From Page 3 of Buddha Chat forum (this is one page of a very long set of threads. Go read the whole thing and also go to e-sangha and do a search and see if anything is posted there on NKT) Someone discusses NKT using both Lifton's criteria and those of Professor Margaret Thaler Singer: Quote Hi there, if one takes Margaret Thaler Singer's book on cults (Singer is an ack
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

The LGATs are corrupt from their source. They treat and process human beings as objects. There is no concept of inherant dignity of the ordinary human person. Both Gurdy and Erhard taught that humans are mere mechanisms. They were both interested in mere power and had no sense of an ethos of care toward thier subjects. PS If you want to read about someone who has suffered horribly in
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteRick Ross wrote: To whom it may concern: It seems like NKT members are attempting to overwhelm this thread. Corboy comments: Yes, and it is interesting how very quickly numerous NKT members showed up, saying pretty much the same thing, and showed up in such great numbers, less than 24 hours after Judy, a new member of the RR.com message board, requested information about NKT.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

This is an old message but it illustrates a difference between two irreconciliable perspectives--whether one puts total faith in one's guru as an emanation of Buddha, leaving no perspective outside of the guru-student relationship one can turn to if that relationship begins to go wrong, or was corrupt from the start because the guru with-held information from the student about the guru'
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I decided to wait and see what would unfold on the message board. No one seems to have been willing to reply to Mr. Ross's inquiry--are you members of NKT and capable of discussing it--or allowing others to discuss NKT from a perspective outside itself. Some may chirp, 'This is a violation of right speech.' In my opinion, it is right speech to state 'there exists a v
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

And Continuing Education Module 'Fringe Psychotherapies: The Public at Risk' by Barry L. Beyerstein This article is on a website that has additional resources. Name of the site is Americans Against Fraudulent Self Help The entire Beyerstein article is great. It is excellent for persons who cannot easily get a copy of Lilienfeld, Lynn and Lohr's book Scien
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Go read Steve Salerno's Shamblog...he has articles on Oprah, Byron Katie, Eckie Tolle, and others. He covers exactly how cultic New age milieu has infiltrated the mainstream. And I am very sorry to report that psychotherapists who are gullible and are NOT adequately trained on the scientist practitioner model are another gateway through which snake oil gets marketed by charis
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Sedgwick's book is fascinating, but it can be expensive to purchase a copy, unless you get lucky on alibris.com or bookfinder.com He has a website, www.traditionalists.org, and also a blog. The comments for Against The Modern World on Amazon.com are interesting---people either appreciated the book, or loathed it. The ones who loathed the book seemed quite irate that traditionalism itse
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Cultic Milieu--a Possibly Helpful Concept? 'The concept of 'cultural milieu', as developed by sociologist Bryan Wilson,is very helpful in understanding this conglomeration of alternatives. According to Wilson, there is exists in Western societies, a milieu, which he terms 'cultic' where much that is rejected by the dominent cultureaccumulates.(Corboy's italics) --
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Advice for those quitting: From QuoteAs to the social/environmental: You may have to decide what kind of environment you surround yourself with during this difficult time. In my counseling experience, people who surround themselves with friends who continue to meditate — or at least support the TM Movement and the Maharishi — have a difficult time cutting back or ceasing meditation.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

From John Knapp's website--an article on trance addiction. (Pause for station identification) Those who dislike the implications of the article may try to dismiss it by saying, 'Oh, John Knapp just wrote this to recruit for his practice. This isnt any different from what BK does. Well, ha ha. There is a difference. Unlike BK, Mr. Knapp is a licensed mental health professio
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

A Vision of the Future A warning to all the successful and aspiring human potential entrepreneurs/euses out there: When you are old and helpless and rich, you dont want to be surrounded by folks who will tell you 'Turn it around' after they've screwed you over in your elderly helplessness. Or if you report that another caregiver slapped you or yanked the catheter too har
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

If at some point, you can describe this mental construct it would be very helpful and informative. I grew up in a secret ridden family. One construct that took me decades to identify was something I learned to do as a young child, before I was even old enough to examine my own thoughts. (I call this sort of pre-verbal training 'pre-formatting') I learned to how to keep secrets wit
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

To Makeup: Keep your day job. Stay employable. Protect your health and sanity. Do as John suggested and make sure you eat even if you dont feel like it. This is going to sound silly but make sure you're drinking enough water. If we get sllightly dehydrated this speeds up heart rate. This, on top of stress can aggravate stress related rapid heart rate and make it harder to calm down a
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Dear Anticult, thanks for your assessment of eastern philosophies as just one method among many that can, potentially, be used to induce trance. This induction of confusion seems basic. Ive been approached by street hustlers who would babble a mile a minute, telling a story, bombarding me with too much information. They'd be agitated and I'd find myself getting agitated along with th
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

ON2LF wrote: Must say, its brilliant to utilize unverifiable stories such as epiphany on a park bench or the cockroach. Why? Because these tie in to every day situations that scare us. Corboy ponders: Many of us fear becoming that person who lives on the park bench. To become homeless is to join the ranks of the living dead. Folks dont even look you in the eye. Its the most te
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

A Long Sunday Rant or Drosh Dear H108: QuoteAnd this was a great shortcoming in cult life - how you were personally feeling and interacting with the world was irrelevant and actually dismissed as illusion. Friend, the guru who persuaded you and others to follow him or her was covertly not taking that same advice. To market oneself and acquire and retain followers and generate income, on
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

A final note on differences between Indian and Western attitudes about privacy: If anyone thinks that Koestler's view point is rare or eccentric, Captain Richard Francis Burton made a similar observation in the 1850s, though he expressed it in language much different from Koestler. Burton was a hardy man, an explorer, a career soldier. But even he had this to say--and he said it despite l
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteThough I had read about it in books, the din and noise and profanity in Indian places of worship came as a shock. I found that there is more peace to be had in Manhattan than in any Indian town or village, temple or shrine. (Koestler was there in the late 1950s!) 'If the temple was an historic monument, the atmosphere was that of Brighton Pier; if it was a modest local shrine, the sc
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteKoestler wrote,w hen discussing his impressions of Advaita as taught by Krishna Menon, who taught a particularly clear cut form of it: ''...that is precisely the trouble: Eastern philosophy cannot be de-mythologized and conceptualized. Every attempt to distill its essence produces an unpalatable acid; and every attempt to translate it into the verbal concepts and catagories of W
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Mr Peter Skolnik, Esq -- Quotefrom the website of Lowenstein and Sandler LLC: Peter L. Skolnik is Chair of the firm's Media and Entertainment Practice, and concentrates his litigation practice in the areas of media and entertainment law, First Amendment law, intellectual property litigation and counseling, and complex civil litigation. Mr. Skolnik counsels clients and litigates cop
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

This was posted in the Google alt fan landmark site. Important Information and Health read here: ; How many people, trying to fend off a LEC recruiter, would even want to mention they have any of the health conditions listed on this form as published on Alt Fan? This stuff is confidential information. How can a person know that LEC or (say) your LEC recruiter will handle that k
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Add this to the LEC form quoted above. What were to happen if the person going through this had not been doing the LGAT at home but had been doing it through another group...and in Europe? The person who reported this horrifying outcome was a social worker. Please read the posts on that thread. Serious stuff. Landmark and Psychosis...Let us not Forget Quote In the winter of 19
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Note: here is way to tell the difference in India between the wealthy man and the poor man. Wealthy men are not the ones selling off their kidneys to raise money for their families. And daughters from wealthy families in India are very much much less likely than daughters from poor families to be sold into prostitution. There's a difference, folks. I dont know if Melville said it
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Solea wrote: QuoteIs that the kind of emotionally disconnected life that people really want to live? The answer may be yes. Look at the popularity of iPods. (I call 'em 'ear worms'). Great way to split off and dissociate from one's surroudings. On a more serious note, if you can, try and get a copy of Arthur Koestler's book, The Lotus and the Robot. Around 19
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Dear Solea: here is the link, from Google group alt.fan.landmark for "NOTICE OF IMPORTANT INFORMATION AND HEALTH WARNINGS" ; Note: despite the contents of this form, one RR.com correspondant told us a very distressing situation that involved her husband, who according to this correspondant, has one of the medical conditions LEC mentions on its form as being good reason NOT to
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Un Reciprocated Loyalty--a case study Here is a way to investigate this. Someone on one of the Google listserves posted a copy of Landmark's form entitled "NOTICE OF IMPORTANT INFORMATION AND HEALTH WARNINGS" the full copy can be read here: ; A very promising way to determine if something might be an LGAT is to get copies of their disclaimer forms and compare
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteThe Anticult:So when someone openly declares what an amazingly spiritual consciousness they have and how Eckhart Tolle has taught them how to live in the moment If you have to say 'I am a spiritual person' that calls into question whether this is true. If you have to say 'I am a loving person' or 'I am compassionate' -- this calls into question whether you
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

This URL might be worth looking at. One area of concern voiced by parents was that the ideological/religious element underlying Waldorf was downplayed and they wished that W school people had been forthcoming with information about the contents of the Steiner belief sytem and how it is applies in W schools, before the parents had selected W school. Its a tough situation because by the
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Here is a way to investigate this. Someone on one of the Google listserves posted a copy of Landmark's form entitled "NOTICE OF IMPORTANT INFORMATION AND HEALTH WARNINGS" the full copy can be read here: ; A very promising way to determine if something might be an LGAT is to get copies of their disclaimer forms and compare them with this one. If someone refuses t
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"