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The good news is, he is visiting his new doctor for the first time tomorrow - - and this doctor has treated a handful of patients who have suffered this very same thing.

That's terrific. Please be sure his new doctor does indeed understand what happens in groups like this. Sometimes psychologists (I'm not sure what type of doctor your family member is seeing) who are unfamiliar with Landmark's tactics may mistakenly, though well-meaningly, try to focus on what happened in a person's childhood, or on other long-past traumas, rather than focusing on the trauma that was just perpetrated by the group (Landmark).

I've read that a good exit counselor can cut recovery time substantially...so it is important to understand what happened recently in Landmark to cause this "break," rather than digging for other emotional traumas. The psychological harm these groups cause is real, and it's important to recognize this.

Glam

Glam, and all: Thanks for your kind wishes. His doctor has indeed dealt with pyscotic breaks resulting form LGAT exposure. We are really fortunate as he is the only "expert" referred to us, and we are a mere 30 minutes from his office. And to Patrick - when he returned from the hospital, he asked us why he had been admitted and honestly didn't know when or why, exactly, his mania/delusional state turned into catatonia. He was still slightly in "Landmark" head at that point. We explained everything we knew thanks to our research (thank goodness for RickRoss.com) and all the doctors and attorneys who had been involved with similar victims. At this point, he is very well aware of the danger he was put through (hindsight is 20/20).

I hesitate to ask him more until his Dr. has assessed him. When he asks questions, we answer; but we don't bring it up ourselves. We've printed out lots of articles and personal accounts which we've accumulated, and he's begun to read them.

Also, I talked to someone "in the know" who said Landmark's arbitration clause means zilch, and that we should file a suit ASAP. If there are any legal professionals out there who have dealt with similar cases, I'd love to hear from you. So far, I haven't yet found an attorney from my state who has represented a plaintiff with charges similar to ours, although I have spoken with several who live out of state.

Hi Cousin,

Landmark has a long history of dealing with lawsuits. They are well schooled in the tactics that will protect their interests. You can imagine there are hundreds of cases over the last thirty-five years, and why have so few been publicized or scrutinized? Landmark, as a corporation, uses the same kinds of manoeuvers in a contentious situation as they use against individuals in their "training programs." Deny, stonewall, play word games, try to convince the complainant that they are "defective," mentally "unwell," or "unbalanced," put on their best, most reasonable "act" in court or during depositions, invoke their "right" to "free speach," and play on people's insecurities and fears or their vanity. Mostly they play games until it gets down to the wire and then they "settle" with stipulations to seal files and gag defendants. They buy their victim's silence. Most people are so exhausted or destroyed at the end of this ordeal, they probably want nothing more to do with Landmark and never want to hear any more about it. This group are cold, calculating, sociopaths. Their rights to future profit are their only concern and protecting their image is tantamount. A few "casualties" are just so much "road-kill" in their path. They are the ultimate Machiavellians and they will do whatever they have to do to survive/profit. As human "predators," they feel no compunction to resist using, abusing, exploiting, or destroying their followers, who are just "sheep to be shorn" in their minds. L. Ron Hubbard, one of Werner Erhard's "inspirations," used to call his potential recruits "raw meat." He wasn't kidding.

You might be able to find some information about Paul Gutfreund and his lawsuit. There is mention of it in "Outrageous Betrayal." He was a successful engineer who ended up living on disability after his time with Landmark. I don't have any current information about him. Landmark has enough time and money to outlast or buy most people out. That is why there is so little information about those who have gone against the group. You would be doing the world a favor if you can bring yourself to fight them publicly. They know most people will decline the humiliating and grinding legal process, and they use that to their benefit.

Best to you,

Ellen

Cousin :

Am so sorry to read of this with you. How tragic! Congratulations for your determination and fortitude to support your cousin and provide this as learning experience to others.

It's been apalling for me to find how many respectable therapists are NOT aware of the damage done by cults. I've personally known therapists who are either related to a high level cult member, or providing therapy to same, and do NOT make the connection that the problems in the person's life are due to the LGAT organization. sigh.

Also, I've watched others go truly schizophrenic from another cult, non LGAT, but other tactics.

IMHO, I agree with you that it was likely his inner resistance to the tactics that caused the psychotic break. From my experience, a relationship w/ a high level LGAT cult member, I truly thought I was going crazy from his conversations and ways of interacting in the relationship. Still I could see the goodness of intentions in him. If I had jumped aboard and joined his group, then I probably would have been at peace with all. Others have told me the same experience.

It is a tribute to your cousin's strength that on some core level he resisted the full indoctrination. Now for him to have the slow process of rebuildling his inner crumbled self. Again, sincere condolonces on going this tragedy.

Thank you for taking action on helping to expose such manipulations. In the USA, physical and financial abuse are illegal. There are no laws about psychological and spiritual abuse. In Italy, there is a law being debated to ban thought reform groups; their government is looking carefully at setting parameters to define such.

Wishing your family the best of luck in rebuilding his life, and your whole family.

Blessings.

take your time. your family is much more important than
landmark.

There are attorneys specialized with cult issues.

You could probably receive referrals for such from either Rick Ross, www.factnet.org, AFF - www.csj.org , freedomofmind.com , or some of the other cult education websites.

There is a history of some fairly substantical settlements for psychological damage, and financial abuse, from cultic groups. There are some articles about such elsewhere on the rickross website. Still, nothing material compensates for the rape of someone's spririt, the existential crises, the splitting of families and loved ones, nor the lost years spent in a false pursuit of enlightenment.

Unfortunately, the law suits hold water only when something as dramatic as Cousin's situation. The rest of the walking wounded are just that, the walking wounded who believe they've been 'saved' or 'liberated' by their soul being taken by the cult. :?

Yes, Cousin, others of us like yourself, have seen firsthand the damage done by such groups. In our ways also strive to bring the matter to the fore.

As mentioned by another poster, please take care of your family member first. Then yes, many folks on this board would be thrilled to support you in gaining media attention.

How about a surgeon general's warning "attending this LGAT may cause irreperable damage to your psyche"

We can dream of such warnings, right?

Yes - it sure would! I think a good place to start (for me) is to log a complaint with the Better Business Bureau while I do my research & due diligence on obtaining an able attorney to represent my family. As it turns out, one of legal friends has found a clear-cut law state statute which negates Landmark's arbitration clause (which they bury in the fine print of their paperwork). This is great news in that we won't be denied our RIGHT to a judge and jury, as well as a forum to express our first amendment rights to inform as many people as possible to the obvious dangers of participating in any Landmark course.

Complaints to the Better Business Bureau have minimal impact.
To get more stirred up, if that is your intention, I'd suggest that you also:

* Lodge a formal complaint with the Attorney General of the appropriate state.

* Also formal complaint to :

Charles Grassley,
United States Senate
Committee on Finance
Washington, DC 20510-6200

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Cousin2004
Yes - it sure would! I think a good place to start (for me) is to log a complaint with the Better Business Bureau while I do my research & due diligence on obtaining an able attorney to represent my family. As it turns out, one of legal friends has found a clear-cut law state statute which negates Landmark's arbitration clause (which they bury in the fine print of their paperwork). This is great news in that we won't be denied our RIGHT to a judge and jury, as well as a forum to express our first amendment rights to inform as many people as possible to the obvious dangers of participating in any Landmark course.

From what little legal ~experience~ I have, I believe this is just some sort of intimidation tactic. In other words, if you "believe" you have signed over your rights, you probably won't pursue any action and will leave quietly and not cause them any trouble. Hospitals and insurance companies now use all sorts of these tactics. If they can shame, embarrass, humiliate, discourage, or intimidate you from seeking care, requesting coverage, demanding restitution or compensation, you are "off their books" and not their responsibility. It's very, very easy to discourage people. They know this and use it hoping you will just go away and/or die in the parking lot. That way you don't cost them anything.

I think Landmark's use of these legal "release of responsibility" clauses would be intantly nullified in a court of law for the simple reason that they provide no "informed consent." It is my understanding, at least medically, that in order to provide informed consent one has to explain fully all inherent risks, however small or insignificant. But remember, they have plenty of money, lots of time, and full-time lawyers on staff to protect them. That being said, they will probably stall and delay and obfuscate until the last minute and then offer to settle with a stipulation to have the records sealed. Even though the whole thing is just some kind of a game to them, the last thing they want is to go up before a judge or jury where their tactics will be revealed.

Ellen

the thing about the Better Business Bureau, LEC does not offer a conventional product. they trade in the intangible.