rrmoderator?

You are just learning about R.B. Thieme recently?


Is that true?




In Christ, GeneZ



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/15/2007 08:31AM by rrmoderator.

GeneZ:

The first read about Thieme was on this message board.

But I am not the subject of this thread, Thieme is.

Please try to stay on topic.

Last warning.

<sub>Truthtesty: It's quite possible that political powers that be within the USA, paid Thieme to teach as he did. For political persuasion of christians within the United States."



November 12, 2007 10:00PMtonyatl
Date Added: 11/05/2007
Posts: 14 Re: R.B. Thieme Jr.
Tonya:

i had responded to this comment earlier but do not see it posted. perhaps my comments were too controversial or it simply has not been processed for posting yet or did not make it to the moderator inbox. but since this has started my hobby horse to rock, i thought i would make another attempt to comment on this important subject.

i do believe strongly that bob thieme was a cia asset. without "smoking gun" evidence i believe that a reasonable prima facie case can be made that thieme was either directly a cia agent or explicitly cooperative in their aims. once you know how the cia operates, especially in its murder of jfk, it becomes easy to connect the dots between thieme, the military and the cia.

i remember vividly bob thieme's endless lectures about how so vital "doctrinal inculcation" was in light of the purported massive breakdown of american gi pows in korea prisoner camps by their korean and chinese captors. the chinese had superior brainwashing and psyops capabilities which the united states needed to match. indeed the cia started before that time to massively investigate that capability even going into the occult in an attempt to gain an edge over communist abilities.

another point to remember is that the cia made use of many and diverse religious groups to recruit as well as to manipulate opinion. it is my conclusion that berachah church was a military and cia recruiting station. thieme's many innumerable comments about leading cia operations and cold war era figures cements for me those ties.

among the key points: 1. thieme was highly defensive of the cia and big military. eisenhower's warning about the military industrial complex was to be laughed off as the foolish comments of a doddering old war hero who did not understand the treacherous times in which we lived. 2. thieme was highly laudatory of the many cold war archie bunkers such as curtis lemay, edwin landsdale, et. al. it is a miracle that we avoided nuclear war with half wits such as these. i think that the defending argument is that they never really meant it because it was for direct soviet consumption. ugh 3. thieme was contemptuous of democracy and although i will grant his distinction between republicanism and democracy he also thought republicanism passe as the usa had outgrown that form of government just as republican rome did when augustus caesar established imperial rome. at the beginning of the roman series thieme went ape#%@& over the foolishness which democracy sends to washington and the need for an enlightened monarchy or oligarchy. this was a leading cia theme during the 1950s and especially 1960s when the kennedys came to power.... 4. thieme bragged frequently how he could become a general any time he wanted but chose to "study and teach doctrine" i mean brainwash the religiously inclined. this speaks of thieme's powerful connections at the time...5. thieme spent massive amounts of energy blasting jfk and spoke of his death as divine discipline. as nixon ineptly alluded on his own tapes, the texas crowd and the bay of pigs fiasco were in a lot of deep doodoo.....clearly thieme's views of the cia and his satisfaction with kennedy's ouster provides another pre-connected dot in my mind. bob thieme was also an inveterate defender of texas oil interests.

the sum total of the foregoing points is that bob thieme's thoughts were so well aligned with the cia AND his connections were so good that it is reasonable that he was not just a cia dupe but an active agent for them.</sub>


Truthtesty:
I certainly can appreciate you comment on the CIA and Thieme, at this point in time.

I remember when I was about to join the Marine Corps, and I was told by one of Thieme's deacons (who was a close family friend of my parents), that when I finished my tour with the Marine Corps, I could come back and join Thieme's "Army". I asked him what he meant by that, and he put his finger to his lips for "shhh".



Truthtesty

Tonya: i remember vividly bob thieme's endless lectures about how so vital "doctrinal inculcation" was in light of the purported massive breakdown of american gi pows in korea prisoner camps by their korean and chinese captors. the chinese had superior brainwashing and psyops capabilities which the united states needed to match. indeed the cia started before that time to massively investigate that capability even going into the occult in an attempt to gain an edge over communist abilities.


Pardon me for having another theory, but in someways I think Thieme was trying to pre-brainwash Americans (or something to that effect), to preemptively defeat Chineese brainwashing. There was a big scare at that time after the Korean war about Chineese brainwashing. Dr. Lifton was also an Air Force officer (psycologist) at that time and actually did counseling work with US Korean War POWs. I think much of Dr. Lifton's criteria on mind control comes from these Korean POW studies. Thieme's theory would not have worked, because it was determined that those who were extremly obediant, simply switched "Masters" when captured. Ironically it was the rebellious types who were rebellious to authority, that best kept America's secrets safe, the obedient cheesepuffs turned over quicker. I read that in some of the articles mentioned in JSTOR about Chinees communist brainwashing.


I keep thinking of Korean War POW sensory deprivation techniques and how people from bereichah night after night, were induced into stress positions of not moving, demands for forced attention, under fear of reprisal (threats- all sorts: God, Thieme yelling, Houston police escort, etc...), and under extreme authority - to break the individual down. Kinda like the pictures you see of POWs today, only we didn't have hoods on and dogs barking in our face. Well we were barked at though.



Truthtesty

To the Forum:


I think also this is the timeframe where Ed Hunter (CIA) is going to come into play. Ed Hunter turned out to have false theories about brainwashing, but he did coin the term "brainwash".

Here's Thieme and Hunter.

[www.schwarzreport.org]

More research is due...

Truthtesty

Quote
rrmoderator
GeneZ:

The first read about Thieme was on this message board.

But I am not the subject of this thread, Thieme is.

Please try to stay on topic.

Last warning.

It was only meant to be in regards to Thieme.

Here's why..

Rick Ross has been incorporated for a good number of years. Yet? Thieme is only being mentioned here recently.

The report on Thieme that TTesty used was dated around 1976. Why are you only seeing his name mentioned here now? And, only after he has Alzheimer's and can not speak for himself?

As well as someone can make a up a report about his past life at this time? And? Who can refute it, or clarify what went on?


Thieme has for a long time been controversial. So have other preachers. That does not make anyone a cult.


Those here filing their complaints? Not one of them wanted to be in Berachah church as a child or teen.

The ones I see complaining the loudest where exposed to Thieme as children, or in their teens. They did not choose to enter his church as an adult of their own free will. And? They hated the church. They were forced by their parents/relatives to attend.



If these are the ones making a complaint? What does that mean? RR should have seen reports coming to your organization when Thieme was in his prime if he was truly a cult.


It was either Newsweek, or Time Magazine. There was a report on Thieme done because he was the pastor of Vice President Dan Quayle's wife. They reported of his right wing leanings. They spoke of his stand on anti-liberal issues. But, not one reporter even hinted at him being a cult. Dan Quayle was the mockery of the media. If Thieme was a cult? It would have been made known then. For the media was very pro-liberal and disliked Thieme's stand on issues.

That's why I asked you what I did. It was not about you. It concerned Thieme.


I figure if all the things being said here are only recent? And, as you indicate, they are. And, mostly by a few, who as children? Were forced to attend Berachah? If it were a cult you should have been long aware of his name by adults who attended as adults. That's how I see it.

Only now after he has Alzheimer's are the critics coming out in the open like they are. A few.. And, not one is coming out with the reports that one normally finds with cults who do use mind control.


Now, saying one is a cult because of a doctrinal stand is nothing new. Its wrong to do in most cases. But it is done more often than not. Here is a prime example:

Billy Graham, and Charle Stanley are cults




I ask you? As a moderator? Why is it your organization was not alerted before and only recently about Thieme? And, only after after Thieme can not speak for himself? By those who were forced to attend as youngsters? I have been in churches where I could not stand what was going on. Did that make them a cult? No. But? What if I were forced to attend by my parents? How would I see it?

That's why I asked if you said you only heard of him recently. The controversy he caused with his Bible teachings has been going on since the late 60's in Christian circles. You are only hearing of him now. Something is not adding up.

But? (the big.. "but.") If enough here want to, and insist? That Thieme is a cult? Be my guest. I came back here because I did not like seeing his name maligned at a time he can not defend himself. But, who am I to convince anyone of something they simply do not want to believe?


Be my guest. Say he is a cult. I think you're wrong. But? At this point? What business is that of mine?


I tried. I love to study the Bible so I am then labeled a devoted follower. Well? I have been called worse. So be it. Carry on. Thieme is a cult, if that's what you want to believe. Nothing I can do to make you think otherwise. So... until next time.



In Christ, GeneZ

GeneZ:

When you post try not to repeat the same things over and over again, which you do frequently.

The Ross Institute has not stated that Thieme led a "cult."

See [forum.culteducation.com]

This is a false or "straw man" argument.

Thieme does fit well within the category of "controversial," which you have admitted.

There are thousands and thousands of small groups throughout America that are led and dominate by authoritarian leaders with little if any meaningful accountability that have hurt people. I learn about a new group that fits this criteria almost every day. Often a group and/or leader has been around for a very long time before he or she comes to my attention.

I have never received a complaint about Billy Graham or Charles Stanley, and they are not the subject of this thread.

Again, stay on topic and stop repeating yourself endlessly.

Your posts do at times make Thieme's influence appear "cult-like."

Quote
rrmoderator
Your posts do at times make Thieme's influence appear "cult-like."

This much I must add..

I know I may appear to be cult-like.

For, a congregation that desires in depth teaching?

It will appear to be cult like.

In some circles its referred to as a Word of God revival. Not, simply revival, where many become saved for the first time.


A Word of God revival manifests a high devotion to the Word of God. Not the man teaching.

The man who can teach well, ends up being highly respected by those who desire the teaching.

But their devotion, is to Jesus Christ, who is revealed in the teaching of God's Word.


In Christ, GeneZ

GeneZ:

Please don't preach, which is against the rules of you agreed to before posting here.

No one has that in-depth learning or study makes a group appear "cult-like."

What I said was that your behavior on this board appears at times cult-like.

And I am not going to go round and round arguing such things with you.

Stay on topic or move on.

voltaic:

Your last few posts on this thread have been deleted.

They were off topic.

If you have complaints about moderation on the board email me.