QuoteSideOfBacon"at the risk of sounding belligerent" That was belligerent. But, since you weren't "remembering yourself", at the moment, there was no risk. By the way, why do you make belligerence sound so undesirable, then venture headlong into it? sorry but your post is unintelligible to me. maybe you or someone else can explain it to me.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

wow-- anybody who has had direct and lengthy exposure to gans and her minions-- again it is gans and her minions-- looks at this government manchurian candidate stuff for what it surely is: the misguided assumptions of someone on the outside looking in but who deeply needs answers. mx kitty-- as i recall from your prior posts, you were only an infant when red mountain ranch was going on, and i re
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

i have one question for those posters who have had positive and beneficial experiences in gurdjieffian groups: since it is axiomatic that self-remembering is the basis and linchpin of your particular discipline, why not submit some of your more advanced participants to the kind of scrutiny that tibetan monks have: this would go a long way to dispel suspicions that self-remembering is anyth
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Quotebill77One more thought on the subject..... …If you are a Christian, your visions follow a certain pattern; if you are a Hindu, a Buddhist, or a Muslim, they follow a different pattern. You see Christ or Krishna, according to your conditioning; your education, the culture in which you have been brought up, determines your visions. Which is the actuality: the vision, or the mind which
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Quotebill77Truth is not for those who are respectable, nor for those who desire self-extension, self-fulfillment. Truth is not for those who are seeking security, permanency; for the permanency they seek is merely the opposite of impermanency. Being caught in the net of time, they seek that which is permanent, but the permanent they seek is not the real because what they seek is the pro
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteBronte GThe Gurdjieff people here where I live apparently, so I was told, decided not to invite me to join them, decades ago, because I had got into "something else", as people will notice from my other postings here, if they feel the need to check. My background was inclining me away from the complicated methods of extreme intellectual aproaches, as they seem to be for the clever
Forum: Recovery from Destructive Cults and Groups

lol. count dracula is dead and gone forever and now one of his many renfields decides to weigh in with some faux-clever recurrence claptrap reference. try living in the real world before you are dead and gone forever too. you're truly creepy. for your information he had convinced himself years ago he wasn't coming back. thankfully this is one of the few truths he ever uttered. hope t
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Moishe3rd wrote: According to this website: The "Alex Horn" Pages Alex Horn passed away September 30, 2007. I am wondering if anyone knows if this is true. "There is no way this winter is ever going to end as long as that groundhog keeps seeing his shadow. I don't see any way out of it. He's got to be stopped. And I have to stop him." lol. coun
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteMoishe3rdI realize that folks are bitter and upset. It's understandable, based on what y'all are writing about. However.... Every few years I Google Sharon or Alex just to find out what they've been up to now... So, I see there's a new website up - - which invites people to "tell their stories." And, stopping by this forum again, I see that some of the com
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

My apologies for assuming you were speaking of Gans and Horn.
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

There is no chance that Sharon Gans and Alex Horn-- both malignant narcissists and paranoid, and likely substance abusers-- could ever have been involved in secret government programs. Alex Horn has in fact based much of his feverish and fetid writings on government conspiracy theories. Grandiosity will do that to you. Sharon Gans was a failed actress and hardly the raw material that the governme
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Skeptical: QuoteI saw the pages on Sharon Gans on this site, so I know there is cult use of the writings of Gurdjieff. A girlfriend of a friend of mine got heavily into Gurdjieff and began going to meetings of some group that studied him after she and my friend had a harsh breakup. I don't know if this group she's in is connected to Gans. Fast forward a couple of years and now sh
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotewasthereSo cher7 you have avoided my question: were you a student of Alex Horn or not? You have danced around it but have not stated directly. So........ Also a dialogue might be interesting but the ground rules are simple. No attacking, no insults. I refuse to get into these. I did attack, and I did insult, in reply. But that has to be the end of it. If you don't agree, fine, but I
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

was there: I took the time and effort to examine and your initial post, offering several points along the way which you chose not to respond to. Your initial response was a dismissive "whatever." Then you thought better of it and now you apparently want to lecture me instead of responding directly to the points I raised. Instead of a dialogue you are asking me to talk back "at&q
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

QuoteI was a member of Alex Horn's group from the Red Mountain Ranch to the Everyman Theatre. I paid $200 per month to be a member, and paid it in cash. Robert Klien and Fred Mindel were my friends and co students. Sharon Gans joined Alex and together started the Theatre. I found Alex's Gym at 24th and Mission, which was turned into the Everyman Theatre. I was there when theatre was bui
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Moishe: QuoteYes, I am sure it could cost thousands of dollars a month and that Sharon (and Alex?) may be wealthy off of this largesse. And, I am not doubting their obsessions with this facet of their "teachings." Largesse? Largesse implies that one has money to spare to give to those in need. On the contrary, many students have had to hold down two or more jobs and neglect their s
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteI was involved with Sharon and Alex back in SF, Boston and NY. I liked them. Obsessive; dominating; and yes, probably dangerous, but nonetheless, I liked them. Obsessive about what? You were with Sharon and Alex during their "theater years." Do you mean "obsessive" as in: dragging people off the streets of San Francisco to watch mediocre actors/students fulfill Alex�
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

QuoteAs always, I google around and try and check up to see what Alex and Sharon are up to - Bob and Fred and the rest too, if I can find them. If you had really left that situation behind as you claim you would not "as always" be trying to find them. QuoteI was in school back in the 70's and early 80's and Bob was actually a very good friend of mine. As were Sharon and
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

If you are a student stuck in a group led by Alex Horn or Sharon Gans-Horn, then the fact you are reading this is already great news. It means that you are smart enough and intuitive enough and courageous enough to have begun to distinguish between the ideas of Gurdjieff and Ouspensky and the people teaching them. Whether or not what Gurdjieff or Ouspensky taught is valuable and valid does not ma
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

If you are a student stuck in a group led by Alex Horn or Sharon Gans-Horn, then the fact you are reading this is already great news. It means that you are smart enough and intuitive enough and courageous enough to have begun to distinguish between the ideas of Gurdjieff and Ouspensky and the people teaching them. Whether or not what Gurdjieff or Ouspensky taught is valuable and valid does not ma
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

If you are a student stuck in a group led by Alex Horn or Sharon Gans-Horn, then the fact you are reading this is already great news. It means that you are smart enough and intuitive enough and courageous enough to have begun to distinguish between the ideas of Gurdjieff and Ouspensky and the people teaching them. Whether or not what Gurdjieff or Ouspensky taught is valuable and valid does not ma
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

If you are a student stuck in a group led by Alex Horn or Sharon Gans-Horn, then the fact you are reading this is already great news. It means that you are smart enough and intuitive enough and courageous enough to have begun to distinguish between the ideas of Gurdjieff and Ouspensky and the people teaching them. Whether or not what Gurdjieff or Ouspensky taught is valuable and valid does not ma
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"