Current Page: 36 of 38
Re: The Work/Byron Katie-strong concerns
Posted by: Stoic ()
Date: August 22, 2010 05:39AM

There is a further Byron Katie post and discussion currently on Guruphiliac:


Options: ReplyQuote
Re: The Work/Byron Katie-strong concerns
Posted by: luckychrm ()
Date: October 10, 2010 12:34AM

I am in the process of filing a complaint on a potentially unlicensed "counselor/family therapist" associated with Byron Katie and The Work. I've been very stressed since speaking with the state licensing board yesterday and hearing that a complaint is the only way they can official look into the individual's practice. You can only file a complaint by mailing in their form, and then my printer wouldn't work ;)

I'll find the proper threads (or create a new one) to delve into my brief experiences and strong concerns about The Work, it's facilitators, and adaptations of The Work in licensed therapy and unlicensed counseling/therapy, which I believe would more accurately be described as fraudulent practice.

I have a few moments while I wait forever (it seems) for internet archive pages to load as I research previous claims via Byron Katie and her associate in question. I came across an early testimonial on The Work that really encapsulated the reason for my distrust of the system and it's practitioners, often so eager to use it ["share it" is really just doublespeak to me] on their own with unsuspecting, potentially vulnerable friends, family, and acquaintances [emphasis below mine]:

Dear Katie,
I just got home from your workshop in Beverly Hills and I just have to send you this jingle that came to me inspired by "The Work":
All things happen
for the highest good.
And nothing hurts
until you think it should.

Thank you, Katie, for your many blessings.


Options: ReplyQuote
Re: The Work/Byron Katie-strong concerns
Posted by: Stoic ()
Date: October 10, 2010 07:06AM

There is quite a lot on Byron Katie and the methods that she has taught to other unlicensed practitioners on these boards. Of particular interest might be the extensive analysis of the hynotic manipulation and LGAT techniques in use in the School for the Work, primarily made a poster 'The Anticult.'
As the main Byron Katie thread is so large:


try using the search facility at the top of the page for any particular info that you are looking for.

Options: ReplyQuote
The Work/Byron Katie/Naomi Aldort: Facilitator of self-realization
Posted by: luckychrm ()
Date: October 16, 2010 06:06AM

Naomi Aldort: Facilitator of Self-Realization Through Parenting

Naomi Aldort [] is a self-referenced "parenting expert" in Washington State who bases her theories and practice in part on Byron Katie's The Work. Aldort conducts many large group seminars, the content of which frequently includes using the process of The Work to resolve parenting struggles. Aldort is not exactly the same as Byron Katie, but she is a facilitator of The Work and at least a few years ago was developing a web site called The Work for Parents []. Like Katie, Naomi Aldort has videos on youTube, has published a book Raising Our Children, Raising Ourselves [] featuring copious vignettes of Aldort's effective family therapy in practice, and sells audio recordings detailing her parenting philosophy, which appears to be well-accepted in attachment parenting circles. Even moreso than Katie, Aldort's background is far less than transparent. There are no online records of her history and interviews with her are almost exclusively limited to the question and answer format exploring people's parenting challenges and how Aldort would solve the problem: often by offering advise that is a bit challenging for the asker to apply, but that is the reader/asker/listener's issue and confusion can probably be resolved by booking one or more $150/hour telephone "sessions" with parenting expert Naomi Aldort herself!

I personally had a very negative experiencing attempting to apply Aldort's suggestions to my own parenting struggle with my irritability over my child's occasional whining. As I looked more deeply into the issue, learned about The Work and tried to find out about Aldort's background, red flags started popping up about whether or not The Work is or should be used as "therapy", what the legal definition of therapy is, and whether or not Aldort is or ever was a legal therapist. I've had to file a complaint with the Department of Health in Washington State in order to get more information as Aldort declined to verify her credentials when I directly asked her to do so.

The following is a letter to the editor that I have submitted to Mothering Magazine, one of the parenting publications that Aldort writes for as a parenting expert.

Dear editors of Mothering Magazine and,

I’m writing regarding concern about the inclusion of Naomi Aldort as a parenting expert in your parenting magazine and website and curiosity about the selection process for your expert panel.

As of July 1, 2010, Naomi Aldort was no longer a registered counselor in Washington State and it is not clear if she has ever been a Licensed Family Therapist in that state. In August 2010, I asked Aldort directly to verify her license, education, and experience in clinical psychology and she declined, stating that she had never been asked by anyone to provide a curriculum vitae and that, “Nothing that I studied in the university is even remotely related to what I teach and how I guide parents.”

Is it true that Mothering Magazine accepted Aldort as a parenting expert without verifying her credentials?

I first encountered Aldort’s book Raising Our Children, Raising Ourselves in 2007 and must say that her credentials, advertised at that time as Ph.D, psychologist, and child and family therapist, played a deciding factor in my purchase of her book. Given Aldort’s credentials as stated, I expected the parenting approach to be grounded in the accepted research in developmental psychology, but I found the book to be far from scholarly. I was surprised then, to find Aldort’s articles and advice columns included in Mothering materials as expert advice and have read several accounts at the Mothering online forum of members concerned that Aldort increasingly uses this venue to advertise her telephone “parenting sessions,” which until recently were advertised as “parenting counseling sessions.”

Am I alone in having been influenced to accept and apply Aldort’s theories based on her stated credentials in psychology? Theories which in part are based on Byron Katie’s The Work, a method that has no scientifically valid published studies demonstrating its effectiveness or appropriateness as a parenting strategy or therapeutic procedure for resolving distress related to past trauma, especially trauma caused by child abuse and neglect. In fact n March 2010, Clinical Psychologist and Ph.D., Dr. Laura Markham warned against following Byron Katie’s protocol outlined in The Work in a response she gave to a concerned reader commenting on Markham’s article Become a more inspired parent by questioning your thoughts:

“I did not actually recommend Byron Katie's practice. Although I use similar wording for two of the questions (Can you prove that thought is true? Who would you be without it?) I very specifically do not recommend the next part of her process, which is about "turning it around." I think that part is designed to get people to take responsibility for their experience, which can be a useful exploration and can be empowering. However, it can also induce shame and guilt if it is forced on someone. In the case of trauma, as I mentioned, it can be a repeat victimization. So I would not recommend it to a lay audience without the support of an experienced therapist.” []. Is Aldort, who states that she utilizes this protocol in her telephone parenting sessions, the type of experienced therapist that Markham recommends?

I ask that the editors of Mothering Magazine clarify to readers the process for including individuals in its publications, in print and online, as parenting experts and that Mothering Magazine ask Aldort to either formally specify her education and credentials in psychology, counseling, and child development or remove references to her work as a life-transforming family therapist from her Mothering biography and articles.

Thank you sincerely for taking your time to consider this request,
[name omitted]
A Mothering reader and parent of a five year old with 15 years of experience as an early childhood educator and advocate in Washington State and a B.A. in preschool through 8th grade education from Western Governors University.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: The Work/Byron Katie/Naomi Aldort: Facilitator of self-realization
Posted by: luckychrm ()
Date: July 07, 2011 11:18AM


Discussion thread on falsifying credentials?

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: The Work/Byron Katie/Naomi Aldort: Facilitator of self-realization
Posted by: luckychrm ()
Date: July 09, 2011 01:31AM


Discussion thread on falsifying credentials?

The link above leads to a lengthy discussion at an online parenting forum where are large group of readers/subscribers are finding out about the unproven credentials of Naomi Aldort, a person who until very recently claimed to have a PhD and to be a psychologist and family therapist ( Aldort uses The Work extensively in her large group seminars, youTube videos, advice columns (self-reported to be published world-wide), and most recently teleseminars.

Aldort has published a disclaim of her PhD here: []

Aldort has no records online anywhere of what her actual qualifications are.

Several of those posting at the Mothering discussion thread are unfamiliar with Byron Katie and The Work and I believe are exposing themselves unnecessarily to some of the more shocking Byron Katie material as they struggle to understand what is "behind" Naomi Aldort (i.e., what informs the often confusing and impossible advice she gives and how could such a large-scale publisher as Mothering have been "duped" to endorse Aldort without verifying her credentials). I've directed readers to the Rick Ross forum in hopes that they can learn more here, although with Neurolinquistic Programming (which Aldort freely lists as source material, as well as Werner Erhard, Byron Katie & Eckhart Tolle among others) the learning curve for the uninitiated is steep.

Even in her credential "clarification" (which many here will recognize is not a true apology or admission) she continues to use NLP style coercive tricks, such as stating that, "I have lectured in colleges and my writing is published in the McGraw Hill university textbook "A Child's World." and then updating (rather than editing) the post at the end of the clarification to say, "Update: The textbook is the "Student Study Guide with Readings" to accompany "A Child's World, eighth edition." Not the textbook itself." AND THEN further clarifies the textbook publication in a different location (which is not directly linked through the original textbook claim or the update) called- Popular Questions about the Clarification Statement "Q. Can we have more details about the McGraw Hill textbook? A. The article "Getting Out of the Way" is printed in full on pages 192 and 193 of the "Student Study Guide with Readings" to accompany "A Child's World, eighth edition."

Ultimately, Aldort's factually correct textbook claim is that a two-page article she likely originally published based on a PhD she now claims is from a "not credible" online university appears in two pages of a study guide of a textbook (presumably college-level child development).

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: The Work/Byron Katie-strong concerns
Posted by: SeekingTruth ()
Date: July 14, 2011 10:17PM

Yet more concerns about Katie Byron - who has discovered YouTube to peddle her scams.

Here she tries to 'cure' a vulnerable and confused gay guy:


Options: ReplyQuote
Re: The Work/Byron Katie/Naomi Aldort: Facilitator of self-realization
Posted by: luckychrm ()
Date: August 21, 2011 04:56PM

I'm very thankful to the rickross forum for publishing my original post about Naomi Aldort, self-proclaimed facilitator of The Work, which was removed from the forum where I directly sought answers regarding the suspicious parenting expert who utilizes The Work in $150/hour telephone parenting "sessions" and who until last month called herself a Ph.D/psychologist. The Amazon book page for Aldort's Raising Our Children Raising Ourselves [] has been amended with the following disclaimer,

"The Ph.D. by the author's name in this book is an error. Naomi Aldort has no degree in psychology. Raising Our Children, Raising Ourselves is a parenting self-help book with ideas developed by the author based on her own studies and experience. The error will be corrected in future printinngs of the book."

That is some change, although it does not completely rectify the situation. After less than a month, Aldort has removed references to her falsely-claimed credential and credential "clarification" from her primary websites. The Mothering Magazine website dropped her as an expert adviser, removed all trace of her previous Q & A forum, and has locked all threads at the main forum when users try to discuss their concerns about the fraudulent psychologist whom the magazine endorsed for years, without publishing a correction, explaining the forum closure, or alerting readers and subscribers of the legal complaint process for reporting an unlicensed mental-health provider.

A different parenting magazine in the U.K. called The Mother published a condemnation of Aldort's actions and the perceived negative impact that her parenting philosophy is suspected to have: []

Another long-time publishing partner in Canada Editor Wendy Priesnitz of Life Learning Magazine posted a timely and cryptic blog editorial: [] and also appears to have wiped Aldort from the archives without a trace, except for old google links that trackback to a general topic page or references in articles not written by Aldort herself. In fact, Priesnitz's March 2011 blog editorial lauds Aldort as a columnist who can, in response to Amy Chua's book Battle Hymn of The Tiger Mother about pushing children to succeed, "sort out some of that confusion – and to give courage to those of us who know there is a better way – in her article in this issue of Life Learning." but the link in that post to Aldort's article published by Life Learning [] redirects to the magazine's domain index.

In at least two online forums I have found my original post on rickross linked by other readers who have been trying to sort out what has been going on in a climate where online history is revised and deleted continually without note. Because rickross has kept these posts here unedited, they stand as a time-dated reference for confused consumers.

Options: ReplyQuote
Short Blog Article Published re: The Work, Byron Katie, and Parenting
Posted by: luckychrm ()
Date: August 22, 2011 04:07AM

I actually got a blog article published at a third party website hosted by a ~quackery~ watchdog group concerned about potentially harmful parenting trends: [] It is the beginning of a series using the Q & A format. It is a start! The article is not an in-depth analysis, especially because the format needs to be accessible to someone who is just a click away from goodbye, or who may only read the preview text in the google description. I've pitched this Byron Katie business to two different investigative reporters in Oregon, with one possible in the fall and one likely no as they said, probably not, and then never got back to me after their meeting.

The article, for posterity, and PLEASE, if you read something and think, "This evidence I know about is a much stronger response to that question," let me know, as I have not the skills/resources/knowledge required to be an expert in ferreting out all of the layers of harm of Byron Katie's message and delivery method.

"Wednesday, July 20, 2011
Things you need to know about The Work but didn’t know to ask
Reader Submission

Did you just hear from a trusted source about this amazing new method for relieving stress by simply questioning your troubling thoughts? Did you stumble across a parenting article that claims you can get rid of all of those “old tapes” from childhood by taking a moment for Self-Inquiry before responding to a child in a tantrum? Were you searching the internet for a respite from depression or anxiety and you clicked into an oasis of self-help hope promising to end all suffering?

If you don’t know it yet, we’re talking about The Work of Byron Katie, and before you try to heal your depression, resolve past trauma, or annihilate anxiety with those four little questions and a turn-around, there’s a lot more you need to know about The Work than you’ll find at the official site []. This Q & A highlights a few spots in the background of The Work that fall into the shadows when the star, Byron Katie, takes the stage to tell her story.

What is The Work?
Byron Katie International states that The Work is, “a way to understand what’s hurting you, and to address the cause of your problems with clarity.” []

Even though The Work isn’t therapy, isn’t it better than therapy for reducing suffering?
In the context of measuring therapeutic outcomes, research-based evidence has become a growing standard used in western psychology [] ... d_practice. There are no evidence-based, peer-reviewed studies of the effectiveness of The Work cited by Byron Katie or Byron Katie International in support of claims that utilizing The Work can, “alleviate depression, decrease stress, improve relationships, reduce anger, and/or increase mental clarity, energy, and peace.” []

But lots of people say The Work helps them, shouldn’t we just take their word for it?
All reports of the effectiveness of The Work, including Byron Katie’s own story, can be defined as testimonial or anecdotal, in the absence of rigorous evidence-based research. The Federal Trade Commission bars the use of testimonials for which an “advertiser itself cannot substantiate,” but third party testimonials such as book reviews and online comments do not have the same limits. [] ... rules-road

But psychologists recommend The Work. Shouldn’t we trust them?
Among the United States psychologists who have documented endorsements for The Work, one of the most visible, self-proclaimed parenting expert Naomi Aldort, has recently disclaimed her Ph.D. and psychologist credential as “not credible” []. Another supporter, Anil Coumar, director of Student Mental Health at the University Washington has self-published one article in support of using a form of The Work in psychotherapy, but neglects to mention in the paper or his profile at the UW that he is also a Certified Facilitator of The Work []. And David Wise, the psychologist who has published the strongest endorsement of The Work, claiming that “The best form of Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, in our opinion, is offered in The Work of Byron Katie,” earned his Ph.D. in sociology in 1967, not psychology [], a fact that was only revealed after questions about his credentials were raised in patient forums. [] ... e1dfbf4190

But isn’t The Work just four questions and a turn-around?
Even the foot-in-the-door mantra about The Work is misleading. As advertised on [], to do The Work, you first fill out a 6 question directed response form about your negative judgements of others on the Judge Your Neighbor worksheet, then you ask 4 questions about each statement on that form, and you are finally directed to turn each of the 6 statements around in 3 different ways and supply 3 concrete examples from your own life in which each of the 3 turn-arounds are true. If you just go through the process once, you have asked yourself 10 questions about your presumed negative belief and been led to construct at least 9 examples of how turning around your belief is at least as true or truer than you original thought. Plus, question 3 of the “four little questions” includes 7 subquestions for those who feel a bit confused by the query, “Who would you be without that thought?” []

Next time: But The Work doesn’t ask you to do anything. Can questioning your thoughts hurt?"

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: The Work/Byron Katie-strong concerns
Date: September 09, 2011 06:17AM

So i read through some of the posts about Byron Katie and i was convinced it's a cult but then i talked to my therapist who supports some of her work but believes that the person who ran through "the work" with me didn't know what he was doing.

here's what happened:
I went to cranial sacral therapist who does intuitive work and such "healing". my first two sessions were pretty helpful so i went to the 3rd. he had brought up the work with me but never done it before. I have been diagnosed with postpartum OCD and have overwhelming anxiety. He told me that he thought we needed to do "the work" by byron katie in order to get to the root of the problem. i was nervous because in my state with obsessing anything can send me on an anxiety obsessive spiral. I told him as much. he said that if i chose not not do it i was holding onto my suffering, that my suffering had a mind of it's own and was hanging on to me and if i wanted to get rid of my suffering i needed to do the work. he said he had repeatedly had clients who really benefitted from it. i asked him if he'd ever had clients who were hurt by it and he said only that there were clients who were determined to hold onto their suffering. i was very vulnerable and crying, i felt like if i didn't go through with it i would always have this thing in the back of my mind that i never got the answers i needed and that i wasn't getting to the root of my "suffering". We did the questions and with each one he had me answer the questions but told me which answers to write down and led me when i said i didn't know, he told me which answers he thought were right, and more right, and the most right. When i had been afraid to start he had told me that once i started i couldn't go back. when i got confused about one of the statements that he made me write (the turning the statement around thing) he told me that was good that i was confused. At one point i was crying and tried to explain to him that with my OCD i was interpreting the statement one certain way, he cut me off and said we had to continue. I tried to explain to him that you cant just turn everything around to be "everything is ok" I explained that someone might have the fear of hurting their kids and there's no way that's ok. he asked me if i've ever yelled at my kids. i said "yes". "well that's hurting them isn't it? and you had to do it, right? if they are about to walk into the street and get hit by a car it's better to hurt their feelings by yelling than letting them die" I found that statement incredibly simplistic. There is no way to turn around and say "it's ok to throw a kid off a bridge" (note:these are not my fears or issues just a hypothetical) He told me that i was simply hanging onto my suffering. told me he was being really firm with me.

i don't know if byron katie is a cult or not but this experience made me feel very much abused by her work. i was seeking help and instead i feel like i was manipulated. i think the line of cult verses healing work can be really thin but it needs to be observed when things cross over.

Options: ReplyQuote
Current Page: 36 of 38

Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
This forum powered by Phorum.