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Re: James Arthur Ray - 2 die at Arizona retreat's sweat lodge
Posted by: Yakaru ()
Date: February 05, 2010 06:38PM

Kristina Bivins is, according to the witness statements, a member of the World Wealth Summit and attended the October meeting after the death lodge event. She also attended the the seminar at which Colleen Conaway died.

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Re: James Arthur Ray - 2 die at Arizona retreat's sweat lodge
Posted by: Stoic ()
Date: February 05, 2010 09:20PM

A video and report from 12 News with JAR on his way to court:

jumpsuit james

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Kristina Bivins, James Arthur Ray - OPM Other Peoples Money, bankrupt?
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: February 05, 2010 11:14PM

Its interesting how James Ray is apparently claiming he doesn't have enough money for the bail conditions?

One thing about these LGAT gurus, they are world-class experts at using OPM. Other Peoples Money. That is one of the first lessons they learn in LGAT Guru con-man school.

So when James Ray is openly crying he is out of money, that is probably a message to his inner circle. All of these LGAT Gurus have "Inner Circles" which they cultivate and fill with people who have access to money, Dave Lakhani even explains how to create an Inner Circle for your cult following. []

A recent example is Keith Raniere of NXIVM who spent $100 million dollars of other people’s money OPM, from Sara and Clare Bronfman of the Bronfman/Seagram fortune []
Every LGAT Guru has targeted and has exclusive clubs and meeting groups for their inner circle people, who are willing and able to spend a FORTUNE just to be able to meet the blessed Guru a few times a year. That is a huge source of income for the LGAT Guru, they all do it from day one, target wealthy and suggestible and vulnerable clients for "special treatment".

So the James Ray World Wealth Summit, and those various groups are going to be targeted. There is a very good chance quite a few members of these inner circle groups are going to continue to be Believers in James Ray until the bitter end, as the indoctrination is very deep and powerful. As can be seen in other sects, even when the sect leader goes to jail, their belief in their Christlike persecuted Guru gets more intense.

So the true believers in the James Ray Inner Circle groups, are going to be financially milked dry.
LGAT Gurus are not stupid, they all know how to stash money in various places, unless of course they are spending it all on their lifestyle. But its very common for various cash donations to be stashed for safe keeping, that is another rule of being a LGAT guru conman, STASH some LOOT!

But for the James Ray inner circle true believers with access to money, they are going to be targeted again, and milked dry. There might be a few James Ray followers who are also heirs to fortunes with access to millions, like Keith Raniere of NXIVM who spent $100 million dollars of OPM other people’s money, from one family.
And there are also smaller inner circle members, who might own their own business and will mortgage their homes and empty their accounts to "save the guru" and cover his expenses during the trials.

On top of this, the Guru goes BANKRUPT and so the slate get wiped.
(that is why the smart LGAT Guru conman always has a serious stash of cash offshore, in safe boxes, and even buried).

And when inner circle members like Kristina Bivins and others put themselves on the record defending James Arthur Ray, aren't they also putting themselves in the middle of it? The board of a company like might not appreciate their CEO & President dragging the company name into a criminal case?
Did Kristina Bivins who is listed as CEO/President of MuseGlobal Inc, ever hire JRI James Ray International to do seminars or coachings for MuseGlobal?

James Arthur Ray | Find a Journey Expansion Team near you
San Francisco JET Leader: Kristina Bivins []

Some have speculated that James Ray might attempt suicide? That is not going to happen, how many LGAT Gurus have ever committed suicide when caught and charged? Can't think of one. They either flee the country like a Werner Erhard, or they fight it out for years, and try to get off on a technicality. Or they plead down, and serve a bit of time, then get out and start everything back up again using a different company name.
If anything, the LGAT Guru conman when busted, perceive themselves as the VICTIMS of the system, like most criminals.

But James Ray, if convicted, is probably finished. Even if he gets out, who is going to insure and allow his LGAT seminars and LGAT style wilderness seminars on their property and run that risk?

But its a bad mistake to count these guys out, even when they appear to be down.
The James Ray inner circle is going to be milked dry for years.

And as stated, any self-respecting crooked LGAT Guru conman, is going to have a serious stash of cash hidden in various places, that was meant for "retirement" and living on a boat offshore somewhere.

Those are 2 lessons you learn from day one in the Guru conman school of hard knocks.
1) use OPM Other Peoples Money.
2) Stash loot where it cannot be traced.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/05/2010 11:36PM by The Anticult.

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Re: Kristina Bivins, James Arthur Ray - OPM Other Peoples Money, bankrupt?
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: February 06, 2010 12:32AM

James Ray is trying to claim he is "not wealthy", he is doing it by the book.

One thing that is taught right at the beginning of anyone who starts up these big money LGAT seminars, is how to try to hide your assets to protect them from lawsuits.
They attempt to teach all sorts of strategies of setting up various trusts, offshore accounts and shell companies, strings of corporations that own eachother, investment trusts, investment holding companies, non-profits, and every trick known.
...and those are just the legal ones.

It will be interesting to watch how the millions in assets are structured.
The first lesson the cynical LGAT Guru learns is to never keep their assets in their own name.
So already its appearing they are saying that James Ray personally has very few assets in his own name, which is standard operating procedure.

Its a bad mistake to underestimate the LGAT gurus, as they have been able to copy the strategies of the LGAT gurus who have come before them. As soon as they start making serious money, they start trying to SHIELD those assets, that is lesson one, literally.
If you go to any advanced persuasion seminar, on how to do these types of LGAT seminars, right from the beginning they are screaming that you need to learn to shield your assets, so no one can get at them. That is a fact, that is what they teach.
Whether or not it works, would have to be determined by experts.

You can bet that James Ray is now going to be used as an example in those seminars on how to run a seminar company. They will are running a seminar, and people die, and you get sued, so you better learn to keep your companies lean, and keep the real assets shielded and spread around.

But of course, finding those assets is for the professionals and experts in that area.

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Re: James Arthur Ray - 2 die at Arizona retreat's sweat lodge
Posted by: objektivist ()
Date: February 06, 2010 01:33AM

death ray in an orange jumpsuit = priceless. He plays a good victim card too, you can see it in his face. Chameleon.

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Re: James Arthur Ray - 2 die at Arizona retreat's sweat lodge
Posted by: Stoic ()
Date: February 06, 2010 04:56AM

Death Ray is also facing numerous civil suits from the families of his victims and the survivors that he has harmed. If he is convicted, these suits become a much easier prospect to pursue.

James Ray put his very expensive home on the market shortly after the sweatlodge debacle, he was active in trying to liquidate his assets fast, not in helping with the investigations.

Presenting himself now as being close to broke not only ensures financial support from his wealthy true believers, it is a ploy to avoid paying out on the many civil suits he also faces.
(e.g. OJ Simpson has a huge civil suit liability to pay, he claims he is penniless)

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Re: James Arthur Ray - 2 die at Arizona retreat's sweat lodge
Posted by: Penelope ()
Date: February 06, 2010 06:27AM

Mr. Harmonic Wealth is broke? And people were paying thousands to get financial expertise from him?
I wonder how his true believers are processing this information.

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Re: Kristina Bivins, James Arthur Ray - OPM Other Peoples Money, bankrupt?
Posted by: Cosmic Connie ()
Date: February 06, 2010 07:34AM

I think Anticult may have hit the nail on the head about James Ray and his hidden wealth. Hiding one's assets seems to be part of Hustledork 101. Another of Ray's esteemed colleagues from The Secret -- and one who has spoken out in support of Ray -- is David Schirmer, the infamous Aussie financial wizard who got himself into a spot of trouble.

A while back, Schirmer was peddling a "Wealth Building 101" course, which included instructions on how to protect one's assets from various "predators." I blogged about it a couple of years ago --
[url= /2008/10/monday-musings.html] /2008/10/monday-musings.html[/url] -- scroll down to "Shameless Schirmer strives for new levels of shamelessness."

Although the link I supplied in that post no longer appears to be valid, I did include a brief quotation from the site. Here's the key part:

"...So the key to preventing/minimizing lawsuits is NOT TO OWN ANYTHING IN YOUR NAME. The key to protecting your assets - is to make sure predator-plaintiffs and their gold-digging lawyers can’t get their hands on your money. When plaintiffs’ lawyers discover they can’t get your money, they won’t waste any time trying. Why should they!, they will get 1/3 of nothing? They can find someone else to sue...."

I imagine James Ray and his colleagues stateside adhere to much the same philosophy and practices. Besides not having assets in your name, the other big key is to have offshore assets, as Anticult mentioned.

While I feel a bit of compassion for Ray and certainly don't wish him physical harm, I'm not exactly crying for him either right now.

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Re: Kristina Bivins, James Arthur Ray - OPM Other Peoples Money, bankrupt?
Posted by: Stoic ()
Date: February 06, 2010 09:21AM

'Mr. Harmonic Wealth is broke? And people were paying thousands to get financial expertise from him?
I wonder how his true believers are processing this information.'

Unfortunately they have been subject to DeathRay's comprehensive snow-job and will undoubtedly have taken onboard his curious logic.
I predict (guesswork, no claim to clairvoyance) that they will have no trouble at all in swallowing the glaring inconsistencies apparent in the fact that they were paying through the nose to get Harmonic Wealth expertise from someone who is now not only broke, but was willing to kill his customers in order to get so broke.

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Re: Kristina Bivins, James Arthur Ray - OPM Other Peoples Money, bankrupt?
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: February 06, 2010 11:53AM

Was just about to post that they are not going to find many assets in James Rays name, that is the first thing you learn at LGAT Guru crook school.
These guys don't even put their houses in their own names, often they are owned by other entities.
Cars are leased, they even buy their suits through the company.
The James Ray mansion could have no equity at all, and just be mainly a showpiece tax write-off for the company.

That peabrain/crook Schirmer just copied that info from others who have been selling the same info for decades.
Now of course, many of the alleged asset protection schemes they sell don't work, or are illegal, but they don't care, they are just selling them. They don't care if you go to jail, they just sell their bogus advice.
Only time will tell if anyone can find anything on James Ray & Co.

But believe it, the assets are not sitting there, they are long gone. That is lesson #1 in being a seminar Guru, they try to protect themselves from the "vultures", without seeing the irony.

And believe it, senior James Ray inner circle people who are still his followers, are going to be milked for every cent they have. He will con them to put money into legal defense funds. He will use OPM Other Peoples Money if he can get away with it.

But please, no empathy for James Ray, that is terribly misplaced. That mass manipulator, and his senior salespeople have ruined the lives of many many people, more than has been reported, as many people got bilked for tens of thousands they did not have.
And James Ray is not done yet.

For those who know in precise detail the POWER of the techniques used by James Ray and his Angels of Death, what they did to Colleen Conaway is evil. Yes evil.
When you have studied these techniques in great detail for many years, it becomes very obvious that they can be used to literally destroy vulnerable peoples minds and lives, and clean them out, and push them into debt they can never get out of.
That is all done consciously by the commissioned super-salespeople.
They do it totally deliberately. Its planned out. Its written in manuals, and on wall-charts, exactly how to do it.
They use these powerful techniques on vulnerable people, they then push them to raise credit card limits right on the phone on the other line, and then they max them out on the spot.

Those who have not worked in that area have no idea of how these LGAT seminar salespeople think and behave. They are utterly ruthless.
They are of the same mentaity of those who scam seniors out of their life savings.

Those who are attracted to that level of human exploitation salivate when they start learning about these powerful covert influence techniques, and it becomes their life work. They work at it all day everyday, and the power goes to their heads. The really ambitious ones are the ones who rise to the top. And the worst of them target the easiest targets they can find, these days that is in the New Agey area, and in the "alternative health" area targeting people with serious illnesses who are DESPERATE

If a person wants to get a taste of the ugly reality, get an unpaid commission job selling LGAT seminars for a month. First, most seminar companies will want to bankrupt you with their "training", but there are certain ones where you can get in there.
Once you see the mentality of the salespeople in these LGAT seminar call centers, it will blow your mind. Only the most ruthless survive, those with a conscience can't take it.

There is no question that James Ray deserves the most severe penalty, and to serve full sentences for what he is charged with. And to also be taken out of the market for life.
Because if he is not, and somehow pleads down, and goes bankrupt, he will be back doing seminars within years, trolling the world for more easy targets.

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