For the record, I am also serious about engagement with spirituality in my life--I am glad your experience has been positive and that you haven't been harmed, but frankly, there are always people who can say that about any cult-like situation. People said that about Osho, Adi Da, Andrew Cohen, Gurumayi, the list goes on and on. The fact that some people have positive experiences and feel rel
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

trixy Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > People who do these practices believe they are > developing some kind of psychic vision. Thus the > term clairvision. Clarity and vision. Everyones on > a spectrum depending on how powerful their vision > is. If someone who has good vision tells you're > bad, or making a mistake you should defin
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

YIKES. There's some stuff here that I would file under 'maybe ok depending on the particular student/teacher relationship' but there's a lot that feels really bad to me, especially the very directive advice to students around major life decisions; that's a big red flag for me. I don't know what the right course of action here is, but just chiming in to say I see what
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I had a VERY creepy interaction with him a number of years ago where he attempted to play the 'I knew when I saw you that you would become my student' card. I was in a vulnerable spot at the time, and felt that he was trying to hook me by appealing to some of my patterning around wanting to be special. I found it to be highly unethical and was further creeped out by the way he seemed t
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

This is all so provisional...the assurance is that once you reach this Higher Self everything will be clear or free, but it places that moment in a far-off future when you have finally practiced enough or become clear of enough samskaras. It keeps people hooked and seeking. grok Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I suspect that a Clairvision response to
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

That's just very weird to me. Even if you buy in to the premise--that we have subtle bodies, that this is how they work, and that CV practices can do what they say they do in augmenting your subtle body--they're describing a process that is fundamentally acquisitive and egocentric, 'more more more.' It's no different than acquiring cars or money or sexual conquests, it�
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

A question for those in the know, as this thread has been livelier of late: I was particularly put off by CV practitioners' view that the goal of their practice and involvement in the school was to develop what they call 'the body of immortality,' or a subtle body that can survive physical death. To me it seemed like the ultimate in egocentric activity, and pretty diametrically
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

These are great posts, grok. I resonate with a great deal of it--the attractiveness of front-facing people pushing ATE courses, setting up expectations that you're going to feel bad and discombobulated and that that's just 'part of the process,' and ESPECIALLY portraying the school as being for 'serious' seekers. This is super insidious--no one wants to think of them
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

Timely post. This podcast series also discusses abuse of power within 'therapeutic' psychedelic settings. Transcripts also available for episodes for those like me who prefer to read rather than listen.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Interesting! Worth looking into. I sent a message to the alumni network at Universite de Paris asking if they can verify whether someone is a graduate or not; hopefully they will respond.
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

grok Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Thanks for that additional explanation, mesche, > that helps me understand a bit more what you're > saying > > > metanoia Wrote: > ------------------------------------------------------- > > I got the impression that there was a lot of > > spiritual ego going on as a result of t
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

oneclickwonder Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I actually tend to believe that there is a > spiritual level to reality and have tended to > before my time at CV. I found the experience of > seeing purple lights and vibration in the eye to > be intense as I did with a number of other > techniques from the school. > > I'm not s
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

I think it is so, so complicated, confusing, and hard to be discerning when there is also something of substance being offered along with the toxic bits. The techniques they teach clearly do something--it's not an out-and-out fraud. I'm just not convinced that they do what the school says they do, or that they can take me where I want to go. It is really hard to figure out if you should
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

Quotegrok -If you go on to advanced levels of the Clairvision work, you will be required to accept certain activities many would consider spiritual abuse as a normal part of your path to enlightenment. Quotegrok -Members engage in activities that they would have previously though were reprehensible grok, would you be willing to share examples of these kinds of occurrences?
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

mesche Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > About the apocalyptic flavor. Many of the students > I met trained for the future and the big > technological changes that are happening right now > in our world as discussed in the books he wrote. > That meant training for a war that will come in a > few hundred years where masters from the archiv
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

Grok, Mesche, these details are incredibly helpful to hear--feeling much better about my decision to not get involved. A few follow-up questions, if you're willing to answer them: QuoteGrok There is a lot hidden, and it may take several years to see things really going on in the school. They will make you feel comfortable and safe to bring you deeper into the folds in these early courses
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

Thanks for posting this, orangegrl. The piece that stands out to me here and that I'm curious about is the 'Esoteric Christianity' bit--I know that Clairvision at least acknowledges relationship with Rudolf Steiner's work, but it definitely does not present itself as any variety of Christian in its forward-facing materials...for those who have been more involved with the sc
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

Addendum to the above message--received a reply; this individual seems to also have had bad experiences with the school but does not want to share more at this time.
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

Just some follow-up here: I recently received a private message from an individual with the following text: "Hi, I wonder if you would be willing to share more about your experience with Clairvision? Would you be open to sharing which of the Clairvision instructors/IST practitioners you had this experience with? Or at least which city you were in where this happened? I have also bee
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

I had a very strange set of experiences with a couple of Clairvision students/practitioners a few years back that set off red flags for me and led me to this thread. Two young women came to some local events in my city and introduced themselves as being really into meditation/spiritual practice...so far so good, it's always nice to make friends who are interested in the kinds of things I
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse