The Power of Now - Eckhart Tolle - Cognitive Suicide
Posted by:
Toni
()
Date: October 22, 2004 02:58AM
Hi all,
Interesting conversation / speculations (as always).
"The Power of Now" was recommended to me by so many folks, but I kept falling asleep when reading it. I actually enjoyed the CDs while commuting though. Some of it bizarre, but some helpful reminders too. T. mentioned some sources of material on one of the CDs, comparing various philosophies, etc, but I don't remember what they were.
I got a kick out of watching sequel books, workbooks, etc coming out. Can't blame him for trying to make a buck. I'm not aware though of Tolle claiming himself to be a deity, nor of having any 'secret' teachings, workshops, etc. All seemed to be pretty above board (I have not paid close attention though). I frankly question whether Tolle was creating the followers, or whether the follower mentality was creating Tolle.
Just a thought... with the combined knowledge and experience of the posters on this board.. how about if we go into business and found our own cult? We could make a bunch of $$, speak real slowly and spacey, tell folks to trust their inner possibilities by listenting to us, etc. WE know it's a proven formula!
:lol:
Interesting conversation / speculations (as always).
"The Power of Now" was recommended to me by so many folks, but I kept falling asleep when reading it. I actually enjoyed the CDs while commuting though. Some of it bizarre, but some helpful reminders too. T. mentioned some sources of material on one of the CDs, comparing various philosophies, etc, but I don't remember what they were.
I got a kick out of watching sequel books, workbooks, etc coming out. Can't blame him for trying to make a buck. I'm not aware though of Tolle claiming himself to be a deity, nor of having any 'secret' teachings, workshops, etc. All seemed to be pretty above board (I have not paid close attention though). I frankly question whether Tolle was creating the followers, or whether the follower mentality was creating Tolle.
Just a thought... with the combined knowledge and experience of the posters on this board.. how about if we go into business and found our own cult? We could make a bunch of $$, speak real slowly and spacey, tell folks to trust their inner possibilities by listenting to us, etc. WE know it's a proven formula!
:lol:
The Power of Now - Eckhart Tolle - Cognitive Suicide
Posted by:
PSIsurvivor
()
Date: October 22, 2004 03:38AM
About a year ago when I was still struggling with my PSI Seminars involvment another PSI person suggested reading Eckhart Tolle's book.
I read the book a couple of times and bought the tapes as well. I listened to them several times. I found a local group that the leader of claimed to be not only enlightened, but that ET himself had ackknoweleged her enlightenment. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
Sitting with that group was a strange experience. The leader appeared to be stoned on valium or something. She had a very strange slow way of talking as if it was difficult for her. The house was richly decorated and in an affluent area of town. She obviously had money. They did ask for donations as well. When I walked by the basket and did not put any money in i noticed that the woman next to me gave me a strange look. I imagined that she felt sorry for me. It seemed like a pity look hmmm. what ever. After a while of silent sitting the leader picked a man out of the group and said something like "i've seen you here a few times. Come up here and sit with me. Then she started asking him questions like who is it sitting here with me? To make a long story short all of his answers just got him another question. He was sobbing in her lap within 10 minutes. I felt very uncomfortable and never went back.
After a long time of pondering ET I conclude that he is just another creep who plays the guru game for cash. I want nothing to do with him or his groups or his writing. I feel lucky that I could see the manipulation, greed, and lust for power. I find it most unappealing.
The problem is my new boss and a few of my co-workers have gotten into the ET craze. My boss actually brought a deck of cards with ET sayings on them to the last work meeting and passed them out to everyone. She instructed us to read them aloud and then to reflect on them. It really creeped me out.
I need to confront her about it before the next work meeting, because it just is not okay with me that religion is pushed by the boss at work.
It is amazing to me to talk to the people who like ET. They seem to read the book and swallow it whole. Doesn't anybody think about what they read? I mean really it's crazy shit that he writes and I see people suck it up like gospel truth. ugh.
I read the book a couple of times and bought the tapes as well. I listened to them several times. I found a local group that the leader of claimed to be not only enlightened, but that ET himself had ackknoweleged her enlightenment. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
Sitting with that group was a strange experience. The leader appeared to be stoned on valium or something. She had a very strange slow way of talking as if it was difficult for her. The house was richly decorated and in an affluent area of town. She obviously had money. They did ask for donations as well. When I walked by the basket and did not put any money in i noticed that the woman next to me gave me a strange look. I imagined that she felt sorry for me. It seemed like a pity look hmmm. what ever. After a while of silent sitting the leader picked a man out of the group and said something like "i've seen you here a few times. Come up here and sit with me. Then she started asking him questions like who is it sitting here with me? To make a long story short all of his answers just got him another question. He was sobbing in her lap within 10 minutes. I felt very uncomfortable and never went back.
After a long time of pondering ET I conclude that he is just another creep who plays the guru game for cash. I want nothing to do with him or his groups or his writing. I feel lucky that I could see the manipulation, greed, and lust for power. I find it most unappealing.
The problem is my new boss and a few of my co-workers have gotten into the ET craze. My boss actually brought a deck of cards with ET sayings on them to the last work meeting and passed them out to everyone. She instructed us to read them aloud and then to reflect on them. It really creeped me out.
I need to confront her about it before the next work meeting, because it just is not okay with me that religion is pushed by the boss at work.
It is amazing to me to talk to the people who like ET. They seem to read the book and swallow it whole. Doesn't anybody think about what they read? I mean really it's crazy shit that he writes and I see people suck it up like gospel truth. ugh.
The Power of Now - Eckhart Tolle - Cognitive Suicide
Posted by:
SarahL
()
Date: October 22, 2004 04:46AM
His official web site has a photo section, 7 different close ups, all available for purchase, certainly looks to me that they are intended for devotion/reverence/meditation.
He does have official disciples, that term "disciple" used, Katie Davis is one.
His story is included in the book [u:f90b45dc63]Mystics, Masters, Saints, and Sages: Stories of Enlightenment [/u:f90b45dc63]by Robert Ullman and Judyth Reichenberg-Ullman, this themed on the "moment of spiritual enlightenment of masters of spirituality from all traditions, ancient or modern, known or unknown.. " and "The focus of the book is on the crucial point of realization in the lives of each of these saints and masters that led to his or her awakening to the divine reality."
His followers hold him in awe, from what I've read, anything he does is seen as mystical and enlightened. They focus a lot on his eyes, and on his personality, all with the belief that he is mystically superior.
Eckhart Tolle himself may not have created this spreading community of devotees, but he definitely is going along for the ride. He may very well believe his own rep. Devotees may be responsible for marketing him, I still hold him responsible.
He does have official disciples, that term "disciple" used, Katie Davis is one.
His story is included in the book [u:f90b45dc63]Mystics, Masters, Saints, and Sages: Stories of Enlightenment [/u:f90b45dc63]by Robert Ullman and Judyth Reichenberg-Ullman, this themed on the "moment of spiritual enlightenment of masters of spirituality from all traditions, ancient or modern, known or unknown.. " and "The focus of the book is on the crucial point of realization in the lives of each of these saints and masters that led to his or her awakening to the divine reality."
His followers hold him in awe, from what I've read, anything he does is seen as mystical and enlightened. They focus a lot on his eyes, and on his personality, all with the belief that he is mystically superior.
Eckhart Tolle himself may not have created this spreading community of devotees, but he definitely is going along for the ride. He may very well believe his own rep. Devotees may be responsible for marketing him, I still hold him responsible.
The Power of Now - Eckhart Tolle - Cognitive Suicide
Posted by:
SarahL
()
Date: October 22, 2004 04:56AM
Quote
Just a thought... with the combined knowledge and experience of the posters on this board.. how about if we go into business and found our own cult? We could make a bunch of $$, speak real slowly and spacey, tell folks to trust their inner possibilities by listenting to us, etc. WE know it's a proven formula!
I am reading Carl Sagan's [u:35eed9251b]The Demon-Haunted World, Science as a Candle in the Dark[/u:35eed9251b] , he describes a purposeful hoax of this nature done by James Randi and a friend, José Alvarez.
Info also on:
[skepdic.com]
The Power of Now - Eckhart Tolle - Cognitive Suicide
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: October 22, 2004 05:12AM
Good luck at work. Read up the laws that protect your spiritual/intellectual autonomy.
It would be interesting to know whether the group leader's behavior described by PSI is typical for a Tolle group leader, or whether this person was atypical.
It would also be interesting to know what kind of training she received to function in this role, and whether her personality was different before she underwent the leader training, or if there was some kind of change.
That kind of questioning described by PSI can be an exercise in power. Vulnerable people can be shaken up by it--as PSI described.
Someone with a reputation as 'being enlightened' will already be given a lot of power by members of such a group and that person may not know how to use such power in a responsible manner.
Its not good to do that kind of intense questioning if you're an authoirty figure with no training as a mental health professional. At least the professional goes by the prime directive 'Above all do no harm' and would known when to stop such questioning when the other person shows signs of becoming stressed.
One has to wonder whether that group leader made arrangements to check that man's welfare after the meeting and made sure he had someone to check in with if he continued to feel fragile--'after care'.
It would be interesting to know whether the group leader's behavior described by PSI is typical for a Tolle group leader, or whether this person was atypical.
It would also be interesting to know what kind of training she received to function in this role, and whether her personality was different before she underwent the leader training, or if there was some kind of change.
That kind of questioning described by PSI can be an exercise in power. Vulnerable people can be shaken up by it--as PSI described.
Someone with a reputation as 'being enlightened' will already be given a lot of power by members of such a group and that person may not know how to use such power in a responsible manner.
Its not good to do that kind of intense questioning if you're an authoirty figure with no training as a mental health professional. At least the professional goes by the prime directive 'Above all do no harm' and would known when to stop such questioning when the other person shows signs of becoming stressed.
One has to wonder whether that group leader made arrangements to check that man's welfare after the meeting and made sure he had someone to check in with if he continued to feel fragile--'after care'.
The Power of Now - Eckhart Tolle - Cognitive Suicide
Posted by:
SarahL
()
Date: October 22, 2004 06:48AM
I had some time today for research and I thought I’d attempt to find out how big Eckhart Tolle and related enterprises are. The answer is HUGE. I finally just stopped researching because it would be endless. Many many people involved, most list each other as references, most are working on the devotional guru wavelength. They are presented as enlightened masters. Some tuck themselves directly under Eckhart, some consider themselves Eckhart's peer as another in the Papaji lineage.
Workshops, books, web pages, tapes, videos, satsangs, classes, music, photos for sale, cable tv programs, newsletters, forums, enneagrams, various organizations and charities, prison work, even a [u:3ef3a662e4]three year [/u:3ef3a662e4]intensive is available.
Just a small taste:
[www.sundanceburke.org]
[i:3ef3a662e4][b:3ef3a662e4]Sundance[/b:3ef3a662e4] teaches with the love and blessings of [b:3ef3a662e4]Eckhart Tolle[/b:3ef3a662e4], the loving confirmation of [b:3ef3a662e4]Gangaji [/b:3ef3a662e4] and Beloved [b:3ef3a662e4]Katie Davis[/b:3ef3a662e4][/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.sundanceburke.org]
[www.katiedavis.org]
[i:3ef3a662e4][b:3ef3a662e4]Katie Davis[/b:3ef3a662e4] teaches with the love and blessings of [b:3ef3a662e4]Eckhart Tolle[/b:3ef3a662e4] and the loving confirmation of [b:3ef3a662e4]Gangaji[/b:3ef3a662e4][/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.katiedavis.org]
[i:3ef3a662e4][b:3ef3a662e4]Gangaji[/b:3ef3a662e4] was born Antoinette (Toni) Roberson Varner in Mississippi in 1942. She had searched a lifetime for personal happiness and fulfillment. She pursued many different things to change her life including relationship, parenting, political activism, career and spiritual practice. Life circumstances improved, however ultimately the longing remained. She made a final prayer for help.
In 1990, her prayer was answered. Her husband, [b:3ef3a662e4]Eli Jaxon-Bear[/b:3ef3a662e4], who was also a spiritual teacher, went to India and discovered a teacher named Sri H.W.L. Poonja, endearingly called [b:3ef3a662e4]Papaji[/b:3ef3a662e4]. Eli invited Gangaji to India to sit with this extraordinary teacher who was a disciple of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi. There, on the banks of the Ganges river and upon meeting Papaji, Gangaji realized the Truth of Being. Her story of personal suffering ended in true fulfillment.[/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.gangaji.org]
[i:3ef3a662e4][b:3ef3a662e4]Gangaji[/b:3ef3a662e4], an American born teacher and author, has traveled the globe since 1990, speaking with spiritual seekers from all walks of life. [/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.leela.org]
(Eli Jaxon-Bear’s organization)
[www.leela.org]
[i:3ef3a662e4]The Three-Year Group is an opportunity to be with [b:3ef3a662e4]Gangaji[/b:3ef3a662e4] and [b:3ef3a662e4]Eli[/b:3ef3a662e4], and be truly supported by the people around you as you awaken and deepen into realization and establishment. It is an opportunity to make a three-year commitment to retreat twice a year with the same group.[/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.eckharttolle.com]
[i:3ef3a662e4][b:3ef3a662e4]Eckhart[/b:3ef3a662e4], who graciously and lovingly likes to support the teachings of spiritual truth, offered his support via his own web site to [b:3ef3a662e4]Karen McPhee[/b:3ef3a662e4], who now has her own web site.[/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.livingnow.ca]
[i:3ef3a662e4]“[b:3ef3a662e4]Karen[/b:3ef3a662e4] holds the consciousness frequency of Presence with grace and gentleness, thus facilitating the emergence and growth of Presence within each participant. My love and blessings go to her and all the wonderful people attending her sessions.” [b:3ef3a662e4]Eckhart Tolle[/b:3ef3a662e4][/i:3ef3a662e4]
[i:3ef3a662e4][b:3ef3a662e4]Karen[/b:3ef3a662e4] is an expression of clarity, grace and strength. Utterly real and playful, she artfully embodies the transmission of Eckhart's heart.
I highly recommend her gatherings."[b:3ef3a662e4]Pamela Wilson[/b:3ef3a662e4][/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.pamelasatsang.com]
Workshops, books, web pages, tapes, videos, satsangs, classes, music, photos for sale, cable tv programs, newsletters, forums, enneagrams, various organizations and charities, prison work, even a [u:3ef3a662e4]three year [/u:3ef3a662e4]intensive is available.
Just a small taste:
[www.sundanceburke.org]
[i:3ef3a662e4][b:3ef3a662e4]Sundance[/b:3ef3a662e4] teaches with the love and blessings of [b:3ef3a662e4]Eckhart Tolle[/b:3ef3a662e4], the loving confirmation of [b:3ef3a662e4]Gangaji [/b:3ef3a662e4] and Beloved [b:3ef3a662e4]Katie Davis[/b:3ef3a662e4][/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.sundanceburke.org]
[www.katiedavis.org]
[i:3ef3a662e4][b:3ef3a662e4]Katie Davis[/b:3ef3a662e4] teaches with the love and blessings of [b:3ef3a662e4]Eckhart Tolle[/b:3ef3a662e4] and the loving confirmation of [b:3ef3a662e4]Gangaji[/b:3ef3a662e4][/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.katiedavis.org]
[i:3ef3a662e4][b:3ef3a662e4]Gangaji[/b:3ef3a662e4] was born Antoinette (Toni) Roberson Varner in Mississippi in 1942. She had searched a lifetime for personal happiness and fulfillment. She pursued many different things to change her life including relationship, parenting, political activism, career and spiritual practice. Life circumstances improved, however ultimately the longing remained. She made a final prayer for help.
In 1990, her prayer was answered. Her husband, [b:3ef3a662e4]Eli Jaxon-Bear[/b:3ef3a662e4], who was also a spiritual teacher, went to India and discovered a teacher named Sri H.W.L. Poonja, endearingly called [b:3ef3a662e4]Papaji[/b:3ef3a662e4]. Eli invited Gangaji to India to sit with this extraordinary teacher who was a disciple of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi. There, on the banks of the Ganges river and upon meeting Papaji, Gangaji realized the Truth of Being. Her story of personal suffering ended in true fulfillment.[/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.gangaji.org]
[i:3ef3a662e4][b:3ef3a662e4]Gangaji[/b:3ef3a662e4], an American born teacher and author, has traveled the globe since 1990, speaking with spiritual seekers from all walks of life. [/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.leela.org]
(Eli Jaxon-Bear’s organization)
[www.leela.org]
[i:3ef3a662e4]The Three-Year Group is an opportunity to be with [b:3ef3a662e4]Gangaji[/b:3ef3a662e4] and [b:3ef3a662e4]Eli[/b:3ef3a662e4], and be truly supported by the people around you as you awaken and deepen into realization and establishment. It is an opportunity to make a three-year commitment to retreat twice a year with the same group.[/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.eckharttolle.com]
[i:3ef3a662e4][b:3ef3a662e4]Eckhart[/b:3ef3a662e4], who graciously and lovingly likes to support the teachings of spiritual truth, offered his support via his own web site to [b:3ef3a662e4]Karen McPhee[/b:3ef3a662e4], who now has her own web site.[/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.livingnow.ca]
[i:3ef3a662e4]“[b:3ef3a662e4]Karen[/b:3ef3a662e4] holds the consciousness frequency of Presence with grace and gentleness, thus facilitating the emergence and growth of Presence within each participant. My love and blessings go to her and all the wonderful people attending her sessions.” [b:3ef3a662e4]Eckhart Tolle[/b:3ef3a662e4][/i:3ef3a662e4]
[i:3ef3a662e4][b:3ef3a662e4]Karen[/b:3ef3a662e4] is an expression of clarity, grace and strength. Utterly real and playful, she artfully embodies the transmission of Eckhart's heart.
I highly recommend her gatherings."[b:3ef3a662e4]Pamela Wilson[/b:3ef3a662e4][/i:3ef3a662e4]
[www.pamelasatsang.com]
The Power of Now - Eckhart Tolle - Cognitive Suicide
Posted by:
Cosmophilospher
()
Date: October 22, 2004 03:41PM
The quote below seems "inhuman" to me. Perhaps he would take that as a compliment.
I hate to be so blunt, but it really seems "schizoid" to me. Its robotic. Its fragmented.
Its also wrong.
We are HUMANS, which are primates, and we have DEEP emotional relationships with our Kin.
To each their own, but that stuff is just too bizarre for me.
My worry is that some people will freak themselves out with all of that Depersonalization, and get severely depressed, and have a breakdown.
But if that what floats their boat, that's their business.
But give me 30 minutes on video with Tolle, and i could show the audience that he is STILL a little old fallible UNENLIGHTENED human like the rest of us. (that's the James Randi in me talking!) :lol:
Coz
I hate to be so blunt, but it really seems "schizoid" to me. Its robotic. Its fragmented.
Its also wrong.
We are HUMANS, which are primates, and we have DEEP emotional relationships with our Kin.
To each their own, but that stuff is just too bizarre for me.
My worry is that some people will freak themselves out with all of that Depersonalization, and get severely depressed, and have a breakdown.
But if that what floats their boat, that's their business.
But give me 30 minutes on video with Tolle, and i could show the audience that he is STILL a little old fallible UNENLIGHTENED human like the rest of us. (that's the James Randi in me talking!) :lol:
Coz
Quote
SarahL
Reading the essay and interview with Tolle that Kim Eng did is informative also. This bit is spooky, Kim speaking here of her own experiences:
[i:cc1f88515a]What is it like to be in relationship with an enlightened being?
As long as I have the idea in my head "I have a relationship" or "I am in a relationship," no matter with whom, I suffer. This I have learnt.
With the concept of "relationship" come expectations, memories of past relationships, and further personally and culturally conditioned mental concepts of what a "relationship" should be like. Then I would try to make reality conform to these concepts. And it never does. And again I suffer. The fact of the matter is: there are no relationships. There is only the present moment, and in the moment there is only relating.[/i:cc1f88515a]
The Power of Now - Eckhart Tolle - Cognitive Suicide
Posted by:
Cosmophilospher
()
Date: October 22, 2004 03:51PM
Holy CRAP!
The LAST thing people need to do when driving is to flake out with that hypnotic mindf*ck stuff!
Focus on the NOW of your DRIVING!!!
Or this might be your LAST MOMENT ON EARTH!
:lol:
Coz
The LAST thing people need to do when driving is to flake out with that hypnotic mindf*ck stuff!
Focus on the NOW of your DRIVING!!!
Or this might be your LAST MOMENT ON EARTH!
:lol:
Coz
Quote
SarahL
[i:b41ebc1b6a]The NOW Symbol
Formed by two simple characters, the NOW symbol signifies the present moment. > represents the completed past. < represents the future, which is unknowable. The gap between the two marks is NOW - the present moment. It is only in the moment that we can really enjoy life and release ourselves from the mental noise that clutters our brain. [/i:b41ebc1b6a]
.
The Power of Now - Eckhart Tolle - Cognitive Suicide
Posted by:
Cosmophilospher
()
Date: October 22, 2004 04:03PM
Thank you for this ENLIGHTENED post! You are much more "enlightened" than Tolle! I am serious when i say that.
He is playing the Guru card.
He is also promoted by New World Library, who are very big players in the New Age field. They MARKET-SELL the shit out of this stuff. Its Big Money, millions of dollars.
You are correct. Religion is not appropriate in the workplace in this manner. Its New Age Religion.
Coz
He is playing the Guru card.
He is also promoted by New World Library, who are very big players in the New Age field. They MARKET-SELL the shit out of this stuff. Its Big Money, millions of dollars.
You are correct. Religion is not appropriate in the workplace in this manner. Its New Age Religion.
Coz
Quote
PSIsurvivor
After a long time of pondering ET I conclude that he is just another creep who plays the guru game for cash. I want nothing to do with him or his groups or his writing. I feel lucky that I could see the manipulation, greed, and lust for power. I find it most unappealing.
The problem is my new boss and a few of my co-workers have gotten into the ET craze. My boss actually brought a deck of cards with ET sayings on them to the last work meeting and passed them out to everyone. She instructed us to read them aloud and then to reflect on them. It really creeped me out.
I need to confront her about it before the next work meeting, because it just is not okay with me that religion is pushed by the boss at work.
It is amazing to me to talk to the people who like ET. They seem to read the book and swallow it whole. Doesn't anybody think about what they read? I mean really it's crazy shit that he writes and I see people suck it up like gospel truth. ugh.
The Power of Now - Eckhart Tolle - Cognitive Suicide
Posted by:
Cosmophilospher
()
Date: October 22, 2004 04:07PM
The Demon Haunted World is truly a a terrific book.
Its too bad Sagan died so soon after.
He could have written a few more in this vein.
There is so much great info packed into that book.
Coz
Its too bad Sagan died so soon after.
He could have written a few more in this vein.
There is so much great info packed into that book.
Coz
Quote
SarahL
I am reading Carl Sagan's [u:e0003e429d]The Demon-Haunted World, Science as a Candle in the Dark[/u:e0003e429d] , he describes a purposeful hoax of this nature done by James Randi and a friend, José Alvarez.
Info also on:
[skepdic.com]
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