Corboy you edited out the best part of your original post!!!!


Pardon me for misquoting but you sum it up so well, and non offensively!!


"The more secure someone is with thier spirituality the less they need to convince others they are right."

That can be said of just about anything but here it has more relevancy.

Nuff said.

To Hope:
Seeing how you are a doctor, I can see how you would be offended by what I write, but I do not apologize for what I have said.
Concerning the man with cancer; he was a member of our church who did go to doctors. He had throat cancer. Diagnosed by a doctor. He had received many prophesies that stated two different things; first that God would heal him of this cancer, and second, that his time here on Earth was short, to make sure that he was prepared to come home. The doctor had already told the man that there was nothing that he could do for him(this happened in the mid to late '70s, so what was avaliable now was not neccessarily avaliable then). A servant, being led by the Holy Spirit, spoke a command over this man, commanding him to be healed. At once the man began coughing uncontrollably. As he left the service area, a few men went with him. They watched as the man coughed up the cancer. Many others saw what the man coughed up. When the man went back to the hospital to check if it was cancer that he spit up, the doctor was amazed that the man no longer had cancer. It had completely dissappeared and left no trace of it presence. A few weeks later the man died in a car accident. Both types of prophisies came true. What happened was declared a miracle by your own colleage.
Concerning the death of our dog:
I have seen enough dead animals to know the difference between one that is dead and one that is alive. Just because you feel that a doctor has to declare someone is dead before they are 'officially' dead, doesn't make them any less dead.
Concerning the gangrene incident:
I did not diagnosis it as gangrene. In fact, until my coaches and teachers made the comment about gangrene and what it does, I had never even heard of it. All I said was that after they said it looked like gangrene, I went home and prayed, and I was healed.
As far as my mentioning my IQ score, it was only to point out that not everyone in our church is, what you guys call simple. Maybe I was wrong to mention that, when in fact compared to the rest of the world we are simple. We trust God.

To corboy:
Of course I read newspapers. Even without the internet, I would have gained the same amount of information. I know you might find this hard to believe, but when someone dies in our church, whether they be adults or children, people pass the word along to others so that we may pray that God will comfort them in their loss. Some of these people, I have never met. But others, I know personally. I am even related to some. Of course I have knowledge of these things. As I also have even more knowledge of other miracles that have happened.

Concerning my beliefs:
I am not on here to defend what I believe. I came only to educate others. This is a 'Cult Education Forum', and since my church is called a cult, I thought it only fair that both sides of the story be heard. You only have one side, yours. How can you make informed decesions about what is right and wrong, if only one side is heard? That was the purpose of me writing on here; to provide you with another side. I am very secure in my beliefs. I am not allowed to defend what I write, because you guys would automatically view it as preaching. Instead, all I have done is try to share information to the readers in an effort to educate them. You accuse me of "bombarding" you with "Scripture", yet I have not once quoted scripture to any of you. What I have done, is quoted from your own posts.

To templar:
If you do believe in God, than I apologize. However, I find it unbelievable that someone can believe in God, and refer to the story of Jesus as a '2000 year old fairy tale'. And no, you don't have to state whether you believe in God or not; that is between you and Him. I am sorry you misunderstood my last post. I was actually saying how many jokes could there be, not the amount of friends you have, but I find it humorous that is what you thought I meant. But you are correct about one thing, I shouldn't allow you to drag me into an endless arguement. So I will try not to respond to any of your posts, but you can still make jokes if you and your friends want. Humor is a good thing.


Finally:
Anyone who is actually reading the posts, can see that it is you guys that are avoiding things. Although the question was to rrmoderator, everyone else can feel free to answer if they want. Does God control ALL things? Yes or no? Do we belong to the government or God? Instead of responding to my statements or questions, you accuse me of 'preaching' or of thinking in a 'cult-like' or 'brainwashed' manner. If you are interested in truth, answer my questions. If teaching your children the way you believe is brainwashing, are not all parents guilty of brainwashing their children? If we are brainwashing our members by reading the Bible, is not the world being brainwashed by reading newspapers, watching TV, and gaining information in other media outlets? If God doesn't exist, why are prayers answered? If God doesn't exist, how are prophets able to fortell the future and speak things to people that noone but the person receiving the prohesy knew? I try to answer all your questions. In fact, that is another reason I began posting here. In order to educate, questions must be asked. I wanted to see if their were any questions. However, instead all I got were accusations of doing things that I wasn't. Surely, I don't want to seem as if I am "hogging the microphone." Hahaha.

LMAO Wow are you weak!!!


Next time you want to defend your cult make sure you dont brow beat your audience with lies and nonsense about your IQ and level of intelligence especially when your insane, schitzophrenic rantings indicate nothing but the contrary.

Does God control ALL things? Yes or no? Do we belong to the government or God?

First of all no. God doesnt control everything, he may know everything but he isnt interested in dictation. He doesnt control everyone, he only set things in motion. In fact he gives Man Free Will as the vessel to which he is to return to heaven.

How does Free Will get humans into heaven? Easy, the CHOICES one person makes based on what they know as right and wrong are the reflection of that persons worthyness to pass through the pearly gates. God gave man Free Will because he loves us and wants to see us return that love on our own. If he controled everything why would he make poeple act against his will? Good luck explaining that one. See if you accept that God controls everything that means He makes us sin and live decadently in contrast with his Comandments. Speaking of which if God controled everything there would be no need for him to convey his will to us in the form of Commandments because we would already be living them. Get it yet??

Funny thing is God more or less explains just that in the Gospel, you must not have been paying attention, probably studying pre calculus.


See your problem is Diesel, you arent nearly as close with God as you think oras you'd have us all believe. See, God and I go way back, to the days of my creation to be exact, and beyond, and he has spoken to me throughout my life telling me about the Blind Sheep like yourself. Take a real close look at my screen name, do you think those letters are assembled at random? You do know who the Templars were dont you?? You should, after all they too were persecuted for their Christian beliefs, but maybe that is only worth points with you if they are listed on Ricks Database.... Anyway back to Gods will, see he wants me to try to explain to you that you are practicing Idolitry by belonging to the fringe group that claims to worship Him. He says that there is NO church left on earth that genuinly follows his plan, He thinks that all churches are an abomination designed to fleece the flock then guide it off a cliff. God says that you arent living his will you are living in another mans fear and God wants you to get your head out of your ass and get back in touch with him before its too late.

Now if hearing those words from your fellow misguided parishoners would be good enough for you why is it that when a stranger poses such a conundrum to you, all of a sudden that stranger is the infidel/ false prophet?

Lets assume God DOES control everything and he is speaking to you through me, isnt it awfully arrogent of you to think that because I dont belong to your parish that Im not speaking the truth?

Either way John you need to seriously reconscider your stance, and your intentions here.

If you claim to want to be here to give your church a fair shake, point taken, but we are going to conscider the source thank you.

If you have come here to tell us that you love us and will pray for our salvation then again thank you but dont dare to judge a single one of us and incinuate that we even NEED salvation because we challenge you or persecute your church.

For all the smarts you claim to have you make alot of assumptions, followed by retractions, and stupid thoughtless senseless accusations also follwed by appologetic retractions when the truth to the contrary is staring you right in your simple face.

I forgive you for all that you have trespassed against me but not what you propose in respects to God. Its clear after reading all your testimony about regenerating house pets and nonmedically remicant cancer, that despite all your good intentions, because of your limited, fearful, closed-minded judgementality you are still on a road straight to Hell.

See you there!!!

you *chose*, on your own initiative, to come to this site and read the material about your church.

It was probably the first time you ever got information about your church that came from outside sources.

We did not kidnap you, strap to a chair in front of a computer and tape your eyes wide open.

You came here and read the material.

It is now up to you to face this new knowledge. It is scary to find out a church you've loved all your life has been doing harm and been in trouble with the law.

Lots of the people here have been through this and have come out the other side.

When you can slow down, quiet down, allow yourself to feel the impact of what you've learned, and get curious, we can provide a lot of support.

We will not permit abuse, but we always appreciate honesty.

As long as you churn out words, you'll never settle down long enough to discover your own true nature, or that you can and will have a fulfilling spiritual life *outside of your church*.

God is love and God is everywhere.

No one owns God. No one ever can. No one church can ever own God.

That's the good news.

You dont have to live in fear with a bunch of scared people in order to have a relationship with God.

Even when you leave your church, you'll still have a life in God.

Dare to be still, find the God who lives in stillness, who speaks in a still small voice, not in a preacher's screams and threats. Then you'll discover this, all by yourself.

You must not have a good memory. I just got through writing that this wasn't the first time I found information concerning my church. Just about every episode in Colorado, I knew about within a day, if not within a few hours. I have family in Colorado, as well as Indiana and California. These things that you have posted as links are nothing new to me. As I also said, some of these people I know personally(josh and mindy). I am not scared. Nor am I here to seek help. I have been told that I need to reread my posts, maybe you should do likewise. READ THIS ONE TWICE. You must not have a good memory. I just got through writing that this wasn't the first time I found information concerning my church. Just about every episode in Colorado, I knew about within a day, if not within a few hours. I have family in Colorado, as well as Indiana and California. These things that you have posted as links are nothing new to me. As I also said, some of these people I know personally(josh and mindy). I am not scared. Nor am I here to seek help. I have been told that I need to reread my posts, maybe you should do likewise.

Now, not once did I say that I, or anyone in my church, owns God. Where you could get such a ludacrous idea like that is unknown to me, but just the thought is so outrageous that I was dumbfounded when I read it. Please.

An excerpt from
[www.culteducation.com]

"The Morgantown church's position on medicine is based primarily on a verse from James 5:12-16. The citation reads in part: "Is any sick among you? Let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord."

So this doctrine of no doctors comes from one verse in the Bible, which has been translated many, many times, and from a time when most health conditions were not understood. For instance, epilepsy was considered possession by demons.

What else does this group take literally?

The member who had throat cancer could make his own decision to go to a doctor, which is how he was diagnosed. The infants and children that members freely discuss when asked, those infants who died as a result of SOMEONE'S fvcked up beliefs, didn't have that choice. One member speculates that perhaps these babies would have become involved with drugs or suffered in another way. Guess what? That's not for congregants to decide.

"Now, not once did I say that I, or anyone in my church, owns God. Where you could get such a ludacrous idea like that is unknown to me, but just the thought is so outrageous that I was dumbfounded when I read it. Please"

Im sure Corboy wasnt implying that you did. Not supprised that you were dumbfounded though, Id imagine velcro straps dumbfound you as well. Honestly we all found you dumb to begin with so again little supprise there.

There would be no problem with the law.

Your church would not have been listed on this site had there not been a huge number of newspaper articles relating to deaths of young children in church families.

Instead of hammering at us, how about bugging the many newspapers who published the stories listed on the RR.com archives?

An adult can make a free choice whether to risk his or her life for a religious belief, but children cannot.

That is why, under the law of the land, it is a criminal offense for parents to withold medical care when children are ill.

As this article puts it

[www.culteducation.com]

(quote)The law varies from state to state over whether religious beliefs are a defense against criminal charges of child neglect for not seeking medical care for a child.

Religious beliefs are not a defense in California, Turner said.

"It's an argument, but it's not a defense," she said. "In California, parents have an obligation to provide for their children the basics of living -- food, shelter and care, including medical care."

Again, *you chose* to read the material on this site.

We didnt write the articles. We put them on file for people to read.

Usually when threatened by bad news, ignorant people tend to want to kill the messenger.