Re: The mystical forces that drove some of us to Krishna Consciousness
Date: May 06, 2021 08:22AM
And so when you say that all this is "nonsecterian" and a person who wants true knowledge needs to find a living teacher in one of the 4 hindu sects of Saivism, Shaktism, Vaishnavism and Smartism, you are speaking of a nonsecterian path?
It's disingenuous to say the path of "krishna consciousness" is "non secterian". If you mean to say that the Gita, as it's been evolved, can be understood as a philosophical system with universal concepts, pleasantly couched in the myth of the krishna god—then, yes, absolutely, the ideas taught in the gita can have universal, non-secterian appeal. I think the same can be said for most religions when you remove the specific god they pay allegiance to. I can't imagine god sat for 2 hours between warring armies and spoke in exacting 4 lined sanskrit verses covering such topics as offering him leaves and flowers in devotion. Talk about inappropriate timing. It's obviously a setting created to represent man's inner battles and search for truth, confronting doubt and looking for answers. It has also been shown to have been injected into the larger Mahabharata tale at a later date. The Mahabharata was a popular myth/epic and it was a good vehicle to slip in some religious ideas for the general public in an effort to create a more unified religious identity in a country built on spiritual pluralism.
I trust you don't believe that the sage Vyasa was one person who compiled the Vedas using the elephant god, Ganesh's broken tusk as a writing implement...
And yes, actually, there are many letters where Bhaktivedanta dicattes that the GBC is to function as disksha guru's within his organization's structure. And many other letters where he forbade his followers from associating with or seeking guidance from Gaudiya Math—let alone guru's outside the general vaishnava sect.
all that aside, I agree with you, people should find inspiration and spiritual guidance in the guru tattva principle, not a specific personage or lineage. The "living" part is also subjective considering many devotees hardly spent much time with Bhaktivedanta in person and most followers these days are not associating with their living guru on a daily basis anyway. So how important is the "living part"? Is it not more realistic and practical to try and absorb the teachings of a guru (shiksha?). I can see in ancient times (when people did not know how to read/write) that it would be important to have a living teacher. But now with mass publications, translations, the internet, and any number of things, we can study, read and compare and contrast the philosophy of many teachers.
Gaudiya Vaishnavism is a sect. The worship of Krishna is 100% secterian. Even within the larger context of vashnavism, the Gaudiya sect is very specific in their beliefs and their lineage is hardly considered bonafide by the other Vaishnva sects. The teachings of samkhya and yoga and other philosophical systems amalgamated in the Vaishnava theology do have nonsectarian ideas. Brahman, atman, Paramatma, jiva, Purusha, Prakriti, Shakti, Maya, Guna etc these can have universal application and in some way they are ideas explored in many world faiths.
I guess I question your motive for coming on a cult forum and trying to convince people trying to get out of these cults (sects) that there is some essoteric meaning behind it all and that they somehow missed the point of what the cults are all about. They see what it's all about and want to get the heck out. That's why they are here. Not to tredge through philosophical arguments with apologists trolling on cult forums. They are done with the guru crap, the "hare krishna is not a cult" crap and the "you must have committed some offenses" bullshit.
If you're going to troll here and make it harder for people to find the support they need by confusing them and deflecting, distracting, lying, scamming, and being all-around disingenuous in why you are here (I assume you are not trying to leave krishna "consciousness") I'm telling you you're in for a rude awakening. And namaste while I'm at it prabhu.