Re: Nichikan gohonzons

After the split, all members who remained in the gakkai that had Nikken gohonzons were, one by one, strong-armed into replacing them with Nichikan gohonzons. It shook the cobwebs out of the frontal lobes of a few of the more "thinking" members, who didn't want to, and they began to question the entire practice. The seeds of doubt were planted. IMO, the split was the beginning of the gakkai's self-destruction in America - they inadvertently showed their hand and the veil came off revealing their true vile, self-serving and manipulative nature.

I remember brainwashed gakkai members literally shedding tears over the beauty of the Nikken gohonzons, admiring the powerful calligraphy, then later, after the split, those same people looking at the same gohonzon with the same scorn as if they were casting their eyes upon used sheets of toilet paper. With a wave of the magical gakkai arm, they changed gohonzons (declaring which ones had "power" and which ones didn't), changed gongyo, changed the prayers and relegated the dai gohonzon to subsidiary status. Such shortsighted chutzpah was the beginning of the meltdown. It was indeed sheer stupidity.

It's pretty clear that the gakkai cult will say anything to make the winds blow in the direction that they desire and to justify whatever it is that they wish to do. There are no core principles to which they adhere and respect, they simply wing it, frivolously changing with the times.

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TheVoid
All this stuff and nonsense about slander and heretics is just so devisive but then again that seems to be the main aim of religion.

Agreed. They all use the same tactics and tricks, against everyone and each other. It's all nonsense.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/09/2012 06:53PM by Hitch.

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SGBye

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Spartacus
Yet another excuse stated that the war was a political affair and SGcult doesn't involve itself with politics.

That's absolutely hilarious since the Soka Gakkai has their own political party in Japan. But that's one of their best-kept secrets in the U.S. I remember mentioning the New Komeito Party to some long-time members and they had no idea what I was talking about.

Hey SGBye! I knew for a fact how this "no politics" line for SGI/NSA was total bullcookies. That's why I was furious - it was an outright lie! Back in the early seventies, every time a major election in Japan rolled around, I would participate in very secretive all night tosos where we chanted for Komeito Party election victories. These "special" tosos were held at locations ALL ACROSS THE U.S. In Dallas, only the most loyal (ready to obey) leaders were invited. We were specifically instructed to chant for a large number of gains in Parlimentary seats for Komeito. You know - victory!

Back in that period, I was so completely brainwashed that I would have chanted for anything I was told to chant for without questioning it. How easily I (mis) placed my trust in the greater wisdom (what a joke!) of my senior leaders. Looking back now at this surreal memory, I know that chanting all night for a foreign political party's election victories was so twisted. Its somewhat embarrassing to admit that I was ever so deluded. Is there anyone who can relate to having been so addicted?

Its just hard to believe that I could have ever swallowed so much crap hook, line, and sinker from the SGcult. I guess thats why it took me thirty years to break free from participating in the SGcult. As the Lotus Sutra says, "Discard the provisional teachings." After 40 years, cleansing myself of the last of the SGcult doctrine and mind control is progressing very well. Especially due to being here on this forum where I've had "A Little Help From My Friends". Well, actually a lot of help - thanks!

Spartacus

Indeed....how SGI describes itself depends on whatever suits its purposes at the time. Some links:

First, from buddha.jones:

[www.buddhajones.com]

------------------------beginning of quote-------------------------------------------

They're a "religion" when it suits them, a "peace organization" when they want school boards in the U.S. to approve Soka-based charter schools, and a "non-governmental organization recognized by the UN" when they pretend at neutrality and honest scholarship. Gotta love it.

I sort of wish I knew how to read Japanese because the article mentions that politcos are talking about removing tax exemptions for religions in Japan:

The justification for this is made evident from another article, which purports to expose the "side businesses" operated by large religious groups, which are said to include schools, hospitals, cemeteries, golf courses and - bless their hearts - love hotels.

Soka has gotta be the king of shady side businesses. Remember the company being run out of one of SGI-USA's warehouses? They sold flatulence-filtering underpants. What was the name of that company?

by: brooke @ Tue May 08, 2012 at 18:41:04 PM UTC

Underpants

Follow up to my last comment. The underwear seller was called iShining. (www.ishining.com) That company and another called PCE International are "importers" that once worked out of 8811 Aviation Blvd. in Inglewood, CA, a warehouse property owned by Soka. They appear to have moved their operations since the links between those companies and Soka were publicized online about ten years ago.

by: brooke @ Tue May 08, 2012 at 18:53:09 PM UTC

-
----------------------------------------------------------end of quote----------------------------------------------------------------

Ah, that Soka Gakkai....it's a religion....it's a world peace organization....it's an NGO....AND it's in the business of selling flatulence filtering underpants.....all under their fearless leader....Captain Underpants! What a gas!


And from The Chakra:

[www.chakranews.com]


--------------------------------------------------------------beginning of quote-----------------------------------------------



Buddhists, Hindus, Jains & Sikhs Combine for 1st White House Conference for Social Justice


Sikhism, Jainism, Hinduism, & Buddhism delegates offer prayers

USA - Hindu American Seva Charities (HASC) again made history, co-hosting with The White House Office of Public Engagement and Intergovernmental Agencies and the White House Office of Faith Based and Neighborhood Partnerships an historic conference, Community Building in the 21st Century with Strengthened Dharmic Faith-Based Institutions for the Dharmic (defined as ,Buddhist, Hindu, Jain, Sikh) Religious Leaders. HASC partnered with many Buddhist, Hindu, Jain and Sikh organizations, including the Council of Hindu Temples, Federation of Jain Associations of North America, Soka Gakkai International-USA Buddhist Association and others to create a coalition that can reach deliver collaborative solutions and services to benefit the communities around us while promoting better understanding of our beliefs, cultures and values.

In his opening remarks, Paul Monteiro, Associate Director, White House Office of Public Engagement observed that the Dharmic-American community is interested in all the same issues that everyone is interested in – healthcare, security, education, etc. He encouraged the participants to follow up this conference with action, saying “the real measure of this conference’s success will be in how much more engaged in service the dharmic communities become in the months ahead.”

Ambassador Cahill, former Counsel General in India, stated, “If there is any strong force in the world, it is individuals who are committed, and faith based organizations have particular strength. We as individuals we can do so much, sometimes more than big organizations.”

Other topics of focus for the participants were the serious challenges being faced by Burmese and Bhutanese refugees in America; the networking of dharmic community resources for disaster response and in support of anti-terrorism efforts; the support of religious literacy programs in the public schools and providing much needed support for dharma-based members of the US Armed Forces.
.
Kenneth Bedell, Policy Advisor, shared the announcement of Together for Tomorrow, a program initiated by the Department of Education and White House Faith OFBNP to re-emphasis the idea that education is not just the responsibility of the teachers, schools or parents, but of the whole community, including the students). Communities can come together using their resources in cooperation with schools, teachers, federal government and parents to address issues. Diversity of religion is important in education ;as there is the power of diversity. Regarding confusing on the separation of church and state, he clarified that the U.S. constitution does not say that the school has to avoid all talk about religion or sharing of information. The Department of Education cannot dictate curriculum; it encourages the states to develop core curriculum, and the public should provide input. Interfaith groups can make curricula and propose them to the federal government.

Dr. Sushil Jain, CAPT, U.S. Navy-retd and President, Federation of Jain Associations in North America (JAINA) emphasized the importance of “‘serving those who serve of Dharmic faiths. Temples can prepare care packages for soldiers, help the veterans transition to the community and assist fallen citizens (those who have been incarcerated), as they too deserve our support.” He concluded, “This first Dharma Conference at the White house was amazing. It helped JAINA delegates understand the level of attention and priority President Obama has given in reaching out to minority faith group. We, Buddhists, Hindus, Jains and Sikhs
were delighted to hear about various programs and how we can partner with federal agencies in addressing our community needs. We at JAINA are looking forward to our follow-up conference.”

“This conference marked an expansion and deepening of the dialogue between the administration and the Buddhist, Hindu and Jain and Sikh communities and a recognition of the growing contribution these faiths are making in American society. And I think it got a number of the faith representatives thinking about how they can expand on those contributions,” said Bill Aiken, Public Affairs Director, Soka Gakkai Buddhist Association.

Joshua Stanton of Inter Religious Dialogue said, “The U.S. is the most religiously diverse country since the fall of the Roman Empire – so how do we lead? India has been the most religiously diverse country for millennia. How can we learn from the Dharmic communities? How do we increase positive relationships and make pluralism a reality.”
Bud Heckman, Religions for Peace USA said, “We have a United Nations, why can’t we have a united front of religions working for peace? Today, 76% of America is Christian – by 2050 more than 50% the American public will be non-Christian. So understanding the Dharmic community is important.”

Mark Farr, National Vision of Public Engagement observed, “in the service movement of the U.S. we see, increasingly the crucial facing is the idea of disconnect – faith from business, from family. Individually we are disconnected from each other. The Dharmic traditions (such as yoga and meditation) can teach gentleness, compassion and wholeness to the Western traditions.”

We hope this will be the first step in the Dharmic community, in coming together to explore and identify common ground, unite for social justice and build a coalition to strengthen each other and our nation.


--------------------------end of quote-------------------------------------------------

"Religious literacy" in the public schools? How? Having SGI members sneak into schools, under the guise of some project like the Liberty Bell?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/10/2012 05:09AM by tsukimoto.

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Spartacus
Back in that period, I was so completely brainwashed that I would have chanted for anything I was told to chant for without questioning it. How easily I (mis) placed my trust in the greater wisdom (what a joke!) of my senior leaders. Looking back now at this surreal memory, I know that chanting all night for a foreign political party's election victories was so twisted. Its somewhat embarrassing to admit that I was ever so deluded. Is there anyone who can relate to having been so addicted?

You're far from alone, Spartacus! I remember participating in the tosos they held for a positive outcome of the Nikken trial. I regret participating in utter nonsense for over 30 years. None of that stuff (conventions, tosos, planning meetings, etc.) contributed to my happiness as a human being. In fact, it had the exact opposite effect.

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KR
I participated in "Rock the Era" and remember being told by local SGI Leadership that "This will be the only big event for a very long time" meaning they have lost the will and resources to organize huge so-called culture festivals.

One of the first things that struck me from watching youtube clips of RTE, was how small the venue/attendance appeared, unorganized everything was and how sh***y the performances were. There were much more massive (seats filled to the rafters / performers filling the floor, corner to corner) and (how shall I say it?) "interesting" "shows" going on all the time back in the 70's & 80's. As an active YMD and brass band member, I had to attend almost all of them and was getting overwhelmed and tired of them all.

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Spartacus
Back in that period, I was so completely brainwashed that I would have chanted for anything I was told to chant for without questioning it. How easily I (mis) placed my trust in the greater wisdom (what a joke!) of my senior leaders. Looking back now at this surreal memory, I know that chanting all night for a foreign political party's election victories was so twisted. Its somewhat embarrassing to admit that I was ever so deluded. Is there anyone who can relate to having been so addicted?

I think we all get pulled into the deep end of the delusional pool, before making our way back to the shallow end and stepping out entirely.

My name was penciled in for "Eagle Peak" during my very naive and ignorant teenage years, around early high school. I was so busy with activities every other night of the week and every weekend, that looking back, it was a feat that I could only accomplish because I was so young (I don't think I could ever withstand that same experience again as an adult.)

In retrospect, I can see how it all went down. The brainwashing and deluding came about secondary to the sheer amount of activities and constant-repetitive exposure to meetings, speeches and being inundated in a microcosm of like-minded fanatical "peers." The perfect mixture of studying only the gosho, hours and hours of chanting + hours and hours of traveling to and from practices + hours and hours of actual activities, all served the purpose effectively by putting my critical faculties to sleep and (at that young critical age) discouraging the cultivation of reason.

The deeper I got, the more I was exposed to things that caused me to start scratching my head and the more whacked out youth leader abuse I began to recognize.

To make a long story short, it took a lot of self-doubt, self-courage and a lot of slow self-education to kick down that last door and get out. I also had a fundamentalist gakkai parent to contend with, fighting me every step of the way, which made the process all the more interesting and even more emotionally charged.

Looking back on it all now, never fails to give me a good laugh (but it wasn't funny at all at the time, though).

Oh and btw, (SGBye & Spartacus): 24 and 48 hour daimoku tosos, midnight gongyos . . . . . YUP, been there and done that - many times!!. Lovely "golden memories" of seeing fellow members asleep on the floor with their mouths wide open and drool trickling down the side. Lovely, indeed. Hilarious to look back on, but a horror to actually go thru.

Such wonderful feedback on the issue of the Gohonzon

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Nichijew

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KR

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Nichijew

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KR

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jlynneda63
Well that is bizarre. Where was the pic aken & why? Where did the gohonzons come from sgi gives out?

The SGI gohonzons are massed produced and if my information is correct, even the act of doing such is grave slander to the Nichiren tradition. Gohonzons are suppose to be inscribed by priest and from what I hear the ceremony is quite special. My linage of High Priest of the Nichiren Shoshu is quite shaky but I believe the SGI gohonzons are inscribed by the High Priest that preceeded Nittatsu (spelling is wrong sorry) SGI had a pretty complicated relationship with Nittatsu and when Nikken Abe became the High Priest the relationship with SGI tanked. Most of SGI's real relationship with Nichiren Shoshu and Nikken Abe is primarily based on heresy so no one will ever know the truth.

Some Nichiren sects principally utilize copies of Nichiren inscribed Gohonzon, rather than those of priests. The SGI Gohonzon is a copy of the controvertial 26th High priest's [17th century], Nichikan.

Nichijew

Thanks for the correction. I heard of the name, but didn't realize that Nichikan went as far back as the 17th century. Is there a rhyme or reason to why they would use a Nichikan inscribed gohonzon?

Yes. 1). A stupid decision by Ikeda 2). Ikeda's affinity for the heterodox heretical teachings of Nichikan [from a Nichiren Lotus Sutra Buddhist perspective].

Nichijew

After the post I did a little research into Nichikan gohonzons and the best thing I found came across was from the Soka Spirit site itself. It isn't a stretch that SGI would want to go way out in an attempt to align itself with a "reformist." This is meaningless to the Non-Japanese convert, but since Japan is by far SGI's bread and butter, aligning themselves negates to the Japanese public that they are reformers...

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Hitch
Re: Nichikan gohonzons

After the split, all members who remained in the gakkai that had Nikken gohonzons were, one by one, strong-armed into replacing them with Nichikan gohonzons. It shook the cobwebs out of the frontal lobes of a few of the more "thinking" members, who didn't want to, and they began to question the entire practice. The seeds of doubt were planted. IMO, the split was the beginning of the gakkai's self-destruction in America - they inadvertently showed their hand and the veil came off revealing their true vile, self-serving and manipulative nature.

I remember brainwashed gakkai members literally shedding tears over the beauty of the Nikken gohonzons, admiring the powerful calligraphy, then later, after the split, those same people looking at the same gohonzon with the same scorn as if they were casting their eyes upon used sheets of toilet paper. With a wave of the magical gakkai arm, they changed gohonzons (declaring which ones had "power" and which ones didn't), changed gongyo, changed the prayers and relegated the dai gohonzon to subsidiary status. Such shortsighted chutzpah was the beginning of the meltdown. It was indeed sheer stupidity.

It's pretty clear that the gakkai cult will say anything to make the winds blow in the direction that they desire and to justify whatever it is that they wish to do. There are no core principles to which they adhere and respect, they simply wing it, frivolously changing with the times.

Quote
TheVoid
All this stuff and nonsense about slander and heretics is just so devisive but then again that seems to be the main aim of religion.

Agreed. They all use the same tactics and tricks, against everyone and each other. It's all nonsense.

Obviously SGI was drunk with power and had no qualms with strong arming it's own. Sadly that's all SGI really does, strong arm their believers.

Nichiren said it himself, "Don't seek the gohonzon outside of yourself" and that statement alone destroys any credibility SGI's thinks it has, it's not that the Ikedabots are stupid, but they simply refuse to wake up to it.

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Hitch

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KR
I participated in "Rock the Era" and remember being told by local SGI Leadership that "This will be the only big event for a very long time" meaning they have lost the will and resources to organize huge so-called culture festivals.

One of the first things that struck me from watching youtube clips of RTE, was how small the venue/attendance appeared, unorganized everything was and how sh***y the performances were. There were much more massive (seats filled to the rafters / performers filling the floor, corner to corner) and (how shall I say it?) "interesting" "shows" going on all the time back in the 70's & 80's. As an active YMD and brass band member, I had to attend almost all of them and was getting overwhelmed and tired of them all.

HA! SGI members literally had to bus people to RTE.

I could only guess that half that were in attendance were actual SGI members. I could only guess they enticed their relatives to go and it wasn't a hard sell, one of the venues was in downtown Chicago after all...

Ever wonder what the modern day version of Jr. Pioneers (Cult Kiddy Division) looks like? Look no further:

[www.youtube.com] (WTF!?!?!)

It's called the "Lion Cub Club" or "Baby Lion's Division."

And incidentally, the Japanese "official" cult newspaper, The Seikyo Shimbun, has a weekly (or monthly?) Sunday-equivalent Kiddy full-color pull-out section for the little lion members to read, study and obtain their age appropriate affirmation experiences. I kid you not.

"Shi Shi Fun Jin, RAHH!!"

Man, this cult stuff just keeps getting CREEPIER AND C-R-E-E-P-I-E-R.

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Spartacus

Back in that period, I was so completely brainwashed that I would have chanted for anything I was told to chant for without questioning it. How easily I (mis) placed my trust in the greater wisdom (what a joke!) of my senior leaders. Looking back now at this surreal memory, I know that chanting all night for a foreign political party's election victories was so twisted. Its somewhat embarrassing to admit that I was ever so deluded. Is there anyone who can relate to having been so addicted?

Quote
SGBye

I think we all get pulled into the deep end of the delusional pool, before making our way back to the shallow end and stepping out entirely.

My name was penciled in for "Eagle Peak" during my very naive and ignorant teenage years, around early high school. I was so busy with activities every other night of the week and every weekend, that looking back, it was a feat that I could only accomplish because I was so young (I don't think I could ever withstand that same experience again as an adult.)

In retrospect, I can see how it all went down. The brainwashing and deluding came about secondary to the sheer amount of activities and constant-repetitive exposure to meetings, speeches and being inundated in a microcosm of like-minded fanatical "peers." The perfect mixture of studying only the gosho, hours and hours of chanting + hours and hours of traveling to and from practices + hours and hours of actual activities, all served the purpose effectively by putting my critical faculties to sleep and (at that young critical age) discouraging the cultivation of reason.

The deeper I got, the more I was exposed to things that caused me to start scratching my head and the more whacked out youth leader abuse I began to recognize.

To make a long story short, it took a lot of self-doubt, self-courage and a lot of slow self-education to kick down that last door and get out. I also had a fundamentalist gakkai parent to contend with, fighting me every step of the way, which made the process all the more interesting and even more emotionally charged.

Looking back on it all now, never fails to give me a good laugh (but it wasn't funny at all at the time, though).

Oh and btw, (SGBye & Spartacus): 24 and 48 hour daimoku tosos, midnight gongyos . . . . . YUP, been there and done that - many times!!. Lovely "golden memories" of seeing fellow members asleep on the floor with their mouths wide open and drool trickling down the side. Lovely, indeed. Hilarious to look back on, but a horror to actually go thru.


SGBye, your "golden memories" remark left me LMAO! Just imagine bringing a new guest to one of those toso sessions. Radical and cultish? You betcha! If I hadn't been 19, I too would have never withstood the abuse.

Good point about the distraction of continuous activities effect of putting the mind to sleep. My senior leader used to revel in the fact that one campaign leads directly into the next, forever and ever - no time for rest!. Now I understand her twisted joy at sucking energy and redirecting the minds of the members.

Thankfully, now I can also laugh at myself for having been so gullible. Maybe thats a part of the healing process. The confusion and inner conflict was indeed very painful at the time.

Thanks for your great analogy of the swimming pool. It brings an image to my mind of a whirling black hole vortex that sucks you down relentlessly. It takes full power on the engine throttles to escape being torn apart atom by atom. Anything less and you may be eventually drawn back into the singularity. Best to stay far away from black holes, whether they are sociopathic individuals or cultish organizations, especially the super black hole, SGcult.

Do u ever look at the clock & feel uncomfortable because it is the time u normally did Gongyo? I do & then wonder why I can't relax! Seems like most of us are 30 plus years of indoctrination. I never slept in. the 70's! It was one continuous activity! I quit for 13 yrs & came back because I could not get the fear out of my consciousness of burning in hell for being tietan! Finally because of this list I am understanding how evil it is. I have knees permanently destroyed due to the hours spent sitting on them for hours & years. Had my first wheelchair ride last month & am being given one for mothers day! I could have refused to sit there hour after hour but I thought I was changing my karma! Now I have time to think about it all since I no longer can work. I wonder what the people monitoring this list think? One thing I know is that finally the calls have stopped so someone knows I am finally voicing the truth!

As for the Gohonzons, i missed all that & came back after people quit fighting & now the few who haven't returned the original just turn it in & celebrate. The new copies feel nothing like the original Gohonzon. It makes no sense.

If I thought about it I could get really mad at the injustice of it all but I don't have time.