And the conditions at the Rajneesh schools were not as harsh as what Anti Chris drescribes.

But its harsh enough to lose one's own mother to an addiction--whether its an addiction to drugs, alcohol--or a guru who generated group states.

Rajneesh was considered and considered himself God. In his view, children were the vanguard of a new awakening. They were getting an enlightened upbringing such that they did not need their mothers.

It hit me in the gut and hard when I found this out about Tim Guest. In fact, I felt both heart ssickand furious.

I felt as though the wrong side had won.

Rajneesh was unworthy of the loyalty he elicited in so many.

His own mother had abandoned him inexplicably into the care of his grandparents, who did a lamentable job providing any sort of consistent structure and parenting.

In an utter tragedy Rajneesh re-enacted his own shoddy upbringing by putting hundreds of other people's children through it.

Now, we learn about Butler and his schools. Ugh!

Keep shining the light!

Stay alive!

Stay related with humanity!

Stay healthy!

Final note:

Its interesting that Rajneesh ended up reclusive and germ phobic, trusting only a small entourage of devotees.

Butler is also living that way.

God, ending up agoraphobic.

I never did understand that part. If Chris was a pure devotee, and protected by God and friends with God and blah blah blah, why didnt God protect him from all the germs and chemicals he is so vulnerable to? Isnt Chris the utmost friend of Krishna? Why would Krishna want his friend and pure devotee to suffer from something so material?

Logic: killing illusions one thought at a time.

In case this could help anyone who has been in SI/Butler, another longtime member, The Anticult, wrote some analysis of another group (SGI) which has people do chanting (nam hyo rhen gye kho) as a thought stopping/emotion stopping strategy, and whose members shame and shun anyone who has doubts--and whose leader has created a business empire.

The Anticult offered some some advice on how to create mental strategies to deal with anxiety after one has left the group and has stopped chanting.

I have lightly edited what The Anticult wrote. The original text can be read here.

[forum.culteducation.com]

Note that SGI recruits adults. But when children are taught to chant away emotions, doubts, legitimate fear and indignation at being put in a bad environment--the effects are probably far more intense.

Quote

The Anticult
....many people who are NOT into SGI, their mind is apt to go into "catastrophizing mode".

"When faced with neutral, or unknown future events, their minds go to the negative scenario, and imagine it might happen, thus making the person with a catastrophising mindset anxious.

So a person like this is on a new job. He or she is doing a very good job, yet their self-doubt creeps into their minds, and they start fearing they are going to get fired, so they are constantly worried and anxious.

When a person who already has that tendency to worry, anxiety, imagining worst event scenarios is recruited into a group such as SGI, they can get trapped. SGI preys on anxiety and any tendency to imagine worst event scenarios.

The group teaches themtthat more chanting will stop the bad thing from happening.

SGI blocks development of inner resources and strategies, and creates more superstition, which is what Ikeda wants.

What is actually emancipatory is when people with that vulnerability learn how to teach themselves that their own focus on potential negative events is the problem.

SGI really is a mind-trap, not so easy to get out of.

(Another correspondant wrote)

Oh, my goodness! This is really helpful advice for me right now. I had a lot of self doubt, and it is so true that SGI blocks development , and creates more superstition! This is true!

dabcult,
Your private message box is full.
Time to clear it out. I hope you got the info you wanted.
otherwise I'll need to resend.

FROM THE CHRISTIAN NEWS WEB SITE
Former presidential candidate Rick Santorum, a Catholic, also made comments earlier this year that Gabbard’s religion “doesn’t align with the constitutional foundation of the U.S. government.”

“It is stunning that some people in Congress would so arrogantly thumb their nose at the Bill of Rights,” Gabbard wrote in response in a statement to the media. “When I volunteered to put my life on the line in defense of our country, no one asked me what my religion was.”

WHAT DOES THE BILL OF RIGHT AS TO DO WITH THIS ? Anyone knows ?

Not every body is saying GREAT she can do what she wants TULSI

I saw the movie Lincoln 3 times now ........just love everything about it
in 1865 when you where putting your hands on the bible .........IT MET SOMETHING for everyone ....NORTH SOUTH republican democrats

Now Tulsi will swear on the Bhagavad gita (she is from a sect that take that Krishna as an historical figure....that came on earth 5000 years ago )
there is not much.....or no ..... archeological discoveries .....that can prove he is an actual historical peson as Jesus ...or Abraham ...or the Budha

I have read it a hundred time ..(IN THE VAISHNAVA TRADIDIONS......BASICALLY ITS THE STORY OF GOD (KRISHNA ) TELLING HIS DISCIPLE ARJUNA

THERE IS NO WAY OUT OF YOUR PREDIKIMENTS .......YOU MUST FIGHT AND KILL ....AND KILL ( FAMALY MEMBERS INCLUDED )
GOD HIMSELF .....COULD NOT FIND A WAY TO PEACE BUT TROUGHT WAR

THATS WHAT THE HARE KRIHNA BELIEVE INCLUDING BUTLER

THERE IS 1001 WAYS TO INTERPRET THE GITA .............BUT TULSI ....A BUTLERETTE ....BELEIVE THE ABOVE interpretation (and also beleieve that she is going to krishna planet where siddha ...says they are all going ...

WHAT KIND OF A SWEARING IS THAT (what does the american people would think of that IF THEY KNEW THE GITA CONTENT ......IN THE LIGHT OF THE BIBLE WHERE JESUS SAYS TURN THE OTHER CHEEK
"FORGIVE THEM FATHER FOR THEY DO NOT KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING "

ITS A STUNT TO GET THE HINDHUS ALL PROUND ...........BUT SHE IS FROM A DESTRUCTIVE CULT

TULSI WOULD NOT BE ADMITED TO 90% OF THE MAJOR HINDHU TEMPLES IN INDIA (I TRIED IN JAGANATH PURI IN 2010)
HINDHU MAJORITY CONSIDER HINDHU ONLY IF YOU ARE BORN FROM INDIA .....THATS IT

BUT SOME PEOPLE ARE GETTING A SNIFF OF THE SCAM THAT BUTLER AND TULSI ARE TRYING TO PULL OFF.
AS MR SANTORUM ....
BY THE WAY WE KNOW THAT JESUS REALLY EXISTED ....THANKS TO A JEWISH HISTORIAN NAME JOSEPHUS ....HE NEVER BECAME A CRISHTIANS
BUT MENTION HAVING MET JESUS IN HIS WRITHING .

Quote
dabcult
FROM THE CHRISTIAN NEWS WEB SITE
Former presidential candidate Rick Santorum, a Catholic, also made comments earlier this year that Gabbard’s religion “doesn’t align with the constitutional foundation of the U.S. government.”

“It is stunning that some people in Congress would so arrogantly thumb their nose at the Bill of Rights,” Gabbard wrote in response in a statement to the media. “When I volunteered to put my life on the line in defense of our country, no one asked me what my religion was.”

WHAT DOES THE BILL OF RIGHT AS TO DO WITH THIS ? Anyone knows ?

She is referring to the FREEDOM OF RELIGION in the Bill of Rights. It's a good argument. But the issue is not her right to follow any religion she wants or if she is really a Hindu or not. It is all about the appearance of lies and deceptions regarding her true beliefs and hiding the level of undue influence Butler has on her life and political career. In my opinion...it is undignified and disrespects her constituency. But her guru wants to be hidden so she will do everything to obey his wishes...

Here is an interesting article by Rick Ross on his blog that is relevant to this topic.
Has the Historic Premise of Religious Identity Been Forgotten?
"And there is a historic right of denominational leaders to determine the parameters of their own faith’s identity, which should be recognized by responsible and objective journalists, rather than misleading the public."

The point is not where we draw the religious freedom line, but where is the line drawn that defines the difference between a historical premise of a religion and a misleading cult?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/04/2012 05:15PM by Vera City.

Quote
dabcult
FROM THE CHRISTIAN NEWS WEB SITE
Former presidential candidate Rick Santorum, a Catholic, also made comments earlier this year that Gabbard’s religion “doesn’t align with the constitutional foundation of the U.S. government.”

“It is stunning that some people in Congress would so arrogantly thumb their nose at the Bill of Rights,” Gabbard wrote in response in a statement to the media. “When I volunteered to put my life on the line in defense of our country, no one asked me what my religion was.”

WHAT DOES THE BILL OF RIGHT AS TO DO WITH THIS ? Anyone knows ?

Not every body is saying GREAT she can do what she wants TULSI

I saw the movie Lincoln 3 times now ........just love everything about it
in 1865 when you where putting your hands on the bible .........IT MET SOMETHING for everyone ....NORTH SOUTH republican democrats

Now Tulsi will swear on the Bhagavad gita (she is from a sect that take that Krishna as an historical figure....that came on earth 5000 years ago )
there is not much.....or no ..... archeological discoveries .....that can prove he is an actual historical peson as Jesus ...or Abraham ...or the Budha

I have read it a hundred time ..(IN THE VAISHNAVA TRADIDIONS......BASICALLY ITS THE STORY OF GOD (KRISHNA ) TELLING HIS DISCIPLE ARJUNA

THERE IS NO WAY OUT OF YOUR PREDIKIMENTS .......YOU MUST FIGHT AND KILL ....AND KILL ( FAMALY MEMBERS INCLUDED )
GOD HIMSELF .....COULD NOT FIND A WAY TO PEACE BUT TROUGHT WAR

THATS WHAT THE HARE KRIHNA BELIEVE INCLUDING BUTLER

THERE IS 1001 WAYS TO INTERPRET THE GITA .............BUT TULSI ....A BUTLERETTE ....BELEIVE THE ABOVE interpretation (and also beleieve that she is going to krishna planet where siddha ...says they are all going ...

WHAT KIND OF A SWEARING IS THAT (what does the american people would think of that IF THEY KNEW THE GITA CONTENT ......IN THE LIGHT OF THE BIBLE WHERE JESUS SAYS TURN THE OTHER CHEEK
"FORGIVE THEM FATHER FOR THEY DO NOT KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING "

ITS A STUNT TO GET THE HINDHUS ALL PROUND ...........BUT SHE IS FROM A DESTRUCTIVE CULT

TULSI WOULD NOT BE ADMITED TO 90% OF THE MAJOR HINDHU TEMPLES IN INDIA (I TRIED IN JAGANATH PURI IN 2010)
HINDHU MAJORITY CONSIDER HINDHU ONLY IF YOU ARE BORN FROM INDIA .....THATS IT

BUT SOME PEOPLE ARE GETTING A SNIFF OF THE SCAM THAT BUTLER AND TULSI ARE TRYING TO PULL OFF.
AS MR SANTORUM ....
BY THE WAY WE KNOW THAT JESUS REALLY EXISTED ....THANKS TO A JEWISH HISTORIAN NAME JOSEPHUS ....HE NEVER BECAME A CRISHTIANS
BUT MENTION HAVING MET JESUS IN HIS WRITHING .

If the voters of Hawaii elected Tulsi Gabbard without knowing she is a hindu, that is a great injustice and deception that should be reckoned with. Dabcult you bring up very good points. If a book is known to be mythical why should one of our leaders be allowed to swear on it? What is next? Maybe swearing on ‘Alice in Wonderland’, or maybe even ‘Mad Magazine’! Why not? The blue god says ‘kill them all, kill your family!’ And what about that lion god they worship? That was brought up in court once by some very disturbed parents who did not like their children worshiping that beast. He also likes to kill family members! How can our leaders swear on such books that praises killing ones own family or gods who want to kill our families? Now the Bible is no longer good enough? Doesn’t make a lick of sense to me.

A bit of advice


If anyone gets PM's from someone they do not know, click the username of the person who sent the PM.

This will give you the profile for that person, which will give information such as when the person registered on the RR message board and whether that person has any published posts.

For example, if you look at rrmoderator's profile, you will see he has been active on this message board for ten years--which makes sense, since he is the moderator.

(And does this for free, and gets plenty of hassles for it)

[forum.culteducation.com]

If the person registered months or years ago, but has waited until now to send you a PM, see if that person has any published posts.

Read or skim the published posts and see if they tend to be pro guru and whether they elicited respect from the others --or triggered any warnings from the moderator.

Do this by clicking the live URL for the name of the person who sent you the PM

Go to the 'search' button at the upper right hand corner.

Click that search button.

[forum.culteducation.com]

Go to 'author' and put the persons username into the slot. For this lesson I am putting
rrmoderator

Select "all dates' because this message board is ten years old and the all dates option is the only one that will scan the entire contents of the message board.

Here is what you see for a diligent 10 year correspondant on this board.

[forum.culteducation.com]

If someone registered, has no published posts and is using the PM function to bug you, report that to Mr Ross IMMEDIATELY. Mr Ross's profile contains a link that will enable you to reach him via PM.

If someone has produced lots of posts a quick scan can indicate the nature of their activity on the board and can assist you to decide to get involved with them--or not.

**Learn to do 'audits' for the names of anyone who sends you unpleasant PMs or if anyone's PM or posts are getting under your skin.

If you dont like the contents of a PM, send a copy of the text to rrmoderator, Rick Ross's userhandle.

By its nature PM is private and bullying can happen in the shadows unless offending PMs are immediately sent to the moderator.

Quote
alapuhsihs

If the voters of Hawaii elected Tulsi Gabbard without knowing she is a hindu, that is a great injustice and deception that should be reckoned with. Dabcult you bring up very good points. If a book is known to be mythical why should one of our leaders be allowed to swear on it? What is next? Maybe swearing on ‘Alice in Wonderland’, or maybe even ‘Mad Magazine’! Why not? The blue god says ‘kill them all, kill your family!’ And what about that lion god they worship? That was brought up in court once by some very disturbed parents who did not like their children worshiping that beast. He also likes to kill family members! How can our leaders swear on such books that praises killing ones own family or gods who want to kill our families? Now the Bible is no longer good enough? Doesn’t make a lick of sense to me.

Being a Hindu is just a front. Wrapping herself in a known and historical religion is the deception because it is known that she is a follower of the secretive cult leader Chris Butler, along with her parents.

I don't think it matters if she swears on the Gita any more than the Bible. Atheists also regard the Bible as a book of violent fairy tales that have no business in the halls of government. The oath is the thing, not the book. In the state of Texas, those who do not want to swear on the Bible can have their oath administered by the court "on pain of perjury." On the federal level, the Federal Rules of Evidence state that before a witness testifies, an oath must be administered "in a form calculated to awaken the witness' conscience and impress the witness' mind with the duty to do so." As a result, the policy is that if swearing on the New Testament won't awaken your conscience, the Tanakh for Jews, or the Gita for Hindus or Hare Krishnas will do just fine. If you don't believe in God, you can go holy-book-free.

A most brilliant move on Tulsi's part would be to totally reveal her connection to Butler completely and honestly. No one would fault her for growing up in her parents cult. In fact, it would bring her more respect and sympathy and seal her position for many long years. Not all groups called "cults" are harmful. To quote Rick Ross, "Instead, they may be benign and generally defined as simply people intensely devoted to a person, place or thing." So if her group is harmless, then it should be no problem to reveal her connection to Chris Butler.

But this will not happen because Butler does not want this to happen. Tulsi is held under the sword of spiritual death for the rest of her life if she goes against the orders of her guru. And her guru does not want to be identified, nor his real teachings, practices or undue influences and secrets revealed. That is the deception, not what religion she professes to follows or not. And in this age of internet, her deception will come out and be used against her during her political career.

Right now she is on the defensive because she knows Butler is her weak underbelly. The truth will come out. How she deals with it will be the true test of her character and leadership abilities. If it is a harmless cult, then the reveal should be no big deal.

She no longer needs the cult to succeed, but she is indebted to them for her win. The many volunteers on Team Tulsi are known cult members and families. The donations from around the world from cult members got her foot in the door. Her videos and PR are all produced by cult members. But she really no longer needs them. If she is an effective legislator, Hawaii will keep her in office. Right now she has a tremendous opportunity to leave and expose the cult.

Not holding my breath.

Again, this is in my opinion and it appears this way to me and is not necessarily meant pejoratively.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/05/2012 01:53AM by Vera City.