Bakka wrote:
"... (BTW, Jeffrey Epstein was in the quote, unquote leadership development business, and via the Wexner Foundation), and the Esalen, Erhard/est, LGAT crowd of days of yore."

Do you think we can link Epstein to Erhard/est/Landmark? That would be epic!

A common pattern I see among 'certain' individuals is this:

1) No credentials
2) Attempts to attract/'collect' persons of influence in academia, and specific scientific disciplines
3) The holding of 'off-sites' in remote locations
4) The funding of various philanthropic ventures, which provide access to vulnerable populations
5) Interaction with Harvard's Kennedy Schools of Social Policy, Leadership
6) Teflon-like -- can evade legal prosecutions

Bakkagirl

Bakka,

I think you can add "politicians" under #2, and apparently Raniere did that successfully. Then that could have something to do with #6.

Yep, add that group to the list, and 'celebrities'.

Can also add new criterion: employed NLP, hypnosis techniques, LGAT

Epstein is an 'outlier', here, or is a 'yet to be confirmed'. However, his victims do speak of a "training' period", and also that he maintained 'odd' conditions in his homes (read, training facilities), e.g. very low temperature.

Note, I also found an anecdote from an Erhard 'admirer at the time', which had him in a Paris hotel, with a gaggle of very young female 'assistants' and greeting his public.

I agree with many of the posts here. And abuse is all about "power and control." People who create these groups naturally want power and control, so it would dovetail with abusive behavior such as crimes against children.

and/or adults reduced to infantile states by these 'programs'.

"To tell you the truth, I always realized Werner was the source of est and thought we just came along with the furniture, you know.

“We got to look at what we all brought with us that was actually a part of the integrity of est. You see, without the part that Laurel represents, and without the part the Elaine represents, it’s not complete, and without the part that I represent, it’s not complete either. As est developed, some things were added that seemed to be necessary for putting it out into the world. Things like what Jack brought in, what Rich brought in, and what other people brought in, too. It isn’t that anyone was personally necessary, but whatever it was that we presented was and certainly is part of what est is."

Goneke Spitz
[wernererhardquotes.wordpress.com]

I would say, "Sister, you did 'just come along with the furniture', because your leader is a psychopath."

That said, presumably not all of the academic and other enablers of this monster were/are psychopaths, and I hold them as being way more culpable than this female minion.

Yes, child abuse would be an inevitable outcome of people with this mindset, and it is a very lucrative way to finance any number of other endeavors.

Bakkagirl

and, see my post, here:

[forum.culteducation.com]

I don't know about most people, but I found an evening of watching a child with taped breasts, robotically playing classical music, whilst recieving channelled messages from the beyond through a purple plastic tube, more than a little unsettling. But this was 'entertainment' for my newly-minted 'coach' friend.

Here she is: [en.wikipedia.org]


The audience was chock-a-block with perv's.

Bakkagirl

Well well, this is common too.

I was in a cultish group in which the leader began to sexually exploit one of the members. I got out before it got worse (which I expect it did).

This cult leader introduced me to a few other members or friends who also preached the same "victimhood" doesn't exist message. The exact same thing. Its all a ploy to prevent victims from leaving the cult.

Sexual abuse not just happened, it was taught that SA was not wrong at all. That is how they groomed the victims. They said all the crap like ego doesn't exist, you need to let go of your ego (thus, anger, pain, rage etc) so that the abuser can heal because after all, the abuser is just the victim here, hurting because YOU, THE REAL VICTIM, are filled with hate. You misinterpreted their love (aka sexual abuse) for abuse, you sick fuck. Its your fucking fault that there is pain in the world. You were never abused. Now go and let the abusers do whatever they want with you, and apologize for how much you hurt them. Your feelings aren't real/are part of ego which is bad and holding the world back from peace and utopia, so therefore there is no such thing as a victim. Its just a tactic to enable the abuse to go on with no resistance from members. They're just predators. It was also taught that the only way to release the 'abusers' from their pain is via this 'energetic'/cosmic release of our pain, because after all, our pain isn't valid. All the pressure and blame was put on the victims. So yes. We were taught there were no crimes, no good or bad people. Its well disguised.