From wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kabir#Criticism: Criticism According to an article in The Independent, a former member has described SIF's teachings as "virulently homophobic, often anti-Islamic and misogynist...they were forced to worship Butler, who is considered to be akin to a God."[10] The same article described SIF as a "secretive cult".[10] A 20
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Good things to read so as not to dry up your common sense:
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

And here we have Tulsi Gabard partnering with the very "elite" she has so many issues with. Funny how she went from "Jai Gurudev" to failed politician, FOX news sweetheart and now Gabbard said she was partnering with X on a series of short films to share stories of people "whose voices are silenced." Wonder what voices she's gonna represent on behalf of h
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

"that unhappy mixture of insanity and ignorance called "faith. "" —Robert Greene Ingersol And another from a different Robert Greene: "too much respect for other people's wisdom will make you depreciate your own".
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

The term Avadhuta or "Paramahamsa." in Sanskrit is often used to (justify) odd behavior in so-called saintly figures. We've all heard the tales of assorted holy personalities that behave in seemingly unsaintly ways but still get pegged as saints. I always struggle with this aspect of these cults. They, on the one hand, ask that all manner of rules and ideologies be followed, but
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Please note: Ex SIF Members Facebook page has at least 3 hard-core hare krishna fanatics on there. These are all folks that can dramatically derail our efforts. Please be careful where you post and who you trust. Happy 2024!
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

To give you an estimate of how many followers butler has (most have never met him or know much beyond some filtered idea they are fed by his disciples) you can look at Butler's wifes (ex wife?) Instagram and probably half that number. There's no question butler liked to tease and make fun of followers in front of a bunch of people at gatherings or letters he commanded be read out lou
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Well, there's no question that intelligent people get involved in cults. And there's definitely no question that Tulsi gabbard is a intelligent person. There's no question that Chris Butler is an intelligent person. I don't think that all they espouse is some kind of complete and utter trash even though I may say so in hopes that people will see through much of it as being so.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Butler made us all so paranoid of iskcon that if an iskcon devotee saw us and somehow or other deciphered that we are devotees, and said "haribol!" Or "hare krishna!" to us we would literally scowl and ignore them and look the other way. Butler had a tendency to just lump everything into dualistic groups. He never bothered to try to understand that many different types of p
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Yeah I'm not sure if every one of those quotes is exact, paraphrased, or simply symbolic of his attitude in many private interactions with people on-site, in letters, audio/video etc. But it sums up what we all constantly felt in his presence. There's discipline and chastisement and strong instructions, then there is being an asshole and tyrant. People stay with this man not out
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Sharing knowledge and love should be free. As soon as you start attaching elaborate titles to a personality and needing excess money to satisfy them and please them and worship them, it is no longer pure. It is a transaction. So any guru that requires more from their disciples and followers and students then simply listening to them share their knowledge and love for free is a charlatan. It doesn
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

And you.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

It's ok man. You don't need to send me the book. And no hard feelings. No hard feelings. I get your point. But you'd be hard-pressed to get much of a direct citation for shit that was done in private, often through letters or audio recordings, many if not all destroyed by now some 30 years later. I appreciate the gesture of the copy of the book, but I'm not likely goi
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Yeah, you can tell by Butler's "spaced out" look that he's really deep in thought about how he can jump in on this "guru gig"... Yes, Butler was very opposed to the idea of an "appointed" guru. I remember that very vividly. Ironically, in Gaudiya Matha this was a standard practice to this very day—a guru in these Krishna cults is 9 out of 10 mostly appoi
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

XKRISHNA, thousands worldwide. At least 2000 more like 5000 last I heard. Many in Poland, Southeast Asia all through the Americas. Most are uninitiated since Butler is a recluse now. Many are completely unaware of anything more than they are part of a "yoga" group and pay to go to assorted classes and events. But many are free and open to the public. It's largely benign. Vege food,
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Shoot. I'm an idiot for thinking that occasionally posting here helps ex-members or those looking to get out or in the process of being sucked in...
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Stupid is as stupid does.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

If you say you believe me, then believe me. He stated and thought of his his followers ase idiots. And I could not agree more with that sentiment. Anyone in this day and age who still follows this guy, gives him money and has not seen through his BS is an unfortunate fool. Anyone who believes, or believed this guy and served and worshipped him is a sad misguided person. If anyone comes her
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I hear ya. and so here it is: "All of my disciples are idiots and making me sick!!!" —Parama Vaishnava His Divine Disgrace Jagad Guru Siddhswarupananda Paramahamsa Srila Prabhupada (AKA Chris Burler the Great) (jagardguruchrisbutlercansuckmyballs.com) Now it exists. And trust me. It happened. There is tons of shit that is not documents in this world. Like Bhaktisiddhanta t
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Like I said, I don't have a citation. Like I said it's for the reasons mentioned above. Hopefully, for those coming to this forum, the 800 plus Pages here of various testimony, both mine and literally hundreds of others, is enough to convince them to leave this cult. That is my true and only hope for those who are still in it or who are considering to get into it.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

XKRISHNA I don't. There are 837 pages of testimony, documents, recordings, posts, links, and so on on this forum. I suppose you could start from page one to find the many citations of Butler's attitude towards his followers and closest disciples. Butler was often making elaborate efforts to scrub any record or proof of their less-than-savory attitudes, actions, and words. When
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Chris Butler was right about one thing and one thing only when he regularly spewed,"my disciples are all idiots". Jagad Guru Siddhaswarupanada paramahamsa, gurudev of Tulsi Gabbard, was right about that, no question.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Just putting this where it belongs:
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Worth a read:
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

A few days ago was the disappearance day of Bindeshwar Pathak (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/aug/16/bindeshwar-pathak-toilet-man-who-revolutionised-sanitation-in-india-dies-at-80), who has accomplished more than Chaitanya, the 6 Goswamis, Bhaktivedanta swami, and Butler combined... You know what India has always struggled with and lacked? Toilet access. This prabhu helped to try to
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

There's no scriptural injunction for half the stuff they believe and do. NONE. All made up BS. Whenever there is some new belief or ritual introduced it's based on some vision or dream or all of a sudden some miraculous previously undiscoved "scripture" pops out of thin air in support of it all. It's a fucking joke amigos. And when you call them on it you're a hindup
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Of course he would not reply. He's a world class loser and coward of the highest order.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

They should write a letter to him and they should question him Point by point on his actions starting from the late sixties all the way till now. It would be as long as his kitchen policy list.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"