Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: dabcult ()
Date: December 02, 2012 07:25AM

[www.youtube.com]


Dear ANTI CHRIS
Hope you have look at this 3 part series videos that I film a year ago ...about the gurukulas of ISKCON .

Its the same stories about serving the guru and neglecting their kids .......if not abandoning them completely ( as story related about a little girls about 2
ust abandon at the dor of the ashram .....I did this with the help of a lawyer that as access to those quasi secret informations.

About 20 ex students have now comited suicide ......mainly as a result from extreme sexual abuses .

To give some credit to Butler .....it seem that many abuses where present (being separated of your parents is cruel anof)...but I have not heard of sexual abuses ...........maybee Butler hatred of homosexuals might have kept pedophiles at bay .

I think its very therapeutic that you are able to share your mind and heart on this forum .
As many here understand very deeply what you have been suffering .

In this world its not easy to find even one psychologist that can understand what a kid raise in a HARE KRISHNA cult as experience .

How long was the longest you where without seeing your parents in person ?
40 years later I am still deprogramming some stuff thats was deep in my subconcious mind .

You have to remember yourself that you have a duty to yourself to feell good .....to be happy and at peace
it uselley begin by cutting any toxic people from our life ..........Namaste to you

Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: IamtheAntiChris ()
Date: December 02, 2012 09:40AM

Quote
dabcult
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yquvQJa_ZYo


Dear ANTI CHRIS
Hope you have look at this 3 part series videos that I film a year ago ...about the gurukulas of ISKCON .

Its the same stories about serving the guru and neglecting their kids .......if not abandoning them completely ( as story related about a little girls about 2
ust abandon at the dor of the ashram .....I did this with the help of a lawyer that as access to those quasi secret informations.

About 20 ex students have now comited suicide ......mainly as a result from extreme sexual abuses .

To give some credit to Butler .....it seem that many abuses where present (being separated of your parents is cruel anof)...but I have not heard of sexual abuses ...........maybee Butler hatred of homosexuals might have kept pedophiles at bay .

I think its very therapeutic that you are able to share your mind and heart on this forum .
As many here understand very deeply what you have been suffering .

In this world its not easy to find even one psychologist that can understand what a kid raise in a HARE KRISHNA cult as experience .

How long was the longest you where without seeing your parents in person ?
40 years later I am still deprogramming some stuff thats was deep in my subconcious mind .

You have to remember yourself that you have a duty to yourself to feell good .....to be happy and at peace
it uselley begin by cutting any toxic people from our life ..........Namaste to you

thank you very much dadcult. i enjoy your videos and your relentless pursuit of truth and justice.

yes! its not easy finding anyone than can even remotely relate. esp a therapist.
when you talk to other ex followers about it, there is paranoia, and you end up not wanting to share it at all.

i havent seen my parents in years. they dont reach out. i try to but i am outcast.
yes the things that you get programmed with really stick into your mind for a long time. i am also in the process of unlearning behavioral and thought patterns.

ignorance, is a choice.

this group will not survive the age of information.

Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Date: December 02, 2012 04:00PM

Dear Anti-Chris - I am so very sorry you had to go thru all of this, know that you are not alone and while it is rare that any psychiatrist would understand your predicament, understand that we do know and we will not stop until Butler has been exposed to the world. He cannot escape from the Truth and neither can Tulsi Gabbard.
The question is now, can the United States Congress (and therefore us) survive Tulsi Gabbard?
Keep in mind, dear Readers, that what Anti-Chris was subjected to was the same brainwashing
that Tulsi was given & from what I remember, the girls fared no better than the boys. Over & over it was the whims of a madman that directed and dictated to the parents in the cult what was to be done or not done. The children were neglected emotionally, specifically, as we'll as physically, that was the purpose of the Butler schools. Free up the parents to do the madman's bidding. This is the same treatment Rama received as well. There were many others. Their scars run deep.
Anti-Chris, your story brought back the nightmares and the mental anguish, the tortured soul-searching that
haunted my waking days and my sleepless nights. What had I gotten myself into, and more importantly could I
get myself out? But so much worse, what harm had befallen my loved ones and the family I had left behind?
Butler preached hate and intolerance and he was a great manipulator of the truth and could twist and turn a lie as well as any despotic ruler. Tulsi learned her lessons well & will obey her master, perfectly.
Butler rules by fear.
Butler controls everything.

But Anti-Chris, know & understand this.
Butler did not break you. You are now free.
You are strong and you will be fine, just trust in yourself and continue to move forward.

Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: IamtheAntiChris ()
Date: December 02, 2012 07:13PM

Quote
VoxVeritasVita Das
Dear Anti-Chris - I am so very sorry you had to go thru all of this, know that you are not alone and while it is rare that any psychiatrist would understand your predicament, understand that we do know and we will not stop until Butler has been exposed to the world. He cannot escape from the Truth and neither can Tulsi Gabbard.
The question is now, can the United States Congress (and therefore us) survive Tulsi Gabbard?
Keep in mind, dear Readers, that what Anti-Chris was subjected to was the same brainwashing
that Tulsi was given & from what I remember, the girls fared no better than the boys. Over & over it was the whims of a madman that directed and dictated to the parents in the cult what was to be done or not done. The children were neglected emotionally, specifically, as we'll as physically, that was the purpose of the Butler schools. Free up the parents to do the madman's bidding. This is the same treatment Rama received as well. There were many others. Their scars run deep.
Anti-Chris, your story brought back the nightmares and the mental anguish, the tortured soul-searching that
haunted my waking days and my sleepless nights. What had I gotten myself into, and more importantly could I
get myself out? But so much worse, what harm had befallen my loved ones and the family I had left behind?
Butler preached hate and intolerance and he was a great manipulator of the truth and could twist and turn a lie as well as any despotic ruler. Tulsi learned her lessons well & will obey her master, perfectly.
Butler rules by fear.
Butler controls everything.

But Anti-Chris, know & understand this.
Butler did not break you. You are now free.
You are strong and you will be fine, just trust in yourself and continue to move forward.

yes i agree completely.
thank you very much for the positive support! you don't know how good it is to hear that.
freedom! feels really good. there is no denying this.
more power to everyone overcoming this part of our lives!

thank you again VoxVeritasVita Das!

Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: December 02, 2012 11:35PM

What Anti-Chris describes is even worse than military basic training.

In civilized countries, children are not put through military basic training.

(Except in truly ghastly boarding schools)

Some comparisons of what Anti Chris describes with how Basic training is done.

You have to be at least 18 years old. (In the old days, you could go in younger, but only with parental permission)

You have to pass tests for physical and psychological health before they let you do basic training, because there's the recognition that it is stressful as hell.

Unlike the people who go to the induction center and take the oath, children's identities are still forming. THey still need a stable home and parents who are there for them.

. To believe oneself abandoned or unwanted by ones parents and sent to another country to a program like that is trauma, even before other crap is piled on.

Other matters:

During basic training, there is medical care available and if people are unable to cope, they are let out. Training facilities are kept clean and attention is paid to keeping everyon healthy, including making sure all trainees have had immunizations and are getting clean food and living conditions. If there is an outbreak of communicable or contagious disease during a basic training cycle, the medical staff will take precautions to quarantine and care for anyone who is ill, to prevent epidemic conditions.

There is a code of military justice--much stricter than civilian law, but still, a set of objective guidelines. It doesnt change at a guru's whim.

Sleep deprivation. That 4:15 AM wake up time is inappropriate for children. Children need very much more sleep than that.

Food deprivation. In US military basic training, the trainees get plenty to eat. They'd break down and get sick if they didnt have a good diet.

Family contact. After the earlier stages of military training, trainees can begin receiving mail and using telephones.

Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: Vera City ()
Date: December 03, 2012 02:22AM

Quote
corboy
What Anti-Chris describes is even worse than military basic training.

In civilized countries, children are not put through military basic training.
...
Unlike the people who go to the induction center and take the oath, children's identities are still forming. THey still need a stable home and parents who are there for them.
To believe oneself abandoned or unwanted by ones parents and sent to another country to a program like that is trauma, even before other crap is piled on.

....

corboy~
It seems unimaginable that parents would do this to their kids...
and that Basic Training looks compassionate in comparison!
Does any one know if there were any suicide attempts, depression, post traumatic stress, or kids going crazy?
In Ian's blog he noted the lack of proper medical care. He was careful not to be too critical (FEAR!?)
I have heard of two cases of suicide attempts (one successful) and that students who had a hard time were sent home as failures.
I have also heard that the poor Filippina girls who get married off to the Aussie devotees suffer from abuse but can not leave due to the Butler indoctrination. I have also heard that the girls, instead of an emphasis on sports, learn cooking, music, and do lots of outreach for Butler. Some get into massage therapy.

Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Date: December 03, 2012 02:39AM

Hi Anti Chris:
Thank you for revisiting those degrading experiences and for being courageous enough to write about your feelings. You will surely be a future inspiration to others with some similar cult experience. Myself, I can only imagine your hardship and heartbreak and just hope I can help to prevent future cases. It is not surprising that there was some same-sex experimentation in that abusive boarding-school environment so devoid of love and understanding. Perhaps the same factors existed at the all-girl CB brain-washing camps. English Boarding schools were notorious for same-sex experimenting and abuse due to the lack of parental love and harsh conditions. I’m open-minded about sexual orientation and don’t judge anyone, however, the atmosphere of these “schools” did not help young people deal with natural urges in a healthy manner.
You off-handedly mention that Tulsi Gabbard and Eddie Tamayo were married about the same time as those who were “Married off” after being caught with their pants down, so to speak. Are you implying that Eddie and/or Tulsi were victims of Chris Butler’s homophobia? Both Eddie and Tulsi are still aiding and abetting Chris Butler so you will be helping them to break free if you can further expose CB.

One of my earliest posts was on the subject of Chris Butler possibly being a repressed homosexual. Here is the link. “Speaking of paranoia and outing, Chris Butler is described on this message board in very strong terms suggesting serious mental illness such as paranoid, schizoid, and delusional. Butler’s own Doctor called him a sociopath. As I recall from Freudian psychology, mental illness can be caused by repressed sexual urges. Is it possible or even likely that homophobic Chris Butler is in fact a repressed homosexual?... Homophobia is apparently associated with homosexual arousal that the homophobic individual is either unaware of or denies…
[forum.culteducation.com]

At the time, I was labeled “gay” for posting my theory- which is not the case – but homophobes are just plain dangerous.


Please help me and others here by writing more about the current followers CG. If they truly want to be left alone, then they must stop abusing children and drinking the foot-bath water of a narcissistic maniac. You say someone very close to CB contracted an STD while at the Baugio City school; could it be that the stepson of CB broke the rule about sex being only for procreation?

Stay Strong!

Flash

KUMARE
Posted by: Vera City ()
Date: December 03, 2012 03:08AM

It occurred to me today that Butler's cult has been so energized by Tulsi's campaign. Her run for office has galvanized them in ways that has not been seen for years. They have a divine cause every election year now. Team Tulsi is non-different than Team Butler. [On her facebook she has lots of Indian guys flirting with her! I bet she is getting marriage proposals from wealthy Indian men... That's a side issue...]

Then I revisited KUMARE I know I have posted this before, but I watched it again in relation to Tulsi's run for office.
Vikram Gandhi made a film called KUMARE in the spirit of BORAT.
He made up a whole religion, pretended to be an Indian guru and made a documentary about it.
He shows how easily it is done, even when using the stupidest and most ludicrous ideas and symbols!
He brings new meaning to the expression, "Fake it till you make it." The only difference is that he is an honest man and not a genuine faker like Butler!
Vikram stated in his Kumare voice, "I fake so much that I forget who I was before.” This is Butler's story. The other difference is that
Butler is a crook and a cheater. The founder of the Science of Identity Foundation is using a fake I.D.! LOL!

Tulsi's campaign has used the same tactics as this film maker, creating her own mythology, and people believe it. They want and need to believe. She's the new Patsy Mink! Woman power! First Hindu! Military rah rah! Jai Sri Tulsiji! MAD MEN could not think of a better branding or ad campaign. Fine, fine, that's all fine... but what about the huge BUTLER CHUNK OF HER LIFE!?
I'll believe her when she outs Butler. (I'm not holding my breath).

Enjoy the video about the making of Kumare FROM ILLUSION COMES TRUTH
Vikram does bring truth where Butler brings insidious lies!
Vikram is an ethical man while Butler is a fraud. They use the same tactics to very different ends.

Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: December 03, 2012 07:02AM

Tim Guest wrote a memoir describing how he was sent as a child through various and sundry communes run by Rajneesh devotees.

Guest at least had some contact with his mother, though not nearly enough. He saw her at a distance, stood so much of the time on tip toes, looking for her that as an adult, his feet were deformed.

Guest and the other children were given good diets, plenty of opportunities to play, though they had to live in common share toys in common.

Even though the Rajneesh schools did not have a regimen nearly as harsh as the Butler schools, Guest reported that many of the children he knew had terrible struggles later in life.

My Life in Orange is brilliant. And here is what Guest wrote about Rajneesh.

Rajneesh refused to suffer. He refused to face his own childhood bereavements. So in refusing to suffer, Rajneesh created an ideology that forced other people's children to endure the kinds of traumas Rajneesh had.

On Page278, Guest quotes Rajneesh's claims about his own development.

"Bhagwan denied his need for others. His claim was that his denial freed him from his lineage and from history (Rajneesh directed that at the commune schools, children were NOT to be taught about useless subjects such as history), allowing him to attain great spiritual height. He felt his separation to be the source of his connection with the absolute.

His wound was also inflicted on us.

"By following him, sannyassins were brought to the heights of spirituality; but when the whole dizzy tower collapsed, we were also cut off from the family and friends we needed.

"Bhagwan refused to suffer..."

Page 278 Tim Guest My Life in Orange



Thus Rajneesh's unresolved issues were acted out on a grand scale and as Tim Guest noted, Rajneesh's traumas were displaced onto the shoulders of his adult devotees--and on the children who were dragged along on the parents' quest.

Rajneesh claimed his grandfather had died before medical care could be obtained, because the only means of transport available to the family was a bullock cart. Could this be why the guru later had such an obsession with collecting the most expensive automobile available--the Rolls Royce?

Rajneesh refused to suffer. When young, he used his magpie mind and wit to collect all the information he could and his friends noted that he always had been interested in eloquence and hypnosis. Anything so that a small young man in fragile health could find ways to control everyone and everything.

As Tim Guest put it, Rajneeshes issues were passed onto the shoulders of his followers, and especially the children in the commune/ashram schools.

Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: Stoic ()
Date: December 03, 2012 07:29AM

[www.guardian.co.uk]

'The strange life and death of Tim Guest.'

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