There's a lot more than just two sides to the story... more like about a hundred. And none of them are "the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth." I was raised there and I can't even give you that - all I can give you is my perspective, what I saw, what I experienced. After living with the shadow of the tragedy for twelve years, I've quit trying to find the "truth." It doesn't exist except at the personal level. One truth applied generically to all, is in essence "cult" mentality in itself. "Rules of Engagement" is propaganda... as are the reports from the media regarding the Davidians... as are the personal testimonies of survivors, and people who left. Including myself, when you really look at it, I suppose. And that is the problem in trying to sort out what happened and why and who did what. Frankly, it doesn't matter to me anymore. I will remember the people I loved, and do my best to live the rest of my life with the pieces of faith that are "true" to me, from there and elsewhere. That's all any of us can do I suppose.

There were many loving and good people that died within the Davidian compound in 1993.

You should remember them with love.

The problem was not really the Davidians, who had after all lived peacefully in the Waco are for decades.

The problem was David Koresh, who was a very sick and destrutive man.

Sadly, this is the tragedy of destructive cults.

A group of people that become so dependent upon a leader to think for them, that they arrive at decisions which are not in their own best interest and may result in tragedy.

Thank you for pointing out that the Davidians had lived peacefully in the Waco area for decades. In a way, that goes back to the issue of people who still "stick with" the Davidians... people like Clive Doyle, who was mentioned earlier in this thread - had been with the group long before Koresh came along. The whole history of the group was one leader following another, which was fine until something - and I'm beyond trying to figure out what - went very, horribly, tragically wrong. I think - and this is just my guess - that some of the survivors are just waiting for another to come along and pull what's left of their group back together and lead them forward on the spiritual journey that they've determined is "true" to themselves. I only pray that if and when that happens, it will be as the history of the group, an honest person with sincere purpose and not lead to another tragedy. For everyone's sake.

I don't think David Koresh left enough people alive to hold the Davdians together as a meaningful sect.

His leadership destroyed the group and its future.

When people have invested so much in a group it is very difficult to just walk away from that emotional equity.

Clive Doyle lost his family and a lifetime. It seems impossible for people like him to admit they lost everything over an evil man that turned out to be a fraud.

Ver sad ending for the Davidians.

There were only nine survivors of the 4/19/93 fire, but over thirty women, children, and elderly exited Mt. Carmel during the 51 day siege - and as far as I can tell, no official list of those people is publicly available. I used to think that the group had been completely wiped out in '93 but when I started researching it as a young adult looking back on a very wierd childhood and trying to make sense out of it... I realized there's a lot more than just the nine fire survivors. There are at least three groups using the Davidian name in the Waco area... and one that I know of in the Austin area, and each has an extensive mailing list of supporters and followers scattered throughout the world. I don't know how much of the various groups is overlap of the same people, or how many of those people are survivors, people who exited durign the seige, people who left before the 2/28/93 raid, or people who have become involved after the events in '93. The only thing I know for sure is, the more I read on the various groups and beliefs, the wierder the entire thing seemed. Which is why I'm not in any hurry to follow *any* particular denomination... I've had enough wierdness for one lifetime, thank you.

Although the government said they went to Waco jsut to arrest Koresh (real name Vernon Howell) and other BD leaders, reprtedly Koresh and others went in and out of teh complex during the time it was surrounded.

TBP:

Koresh and his followers never went in and out during the standoff.

And that was not reported by any reputable media source.

See [www.culteducation.com]

Quote
TBP
Although the government said they went to Waco jsut to arrest Koresh (real name Vernon Howell) and other BD leaders, reprtedly Koresh and others went in and out of teh complex during the time it was surrounded.

Not exactly. The government had the group under observation - with undercover agents posing as college students in a house accross the highway - for over a year. During that time Koresh and others came and went freely by the "main" road leading to the front of the property, or by the "back" road which was a more direct route to town.

At any rate the DOJ report notes that the survelience during this time was innaccurrate and misleading because the undercover agents could not see who was coming and going via that back road route - which was most likely the one more used.

During the actual siege - between 2/18/93 and 4/19/93 - the only comings and goings were of the Davidians who left, two people who snuck past police lines and joined the Davidians inside Mt. Carmel for a brief time before coming back out and being promptly arrested, and the Davidian's lawyer who was allowed to go in and talk to them (I think once, perhaps twice? Not sure on that info at the moment).