years!). I was deeply hurt by many people in this church and, whilst not wishing to pull down any fellow brothers or sisters in Christ, I do believe that SMC need to look within their own walls before they can grow and move on. I went from being an extremely happy and outgoing child and a deeply surly and withdrawn teenager solely because of the treatment received in SMC. This carried into my adult life causing me to have a deep mistrust of people and transferring that into a deep inability to trust God. I was so fortunate to have a close friend invite me to their church where I met amazing and wonderful people. I have been able to work through my issues and, with the love and support of my new friends, learnt to trust again. As a result, my life in God has been able to go deeper. Indeed I am now a youth leader and am deeply active in my church. SMC do need to look at how the treat members and realise that "naming and shaming" from the pulpit is not in anyway an acceptable way to run church. The culture of fear does indeed make many people insecure and feel that they are unable to question anything preached from the pulpit. Many times I've personally been told that I should " just get on it with and not question " when I challenged leadership indeed being forced to preach when I was clearly not wanting to or able to do this. Indeed once I heard it preach that if someone, after leaving SMC, says that they are growing more, you should question whether they are settling for lower walk in God. There is definitely an elitist attitude there that they are THE church and anywhere else is just not as good. Surely, as long as God is at the helm of any church following the gospel, it doesn't matter where you go as long as you are growing in God and are reaching out to those outside of the church to those who haven't heard the good news. Indeed I don't think my whole time in SMC, I heard them saying anything about going out on the streets or supporting charities. I'm also betting that most of those who tithe to SMC realise how much of that goes towards to up keep of Cedars School! Since leaving SMC and moving to another church, I have grown so much more and am now indeed ready and able to do so much more now that I am able to grow and become exactly what God intended me to be. Those who have been deeply hurt by practices here should take courage from this. I know personally now that God can and indeed does help you to work through problems encountered by your times in SMC. 


Chris19

As an escapee of Stuthers, from time to time I would check out their website and marvel that in the years since I left, the sermons ( I could only bear to listen to a few minutes) had not really changed. Still the same call to introspect and uncover hidden idols and unworthiness etc. It came as a bit of a surprise to find this site and although I haven't read all of the posts, I can identify with many of the things which have been said. I don't want to repeat stuff but thought I would offer the following comments 

There seems to be some hurt and frustration that only a chosen few are picked out by the leadership and that they get preferential treatment. Those to whom the leaders are not drawn are just left to get on with it despite all their best endeavours. I don't disagree with this but want to offer a different perspective. I was one of those singled out. It was flattering and for a time I did seem to benefit spiritually from greater access to the leaders. However with this came greater demands. My life became completely transparent to them. Although I had little life outwith the church anything I did do had to be reported to them. If you think it's bad sitting in the congregation listening to a condemnation sermon just be glad you didn't have it on a one to one regular basis! By the time I was told by the leadership that God had destined me to a single life I was in SMC hook line and sinker. I wanted to honour God and be obedient but at the same time I didn't agree with what I was told. Over the course of several years I tried to leave several times. My absences were always followed up and pressure bought to bear. I was told that I would miss God's plan for my life and I would always feel what I had snatched (ie marriage and kids) would be second best. Most times I caved in quickly, repented and rejoined the fold, only to be sucked in even deeper. Looking back I know my reservations did not go away - I just tried not to listen to them because I genuinely and passionately loved God and wanted to serve Him. On one occasion I lasted several weeks before returning which had to be marked by me repenting in testimony form by acknowledging the error of my ways (although I didn't have to give the specifics). Ultimately I left not because of the leaders but because I realised I wanted a fuller life. By this point I was estranged from my family and had few "normal" friends. Worst of all as others have also said, by leaving I felt I was turning my back on God. I didn't cross the threshold of a church for years because I felt I had disobeyed God. Happily I now an active member in a God-centred rather than Leader-centred church. Those to whom the leaders are drawn should not be the envy of others - they should be pitied. In my case, demands and sacrifices were made which, in retrospect were not of God and as a result it took me years to recover. 

Over a decade after I left I requested a meeting with one of the leaders and unlike the experience of some others, this was granted. After a bit of small talk I broached the subject of how damaged I felt as a result of some of my experiences in SMC. Whether the surprise I witnessed was genuine or feigned I don't know. I was told that they thought they had been acting in my interests. I wasn't met with hostility or anger just an incapacity to really hear what I was saying. It was then suggested we pray together. Their prayer contained the words "if by my actions I have caused hurt then I regret this but God You know this was never my intention". I suppose I should be grateful to have had this acknowledgment but I was furious at the lack of resonsibility taken- I had just spent 10 mins or so detailing the negative ways in which their actions had affected me - as far as I was concerned there was no "if" about it. I realised at this point that there was nothing they could do or say which would ever suffice. 

I know there are some wonderful people in SMC who have a deep faith. Despite my experiences I don't think the leadership deliberately set out to harm their flock. But as they have been immersed in rigid teaching for decades it is all they know and if it has been helpful to them, then they want others to come to the same place. Lack or tolerance and flexibility have always been issues though it sounds from some of the postings that this has become worse in recent years. In place of fearful introspection I now have joy in my life and that is a real gift from God.


Anonymous43762

I attended this church in the 1980s on a regular basis as a young child upto my early teens. My family was very much indoctrinated into the SMC way of thinking. We were told that TV was evil, modern music was evil, certain clothing was evil, hairstyles were evil etc. As a result, I grew up in the belief that all these things were evil and would corrupt me and my life would be ruined. My family often told me to either bring my friends into the church or to shun them as they weren't in the church and as a result, I lost a number of good friends. 

I attended Glasgow church on Sunday mornings / evening and Friday evenings. We attended Greenock on Saturday nights. 

I do have some happy memories of visiting Wiston Lodge every year and 'doing the assault course' or 'doing Tinto', but as I grew older, I moved from the youth programme into the adult meetings at camp and that when it really started to get disturbing. The pastor at the time was Mr Hugh Black assisted by Miss Mary Black and there was someone called Miss Taylor and I remember being absolutely terrified from her. She seemed to be very disturbed and almost maniacal when she preached. 

The indoctrination has lasted into my adulthood and I took a lot of anger and resentment about this church. I consider myself a christian and I try to follow a christian life, but I frequently find myself in conflict with the teachings I took as a child from this church with what my beliefs are now. 

There were frequent occasions when I was a child when I questioned the church and the people who lead the church. This frequently resulted in severe whippings when I got home as questioning this church is considered sinful and evil and noone should ever question the guidance of the leaders of this church. I believe this is not what the bible teaches. Doesn't the bible teach us to question things and to love one another. Not beat them. I would then be bought before Mr Black who would then 'lay his hands' on me and 'heal me', even though there was nothing wrong with me. 

Before I found this forum, I actually felt that all churches would be like SMC and, as a result, felt some resentment against christianity in general, however, now I realise that this is not the case and my resentment is only directed towards SMC. Trust me, when I discovered this forum, so many posts hit home and reading some of them had me in tears as I now realise I'm not the only one who feels this church abused it's position. 

My family still attend. They are not well off, however, they feel they must contribute to the collection which I am aware pays for the private school which only the priviledge few are able to get any advantage from. Shouldn't this church be helping the local community with the fundraising they do and the contributions from the members? 

I feel that if I discussed this with my family now, the conversation would go the way of me being sinful and the motives of the SMC should never be brought into question, but I tell you, this church works on the power that a small number of leaders have over the congregation and the amount of control they exert over their lives and they will never release that hold. This is completely out of line of the bible teachings. 

A surprising result of finding this forum and reading the posts is that I would actually like to start attending church again.

Chesterk55
The persistent message over decades from the same few platform speakers is that the long term committed Christians of Struthers Memorial Church are failing God (in more and more hard to detect ways) because, despite 5 meetings a week and all their holidays given over to church camps, they are not doing enough "holiness". Not surprisingly this can have a corrosive effect on people. This change in people is alluded to in the first post on this discussion where Ohio asks about a dramatic negative personality change in her long term friend.

Grace-girl

Hi all, i have recently left struthers,i was in one of the outlying branches and i have to say that the people there are kind and loving,and not like the leaders being described in this forum. I do have issues with the main leadership in the west though,which is one of the reasons i left the smc movment! I have had experience of feeling inadaqute and not part of the "in crowd" i was in smc for over 20 years. Although God blessed me greatly during my time in smc, i always felt i never quite made the grade! I am now looking to where God will take me in my walk with Him,although i do still have to deal with the fact i have no friends outside struthers and will have to almost try to rebuild my life!

Uncertain
I am currently attending one of the branch churches. I recently started attending another church too after various restrictions were placed on me. I have been told that I need to repent but I do not know of what I need to repent. 

I have also felt very intimidated by control. I was told I was putting family first when I missed a meeting to attend a family birthday party. 

I am very drawn to the standards of holiness in Struthers and I enjoy the deep presence of God in the meetings and the singing. However, I am concerned by the excessive control and the way that the discernment of the leaders is expected to be accepted unquestioningly.

Clive

I have been to a summer camp ran by Struthers Memorial Church and several of my family are members of it.

Many things trouble me about this church. Firstly it is heavily woman led. Even if one were to have no objections to the idea of female leadership, pastors and preaching and teaching by women, it is a fact that in the Struthers group there seems to be a definite bias towards women leaders. Currently the leader is a woman.

I reckon there are at the least three “satellite churches” belonging to this group that have women pastors. It is based i understand in the history of the church. A woman - “Miss Taylor” was a founder and while alive it appears the the church regarded her as being heavily “anointed”.

When I was at the camp and asked why there seemed to be such a female bias and, as an evangelical, naturally raised my concerns about why they as a pentecostal church claiming to be evangelicals I was given this answer: They “comply” with scriptural teaching because they have a man providing the “teaching” and leadership ( ie “head” as in the letters of Paul ) roles, the women merely give “talks” and "laying on of hands” and so on.

However since the death of their male leader Hugh Black, the church is now led by a woman and as stated before, many of their sister churches and groups are totally led and taught by women pastors. When I suggested recently that this conflicts with what other evangelical and pentecostal churches teach, i was given a new “rationalisation” about how this is still scriptural. Basically it boiled down to the fact that in the Epistles, Paul uses the “I” word when giving the command for women not to be allowed to teach. Thus Struthers members appear to use the excuse that since Paul specifically states that this admonition comes from Paul personally and NOT the Lord himself, then they as a church are free to choose not to implement that command. This reasoning seems to me to be suspect and a case of special pleading designed merely to allow the Struthers church to carry on adopting its idiosynchratic approach to pentecostalism. This is worrying especcially considering that on other matters this church is staunchly fundamentalist.

My second concern with this church is its heavy emphasis on its leaders. Although it is not unusual the believers tend to flock to churches specifically because of a certain individual being the pastor, in the Struthers movement this is taken to an unhealthy level.

My third and last worry about this church is that as part of its overt focus on “Holiness”, members and particularly children are groomed to consider other churches and christians, not to mention the “world outside” to be considered less spiritual, committed, mature etc.

Many cults will used the supposed “shunning” of sin and the “world” as a device to “lock-in” their followers to their own sect. Athough admonitions to live pure lives and avoid the “world” are found throughout scripture, the Struthers group takes this to dangerous levels - so for example it is often implicitly if not explicitly taught that its members should avoid contact with the media, newspapers, television, and the creative industry because of its worldy corruption.

Whether this qualifies as a true cult depends of course on how one defines a cult, but the above, coupled with a general feeling that Struthers Church members and its teachers themselves often feel no qualms about claiming that their church is somehow “special” and superior ( for example in terms of supposed "anointing”, “holiness” and commitment ) suggest that there is an implicit exhortation on its members NOT to consider any alternatives outside of this movement. It is a common tactic of cults to paint any doubts or objections my their members about the sect itself ( or its teaching ) as a sign that the member raising the objection is somehow at fault spiritually, rather than merely raising valid concerns. Such sects often couch such criticisms about their sect or leadership as “attacks fro the devil” and simply and aspect of their “spiritual warfare”.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/29/2011 08:22PM by seekingsusan.

and more:



Rensil
I also found that rules made by the church leadership can change but with no announcement of the fact or instruction to the members. For example, it used to be that women were not allowed to wear trousers, especially not jeans. Nowadays most of the women there wear trousers including, in the younger women, tight-fitting jeans. Nothing is said. The wearing of hats for women ceased also, with nothing being said; it was just that graduallly women stopped wearing them. Before then, not wearing a hat was said to be a sign of disobedience to the leaders. 

Other things concerned me, one of which, not so far mentioned in these posts, is their healing ministry, so much so that people are afraid to say they are ill because that indicates that there is something wrong in your life, or you don't have enough faith or you've lost the healing you had, so basically, it's your own fault. Some people have experienced great confusion and upset on this matter.
….
we were continually told in SMC that it was not a good idea to visit other churches or outreaches, because, we were told, Christians in other churches were not living as holy lives and weren't as fully committed to Christ as SMC members and leaders were. I heard this said again and again from the platform and was also told it during personal counselling with SMC leaders. We were not allowed to put up posters or adverts for other churches or outreaches, although in more recent days, I believe some have been put up. The reason for not putting them on display, leaders told us, was that they could draw people away (from SMC) to other places, and they did not want this. Their twisted reasoning then propagated the idea that to leave and go elsewhere meant that someone was leaving their high calling in God to go an easier road. So that's why they see others as the enemy. 
I am amazed that I actually swallowed this lie for many years, for that's what it is, it is a complete lie.

susie
My experience of S.M.C. When I went there at first no one was allowed to talk to me. The Pastor of the Cumbernauld branch seemed to hate me on sight. The time I was there I was emotioally abused. The abuse was very subtle it came in the form of; giving me dirty looks at every meeting, throwing remarks at me from the platform while she was preaching, ignoring me, saying and doing very unkind things to me when we were on our own, taking me down in front of others and so on. I went to see her about some of these issues and I was told that it was all my imagination and that I needed deliverance, because I was demon possessed. 
This only caused me further trauma. I could say much more but I will leave it there, by the time I had left I was quite ill, as I had lost the ability to know the difference between right and wrong. I had developed postmatic stress syndrome a condition that soldiers get in a war, also the shock of it all has made 50% of my hair fall out. I still get flash backs and really bad dreams, that hang over me for days at a time. I have also lost two of my family through this woman Pastor, that can never be made up for. To my mind this is a very dangerous woman Pastor, who should not get to be anywhere near innocent children.

….. Thank you for your prayers. Is has taken me a while to speak out about this one, reason being I felt really stupid that I sat so long under that kind of abuse, while I happily gave my tithes every week, as well as my time in doing things for the church coffee shop. I knew also that no one would believe me. I had known there was something very wrong for a long time, but I could not trust my own feelings on this as it involved the servants of God. I now realise that many of God's people have suffered at the hands of the leaders in S.M.C. I do not know what the next step is for me, but I know there is one. I had been told stories about the people who had left I now know that these stories are not true. I remember one young woman who made accusations against the leader of the Cumbernauld branch of S.M.C. after she left the Pastor Diana Rutherford told us she was mentally ill. I met this woman several weeks later and got a very different story. This young woman now has written a book and is on the God channel ministering to others who need help.

I know what you mean by the other branches of S.M.C. having the same abusive system in place. I would like to point out to you, that the Pastor of the Cumbernauld branch is more known for her so called decernment than anything else. She holds great sway over the other branches of Struthers and her word is paramount in the church as a whole. I do believe that many an unsuspecting soul has been damaged on her say so alone. I remeber a story about one of the young leaders who took the fire conference who took a liking to one of the young people who came along to church. Then the Cumbernauld Pastor came on the scene, had a few words with this young- likely leader to be and everything changed. Make no mistake the woman has great influence in that church, I some times wondered who really was in charge of the S.M.C.

oldskool
…reading through all your posts brings back a lot of memories for me,having been brought up in the church through the 70's and 80's.....i have to say things haven't changed very much!i would say that quite tellingly 95% of my peer group(including myself) are no longer there. i have very happy memories of wiston lodge and the fun we all used to have there,although these are tempered with memories of sitting through 5-6 hours of meetings a day,back then there were not always youth meetings as today.

if you listen to some of the flowery descriptions of miss taylor that you will all have heard,she was the lords anointed,however growing up she absolutely terrified us all,very very intense with zero time for anyone not completely willing to bend to her will.this is where the control freakery (heavy shepherding) that you talk about comes from,todays leaders learned at the feet of a dictator!
mr black was not in the driving seat at any time! 
i was listening to mr black preach about 10-12 years ago when he claimed that his phobia ministry had a 95% success rate,does anyone know how he could substantiate that figure?as regards the comments about women ministry struthers has always been driven by feminine doctrine,the two main founders were women,as have all leaders since,with the exception of mr black although it could be argued he was leader only briefly between miss taylor and miss black. 
Mr black was a lovely man in many ways,and although fundamentalist in his outlook i always found him caring and approachable,by the sound of things todays congregation don't have that luxury with their leaders. 
is television approved of now?when i was a young teenager there was a list of things miss taylor disapproved of,t.v.,christmas trees,any shopping on a sunday,make up,jeans(especially on girls!),perms,anything not bible related really. 
i could go on for a long time,i have seen both sides of struthers in action,there are good people there and there are self-seeking aggressively ambitious sycophants there,along with a few fundamentalist pharisees,i will let you work out which is which

…

Growing up in SMC very much affected how i got on with other kids in school,all the way through primary for example once the school day ended and at weekends i would not really socialise with them,the only birthday parties i would attend would be church ones and the summer holidays would usually be used going to camps.none of us thought anything about strange about it,it was all we knew,and as i said before camp was a happy time, although as you got older,the amount of meetings would start to do your head in.a lot of my generation became gospel hardened,i would switch of with the first hymn and waken up with the last prayer.

and more..:


Biscuits

I was a kid and a teenager in SMC, and although I loved the worship and the very real presence of God (totally addictive), I felt under the most extreme pressure to perform. I remember in one Saturday night kids’ meeting in Glasgow, the leader made everyone sit in a circle and asked everyone who had been baptised in the Spirit to raise their hands. (This by the way is synonymous with speaking in tongues – I was once at a camp where a poor teenage girl got verbally shot down for suggesting that even although she didn’t speak in tongues, she knew she was filled with the Spirit). Every kid raised their hand – even the tiniest ones – then everyone was encouraged to share their experiences of when it happened. Naturally, the age of ‘being filled’ decreased rapidly with each story being told. As I remember it, there were certain places, things and brands which were acceptable, and others which were not. Make-up, ear-piercing and (in my day) Bebo Norman were a big no-no. Star Wars, Lord of the Rings (Mary Black was a big fan), photography and anything made by Apple were things you should invest a lot of energy in. It seemed to lie on the shoulders of a few people in a kind of ‘magic circle’ to determine what was kosher, like foreign holidays (at my time forbidden, now ok) or strappy summer tops (oh, the embarrassment of a friend being asked to change at camp!). It was exhausting keeping up with what I was allowed to do. I attended meetings every single night of the week and twice on a Sunday – and similar to what others have said, absence was always noted and strictly followed up. Superiority was encouraged – working with other churches was not. And all the time I remember the fear of being found out to be not good enough, or not holy enough; not living up to what the leaders planned out was a terrifying thought. Stories filtered through to us teens (sadly can’t vouch for the accuracy of them) that certain people had been dissuaded from marrying the person they wanted to because the leaders had deemed they were not the right person for them. I was terrified for falling for the wrong person and having heartbreak heaped on shame!

I do remember a couple of people leaving the church while I was there and the whole affair being massively hushed up. There seemed to be a hardness, and a blatant lack of compassion – in a way that I have seen very similarly demonstrated by members of the Westboro Baptist Church when someone makes the heart-breaking decision to leave their whole family’s chosen way of life. My experience of leaving was very similar to everyone else leaving SMC – first questions, then shunning, then ex-communication. One final thing I would say is that I have heard some of my acquaintances still in SMC say that it is a growing, vibrant church. Vibrant maybe, I suppose that’s in the eye of the church-goer, but I find it pretty hard to swallow that it’s growing. The ‘leadership’ team doesn’t seem to have changed for ten years as I can see it, and when I look at recent pictures of activities in the church, I recognise everyone in them. Strikes me as a big odd, is all. Needless to say – God is no man’s debtor, and what the devil means to harm us, God only brings to prosper us. He has taught me so much through the whole experience and I have an ongoing hunger to know God at a deep level. I just pray so much I will never again be dogmatic, blinded and hard - God is just too full of love;

SolaScriptura

I am so glad that others have had the same experience that I have had! I am also conscious of people having left the faith altogether because they are fed up of not 'feeling' anything or not understanding simple concepts such why God doesnt do everything they ask, when they ask it! There is a sense that if God doesn't give you what you ask for then it's your own fault which is ridiculous and wrong in the extreme! Whereas I say there is a reason why the Lords Prayer says "your will be done"! I went to this Church for years, the first time I went they prayed for me to be 'baptised in the holy spirit' this seemed to me to have more focus than being born again. It was mentioned in the same sentence be a Christian and be baptised. At first I didn't do anything but when they persisted I just copied them and believed I was speaking in tongues when actually it was just gibberish. I also spoke to a girl who the people didn't like and was told to stay away from her, when I refused I was ostracised. Eventually she was told to leave the Church and I left anyway. I remember when I wasn't healed feeling sinful, when I didn't have what other's had 'spiritually' I felt useless and as if my relationship with God must have been rubbish. I have since realised I didn't want more of God but more of his Gifts, it wasn't for His glory but my own!

When my friend committed suicide I was told I shouldn't be hanging around with people like that anyway. That really hurt me because I knew I was not 'doing anything wrong' although recognising that we are all sinners, it was not a great sin to befriend someone who was struggling with life.

I pray that God would enlighten them through scripture! The bible is read and God can speak through that, I pray they would see through the hype and see that God is amazing just by being GOD! He is not amazing because he can make you 'drunk in the spirit', he amazing because he is Glorious! Yes he can heal but as Spurgeon says he's not a celestial bellhop to do our own will at out beck an call! We are the servants and he is God! I'm glad God found me again! All Praise to him , glory and honour forever! He is sovereign over all things and he will bring his Children to him through the preaching of the word, he even brings people to himself when people are in error! Our God is an awesome God! 

I am a woman and totally disagree with woman ministers and even woman elders to be honest, woman can have other roles in Church and this compliments the men. I also don't think the holy spirit would EVER accuse you of sin in front of people, he can gently rebuke but the accuser is ALWAYS satan! I remember the minister ranting that some people didn't know the difference between the voice of God and the voice Satan and how this was shocking, the reason for this is that they were not told that God's voice is heard THROUGH SCRIPTURE and not your imagination and they were imagining their own desires and worrying that they were not doing it right! Encourage the reading of the word, not experience! 

I have had to re-learn scripture and repent of demanding of God and doing things to 'fit in' to the Church! I praise God that his sovereign grace has led me home! 


English

My parents were members of one of the English branches of SMC, as a child I attended dutifully with my brothers from a young pre teen age. 
We had been to churches before CofE and Penticostal, happy places in the main with happy people running them. I thought I knew what to expect.My illusions were shattered when the first contact we had with the leaders was a lecture on how we were to behave, sit at the front, dont look around and behave. We went on many camps and met some truly lovely people. SMC back then seemed to attract a certain type of person, it was there I met my first drug addict, first alcholic and my first demon possesed person. SMC seemed to be a magnet for either the less fortunate or, if you look at it another way, people who previously liked to really enjoy themselves. It always struck me that the majority of leaders were school teachers, even our English branch was run by school teachers, and they were all controlled by the fat controller himself, Mr Black, oh and his daughers Grace (if ever someone was misnamed it was her )

My main beef with SMC was the amount of control levied by the leadership, there was no tv in our house, popular culture was banned and if Mr B could have fitted into a horse and carriage and got a horse hair shirt to fit then Im sure he would. My Dad used to tithe a 3rd of his wages, not a percentage which would have been intelligent, a 3rd. Were did it all go ? Who accounted for it ? Some may say that it was used to invest in the stock market. Some may say an awful lot of it was lost in the late 80's stock market crash. Certainly non was ever spent on the damp, miserable edifices in Greenock and Pudsey. Is SMC a cult ? I doubt it, it wasn't then, I was given the choice by my parents of attending or leaving once it obvious I was never going to become a missionary or a devoutee of Mary Charmicheal. Is it now ? I sincerely hope not, when I was there, as I said, there where so many happy people there who wanted to do great things. Shame they were all in the congregation


Stephen

Many years ago, certain SMC members run the youth group in Buckinghamshire. Certainly this was a female dominated group and favour was given to the women and to one teenage male, who always wore a suit and tie, and received birthday presents, when all other males did not. The Anglican Church, saw through them and kicked them out, and they left, taking the females with them. Such was their control. I left before this, as I was made aware on numerous occasions, that I was out of favour, even after a face to face with the husband, Derek. Joan controlled the show, and when Derek gave his testimony about smoking on the bus in Glasgow, he was told, in front of his young audience, that there would be more to discuss later, on this matter.Even now, one of the girls was so enamoured by the leader, that she named her child after the daughter of the leader, it was an unusual name as well.

clare

I always found the speakers very inspirational , but i always felt also that i fell short of their standards of holiness. I have learnt since that its what God requires of me that counts . Struthers is very specific and not for everybody , i think they should be more open about this and be aware that people go there sometimes for the wrong reasons , searching for their personal path and its not necessarily the Struthers way that is appropriate. It can seem the ideal way, the highest way and they present it like that but i think there is a lack of wisdom . I think its aimed at single people , it provides a noble alternative to a relationship maybe, ( check out the number of single women who minister in the church). You can leave there feeling very "down" very unworthy ,very negative and i dont think these feelings come from God, i simply think its because you shouldnt have been there its not for you. God is everywhere not just at Struthers.

I had a long time friend who was very involved with them and still is probably, the last time i heard her speak i have to admit the phrase that came to mind was that she a Struthers "clone" there was nothing wrong with what she said but it was the way it was delivered , only someone who had been to struthers would recognise it . She would say it was because she has the same annointing as they do but i dont think its that at all and i was sad to see my friend transformed into someone that made me just a little embarrassed when she spoke. I think this church, and others like it does damage, but unknowingly. I have been a christian since 17, i am 50 now and have come to some conclusions . God is far bigger far greater than we could ever imagine we must stop putting him in a box labelled struthers or any other movement for that matter. am sure of three things, I know he exists ,i know he has ultimate control , i know he cares for me on an individual level .

…..

I too had an experience of so called deliverence at their hands where nothing happened after a lot of speaking in tongues . I felt stupid actually, embarrassed to have divulged something very personal and then nothing happens. No-one was wise enough or had sufficient discernement to say to me, "well i'm sure there is nothing wrong dear" I felt i was being laughed at by "he who's name must not be mentioned" and i dont mean lord valdemort! Sorry, the new Harry Potter film is out isnt it!! i mean i really felt the" father of confusion " was having a right good laugh at my expence watching me tell them about sins from the past in case i had a demon etc.I can see how lonely christians who so want to please God and find their way in life end up being easy prey . But do they, the leaders of SMC, do it knowingly or are they themselves victims of lies , confusion and lonliness. At one time i bought every book that came out of SMC, Hugh Blacks writings at least AND the camp tapes , i would listen and read avidly, and where do you think it got me? Thats right no where! a whole lot of what i can only call spritual masturbation, which left me just as lonely and frustrated as at the start.

My experience of God now, is that He is just not like this , we are far harder on ourselves than He is, do we really think the Lord of all the universe and beyond needs our pitifull attempts at holiness, i think what matters to Him is us wanting the truth , believing in Him and trusting Him, above all trust Him. Its not complicated really and they(SMC) make it so complicated .



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/29/2011 08:16PM by seekingsusan.