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cultreporter

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Joe K

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Rama Das (slave name)
congratulations on knowing everything

Wow, in the absence of counter-arguments we are resorting to flaming. Kath was simply expressing her opinions, as the people arguing against FMS here have certainly felt free to do.

Well in perspective we have the person who started the whole thread casting very unempathetic and quite odious judgments on how people who have been sexually abused should act.

In your previous post you were making arguments rather than taunting.

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cultreporter
Well in perspective we have the person who started the whole thread casting very unempathetic and quite odious judgments on how people who have been sexually abused should act.

I don't know what you are on about ere. I support people who've been sexually abused 100% and I haven't said they should act any particular way.

Please point out anywhere where I have said this.

anticult,

You make a reasoned argument. I would need to know about the researchers quoted and their methods being being convinced of their accuracy, though.

I certainly cannot prove that there is no SRA in the world, although I strongly think that there would have been evidence of any *widespread* SRA before now. I personally find it unlikely that they are so disciplined and sophisticated that a large number of them have remained completely undetectable.

I have a close and loved relative with recovered memories of SRA. She recovered these memories after seeing a "Christian counselor" who deals a lot with SRA. Rather than being an actual SRA victim, I personally think it more likely that my relative developed recovered memories of SRA as a result of a well-meaning and perhaps unconscious agenda of the therapist, combined with (again probably not deliberate) induced suggestibility in my relative. The status of the therapist as a "trusted expert" and the methods usually used for memory recovery are ideal for trance-and-suggestion to occur. In other words, I think it more likely that my relative internalized the therapist's agenda rather than than that she recovered memories of actual SRA.

I don't think it's just "SRA specialists" who may induce FMS. For example, I think that if a person goes to a "DID (MPD) specialist" then one is more likely to develop iatrogenic DID. (I also have a very close and loved friend who developed a diagnosis of DID after seeing a DID specialist.)

None of which proves that SRA and DID aren't real for some people.

I don't challenge my relative on these memories. They are very real to her. Nor do I challenge my friend on her DID as it is also very real to her. I of course can't prove whether the recovered SRA and diagnosed DID are real or not.

kath, I totally feel like you were being overly dismissive...

For one, to claim that "All research into SRA has proven it to be non existent" and supply that website, clearly shows you have very scant understanding of the issue.

A very large body of research suggests that this IS happening, many, many people claim to have had such experiences.
Many more since the dated research on that website, also (most of the data there being at least 15 years old)

I will be the first to admit that it is the most outlandish concept, and if you were seeking a fraudulant abuse lawsuit, I am sure there would be much better ways to do it than claiming to be a victim of such a large, secret network.

The strange and unbelievable nature of the topic, coupled with dismissal from most people (like yourself?) would be far more than enough pressure to keep actual victims very quiet, especially if the abuse no longer continues.

The famous "McMartin" case, which happened in the early nineties, is the centre of the arguement that it does not happen, as the accused were later acquitted. I think there is reason to believe that many aspects of that case were surpressed, including that tunnels were found by an archaeologist independently comissioned by a few parents, and the subsequent report would not be published by anyone.

This is the statement of the mother...
[www.rumormillnews.com]

and the archeologist's report...
[tesserae.org]

You also went into a very unneccesarily dismissive and ignorant comment about the Bilderberg group.

Here is a Canadian news article on it, as the last meeting was in Canada.
[www.ctv.ca]

I only mentioned the Bilderberg group in conjunction to the researcher Daniel Estulin, whom I thought might be found to be considered a fact based researcher that is credible, he investigates the individuals that appear to be involved in hidden, over-arching power stuctures.

The people that attend these meetings are very real, and there has been much information gleaned concerning the content of these meetings which definately point to global policy being disseminated at these meetings, thanks to very serious and fulltime researchers such as Daniel Estulin and Alex Jones.

These researchers have stated that many of these high ranking "Bilderbergers" ARE in fact involved in satanic, occult ritual.

There is much data concerning the yearly attendees available, like a complete list from of attendees from the previous meeting, validated by the journalists like Alex, who stand outside and document the various people who arrive for the meeting, such as David Rockefeller and Henry Kissinger, sometimes talking with them, also.

[www.prisonplanet.com]

page two is interesting. a statement about the group, from the group.

The researcher Alan Watt also specializes in the Bilderberg Group, he has a collection of their minutes from the earlier meetings, like from the 50's, the content very interesting.

My point being that the "Global Satanic Network" may be real, according to the claims of the victims, according to the findings of researchers like the above mentioned. It should also be understood that this network is very privileged and very secret, thus not just some local ring of satanists.

It is a very complex and convoluted situation, and, of course, if it is real, especially in the context of this "hidden power structure", it has been tucked away very well for a very long time.

I can understand just dismissing it, that is fine, but in the context of someone who claims to be a victim of it, like your internet friend, would a serious discussion of the issue not be apropriate?

Your conclusions are not based on all available information, very far from it, I would suggest.

The research into this is out there, but to actually come into contact with the work of someone who is ACTIVELY INVESTIGATING the claims of victims would involve entering the "independent" arena.

Joe K wrote:
"Often" isn't good enough. Again, the judge has absolutely no way to tell if a memory is confabulated or not when it is the "victim's" word against the accused's, as is often the case. If there is other evidence supporting the "victim's" claims, then that other evidence should be considered of course. But in the absence of other evidence, the judge just can't determine whether a recovered memory is accurate or not."

And would thus be insufficient to convict somebody on.

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Joe K

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Rama Das (slave name)
congratulations on knowing everything

Wow, in the absence of counter-arguments we are resorting to flaming. Kath was simply expressing her opinions, as the people arguing against FMS here have certainly felt free to do.

No, I was just too tired. Tired and bummed out by her response.

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Rama Das (slave name)
The famous "McMartin" case, which happened in the early nineties, is the centre of the arguement that it does not happen, as the accused were later acquitted. I think there is reason to believe that many aspects of that case were surpressed, including that tunnels were found by an archaeologist independently comissioned by a few parents, and the subsequent report would not be published by anyone.

This is the statement of the mother...
[www.rumormillnews.com]

and the archeologist's report...
[tesserae.org]

This article contains a different opinion on the McMartin tunnels...
[www.ipt-forensics.com]

It's pretty lengthy and a bit "academic", but the whole thing is worth the read if one is interested in the McMartin case (if not familiar with this very interesting case here is the "skeptical" angle on it: [www.religioustolerance.org] ).

In particular I found these interesting...
[www.ipt-forensics.com]
[www.ipt-forensics.com]

And here's the conclusion...
[www.ipt-forensics.com]

Oops, I quoted from religioustolerance.org.

Try this instead: [www.law.umkc.edu]

OMG I'm *really* sorry for quoting from religioustolerance.org, it's very creepy there...

"The Scientology religion is an expanding new religion, founded by American author and humanitarian L. Ron Hubbard. The word Scientology means the “study of knowledge or truth” and addresses the rehabilitation and salvation of the human spirit."
[www.religioustolerance.org]