From Fraught With Peril, the Kempon Hokke Blog:

[fraughtwithperil.com]

----------------------------Beginning of Quote------------------------------------------------------------------
3072 Performers East Zone x $125 performance fee. $15 for day spectators not including bus fees x ~ 3000. $3 lunch for spectators. Spectators $125 fee for Temple University shared four (two?) to a dorm room and 6 meals if staying 2 Nights x ~ 1000. Probably a cool half million in profit to Rock the Era for Sensei. At least auditing (guidance) is free.
---------------------------------End of Quote-----------------------------------------------------------------------


From Blue Lady, www.culteducation.com

----------------------------------Beginning of Quote-----------------------------------------------------------------

The clincher for me is this: If you were a youth you had to pay $15 to be confirmed. This would allow you to then get a a T-shirt or some sort of gift. BUT if you sign up after the deadline you still have to pay the $15 but GET NO GIFT. So where is the extra cash going too? Especially since we were told we were not paying for the venue? 


So in my next of the woods they could easily make $100,000 off this event. This money might be used to pay for the Venue - which they say it's not , or they just pocket it. If you order 5000 T-shirts its only $2.60 for a simple one color font and white shirt. The other gift might be some old bookmarks - which can be made at a fraction of the cost.
They are makin money off of this event- trust me. SGI over charges on things like materials etc so that if Actual and Budgeted are off by say 45% they will not loose thier shirt in this mess.

Here is the contracted agreement. I say they will probably pay a minum of $100,000 .
SGI brings thier are staff but you need union people to sit next to you . Last time we rented McCormick we brought in our on SGI wizkids in computers and A/V
The YMD/YWD run around as security and ushers although you still need thier security.
We bring our own food so they dont need the 30% cut.
-------------------------------End of Quote-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sounds like your typical SGI activity. Members are doing the actual work, for no pay. They're providing transportation for themselves and other members and not being reimbursed for gasoline. They're bringing in things and paying for it out of their own pocket -- food, bottled water, snacks, band-aids, you name it. On top of all this, they're PAYING to go! $15 for day admission, $125 for two nights -- when the two nights are in a shared dormitory room, and the food's probably just cheap stuff like cereal, hot dogs, baloney sandwiches, peanut butter? How much would a university charge a group to use an empty dormitory in the summer anyway? How could SGI not make money?

Very common tactic in all kinds of groups -- get people to work for you for free. Even better if you can get people to pay their own money to work for you. The Byron Katie thread in the "Cults, Sects and New Groups" forum also discussed this. This very rich lady puts on these seminars and gets people who've been to other of her seminars to come in and work -- not just for free, but paying her! Yes, paying her so that they can work for her!

It's like the story of Mark Twain's Tom Sawyer -- Tom was a boy who had to whitewash his aunt's fence. He didn't want to paint the fence, he wanted to play. So, being a smart, sneaky kid, he manipulated his friends so that they were giving him things so that he would let them whitewash the fence. This kid was really able to con the other boys into thinking that working for him was a great privilege!

The story about Tom was funny....the reality of SGI, not so funny.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/22/2010 08:19AM by tsukimoto.

From the rickross forum "Cults, Sects, and New Religious Movements," the "Eckhardt Tolle Made Me a Zombie" thread:

[forum.culteducation.com]

-------------Beginning of Quote---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I just purchased The Guru Papers by Joel Kramer and Diana Alstad. This book has really confirmed my belief that ET has manipulated everyone so he could attain power and money. "A guru, to be a guru, must know how to move people into a psychological state of surrender and keep them there." "Once an initial commitment has been made, techniques geared at disorientation come into play. This is done through undermining both self-trust and one's previous attachments and support systems. Critical thought and relying upon previous experiences are made to appear the source of one's past or current problems.
----------------------End of Quote-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Substitute "Ikeda" for "ET" (Eckhardt Tolle) and that describes SGI. Taking Ikeda as a mentor -- what is that but surrender?

Some psychologists who have studied manipulation, salesmanship and cults talk about getting an initial agreement or commitment. Agreement or commitment can be a slippery slope. A good salesman, saleswoman, con artist, or cult leader gets you to agree with him or her on something small, or gets you to commit to doing something small...then gradually increases the things that you have to agree to, or do. People like to be "congruent" or have their actions be consistent with previous actions. If you've agreed with someone, or done something for someone in the past, you are likely to continue to do so.

If you like someone, you are more likely to do what they want you to.

If someone gives you something, even something small, you are more likely to feel that you should do what they want.

So getting young people to agree to attend a convention is clever...that initial commitment. Sure, lots of kids may attend Rock the Era and never go to another SGI meeting, but with SGI it's a numbers game. A certain percentage will get hooked and stay for years.

Disorienting? Well, Rock the Era, if it's like other big SGI activities, will be hectic, and emotional. Exhausted people, from working, travelling, rehearsing. Excitement, noise, and just being out of the usual environment.

Undermining self trust, critical thinking, previous attachments? SGI does that. Look at that letter that I got about May contributions and supporting Rock the Era. Most people would say DON'T give a donation if you are about to lose your job. It just doesn't make sense to give away money if you're about to be unemployed. This person gave SGI the donation -- lost their job, and then was offered a new job, without even having to job-hunt. The message is -- don't THINK about what you can afford to give -- don't trust your own logic! Trust SGI instead -- just give to us, and everything will be all right!

There's the lack of any real study or dialogue in SGI...just the message to trust Sensei and everything will be wonderful! That'll be the message that the attendees at Rock the Era will hear -- over and over. Don't think, don't study, don't rely on what you've learned from past experiences, don't listen to your family and friends if they disagree with us...JUST.....TRUST......SENSEI!!!!!!!!!

Critical thought and relying upon previous experiences are made to appear the source of one's past or current problems.

Quote
quoted by Tsukimoto

I believe this to be quite critical. The SGI-ideology is very good in creating a bad conscience and fear that evil will fall upon oneself if one disagrees or even thinks on leaving. In my books this is one of the most disgusting parts of SGI- ideology AND it has nothing to do with Buddhism. At any rate any ideology that supports to not even listen to one's gut feeling is to be mistrusted, any organisation which attempts to fuse ones own existence with the existence of an organisation is to be mistrusted, any organisation which treats questioning the rightness of the supremacy of a single person as an evil is to be mistrusted. When I was a young kid I never understood the rise of the Nazis - now I do.

A quick question to anyone who's been to an SGI study meeting recently.

Does SGI mention Ichinen Sanzen anymore?

I was thinking about this earlier today. As far as my understanding goes, the concept of Ichinen Sanzen is the fundamental principle of Nichiren Buddhism. It underpins the very act of daimoku, and is the only 'real' way to explain karma, the human condition, and existence itself. When I think back I can remember one study meeting (about 3 years ago) when we covered Ichinen Sanzen. Obviously to go into it in its full depth is extremely difficult, but the woman taking the study meeting was very moderate and knowledgable (as far as I know), her presentation did not seem like something emailed over from Tokyo, she prepared it all herself.
This was in the UK though and as has been said before it seems SGI Europe is a bit different (on the outside at least) to SGI USA and SG Japan.
With regards to Nichiren buddhism (and it could be argued, all forms of buddhism) only an enlightened person can fully understand and 'reside' in Ichinen Sanzen, but from my reading I understand that all people can 'glimpse' it or atleast see it on the horizon.

So it is deeply unfair to expect the nice person at your study meeting to deeply and insightfully explain Ichinen Sanzen. But is SGI even trying?

For me, the concept of Ichinen Sanzen is the only thing that gives Nichiren buddhism any doctrinal and theoretical basis. Without it Nichiren would simply be 'Lotus Sutra Buddhism' (that isn't a derogitory remark btw). It should really be the primary study focus as all other buddhist concepts and ideas revolve around it (in Nichiren buddhism).
But then I remember SGI's get out clause, "substitute faith for wisdom". I never could understand that idea when I was in SGI. I read the gosho passages that SGI claimed proved the idea, but even so it seemed a preliminary activity for those who had no oppertunity what so ever to study buddhism deeper, i.e illiterate peasants ruled by a brutal regime in Japan in 1200 AD.
Things are very different now!

If SGI was really a humanitarian/education organisation it would provide high level study material and meetings for those who want it. SGI would say being 'over intellectual' is an effect of fundamental darkness.
But then, Shariputra never went far did he, only one of the Bhudda's closest disciples.

Rant over.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/23/2010 06:18AM by DavidM.

@ David M

Hi , I don't know about where others practice, but the last presentation I went to (and that was the last meeting ), a young lady read from Dr. Seuss and connected the various topics to Nichiren Buddhism, it was bizarre. The chapter study later that month consisted of the study leader person only reading from the living Buddhism, this resulted in us not studying the whole gosho just parts of it and not even the salient parts, just the parts that reinforced..... you guessed it "Mentor and Disciple". As for ichinen sanzen, are you kidding?? that is a real Buddhist topic that requires thought, no it is not discussed, it is considered bad to discuss anything to "hard for the members to understand" as I was told.

@DavidM

Doctrine aside here, I do agree with you that SGI wants to go as simple as possible.

In fact, I remember that when we had study meetings, it is mostly about the same basic things. In fact, I remember when I lived in Korea and went to a study meeting with no guests. You know what we had to study? The Ten Worlds. We actually had someone explain that to us as if none of has ever heard the concept in our years of keeping the Gohonzon. Frankly, I find it as ludicrous as Christian who didn't know what the 10 Commandments were.

I also remember at times when I had to go speak at a meeting or two, I wanted to cite the Lotus Sutra. I was somewhat "discouraged" to do so and was told to quote from Living Buddhism. I cited the Sutra anyways.

I can give numerous examples of how simplified things are supposed to be in the Gagkai.

There are two reasons I can think as to why it is meant that way.

First is obviously they don't want people questioning the status-quo. SGI is a Nichiren school where a founder lived in very humble means without a lot of parades and "degrees" yet the "greatest Buddhist master ever" gets all that and more. There is also this whole talk that if you don't do as the gagkai says, you're screwed for this life and maybe for eternity. Yet even the Lotus Sutra implicitly states that Devadatta will some day attain Buddhahood, despite the fact he tried to kill the Buddha many times.

Secondly, and this is where I am stretching, they don't want people to know how much they don't know. I.E. if all you need to do is chant, learn about the Ten Worlds, and know how to sing "Forever Sensei" then you are all set. You know everything that needs to be known about Buddhism and to hell with the 4 Noble Truths! Those other guys got it all wrong anyways! The best way to be ignorant of everything around you is by believing you know everything and there is nothing else to learn.

Hi, Morgaine.

Let me quote your last post on this thread:

@ David M

Hi , I don't know about where others practice, but the last presentation I went to (and that was the last meeting ), a young lady read from Dr. Seuss and connected the various topics to Nichiren Buddhism, it was bizarre. The chapter study later that month consisted of the study leader person only reading from the living Buddhism, this resulted in us not studying the whole gosho just parts of it and not even the salient parts, just the parts that reinforced..... you guessed it "Mentor and Disciple". As for ichinen sanzen, are you kidding?? that is a real Buddhist topic that requires thought, no it is not discussed, it is considered bad to discuss anything to "hard for the members to understand" as I was told.

This is interesting to me, since this is the technique used by many christian evangelical groups (using pop-culture to show a connection to the ancient belief).

I would suggest that many, many pop-culture literature/movies are picked apart by SGI and other orgs to justify and strengthen the "normal" status of the group.

Keep your mind open (but not so open that your BRAIN falls out...if you know what I saying). A mindless person is useless to society and cannon-fodder for a cult/sect.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/23/2010 11:05AM by Sparky.

@ Sparky

quote:
Keep your mind open (but not so open that your BRAIN falls out...if you know what I saying). A mindless person is useless to society and cannon-fodder for a cult/sect.[/quote]

Hi Sparky,

I can't tell from your post,I always find the medium of email/internet to sometimes not be adequate for conveying the idea the person originally intended. So let me be clear, I hope you are not telling me to keep my mind open to the nonsense that was that meeting with the reading of a Dr.Seuss, it was ridiculous and insulting to anyone who has even done a modicum of study. In response to David M, it seems more over the last few years has been done to make this practice simplified to the point where there is no serious study of the Gosho. I have also noticed when we do use the various publications , we only quote some parts of the Gosho or some book Mr. Ikeda has written.

@DavidM

But then I remember SGI's get out clause, "substitute faith for wisdom". I never could understand that idea when I was in SGI. I read the gosho passages that SGI claimed proved the idea, but even so it seemed a preliminary activity for those who had no oppertunity what so ever to study buddhism deeper, i.e illiterate peasants ruled by a brutal regime in Japan in 1200 AD.

I'd be inclined to think it would be attributed through the concept of "simultaneity of cause and effect" in which the act of faith is in fact equivalent to wisdom and the actions have the "same effect". For example, the "initial blessing" concept for new members was put forth that by accepting a Gohonzon they had created a powerful good cause in their life, and the initial benefit came as a result of that - i.e. they changed Karma by substituting an act of faith for an act of wisdom.

Wakatta1

Quote
Morgaine
@ David M

Hi , I don't know about where others practice, but the last presentation I went to (and that was the last meeting ), a young lady read from Dr. Seuss and connected the various topics to Nichiren Buddhism, it was bizarre. The chapter study later that month consisted of the study leader person only reading from the living Buddhism, this resulted in us not studying the whole gosho just parts of it and not even the salient parts, just the parts that reinforced..... you guessed it "Mentor and Disciple". As for ichinen sanzen, are you kidding?? that is a real Buddhist topic that requires thought, no it is not discussed, it is considered bad to discuss anything to "hard for the members to understand" as I was told.

Back in the eighties, SGI did have real study, at least in some areas. This one leader that I had was very big on it. We were expected to read various Gosho and come prepared to discuss them, as well as studying concepts like ichinen sanzen. Then I moved to another city...and our "study" was just reading aloud from The World Tribune and Living Buddhism. That still sounds better than what Morgaine is describing now. In the past, the publications actually did have some decent study material, something besides mentor and disciple.

As to why SGI has so dumbed down their study:

1. The senior leadership really doesn't want members who think too much or know too much about Buddhism. Such members would realize how far SGI has truly drifted from practicing real Buddhism. They might feel more allegiance to Nichiren, the Lotus Sutra, the Gohonzon, or Nam-myoho-renge-kyo than they feel for Ikeda. Can't have that!

2. The senior leadership really believes that Ikeda is the true Buddha, and that truly, all a person needs to do is dedicate themselves to following him.

3. The senior leadership just doesn't think much of the members.