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Re: Universal medicine
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: May 24, 2012 11:16PM

The saddest thing about waking up to a situation like this is discovering you were not loved for yourself.

But that you are or were just one among many.

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Re: Universal medicine
Posted by: frodobaggins ()
Date: May 25, 2012 06:22AM

OMG - $10 - $25 million in revenue?!?!?!?!?

THis guy has tapped into a gold mine!

Congrats to you serge.... you have really mastered the art of fleecing people.

Im in the wrong business.

Im going to start working on some cool funky buzz words and move to byron and get in on this action.... oh wait... i wont because i have morals!

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Re: Universal medicine
Date: May 25, 2012 07:11AM

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HerbertKane178
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COncerned Partner
The claim to be no more special than anyone else is of course the same as any other claim made by Serge. It's the false choice, double speak that forms the mind cage for the student:

I am just like you-- a forever student. I am not different, not a teacher, simply a presenter of energetic truth..... yet, I am the re-incarnated Renaissance Master, mathematician and ancient philosopher all of whom were clear beings living in the energetic truth! I am also able to communincate with the hierarchy, where as you are not clear enough to know the energetic truth, and are probably in some astral/pranic trap and being misled by a spirit if you think your meditation/inner truth has merit!..

Universal Medicine is about integrity and truth, we invite you to find out what we have to say, and if it doesnt resonate and is not right for you, so be it-- yet, if you dont agree with it, you are going to have mulitple bad lives, lower the vibration, add to the forthcoming chaos, and generally have a bad life. But. that's your choice.

You dont need to eat this diet, we simply invite you to feel what is right for yourself-- but if you dont eat this way, you are dampening yourself and draining vital energy for being fiery and in your livingness. And also, other UM people will look scornfully and freak out when some gluten ( shock, horror!) or god forbid, cheese ( the work of the devil) comes within 100 metres.

We invite you to see if UM is the truth, if not shut the book and have a wonderful life, with love!--- but remember, all other traditions are false, all other guru's are 'spiritual' and dangerous! all religions are evil and controlled by the lords of form ( boo!) Science and evidenced based thinking shuts you off from your 'inner heart'- but that is okay, you choose...

I invite you to consider how UM feels for you and whether it is right or not--- yet do you know you cannot trust your feelings?how can you? you are being misled by a lifetime of expectations and lower mind pranic thinking. How can you check what feels right when you are not in your fiery heart centre? - but that is okay, you are free to choose..

In time, science will find the Xkaddadmyslphous gland ( made up the name just like SB did) and UM will be proved right. In time ( um 50 years or so, just outside our lifetimes I notice), science will also discover the energetic truth for all to understand---Science and 'evidence' based thinking belongs to the pranic mind which seeks evidence of that which is cannot know. The only way is via the inner heart- forget the mind and proof and science...

It goes on and on. Of course, UM students, you are lost in the trap so you will be thinking ( or think you are feeling)- "WOW what a pranic attack ( where art thou pranic?) I feel sorry for this ( unidentified ) person lost in the Miasma fog.. with love. Let me sit down and check in with myself and eat a gluten/dairy free muffin and blast out some goovy tunes of the younger benhayon clone and bring and bring it back to me" But just before you do that please consider this ( thusly if it helps) You're reading this made you feel a certain way. That is how feelings actually happen. they originate as a result of the mind..they are not independent energies that can guide you as your master says. Do you feel that energy?- the one you want to get away from with the music ( sic) and safe snack. The reason you want to check in, is to maintain the 'mood'- because without it the truth crowds in. You cannot tolerate reality because you view it the same way as you did before UM. nothing has changed from inside, because as per my last post, you've been given nothing to change it with. Just a new story to replace your own.

Thusly I say, ponder that.
Till next time
the forever awakener to truth and the mountain of science.

This is a truely magnificent post COncerned, thank you for it.

And Serge, as Frodo says, where are you? Why not use this forum as an opportunity to speak to a wider audience? An audience not paying you to appear I am afraid, but surely that does not preclude your ability to answer a few basic questions?

There are many points of discussion here, and many people reading who would love to know your answers. Or should I/we take your lack of interest in engaging in discussion as a sign that Universal Medicine is all that we suspect?

+1 COncerned Partner - fair play to you, that was good, well constructed, I don't think anyone can argue against this type of logic-based intelligent analysis.

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Re: Universal medicine
Posted by: lifetruetome ()
Date: May 25, 2012 09:07AM

This is quite interesting. Its hard to imagine that Serge was the only person on the planet that predicted humans in the 21st century will have multiple symptoms of physical disease. My GP 10 years ago told me that immune system problems were on the rise due to over processed food, toxins etc etc ie the rise in autism, allergies etc. It is farcical to think that Serge predicted this, when research and medical science already knew this. This woman must be very intelligent (she is a surgeon and registered dr) but if you read her post you can see that she has been completely brain washed by Serge. Everything that Serge predicts is already out there but somehow his followers believe he was the only person to have predicted them. ie earthquakes have been happening since the world formed and will continue to happen as tectonic plates shift, this has nothing to do whatsoever with human spirit or prana. There were thousands of earthquakes before humans even walked on this planet.

Ahh it is so frustrating that I can't quite believe I am even debating this with adults.

If only he wasn't raking in so much money and having such a hold on the people we know and love you could almost laugh at the absurdity of it all.

[www.thesoulfuldoctor.co.uk]

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Re: Universal medicine
Posted by: MacReady ()
Date: May 25, 2012 12:05PM

Quote
lifetruetome
This is quite interesting. Its hard to imagine that Serge was the only person on the planet that predicted humans in the 21st century will have multiple symptoms of physical disease. My GP 10 years ago told me that immune system problems were on the rise due to over processed food, toxins etc etc ie the rise in autism, allergies etc. It is farcical to think that Serge predicted this, when research and medical science already knew this. This woman must be very intelligent (she is a surgeon and registered dr) but if you read her post you can see that she has been completely brain washed by Serge. Everything that Serge predicts is already out there but somehow his followers believe he was the only person to have predicted them. ie earthquakes have been happening since the world formed and will continue to happen as tectonic plates shift, this has nothing to do whatsoever with human spirit or prana. There were thousands of earthquakes before humans even walked on this planet.

Ahh it is so frustrating that I can't quite believe I am even debating this with adults.

If only he wasn't raking in so much money and having such a hold on the people we know and love you could almost laugh at the absurdity of it all.

[www.thesoulfuldoctor.co.uk]

Agreed. He constantly takes credit for discoveries in various fields as if they were somehow evidence of his predictive powers. Whether it's medical, geological, archeological, he'll share news reports with students and put a very general, ambiguous, 'I've been saying this sort of thing for years' spin on it.

In one of his books he actually states that human evolution will eventually eliminate the separate genders and become hermaphrodites. If that cones to pass I might give him some points, but like all the specific predictions he makes in his books it's always forecast in a future beyond our current lifetimes.

Any UM students reading this will know that Serge has repeatedly stated he'd love to debate his information with scientists and intellectuals. Great, let's see him put his money ($10-25 million) where his mouth is. How about interviews with media figures who aren't UM devotees, and thus willing to ask tough questions (unlike Gayle Cue)? One lone blogger (Yvonne McIlwain) couldn't even get a response to her critical questions. How about a televised debate series so that the world can see Serge outsmart the pranic, lower-minded intellects he criticizes?

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Re: Universal medicine
Posted by: gillweir ()
Date: May 25, 2012 02:29PM

Hi,
I am new to this discussion and forum. I only have indirect experience with students of this organisation and therefore cannot offer first hand experience. The analytical critique of his work is definitely required I think though perhaps we need much more. Multiple disciplines such as psychology, sociology, linguists and post modern theorists could present very revealing information. Can we deepen the analysis somehow?

Initially this was to be a lengthy post scruitinising the lack of esotericism in his vague assertions. I wonder is this approach something that is worth starting another discussion upon? I have experience with various branches of esotericism including Alice bailey and H.P.b (theosophy), Golden Dawn, Rosicrucianism, Kabbalah, and Vajrayana Buddhism.

Initially I would approach: (what is in brackets is just an indicator of where this could go)
- the unusual usage of the word esoteric (he mentions somewhere surfing as not esoteric , well clearly not it is physical plane activity and no esoteric assesment is given. Thought there are various points of view to consider this assertion.)
- 5 vayus or pranas from Hinduism, Buddhism and yogic philsophy (where is is his assesment of these doctrines in his modification of the word prana?)
- Contrasting Alice Baileys work and Serges work (There is no continuation of thought)
- Perhaps an esoteric assesment on the preceding incarnations he claims are his

The list is much longer I know and perhaps others could suggest more of his strange concepts to assess. The purpose is not to present something as true and I assume many on this forum have no interest in esotericism proper and this hopefully is not an issue to all involved.

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Re: Universal medicine
Posted by: rrmoderator ()
Date: May 25, 2012 08:53PM

gillweir:

This thread is about Universal Medicine.

If you wish to discuss something else start another thread.

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Re: Universal medicine
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: May 25, 2012 10:06PM

The focus here is behavior and that it has collatoral victims.

From reports given by Herbert, Concerned Partner, Macready and Frodo what is going on is independant of whatever belief system SB utilises. Many groups with quite different belief systems have had similar effects--which have led people to come to the Ross Institute message board.

From the reports given by Herbert, frodo, Concerned Parnter and Macready here are issues that have been voiced about UM:

*Lack of informed consent.

What people are told in the Level One UM workshops is different from the far out stuff that is given in later, more advanced workshops.

* Existing partnerships are strained or ruptured - that is why Herbert began this thread.

* Devotees spending huge amounts of money to pursue an ever - receding goal, money they may need later in life.

*Collaterial damage to families because UM devotee spouse or friend withdraws. Because UM attracts so very many women, if a UM devotee has children and then goes into this non communicative pattern where only 'feeling into' matters counts and where concerns of non UM members are to be ignored, this withdrawal on the part of someone who is a mother can have a devastating effect on children.

When Mum withdraws ever more, engages in eccentric behavior(cards around the house and under pillows), children will do what children do, and blame themselves for Mum (or Auntie or Big Sister) becoming more and more distant.

All these and the actual details of the business angle/revenue stream for --
this is the throbbing, beating, aching HEART of the matter.

No need to get distracted discussing esotericism.

Actually the genuine hiddenness/esotericism is that we have heard hints that very, very many others would like to discuss the pain UM has brought to their relationships. But they dont talk about it because they are trying at this point to salvage their relationships with UM spouses and fear that participating in an open discussion would jeopardize this.

**So the silent suffering of UM affected friends, partners, families, is the real esoterica of UM. That and its financial status.

I put some Theosophy/Bailey material at the earlier part of the discussion to demonstrate that Serge's material is not as special as he it to be.

That will be part of the heart ache for devotees to face as the cost of leaving UM and re connecting with the world they had been taught to fear. The stuff wasnt special, except in the amount of sacrifice expected of members.

This is another sad thing:

From what I have read, a lot of the recruitment seems to take place through what I would call 'The Girl Pal Network'.

Other gurus have used this, too.

There is a huge bond of trust among women friends A spa, the hairdresser, having lunch together.

It appears that through this girl pal network a lot of recruitment is done for UM, and done sincerely. It may be that a friend who recommends UM is in the early stages, and hasnt been in it long enough to become fear ridden and fragile with slowed gentle movements, a labor intensive diet, and early bedtime that cancels out most adult socializing.

Your friend may be getting the benefits that early stage UM members get, and you trust her because she seems to be happier and healthier and you want to be that way too.

If you are in UM with your friends and have misgivings, you may hesistate to leave because that means losing your friends.

Bonding with members of a group is intense, even if one hasnt been friends prior to membership.

If an existing friendship is spot welded by the additional bonding that takes place in UM and a bonding strengthened by adoration of Serge as fount of all wisdom, disagreeing with that can mean losing ones friends, being made to damned.

And theres the shame of being taken for a fool.

You were not a fool to love and trust a friend.

Thats the worst thing about the groups discussed here throughout RR.com

Turning human friendship into a pathway into something that you are not given full information about at the very beginning.

And that your friend may not have full information about, either.

This isnt being a fool.

It is being adult and intelligent and lacking full disclosure up front of what will be asked of you, long term in UM.

My summation of any group discussed here on RR.com:

Unreciprocated loyalty - unreciprocated in kind, and unreciprocated in one's hour of need.

Some have wondered why I post here and other places on RR.com

Ive experienced unreciprocated loyalty in my family, not once but many times.

One feels burned to the bone.

One feels like a fool to have been human.

Thats the worst of all.

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Re: Universal medicine
Posted by: HerbertKane178 ()
Date: May 26, 2012 04:47PM

I agree, the prediction thing is amazing, I can't quite believe how he gets away with it. For me, this shows just how brainwashed his followers become. They are unable to look at the world apart from through SB's eyes anymore.

I would also like to note, it is a real shame Yvonne McIlwain's blog is no longer around. To read Eric's post saying it helped him extract his wife from Universal Medicine shows the validity of this blog. Most of it is thankfully copied and pasted earlier in this thread, so there for all to read.

Yvonne, if you are reading this, thank you for your work. If you feel like contributing here, you would be most welcome. I think many, many people would be very keen to know what caused the closure of your blog. You can always contact me via PM if that's more appropriate.


Quote
MacReady
Quote
lifetruetome
This is quite interesting. Its hard to imagine that Serge was the only person on the planet that predicted humans in the 21st century will have multiple symptoms of physical disease. My GP 10 years ago told me that immune system problems were on the rise due to over processed food, toxins etc etc ie the rise in autism, allergies etc. It is farcical to think that Serge predicted this, when research and medical science already knew this. This woman must be very intelligent (she is a surgeon and registered dr) but if you read her post you can see that she has been completely brain washed by Serge. Everything that Serge predicts is already out there but somehow his followers believe he was the only person to have predicted them. ie earthquakes have been happening since the world formed and will continue to happen as tectonic plates shift, this has nothing to do whatsoever with human spirit or prana. There were thousands of earthquakes before humans even walked on this planet.

Ahh it is so frustrating that I can't quite believe I am even debating this with adults.

If only he wasn't raking in so much money and having such a hold on the people we know and love you could almost laugh at the absurdity of it all.

[www.thesoulfuldoctor.co.uk]

Agreed. He constantly takes credit for discoveries in various fields as if they were somehow evidence of his predictive powers. Whether it's medical, geological, archeological, he'll share news reports with students and put a very general, ambiguous, 'I've been saying this sort of thing for years' spin on it.

In one of his books he actually states that human evolution will eventually eliminate the separate genders and become hermaphrodites. If that cones to pass I might give him some points, but like all the specific predictions he makes in his books it's always forecast in a future beyond our current lifetimes.

Any UM students reading this will know that Serge has repeatedly stated he'd love to debate his information with scientists and intellectuals. Great, let's see him put his money ($10-25 million) where his mouth is. How about interviews with media figures who aren't UM devotees, and thus willing to ask tough questions (unlike Gayle Cue)? One lone blogger (Yvonne McIlwain) couldn't even get a response to her critical questions. How about a televised debate series so that the world can see Serge outsmart the pranic, lower-minded intellects he criticizes?

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Re: Universal medicine
Date: May 26, 2012 06:21PM

Hi All
I thought I might use a different tact having spoken today with another student who, god love her, has no idea how she is just channelling Serge. It is saddening to see people lose there unique self and become mindless channels for Serge. So this post is addressed to those who are thinking about Universal Medicine and hopefully for those who are deep in and a small part of their true self wants to find it’s way back out.

A meditation on Universal Medicine…

First let me say, I understand that it ‘feels good’ to be a part of the UM community. There is a sense of knowingness, soulful evolution, community and connection. At this time perhaps that feel good is pre-eminent and any contradictions, doubt, concern about the money you are spending, what your friends, partner, husband says, very secondary. On top of that, you have been told, over and over that resistance is a sign that the person doing so has been ‘touched’ by the truth of the work and that the greater the criticism the more it is true. Moreover, you have been told that the new era is upon us and that resistance will grow. Yes Serge has anticipated it all. So right now, you maybe slightly confused. Is Serge right, or is he a masterful manipulator? If you choose to read on, the questions I pose are to make careful consideration of that:


There are many many similar groups in the world today.
All of them discredit other leaders, traditions and thought systems. Yet members in these groups believe that theirs alone is not a belief system and they are being liberated and that they are 'in-truth'- They all feel happy, even joyous ( at least to begin) and are in a love bubble. If you question them if they are in a cult they will look at you with head slightly to one side and assuredly tell you "no, it is all about love...nothing else"- this is not exclusive to UM- Consider: If universal Medicine IS the first group ever in history to know the truth, you are very very lucky… or possibly just in the same situation as many other well meaning seekers in other the many other groups on the planet ( and remember, many if not all of these leaders predict attack or resistance in some form from people not aligned with their message, and some cases that has became self-fulfilling)

Putting aside the connotation of the word CULT for a moment
, let's consider what your group is about: It has its own set of books and fundamentals. It has its own rules, language, symbols, music, art, food, (Non) exercise regime and mediation technique. In a true sense it has its own CULTure. A belief system in itself usually does not necessarily require any particular adherence in behaviour outside of the central belief and a moral code. ( think mainstream religion) A sect is defined as a sub group of an existing belief system ( Christian or Muslim sect for example)- and in this case, to define themselves they may ask for certain rules around food or dress as well as the central re-interpretation of central tenets. A Cult is defined as one when it's own independent belief system (and remember, UM is now a registered religion. In order to be one, it must have a belief in a supernatural being and its own set of doctrines to which to adhere- if this is not the case for UM, then the registration is illegal) Now Consider: Forgetting how you feel about the word cult- IS UM a group of people truly free to decide what is right for them without deference to an exclusive doctrine and without guidelines on how to behave in the world?- or is it a by this sheer definition ( and the recent registration as a religion) alone a cult?

If something or someone else is wrong, is UM therefore right? Serge uses a classic sleight-of-hand to “prove” his ancient wisdom. He emphasizes something that is clearly wrong as ‘prima facie’ proof that his words and wisdom are right. For example, drinking lots of alcohol is clearly not productive and does result in health consequences, as does smoking, drug taking, over eating, lack of exercise…however because that is the dominant paradigm of contemporary times, does it validate the tenets of his ‘wisdom”? Just because the Catholic church is clearly flawed, does it make his new religion not? Serge uses subject matters which he knows will touch people and get them nodding profuse agreement so that when he introduces his ideas your head is still nodding. So next time you are listening to Serge, ask yourself, is he simply gift-wrapping his ideas in something I can accept to make the unacceptable less so?

Is Serge mesmerizing you? This may seem strange question, but ask yourself, when you go to the retreats and the EDG’s and the treatments isn’t part of the process to site and go inside and to let Serge’s words ‘energetically’ go past your mind? Many talks start with a ‘going within’ and relaxation process very similar to that used by clinical hypnotists to prep a willing subject into a more suggestive state. It is true, people cannot be made to do what they do not wish, but it is known that in these relaxed states the mind is more suggestive. So ask yourself: Is there a reason you feel ‘relaxed and wonderful’ post retreat, treatment and EDG and why you have a constant need to go back, and moreover that you are not able to induce the same state exactly without revisiting the retreat, the course, the treatment…?

Is Serge a leader or just a fellow student? This question answers itself. He is clearly the centre of the organisation. The money flows to him and his companies and charity. (If he is not the centre, maybe he would happily share the funds and rotate the speaking schedule so everyone can share their wisdom and in the abundance) He is the one allegedly in contact with the Hierarchy, the author of the books and the ( registered) doctrine, he is the one that claims the authority of lifetimes of significant historical figures, makes predictions and picks significant dates and tells his audience he is smarter than leading scientists and the Dalai Lama. Contrarily, he does say he is no different to anyone else and is just a presenter of information; but please consider, if Serge is not the leader, then why do you look to him for information and treatments, and why is it that most UM students follow the edicts of his books and lectures. What would happen if Serge passed to the other side tomorrow? When you are thinking about UM who is the first person to come to your mind? Yes, that person in your minds eye is the leader.

The next question is are you under the control of a leader? You may say, no I am free to do as I please and I make my own decisions. Serge encourages us to check in with ourselves to see how we 'feel' about it and says he doesn't want any one to believe something that doesn't feel right. I don't live in a compound like I imagine cult people do, I work normally, interact with other people- I just feel more loving..... but do you, and are you? Consider this: Do you feel just slightly guilty when you eat something with dairy or gluten? Do you avoid that food for the same reason? Would you feel guilty cheering a football game, or riding your bike up a big hill and breaking into a profuse sweat? If the answer is at all yes, you ARE under his remote control. By creating rules of how you engage with the world he is delineating you from others and creating a choice of sanctity ( esoteric) or non-sanctity ( pranic) in your every waking moment. If you don't lift the heavy shopping bags, are afraid of vigorous love making, only listen to tacitly approved music and so forth it may be you are under a control and not making your own choice. So consider: Is the reason you don't do these things truly because that is your choice and how you really feel joyously, or is there an element of guilt and perhaps even shame? If so, is that constant negative ( or potential )EMOTION something that you want to live with? will it bring you closer to your own truth? And most importantly, are you really making your own decisions or are you under some type of control with implicit rules set by another?

Is UM a liberating tool or a complicated belief system designed to befuddle the mind? Does the practice empower you to understand more about yourself and what is right for you? Or does it entail a complicated cosmology of ideas that you cannot possibly prove or know for yourself, and most importantly that you cannot disprove; therefore rendering your objections, if any, as merely someone unable to perceive due to lack of development or clouding of the unformed/lower mind? Then consider: if you (dare in your own mind) question or even deny some of the more radical ideas that Serge puts forth in his “treatise’s” and “sayings” and “Satsangs” and retreats and EDG’s, do you feel like you are denying the ultimate goal? – namely connection with your inner heart, soul and God? Does that make you feel bad? If so, rather than finding your own truth, you ARE being asked to accept his to prove your worthiness of the goal you seek and that you are ‘doing the work’?

Is Serge asking you directly or tacitly to forsake you own mind, knowledge and sense in favour of his? Next time you are reading his books, listening to his words, ask yourself with that other part of your mind.. “is Serge telling me I am incapable in my current state to know the (energetic) truth?” “ Is my mind not to be trusted? And other books, philosophy, traditions, teachers, authorities, it is not me, and not others who am I left with? Does that also make you feel guilty, like you are treading of the path? Not doing ‘the work’- If so are giving your self to Serge rather than learning how to find your own truth without fear of where your mind/heart/feelings might go in its journey to truth?.

You counter with, “it resonates with me and I feel good” and “it explains the unexplainable things that have happened to me!”- But consider; Is the resonance as simple as the powerful feeling of someone breaking your paradigm or long held point of view? The sense of an epiphany is often simply the realisation that your existing paradigm, thought, belief was wrong, NOT necessarily that the new one is right. But it is a great time to get someone to your way of thinking if you are the one that breaks the old paradigm! And yes, we have all had things happen we can’t explain- co-incidences, feelings, insights. But is Serge’s interpretations the right or simply the more convenient one because we cant or refuse to allow ourselves to see an alternative and equally satisfying explanation?

The unexamined life is not worth living. -Socrate in Plato, Dialogues, Apology


If this is not true then, you may feel despair and ask, is there any truth in the world if Serge and Universal Medicine is not. Don’t let that be a reason to cling to something that may not be true. The answer is there IS truth. But the path is narrow and requires your ultimate participation, and unreserved search for your truth. This means casting aside your predilections, your untested beliefs; acutely examining the source of information, and why you are attracted to it, and not another. Examining why you seek information that supports the belief already formed and eschewing that which does not, and the confronting those ideas truthfully… only when we have undertaken that difficult journey are we ready to discern what is true for ourselves without fear of finding it is not what we imagined at the start of our journey.

Many of us, if not the vast majority, make the error of looking to others for the truth, and the greater error of believing that others can and do know something they do or cannot. As Serge says himself without understanding its true import , the truth is within. The path does not require MORE beliefs and unprovable ideas even more fantastic than the one before. You do not have to believe in something obscure to hold the notion of advancement towards a higher understanding, self-realisation or even God. In each of us is an amazing ability for self-reflection above and beyond our minds. It allows us to examine ourselves, and as Socrates sagely implores, our lives to find their meaning. No one outside can tell you that and if they are asking you to fill your mind with even more ideas that will have to be discarded later, then they are not helping but hindering you. The next time you choose to read Serges works or listen to his words, ask yourself, “Am I examining myself for all I am truly worth, or am I giving myself to someone for all I am worth”

Trust yourself. Take the good from UM, if you found any, leave the rest and continue your journey with the discernment of Buddha who saw that humans’ construct meaning to obscure themselves from the more simple truth of themselves and of our ultimate nature. We have been blessed with self awareness and it is because of that we seek meaning, and it is from that you will discern it if you take the road less travelled. As you wouldn’t surrender it to drugs and alcohol, you should not surrender it to another outside yourself.

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