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Landmark Advanced Course Info needed
Posted by: Concerned Oz ()
Date: December 12, 2003 10:24AM

Hi GC, Guy, Ellen and All,

Jane has moved out of LEC. I have passed onto her all the help I can by way of professional contacts etc. We parted last Saturday after a 5 hour phone call. All communication is cut.

She is the love of my life but she closed the door on me after a 10 week stint with LEC. We parted peacefully. I will never forget her nor the agony of this time.

I want Landmark brought to its knees and distroyed!

Thankyou for your care,

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Landmark Advanced Course Info needed
Posted by: LoriS ()
Date: December 12, 2003 09:14PM


I'm so very sorry. I have no doubt about how hard you tried.

You helped her a great deal, you should feel good about that at least.

I share your feelings about Landmark and all it's ilk. I wish there were more we could do.


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Landmark Advanced Course Info needed
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: December 12, 2003 11:33PM

you did the right thing. Your story is now here for others to read, so they can take heed.

And, perhaps, perhaps, all that you told your friend will someday surface and be available to her when she dares to entertain a moment of doubt.

Some seeds sprout after longer periods of time than others.

Take care of yourself. Enjoy your beer but dont over do it. If you're feeling really fraught, be careful when driving--suffering people are accident prone.

Living well is the best revenge. Do everything you can to thrive and flourish.

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Landmark Advanced Course Info needed
Posted by: elena ()
Date: December 13, 2003 12:11AM

It's a bit premature to make any judgments. Don't jump to any conclusions. She's only just started, if she has indeed started, to come to terms with what has happened. Go easy. A Landmark involvement can be the emotional equivalent of a drug addiction, bad marriage, or traumatic injury. It takes time, sometimes a long, long time, to recover from this stuff. Landmark targets the innermost or deepest parts of a person's personality. It works on the "DNA" level of beliefs, conceptions, and individual perspective. Very dangerous territory for rank amateurs to go mucking about in, as gc and Guy have pointed out.


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Landmark Advanced Course Info needed
Posted by: Concerned Oz ()
Date: December 13, 2003 08:22AM

Hi All,

Thankyou for your kind words of support.

Corboy - you are right about driving. Sometimes I do not go out because I feel so depressed. There is another part of the story I would like to share.

12 years ago I participated in a course called "Money And You" and I completed a further 2 courses, "Creating Wealth" and "Powerful Presentations". has anyone heard of Buckminster Fuller - most of the teaching came from him but the course was run by ex-scientologists. It's format was similar to LEC with the exception that the intimidation was not as strong. On the Saturday Night I got that euthoric state combined with a connectedness to everything. Jane also received this in LEC and I presume those who have done LGATs of some description also "got it" too if you don't break in the process. It's not worth it and watching Jane over the 11 weeks now has brought back memories and realisations that some of that implanted knowlege was still with me - 12 YEARS! That is why I have been so frantic to save her mind and soul.

Does anyone know of a support group in Sydney? I need to talk to someone who has expereinced the loss of someone they dearly love with their heart and soul to LEC. My heart wants her back but I know I will never see her.

As a mention - on Auto's thread regarding dating: I can vouch for the flirting behaviour. Jane never use to: only with me. Now she flirts with all men, even if they are Church leaders. Is this recruitment or residual lustful behaviour implanted from LEC?

GC - is there a way I can contact you privately?


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Landmark Advanced Course Info needed
Posted by: kittypaw ()
Date: March 11, 2004 12:22AM

Thanks for all the info on the Advanced Course and the SELP follow up.

Yikes! Talk about technology. What a system!

My friend M. tried to refine her technique after the Advanced Course. (She had dragged me to the Intro course 'completion' and I had a visceral reaction.)

M: So, I know that you said you were feeling 'pressured' to sign up for Landmark. Can you tell me exactly what is was that I said that made you feel that way, so that when I invite other people they won't feel that way?

It was hard to respond because there WASN'T any one thing that bugged me- it was the coercive atmosphere of the whole event. I felt like the oily tentacles of Landmark were trying to improve a sales technique, and I wasn't about to help.


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Landmark Advanced Course Info needed
Posted by: Concerned Oz ()
Date: March 11, 2004 08:30AM

Ellen Wrote from another thread:

>>BTW - this site and this discussion board have been largely instrumental in getting my loved one out of Landmark. She is now on the road to recovery.

>>Any feedback on which posts, or was it cumulative, maybe?

Was there one particular poster who affected her?

Ted Patrick, the original cult "deprogrammer," talks about
finding that one special question that gets the person
thinking again. That one observation that sparks their
curiousity again. For so many, the mind snaps shut after
indoctrination much tighter than it ever was before. There
is the brainwashing itself to contend with and then the
grip that some people hold it with beyond the strength
most people would imagine.

I am happy for you. And her.



She has only had the url to this site since this week. The site has been benefical for my education to help her.

I read all about exit counselling, mind control, the LE section and other material on the web. I sought the advice of Rick Ross himself, spoke with clergy, both Protestant and Catholic, psychologists, psychiatrists and counsellors. Very special people from this discussion board also came to our aid.

I found it very insightful to know what exactly happens in the Forum and the Advanced Course, linking the relationship between philosophy taught and the psychological tactics used to drive the philosophy. I arrived at the point where I could predict her behaviour to some extent, giving me advanced warning of things to come. I can't stress it more to people to study up. The weakness of LE is based on the "one size fits all" method and Grads seem to act, speak and think the same.

As I was learning, Jane was moving at a fast rate of knots getting deeper and deeper into LE and making life changing decisions based on her new "meaning" of life. I liken the situation to that of a juggler who was happy with two balls but the assistant kept adding a new ball every ten seconds for an hour.

I fell into the trap of arguing which did not help.

She states that she finally exited because: 1) of me; 2) of the pressure. I believe the second reason is stronger and this tends to support readings and advice that most people leave a cult through exhaustion, not interlectual rigour.
This covers the period 26 Sept 2003 to 4 December 2003.

Okay - so she's out but still thinking, feeling and behaving like a Landmarkian. It was not until early Feb 2004 that she realised that "We, [herself & other LE people she knew] were running around thinking that we were little gods".

She concluded this opinion through a document I gave her which explains the LE philosophy. A snapshot of it is found in my first writing to Briggs in the following thread:

Her critical thinking was returning and she was able to make a value judgement of LE vs Christian philosophy. Hence, my tact may not work for all. It depends on the person's original belief systems and the contrast with LE. The key is to allow the person the space and environment to weigh up their original beliefs with that of Landmark's.

She mentioned to me last Sunday that throughout her LE experience she felt that something just was not quite right. Somehow, LE just can't quite turn the little voice off completely. She also mentioned that my persistance was a key as well.

This story is not over.

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Landmark Advanced Course Info needed
Posted by: kittypaw ()
Date: March 11, 2004 11:24PM

and I really appreciate you sharing your insider's info with me.
You're fighting the good fight and putting the info about the Landmark's dark site out there.

Many, many thanks...

Oz- So glad to hear about your friend. Best wishes for her recovery...

--Grateful Val

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Landmark Advanced Course Info needed
Posted by: Concerned Oz ()
Date: March 28, 2004 03:12PM

To all who have followed this thread and my story:

Jane now understands:
1. How LE philosophy counters her Christian, (Catholic) philosophy;
2. How LE uses mind control techniques to drive home their philosophy and can pin point specific exercises in Forum and Advanced Course that use different techniques;
3. That she was brainwashed against her will;
4. That LE is dangerous and none should d otheir courses.

Her LE behavioural paterns are diminishing slowly. Her emotions are returning slowly. However, she is still not fully intouch with reality and is still prone to lying. She suffers from mood swings which she never did before.

Jane and I have now parted our separate ways. LE broke this relationship by causing a massive communication gap between us, stripping her of her personality and to some extent I feel, her identity.

I have faith that she will recover in time with God's help. I pray that I will recover from losing the Love of my Life.

If anyone reading this is considering doing any Landmark courses, please do not risk it. Ask yourself, Do I value the close relationships I have with people, especially with my significant other. If you do value these relationships, you will not risk attending LE courses.


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Landmark Advanced Course Info needed
Posted by: Concerned Oz ()
Date: October 04, 2004 10:36AM

To All,

It is now 1 year and one week since my ex-girlfriend did her first Landmark course, The Forum and 10 months since she left this white collar cult.

I write this update for the purposes of assisting anyone who has lost their loved one to Landmark. Her identity, as is mine, is protected.

We are back in communication after her "closing the door" about 5 to 6 times since this nightmare started.

Her condition is slightly improved. She conducts her life on the surface, professing that she is "superficial". She appears not to trust anyone. Interlectually, she rejects all that Landmark stands for but still seems unconsciously driven by its philosophy and its "technology". She is not aware of this. Her personality has not returned to her former Landmark self. She is narasistic and still continues to lie. She is unable to reflect on the Landmark experience as it appears to be too painful.

However, her conscience is returning slowly as is her understanding of what is right and wrong. Her grasp of ethics and morals appears to be at the level of a 5 year old. She finds herself in "double bind" situations, "damed if she does and damed if she doesn't - can't win.

Unfortunately, she will not get therapy. Cognitive behavioural Therapy, (CBT) has measurable sucess in helping people recover from Landmark Education Courses by helping the person to reconstruct their rational thought processes, and so enabling them to deal with the irrational beliefs that Landmark loads into the unconscious through both trance induction and unethical use of Rational Emotive Behavioural Therapy, (REBT).

I am hopeful that one day she will make a total recovery.


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