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Re: Maum Meditation
Date: February 10, 2015 11:12PM

I found it easily. A center opened up very close to where I live and I saw their sign. I have always had bad anxiety and low motivation. Additionally, my mother passed away recently and there is a lot of trauma and emotional baggage Im dealing with as well. I live very much inside my head and never really feel like I'm experiencing/appreciating the present. So clearly, their method appeared very relevant to me.

I was aware of the man who established the method. My helper spoke of him briefly in my intro lecture. I don't remember her saying anything worship-like so I was suprised a little after my online research. I suppose I need to research the different forms of meditation and find another...that isn't actually a cult...

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Re: Maum Meditation
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: February 11, 2015 04:45AM

Dear Skeptical:

The first red flag is when you discover a discrepancy between
what you're told at the introductory lecture vs. what former
long-time members describe after they've been involved.

A group's actual attitude toward its leader should not
be so extremely submissive that this submission is
kept secret lest new recruits be put off.

Saying one thing in public while behaving quite differently
in private is to live under chronic emotional tension.

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Re: Maum Meditation
Posted by: tree001 ()
Date: February 12, 2015 02:30PM

I understand you, I had somebody close who was in similar situation. my advice- educated your self, try search what is mind control, and how cults operates and who is more vulnerable to cults, and what is considered a destructive cult and try to learn to recognize them. Then I would recommend to find some good Christian church or other organization (that not cults), or maybe even visit professional psychologist.
Wish you luck.

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Ten Warning Signs of a Potentially Unsafe Group
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: February 12, 2015 10:24PM

Being vulnerable does not mean a person is stupid,
and being vulnerable does not mean you have failed.

Only a robot is invulnerable.

"Potentially unsafe groups or leaders "come off very nice at first, they go for vulnerable people who are looking for answers, lonely, what you'd call 'normal people.' They're very good at what they do and can get people to believe anything. You might think you'd never get taken in, but don't bet on it. "

-- Margaret Singer, Ph.D


These may not be apparent when you attend an introductory meeting
or lecture.

Often, the first and earliest warning signs are reports given online.

Quoted from below


6. Former members often relate the same stories of abuse and reflect a similar pattern of grievances.


Ten warning signs of a potentially unsafe group/leader

1. Absolute authoritarianism without meaningful accountability.

2. No tolerance for questions or critical inquiry.

3. No meaningful financial disclosure regarding budget, expenses such as an independently audited financial statement.

4. Unreasonable fear about the outside world, such as impending catastrophe, evil conspiracies and persecutions.

(Corboy note:This may be hidden not only from visitors, but in some cases, lower ranking
members are not yet fully indoctrinated and do not yet know or share
the fears of more thoroughly indoctrinated upper level members.)

5. There is no legitimate reason to leave, former followers are always wrong in leaving, negative or even evil.

6. Former members often relate the same stories of abuse and reflect a similar pattern of grievances.

7. There are records, books, news articles, or television programs that document the abuses of the group/leader.

8. Followers feel they can never be "good enough".

9. The group/leader is always right.

10. The group/leader is the exclusive means of knowing "truth" or receiving validation, no other process of discovery is really acceptable or credible.

Ten warning signs regarding people involved in/with a potentially unsafe group/leader.

1. Extreme obsessiveness regarding the group/leader resulting in the exclusion of almost every practical consideration.

2. Individual identity, the group, the leader and/or God as distinct and separate categories of existence become increasingly blurred. Instead, in the follower's mind these identities become substantially and increasingly fused--as that person's involvement with the group/leader continues and deepens.
3. Whenever the group/leader is criticized or questioned it is characterized as "persecution".

4. Uncharacteristically stilted and seemingly programmed conversation and mannerisms, cloning of the group/leader in personal behavior.

5. Dependency upon the group/leader for problem solving, solutions, and definitions without meaningful reflective thought. A seeming inability to think independently or analyze situations without group/leader involvement.

6. Hyperactivity centered on the group/leader agenda, which seems to supercede any personal goals or individual interests.

7. A dramatic loss of spontaneity and sense of humor.

8. Increasing isolation from family and old friends unless they demonstrate an interest in the group/leader.

9. Anything the group/leader does can be justified no matter how harsh or harmful.

10. Former followers are at best-considered negative or worse evil and under bad influences. They can not be trusted and personal contact is avoided.

Ten signs of a safe group/leader.

1. A safe group/leader will answer your questions without becoming judgmental and punitive.

2. A safe group/leader will disclose information such as finances and often offer an independently audited financial statement regarding budget and expenses. Safe groups and leaders will tell you more than you want to know.

3. A safe group/leader is often democratic, sharing decision making and encouraging accountability and oversight.

4. A safe group/leader may have disgruntled former followers, but will not vilify, excommunicate and forbid others from associating with them.

5. A safe group/leader will not have a paper trail of overwhelmingly negative records, books, articles and statements about them.

6. A safe group/leader will encourage family communication, community interaction and existing friendships and not feel threatened.

7. A safe group/leader will recognize reasonable boundaries and limitations when dealing with others.

8. A safe group/leader will encourage critical thinking, individual autonomy and feelings of self-esteem.

9. A safe group/leader will admit failings and mistakes and accept constructive criticism and advice.

10. A safe group/leader will not be the only source of knowledge and learning excluding everyone else, but value dialogue and the free exchange of ideas.

The most intelligent and best educated of us can be thrown
off balance and into grief by the death of a parent,
by a pre-existing illness that wears us down.

And, these days, anything to do with meditation tends to
sell well. Very few imagine that meditation in and of itself
could be harmful.

Thing to remember, is if meditation is effective enough to
bring stress relief, it can have the potential to rub other
people the wrong way.

Even aspirin has side effects listed on
the side of each package, and a list of signs that you should stop
taking the aspirin and call your doctor.

One sign of an unsafe group is either to claim meditation ios
perfect for everyone.

Another sign of an unsafe group is to claim or hint that anyone
who leaves, who refuses to participate, or who had a bad reaction to
meditation has somehow been a failure, had some sort of bad karma
that kept them from benefitting. As the list above states,
an unsafe group will never admit there's a valid reason to leave
or disagree.

Corboy notes:

4. Unreasonable fear about the outside world, such as impending catastrophe, evil conspiracies and persecutions.

(Corboy note: In some cases, lower ranking members who have not yet
been fully indoctrinated may be the ones who meet and greet and give
orientation to newcomers. If so, these members may have a newbie enthusiasm,
and not know themselves how fear ridden the higher ranking members are. Thus
the new members may in their own ignorance of the group, be quite sincere
because they themselves do not know the true nature of the group
they're involved with.)

If a group arranges things in this manner, even the new members who
do the meet and greet and introductory teachings may, themselves
be quite unaware of the actual role of the leader and the amount of
submission demanded by the leader.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2015 10:50PM by corboy.

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Re: One person's report on Reddit
Posted by: Jeffrey King ()
Date: March 06, 2015 05:34AM

tree001 Wrote:
> I have been involved with maum meditation for some
> time. In my opinion Maum Meditation has nothing
> to do with real meditation, you do not meditate
> there at all (only at the end of the session they
> ask you to meditate for few minutes), the rest of
> the time they will help you to clean your mind, so
> Maum Meditation should be called Maum
> Brainwashing.

Just curious what you, and others, consider to be "meditation." I've seen some general statements about meditation here, but would you consider it a technique to reduce mind activity, some kind of spiritual endeavor, or something else? I think this is a pretty good place to ask since there are a variety experiences of "meditation" on this forum.

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Re: One person's report on Reddit
Posted by: rrmoderator ()
Date: March 06, 2015 05:40AM

Meditation is essentially stilling the mind through trance induction, or what can seen as self-hypnosis. This puts people in a potentially highly suggestible state.

See []

Excessive mediation done for hours a day can cause negative residual effects.

Also, when meditation is done under the influence of a specific group or leader it can be used to manipulate people.

Watch "Captive Minds" on YouTube.

See []

This Canadian documentary film exposes the power of hypnosis and the suggestibility of the human mind.

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Re: One person's report on Reddit
Posted by: Jeffrey King ()
Date: March 07, 2015 06:09AM

Right. tree001 wrote that "you do not meditate there at all ... the rest of the time they will help you to clean your mind"

And rrmoderator said, "Meditation is essentially stilling the mind through trance induction"

I'm quoting here somewhat out of context, but what are they doing to clean your mind that isn't meditation?

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Re: One person's report on Reddit
Posted by: tree001 ()
Date: April 18, 2015 03:06AM

what they are doing there is- brainwashing, literally, they do not hide this, the maum group states that peoples mind is dirty with memories and experiences, its like camera full of stored pictures, so it needs to be cleaned.What person does there is sits in front of the wall, mentally dying violent death then and looks at the black dot made of a paper, and brings up all memories and mentally destroying them -throws them in the imaginary black hole (black dot), the session is two hours, as the person progress in maum levels is different things they focus on destroying, first memories, later friends and family, their own body and organs, believes an etc. So can you call this meditation ? I dont think so, its real mind control technique of a destructive cult for gain of peoples money and time...

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Memory does not operate like a camera
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: April 18, 2015 09:02PM


Tree001 wrote: "maum group states that peoples mind is dirty with memories and experiences, its like camera full of stored pictures, so it needs to be cleaned"

If Maum is teaching this, students should be informed that current research does not support this.

Evidence Based Justice: Corrupted Memory


Expert says don't always trust memory



"Human memory is malleable. It does not just work like a video camera," Loftus said.

Not only do people incorrectly remember the details of events they've witnessed, but it's pretty easy to make them believe they've seen things they haven't, Loftus said her research has shown.

Although a question may sound like it was designed to elicit information, it can also subtly deliver information to a witness, she said.

She cited, for example, research showing people's estimate of a car's speed depended on whether they were asked how fast it was going when it "contacted" or "smashed" the other car.

When the verb "contacted" was used, the average estimate was 32 mph, she said. It rose to 34 mph when "hit" was substituted, 38 mph when the verb was "bumped," 39 mph when the word was "collided" and almost 41 mph for the word "smashed."

What happens, Loftus explained, is that people remember the impact, but when a word like "smashed" is used, it enhances the image of the force involved, which the hearer can easily and unconsciously integrate into his memory. When the experiment was carried further, people were more likely to falsely remember there was broken glass at the scene if they had previously been asked how fast the car was going when it "smashed" into the other vehicle. It is very easy to alter or contaminate a witness' memory, Loftus concluded.

Evidence Based Justice: Corrupted Memory


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Re: Maum Meditation
Posted by: Peter Daley ()
Date: April 19, 2015 09:37PM

I just came across this strangely titled book by the leader. The reviews all point to something very cultic. I'll buy it and post excerpts here.


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